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When do fantasy humans cease to be human?

Tom

Istar
I've been wondering about this lately. I've noticed how we like to take baseline humans and modify their magical capabilities and physical and psychological characteristics to suit our stories and worlds. I do this too--for example, one of my ethnic groups has invariably dead-white skin, and either jet-black, bright red, or white-blond hair. Due to genetics, such an extreme ethnic phenotype is impossible in our world, but I still consider those people human.

How much can we as writers tweak the human race in our worlds before they cease to be human and become a human-like race? Where lies the boundary between what we consider "human" and "not human"? Can we fantasy writers step over that boundary, yet still consider our characters human?
 

Russ

Istar
That is a huge question.

From a scientific perspective I think the answer would be something like "when they can no longer interbreed with humans."

But to answer the question in any other realm requires entering into an analysis of what it means to be human, which is quite a task.

Perhaps they stop being human when they are so functionally different from us that we cannot effectively understand or empathize with them as we can with other members of our species.
 
Well, if you want to get technical, how could be be certain that any human in high fantasy is actually human? We don't know their DNA so we can't compare them, we don't know their evolutionary history. What if they evolved differently but still have the same DNA, does that make them human? There a ton of philosophical questions that come with that. But the point is, there are a tons of technicalities with what is considered human and you shouldn't get hung up on it.

Personally, I'd just call them a fictional race of humans, if you do go super crazy then you might as well just make them a fictional species. But that would require something like adding horns, scales, fur, etc.
 
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Tom

Istar
That raises another question: Do we consider fantasy half-breeds human? For instance, my MC is half-human, half-Fey, yet I as well as other characters in the story consider him human. Originally, I had him at three-quarters Fey, yet I still saw him as human. Do we base the human-ness of hybrids on their upbringing? Would I consider my MC non-human if he'd been raised by the Fey? Or is it based on psychology? Would we still consider a character human if they had a human mind, but resembled a humanoid dragon or other monstrous race?

I guess this whole discussion boils down to the age-old question--what does it mean to be human?
 

Gurkhal

Auror
I'd say that when they stop to behave in the same patterns as ourselves, they stop being humans as become something else.
 
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Trick

Auror
I guess this whole discussion boils down to the age-old question--what does it mean to be human?

It does. But, I think for the specific application of writing fantasy it has to do with reader experience. Can the reader identify with the character? If so, they are human on some level. And, since they were created and written by a human, that makes sense. I don't think it's possible to write an entirely alien/non-human character. Show me an example and I'll either find that they are somehow like humans or they are not actually a "character."
 

Russ

Istar
There are so many ways to answer the question what is a human.

It is a legal question, a scientific question, a cultural question, a religious question and I suspect more.

The answer to each can be different.

Personally, in the real world I completely reject the concept of race. But that is me.

To start the discussion I think you need a definition of human.
 

Tom

Istar
I don't believe there are races either. We're all one race--the human race.

To define humanity is a difficult task. To think, to create, to laugh, to weep, to dream, to explore--those actions are what I think of when I think of humanity. I've always believed that it's our minds and emotions that make us who we are.
 
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Hi,

Like the others have said, you can't define what is not human until you have first answered the question what is human. The former depends entirely on the latter. So your albino race is human if you define human as containing or at least not not containing people with this phenotype.

Really I'd say, go back and think about what it is that you think is important about being human. What are the characteristics that are key. Then decide.

Cheers, Greg.
 

Mindfire

Istar
Perhaps they stop being human when they are so functionally different from us that we cannot effectively understand or empathize with them as we can with other members of our species.

The problem with this definition is that, when consistently applied, it makes elves, dwarves, and a whole bunch of fantasy races effectively human. It may not be precise or narrow enough to be useful.
 

Tom

Istar
In terms of my worldbuilding, I've always thought of dwarves and elves as offshoots of the human race, either brought about by magical means, or by simple evolution. Often they share enough characteristics with humanity to be considered part of it, in by book.
 

