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How to handle a Catholic character?

Tom

Istar
To start off, let me just say that I'm scared stiff of writing this character's religion.

I have little experience with Catholicism, despite hailing from a city famous for its strong Catholic roots. Both my parents were raised Catholic, but left the denomination and became Protestant. I know how to make the sign of the cross, used to be able to recite maybe one Hail Mary, and can only manage to follow along (or at least pretend I can) when I attend Mass with my Catholic extended family. That's the extent of my knowledge.

My character is Irish Catholic, but he's kind of a casual observant. He probably only goes to Mass on holidays. I'm not sure how to write his attitude toward religion, since I don't know the Catholic perspective. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
 
Best advice I can give is handle him honestly. By that I mean sell neither the character nor the religion short.

My dad is a former Catholic, he converted to Mormonism when he met and married my mother. He still, in some ways, holds to his former Cathlocism. He uses Catholic swears, (like when he hits his thumb with a hammer he says "Mary, Martha, and Joseph.") He still uses some Catholic sayings he learned from nuns while growing up ("Sing at the table, dance in your bed and the devil will get you by the hair of your head."). This as waned over the past thirty years from his conversion to Mormonism but it's still there. So if I were to put a character like my dad in the story I would make sure he is that blend of Catholic upbringing and Mormon adulthood. That is being honest to the character, making sure they are who they are.

Now comes the trickier part: being honest to the religion.This one is tricky. I can't count how many times I see a Mormon in pop culture or other places and say, "That is how exactly none of us are." Or, "No that is not what the religion teaches ya danguses. Use something other than wikipedia." One of my personal favorite lines I've actually said to people, "No I don't have multiple wives. Hell, last I looked I don't have a wife, or a girlfriend, or ever had one." (I was twenty at the time). So, when looking at religion and writing about it and a person's feeling towards it you'll have to be honest about what the religion actually is and not what you think it is. For the actual religion you will have to look at what Catholics actually teach, which involves looking at their scriptural interpretations. And you will have to observe the Catholic culture, by either speaking with Catholics or by reading about them from their sources and from neutral outside sources. I want to emphasize the need for the outside sources to be neutral. There are tons of anti-catholic publications out there. And they are vile. They're tainted, wrong, and just plain evil. (Note not a Catholic but any such anti-pick-your-religion is tainted, wrong and just plain evil) These publications are usually lies sprinkled in with just enough truth to make it plausible. Steer clear of those and you should get a fairly accurate representation of the Catholic faith and how a Chrieaster (I heard the term used by my Catholic grandmother to describe Catholics that only attend on holidays) would view the religion.

Hope that helps.
 
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If he is a Catholic that only goes to the Mass on holidays, than it would be any little different than you yourself.

I'm Catholic, was raised in a traditional Catholic family, have all the Catholic education, etc...
So I'll give my personal perspective on the subject: just made him as you would do anyone else, really.
He might pray once in a while and promise something when the times are hard, a promise that he will seldom fulfill.
He might be offended by someone else comment about Jesus or the Virgin Mary, but he won't act on it and he won't try to convert anyone.

As I said, this is a personal view, pretty much myself here, albeit I go to church when able, not only on holidays, but I won't fret if I can't. I won't go if too tired, etc...
(This is a very tricky subject and I do hope I haven't break any of the forum rules, somewhat. :D )

Again, just write him as you would write anyone else.
 
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We call them"Cape Catholics" or "Cafeteria / A la Carte Catholics" [CAPE comes from Mass attendance on Christmas, Advent (or Ash Wednesday), Pentecost and Easter]

"Capes" or "lukewarm" Catholics differ in every country & region. Among Hispanics being a Cape means you(r character) probably prays semi-frequently but doesn't attend the sacraments while, for instance, the Italians might use birth control & sleep around and never pray but they usually attend Mass regularly.

What time era are you dealing with?

I can talk to you about Catholicism until your ears bleed (and if I don't notice I'll probably keep talking).

A good place to start might be "Catholicism for Dummies"- it should give you all of the information you need tot know without getting too technical or overwhelming. Otherwise, if you're okay w Anthropology books I had one that I really liked on Irish Catholics called the Occasions of Faith . He's a tad critical but I think its overall a decent representation of the Irish Catholic experience. If I remember correctly it was very approachable and alternated chapters between anecdotes and his interpretation/analysis of the events.

I'm Catholic but I've never been to Ireland so I can't speak for how their lukewarms & Cape's practice.

I don't want to discourage you (I LOVE that you're trying to bring in a different perspective and I applaud you on that). But something to keep in mind is that religion is more than just beliefs. It is also very deeply tied to culture (and vice versa). Clifford Geertz (who has set the dominant social view in the field) argued that Religion IS Culture. Along with the beliefs come practices, rituals, texts, symbols, images, etc. If you're raised Christian and see a white dove you probably think of the Holy Spirit while the same bird would make an indigenous individual probably think of their dead grandma (or something along those lines).

Regardless of personal devotions, there's probably also discomfort or anxiety with other religions (I feel SO OUT OF PLACE when I go to Protestant weddings or services - the lack of uniformity in the ritual is literally stressful. In Mass I know exactly what I'm supposed to say and do at all times so there's a definite comfort in that). Clapping? No thank you! Women on the altar? Nope! Jeans or sandals? Noooo!!!!! Entering the building without a veil? With my elbows or knees showing? NOOOOOOOOOO!!!! [I really do practice my religion though so I'm probably way more devout than your character would be but the thought of these makes me uncomfortable. Can I pray dressed in anything? Of course -but the way I was raised makes me feel like that's really weird & disrespectful.]

Even if your character no longer believes in his/her religion, in some way the way they were raised forms the way they think for life.

If they (later) reject the religion, there's a tendency to be skeptical or hateful of (what they come to believe were the "lies" they were taught). [I forget the movie right now but there's one w Ryan Gosling where he's a (former Judaic) Skinhead - the ending is bizarre but I think they did an excellent job of showing his character's reluctant respect for the Synagogue and the Torah even though he steals the text & is trying to blow the temple up he still scolds his girlfriend for touching the Torah with her bare hands.] A very strong sense of taboo is created and even people who leave their religions often keep these for life.

Ursula Hegi's Stones From the River features a MC w Dwarfism around the WWII era in Germany. Gertrude Montag (the character) is Catholic but mostly lukewarm.

Another character that comes to mind is Peggy in MadMen. She often says very little about her religion (though she'll sometimes say "I was raised Catholic")- its really her sister and mother's devotions that are more apparent which contrasts with her lack of devotion without her having to explicitly state "I'm no longer part of the Church".

I recently read Chuck Palahanuik's Survivor where the MC is former cult member. Its a very depressing Existentialist Atheist book but if you want to go the "religion only matters in times of personal crisis" route this might help give you some ideas.

If there's anything you want to know about Catholicism (literally ANYTHING) feel free to ask me or shoot me a PM.
 

Mythopoet

Auror
Is there any particular situation or context where this character's religion is supposed to show through? It might be easier to advise you if we had some more information and more insight into the other aspects of the character. There isn't a particular "Catholic" way of acting. The Catholic Church is probably the Church with the widest variety of types of practitioners (or non-practitioners who still identify as Catholic) to be honest.

If you don't want to go into detail here feel free to PM me. I'm a Catholic as well and married to someone who comes from a long line of Irish Catholics.
 
I *think* not attending Mass every week is a widely American thing ... I suspect that in Ireland Mass attendance is still much much higher.

American Catholics draw quite a bit of influence from our Protestant (and even Jewish) brothers and sisters, friends, teachers, neighbors, etc. The notion that the Sabbath requires rest rather than church attendance sounds like a Protestant concept that has crossed over into American Catholicism.

Another good book to pick up might be White Bread Protestants which is a wonderful study of American Protestantism. I read it (as a Catholic) and learned tons about American Protestantism. You might find that things you take for granted as being "Christian" (across the board) are decidedly localized American Protestant experiences. (Like reverse research as in "this is NOT what Catholics do").

If your story takes place in the modern era you might want to look into the Charismatic Catholic Renewal movement. I'm personally not a fan but among people that are there's a tendency to take a more Protestant (Methodist I believe) approach to prayer and spirituality. This might add to your list of things to research but it would definitely help when you go to write the character. (Charismatics began in the US and have spread elsewhere).

If this is all too much and the timeline fits, you could have him/her be a Protestant from Northern Ireland ...
 

Devor

Fiery Keeper of the Hat
Moderator
I'm a convert from Protestantism to Catholicism, so my perspective may be a little different than others.

Here are a few of the things that still strike me as different now years after I made the decision to become Catholic (and had absolutely nothing to do with that choice):

- There's a history, and it's very local. Nobody knows the history of the Church. But they sure know the history and stories of saints from their country or field of business. Nevermind the "they pray to saints" thing for a moment; they also like to talk about them and tell their stories, even people who are half-hearted about their faith. The more serious Catholics will go on to quote their favorite saints.