Mindfire

Istar
That's another thing. You also have to take into account the origins of humanity and the metaphysics and cosmology of your universe. For example, if humans are created beings with souls, then knowing whether someone/something is human or not may be a simple matter of determining whether they have a soul. But if your universe is more naturalistic, things get considerably murkier.
 

Ankari

Hero Breaker
Moderator
This is a great question.

While going through my worldbuilding phase, I created a diversity of races. Someone (I shared the drawings online) commented "why are all of your races so human-like?" I tried to make my races are different from what is physically accepted as human as possible. This commenter suggested that a human is defined by sharing similar physical traits of "humans." Two legs, arms, eyes, ears, etc. With a female and male gender.

All of my races can interbreed. Does that make them human? One race uses photosynthesis, another generates light, another has horns that can emit sonar, and yet another can create a body armor from minerals they ingest from the earth (I have others. Generic "humans", something akin to elves, and a couple others). I tried to be as diverse with my attributes as possible, yet they're still considered "too human-like."

Inversely, I find that many of the "humans" in high fantasy do not act human. They are too "pure" in motive, too innocent morally. I find their personalities flat, inhuman.

I define "human" by the range of emotions, motives, thoughts and moral shading as typically found in a "real human." So, yes, my races are all "human", even if they are physically different.
 
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Addison

Auror
I, personally, think that the line is up to you and how YOU define humans. If you define humans based on appearance, two arms, two legs, normal ears, eyes can only be these colors etc, then the line is crossed the second you give them feathers for hair or pink eyes.

Or it could be by characteristics. Some people define humans differently based on how they think a true human behaves.
Personally I start with an actual human character and, as they change through the story, I watch to see if they're growing as a person and if they may be leaning also toward crossing that fantasy-race line.
 
I like to approach it from an in-universe perspective. A couple of my settings have races that I, personally, would have to define as human if you asked me. Some characters who are members of those races call themselves human, too. But the dominant "humans" of those settings consider those races to be "monsters" or "outsiders," so they're basically nonhuman as far as that setting is concerned. (They still act like humans, of course, but you could say the same for most of my characters.)
 
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Tom

Istar
I consider my Fey human, since they're a magically mutated offshoot of humanity. They think and feel as humans do, and are motivated by the same things--love, hatred, fear, jealousy, etc.

Yet the human peoples consider Fey monsters, and reject them. Just recently I realized that the Fey were just another people like all the rest. I had been thinking through the lens of my human MC and his culture, seeing them as inhuman monsters as he does. Now I recognize their innate humanity. I've also realized that the human peoples have ostracized the Fey because they see themselves reflected in them, and fear their own flawed natures.

Hopefully this new understanding will show in my finished work.


(It had better, since I've spent half a decade or more coming to that conclusion!)
 

Caged Maiden

Staff
Article Team
You know, I don't really write humanoids who aren't "real" humans, so I'm probably very alone in this, but the way I'd view elves and humans (because I do have elves and dwarves) cohabitating a world is probably how our own Earth history saw an overlap between Homo Sapiens and Neandarthals. They can interbreed, they have similar characteristics, but they're different. In fact, just thinking about this might prompt me to do some more brainstorming.

See in my world, I have loads of humans, but some have special characteristics that make them different, but not different enough to give them a new species identifier. Mages, for example, are regular humans, but they have a natural talent for magic. Do they have different DNA? Maybe as much as musical families or whatever have some natural traits they're passing down. I mean, comparing humans to horses, not all horses are racing material, just like not all humans are destined to be mages, but like all horses can run, so could all people probably learn some small amount of magic. My high-talent mages are less like horses and more like unicorns, I'd have to imagine. Something went weird, and they pass it down.
 
None of my current settings are filled with non-human races. When you strip all the scales and pointy ears, they are all just humans.
 
When they are capable of doing things that humans in our reality cannot?

Unless of course you chalk this up to some continued type of evolution, but even then it's still in a sci-fi/fantasy context.
 
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