- There's a sense of obligation and community that's going to be there, nevermind their acceptance of doctrine. I've heard people say, "I'm not sure I believe in God, but I'm still Catholic." From a Protestant background, I can only think, "Then what in the world are you doing at an after-Mass luncheon?" But it's the community, and the obligation to that community, which keeps people participating even when their faith fails.

- Priests drink. One of my first memories drinking, I was 19, sitting outdoors at a little shop in Germany with a beer and a priest (I was still Protestant). At my church they also serve Bloody Marys at those after-Mass luncheons, which happen about every two months. Also, Sundays are considered feast days, and many Saints also have feast days depending on where you live, so you'll find a lot of Catholic events that are tied to food.

- It's really common for Catholics to take trips. They go on pilgrimages to the shrines in Europe. They see the Holy Land. They build poor people homes in Kansas. They do who-knows-what in Haiti. They do visit-swap-things with churches in other countries. They go to world youth day or drive across country to see the Pope. I mean, not everybody goes by any means, but in a single community you'll find many people who have gone on these kinds of trips and will talk about them openly. A Church will also have a guest priests come and speak all the time, maybe about their religious order, or you'll get a priest from Africa, or a nun to talk about their charity work. Taken all together, you get to feel a very real connection to the rest of the world.

- The Mass is super boring and everybody knows it. Even the songs are dull. But you can't say it. The reverence Catholics have for their Mass is very personal and real.

I hope some of that helps!
 
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Mythopoet

Auror
I'm a convert from Protestantism to Catholicism, so my perspective may be a little different than others.

:wavespin: High five! Me too.


- The Mass is super boring and everybody knows it. Even the songs are dull. But you can't say it. The reverence Catholics have for their Mass is very personal and real.

On the plus side, it's always exactly an hour long. I never went to a church that actually kept a schedule before going to mass. It was always, "church service is as long as it takes, depending on how the Holy Spirit moves us". That may be an Evangelical thing though. ;)
 

Devor

Fiery Keeper of the Hat
Moderator
:wavespin: High five! Me too.

Cool!


On the plus side, it's always exactly an hour long. I never went to a church that actually kept a schedule before going to mass. It was always, "church service is as long as it takes, depending on how the Holy Spirit moves us". That may be an Evangelical thing though. ;)

So true. My First Baptist church kept usually a schedule, but it ran long a lot. I remember standing outside the door at 11:35, five minutes late, and still waiting for the 10:00 service to let out.
 

Devor

Fiery Keeper of the Hat
Moderator
(This is a very tricky subject and I do hope I haven't break any of the forum rules, somewhat. :D )

The forum rules are that you can mention religion, you can ask people about their religion, but you can't try to disprove or argue against anyone's religion.

Also, you have to be respectful, but that's also the rule in general.
 
On the plus side, it's always exactly an hour long.

;) Unless you go to a Extraordinary Form Mass (the Latin Mass for you non-Caths out there).

Yes on the drinking. I don't drink but EVERYONE I know does. Protestants took the prohibition pretty seriously and have maintained more rigid beliefs about alcohol in general while Catholics don't usually shy away from a glass of wine or two (or five)... I read a study that said Catholics are 2 - 3X as likely to drink regularly than Protestants (in the US). You might also consider ... we have the Italians, Hispanics, AND Irish. Catholics generally drink (casually) and often.

I forgot to add that Irish priests have REALLY short homilies. It's not uncommon for their Mass to be under an hour. (Their confessions are super straightforward too. Others might ask you questions or give you a mini-lecture on why your sins are wrong & what you need to do to change but the Irish priests are like "Okay, well, pray 3 Our Fathers and ask for God's forgiveness").

We pray before every meal (together) and the prayer never really changes. We like repetition can be (and is) comforting. We know what we're expected to say/pray and we can add on to it but we also know its not an open-mic thing. We don't use the same tones and religious language as Protestants do when we pray (namely our prayers are more straightforward and don't delve into a dozen names for Jesus ["Jesus Christ my Lord and Savior, my redeemer, the Holy of Holys, whose name I lift on High, Jesus my rock and salvation, my friend and messiah, the Lamb of God ... bless this food.")

AND saint statues and crucifixes EVERYWHERE in every room of the house, on kitchen aprons, on key chains, dangling from the rear view mirror. EVERYWHERE.
In my family we're all named after saints as well. Really- its a pretty big thing. One of the families in my parish named every daughter after St Ann (Jesus' grandmother) : Mary-Ann, Molly-Ann, Lily-Ann, and there's another but I can't remember it atm. In my own family we use first or middles - I'm Stephanie so mine comes from the Biblical St Stephen but others include Adam, Noah, Augustine, Faustina, Therese, Jordan (after the river), Maria, Grace, Hope, Faith, and Anthony (there's only 9 of us ... this list includes middle names). We all have our favorite (patron) saints and personal devotions (I like the Sacred Heart & Catherine of Alexandria, others might be partial to Aloysius, Martin, or Patrick).

Speaking of which, not every family has a ton of kids but some do... in my small town I know a family with 10 children, two with 7, and my own with (my siblings + myself makes 9). These are the ones that come to mind (the people I grew up with) there's probably several more that I'm forgetting.

3 O'clock PM is the Holy hour and 3AM is "the devil's hour". We keep our palms from Palm Sunday and have them around the house (you're supposed to turn them in to burn for Ash Wednesday but we somehow never remember so we have tons all around the house. They're intricately folded into crosses, roses, etc.)

We LOVE candles. We have holy water fonts at the entrances / exits of the house.

There's seasons in the Church. And tons and tons of options for novenas and devotions.

There are 3 basic types of Catholic [stereotypes].
Traditionalists- (which is where I fall) this includes everyone from SSPX (a schismatic group that rejects Vatican II and the current pope) to the rest of us who just prefer to pray in Latin. Trads have a tendency to believe that the height of the Church (Theologically and in practice) has already passed and our current church is not doing the Faith justice. More emphasis is placed on doctrine and practice than social justice (which is viewed as something you do personally and frequently but doesn't need to be discussed all the time ... along with the fact that "Jesus Loves you" ohh ... that gets under our skin. WE KNOW! If we didn't we wouldn't be there ...) Trads can get a bit elitist sometimes and are easily annoyed with people that don't take everything in the faith as seriously as they do.

Moderates incorporate a less strict view of the religion and might be flexible in their interpretation (this can include Charismatics). This is where most people fall. They're okay with clapping, guitars and drums or synthesizer in the Mass etc. They believe in "Christian unity" and (mis)interpret the phrase "Ecumenism" to extend to all Christian religions. (Ecumenism technically refers to the groups of Apostolics that join us in Ecumenical meetings). They believe the Church is currently at its greatest point.

Finally there's the so-called "Progressives". Make no mistake about it, they believe themselves to be Catholic but according to actual doctrine they're usually "latae sententiae" excommunicated though they're probably not even aware of it. They push for abortion, gay marriage, female clerics, etc. They believe the Church is "archaic" and needs to adapt to the modern era. With this mindset "the best is yet to come." Most of us don't see these as Catholics at all because, well, they technically aren't.

Hope this helps!
 

Legendary Sidekick

The HAM'ster
Moderator
@Mytho, Devor,

My wife can top you on the conversion thing. From Taoist to Catholic at some point in her early teens. She went to a Catholic school (in Hong Kong) and thought it made more sense than the religion of her family. So did her siblings, apparently, as her sister is a Baptist and her brother is a Buddhist. My wife (the youngest of the three) got her parents to convert to Catholic.

I was always Catholic, and when I met my wife ten years ago, she took me to a Taoist funeral. She thought it would weird me out, but I was fascinated, in fact. I said my prayers in silence and didn't make the sign of the cross. Being Catholic, I have no qualms about making the sign of the cross publicly, like if I'm praying before eating at a restaurant. But at a funeral for non-Catholics, I can pray without moving my hands.
 
Hi,

You learn something new every day! Catholic Crow I'd never heard of the SSPX and I find it hard to imagine a group of Catholics that don't accept the pope. It seems almost impossible to me. But then I speak as an Anglican.

As for the OP could I suggest going to a service or two. It would seem the easiest way to get a feel for the people and the faith.

If you want to gain an interesting outlook on what it means to be Catholic could I recommend any of the books by Karen Armstrong. She's an ex-nun who writes at length in defence of her faith, and she has a refreshing outlook. For her the faith is about the praxis - the doing - as opposed to the dogma, and as she rightly points out in my view Christianity is something that's meant to be lived.

Also I think there's one thing missing from this thread - the understanding that most people aren't their faith first. They're people first, just like everyone else. Some of them follow and devoutly believe in particular faiths. Some don't. But my though would be to first write your MC as a man, then see how following a particular faith however loosely, flavours his character and his life.

Cheers, Greg.
 
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Tom

Istar
Oops, I probably should have specified more details about my character/setting. Well, the setting is modern, and mostly revolves around the major cities in Western/Central New York--Buffalo, Rochester, Syracuse...Buffalo is a very big center for American Catholicism, having been inundated by Irish, Italian, and Polish immigrants during the early 1900s. You're guaranteed to find a Catholic church on pretty much every street. Rochester, not as much, and Syracuse I'm not sure about.

My character, Will, is a Japanese-Irish vampire. (Weird, yeah.) His mother was a strong Catholic and the daughter of Irish immigrants. His dad was Japanese, but converted from Shinto to Catholicism when he married. Will still considers himself Catholic, but isn't sure where he stands faith-wise; I mean, he's a vampire. He's afraid his eternal soul has been corrupted.

EDIT: Also out of Thanks. Drat.
 

Trick

Auror
As an Irish (descent) Catholic who strictly attends the Traditional Latin Mass (FSSP, in union with Rome, in case The Catholic Crow is wondering :)) I was very excited to chime in until I saw that The Catholic Crow had covered many basics and even some more obscure things.

The only thing I can add, really, is that if you have specific questions about Irish Catholics, Cafeteria Catholics of Irish Descent or other cultural/faith things relating to the Irish and Catholicism; I may be able to help. I have been to Ireland, am pretty versed in my people's culture and am a devout Catholic with many "kinda" Catholic relatives, both from the Eastern and Western U.S.
 

Devor

Fiery Keeper of the Hat
Moderator
AND saint statues and crucifixes EVERYWHERE in every room of the house, on kitchen aprons, on key chains, dangling from the rear view mirror. EVERYWHERE.
In my family we're all named after saints as well. Really- its a pretty big thing.

I didn't mention some things because they were "issues" for me as a Protestant, so I figured Tom might be more hesitant with them.

But this ^ - I literally did a jaw drop when I read this because of how completely I had forgotten about the crucifixes and saints names, but more so to realize how thoroughly I've embraced it. My wife was raised Catholic, but I'm the one who pushed for Saints names for the kids and randomly came home with a wall-thing of the Holy Family.

I mean, a man's got to represent. *double chest thump*
 
C

Chessie

Guest
Also I think there's one thing missing from this thread - the understanding that most people aren't their faith first. They're people first, just like everyone else. Some of them follow and devoutly believe in particular faiths. Some don't. But my though would be to first write your MC as a man, then see how following a particular faith however loosely, flavours his character and his life.
I'm not Catholic (non-denom Christian) but every Catholic I've ever met has been supremely devout. If a person is following God's will, then faith comes first and that changes everything about someone: praying, reading the Bible, confessing their sins on a weekly basis, definitely the crucifixes and statues of Saints. Imo, if you're writing about a man of faith then writing him as just a man with beliefs after would be a mistake because to the religious/spiritual person, God comes first.

I dated a man once who was Catholic and his parents had Mary pictures everywhere, even above the kitchen sink and in the bathrooms.
 

Tom

Istar
@Devor: I'm definitely a little hesitant with icons and related things, because of my denomination. I'm not afraid to include them, though, if it strengthens the religious thread of the story.

The trappings of Catholicism are completely foreign to me--the first time I visited a Catholic friend's house, I was overwhelmed by the sheer amount of rosaries they have! My friend was definitely giving me the side-eye after about the fifth time I'd paused to examine a rosary in greater detail. Madonna statues are fairly common in front lawns around here, and I'm totally used to those, but most other Catholic items are a novelty for me.
 

Devor

Fiery Keeper of the Hat
Moderator
@Mytho, Devor,

My wife can top you on the conversion thing. From Taoist to Catholic at some point in her early teens. She went to a Catholic school (in Hong Kong) and thought it made more sense than the religion of her family. So did her siblings, apparently, as her sister is a Baptist and her brother is a Buddhist. My wife (the youngest of the three) got her parents to convert to Catholic.

I was always Catholic, and when I met my wife ten years ago, she took me to a Taoist funeral. She thought it would weird me out, but I was fascinated, in fact. I said my prayers in silence and didn't make the sign of the cross. Being Catholic, I have no qualms about making the sign of the cross publicly, like if I'm praying before eating at a restaurant. But at a funeral for non-Catholics, I can pray without moving my hands.

That's pretty awesome. I've read a lot about Taoism, but it was all academic. I don't really have a good understanding of what it's like to even walk into a Taoist temple.

Maybe I'm biased, but some of the most fascinating people I've ever met were converts to a religion; I think it speaks volumes about the level of soul searching that many of us go through.
 
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