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Why YA?

Laurence

Inkling
Firstly, what're your main reasons for writing it in the first place? It seems to me that it gives only limitations. Beyond being unable to write about grittier things, I imagine adults are less likely to enjoy YA fiction while I think most young teens and up are perfectly capable of/willing to pick up a non-YA book.

Is it that you intend your book to be kids' gateway novel in to the world o' fantasy and therefore need your story to be less wordy and intimidating?

Secondly, what do YOU consider the cut-off point between YA fiction and (is there a term that encompasses everything else?) adult fiction? Any particular examples of books that are right on the edge and do editors and publishers usually like to push people one way or the other?
 

CupofJoe

Myth Weaver
There are some very gritty YA stories out there. All subjects are and have been covered. I wouldn't put any topic outside the YA readership. It just has to be approached in a way that makes sense to those reading the stories.
Just look at the Harry Potter books. They are considered YA by some and have a lot of grim and disturbing story lines...
 

glutton

Inkling
Is it that you intend your book to be kids' gateway novel in to the world o' fantasy and therefore need your story to be less wordy and intimidating?

I label a lot of my books as YA because I don't like to write in a 'wordy and intimidating' style and my MCs are often in the right age range or close enough to it.
 

Demesnedenoir

Myth Weaver
As Russ said... Thars money in those YA words. Huge market, and a fairly natural niche for fantasy writers. Me? I loathe YA, but I do have one story that could be fit into a YA story, but it'd lose part of its appeal to me. On top of that, lots of folks now are growing up on YA, that's all many aspiring writers have really read. People tend to write what they've read. And YA appeal to a less read audience, much like movies have for years targeted this age group.. They haven't read/watched the same story 500 times yet, LOL.

And frankly, there's a natural appeal because in my opinion, the writing form is easier. The trouble is, as with any gold rush, competition is extremely fierce where all the money is. Writers seeking a haul of cash look at YA, if you are looking for literary creds, YA is not the route to go, for the most part. Of course, fantasy makes for difficult literary creds anyhow, LOL. But, breaking into YA is extremely difficult from what I hear, and Sanderson reinforced that notion in his lectures.
 
My general tendency is to answer the question thus: It's easier. Easier to write and easier to read.

I do sincerely believe that some writers of YA–I don't believe all, but only some–do so because they can then use all the little shortcuts and simplicity that make it easier to write. And, quicker.

But I'd also point out the comparative "easier." It's not easy to write, at least to do well; but, easier.

In general, I don't think well-written YA is any less entertaining than other types. But since I'm generalizing...
 

Nimue

Auror
To put in a more idealistic word for YA, there's something appealing about writing for young people: they can be very passionate, they're discovering new things, they can really become engrossed in literature. Some of the best reading experiences I had when I was a teen, and a lot of those books continue to be my favorite comfort reads: the Abhorsen series, Tamora Pierce's books, Harry Potter. There is certainly some market flooding of dystopian love-triangle sort of stuff, but I can't write off the whole genre. There's something very fun and genuine about good YA. I could see myself writing it at some point; after all, I don't much care for gore and grit, and I love drama and happy endings. Heh.
 
To put in a more idealistic word for YA, there's something appealing about writing for young people: they can be very passionate, they're discovering new things, they can really become engrossed in literature. Some of the best reading experiences I had when I was a teen, and a lot of those books continue to be my favorite comfort reads: the Abhorsen series, Tamora Pierce's books, Harry Potter. There is certainly some market flooding of dystopian love-triangle sort of stuff, but I can't write off the whole genre. There's something very fun and genuine about good YA. I could see myself writing it at some point; after all, I don't much care for gore and grit, and I love drama and happy endings. Heh.

Happy endings aren't very popular in YA at all...
 
Firstly, what're your main reasons for writing it in the first place? It seems to me that it gives only limitations. Beyond being unable to write about grittier things, I imagine adults are less likely to enjoy YA fiction while I think most young teens and up are perfectly capable of/willing to pick up a non-YA book.

Is it that you intend your book to be kids' gateway novel in to the world o' fantasy and therefore need your story to be less wordy and intimidating?

Secondly, what do YOU consider the cut-off point between YA fiction and (is there a term that encompasses everything else?) adult fiction? Any particular examples of books that are right on the edge and do editors and publishers usually like to push people one way or the other?

The assumption I keep running into, which I find incredibly annoying, is that YA is a watered down version of an adult novel (like adult fiction but with smaller words and no bad stuff), and that's totally wrong. The tone of your post is indicative of a condescending attitude toward books written for teens.

"Why would someone write YA?" is a weird question for me. Why would someone write a children's book? why would someone write ANY book? People write YA because there are people that read and love it. Plenty of adults love YA novels. My grandmother loves YA novels and she's 66. I've read estimates stating that about half of YA books are read by adults.

"unable to write about grittier things.." There are a whole world of authors who don't want to write graphic sex scenes, rape scenes, and extremely gory violence, and that's about all the YA genre would prevent you from. YA is far more mature than most people imagine. CupOfJoe mentioned Harry Potter as an example of a grittier YA novel, but Harry Potter is quite tame compared to what's out there. Teens aren't innocent. YA deals with rape, abuse, violence, drugs, and other difficult subjects on a regular basis.

Young teens are capable of reading non-YA books. But there's the thing: YA is written for them. YA is YA because it's relatable to teens. Teens have a totally different perspective and experience than both children and adults. They're in the process of becoming who they were meant to be. They're getting stripped of their innocence, learning of the darkness of the world. YA deals with that which is unique to the teenage experience. Teens aren't big children and they aren't childish adults, either. Literature itself is built around the human experience. A unique experience has to have a unique literature. Thus, why YA has to exist.

"gateway novel into the world of fantasy" What? This insinuates that YA novels have no value in of themselves as literature--instead, they are only to prepare teens for "real" literature.

Wow. there's not much love for YA in ANY of these comments.

It's totally true that there's lots of money in it.

But...easier? Easier to read, maybe, but to write? Writers of children's books HATE the insinuation that children's books are easier to write and i'd imagine the same for YA writer's. As i said, it's a unique market with unique challenges. To write excellent YA you have to delve deep into what it means to be a teen. There are a ton of writers that assume all teens are stupid and innocent about reality and so obsessed with the opposite sex it takes priority over everything (ok, that last part might be a little true). The most popular YA books treat their teen characters basically as adults, but not fully formed yet--they haven't found their place in the world yet.

YA definitely is where the money is. Part of this is because YA has become mainstream and isn't just the "gateway" for young people who aren't ready for "real literature."

Heck, i read "real literature" far more than i read YA and I find this thread upsetting.

As for the OP's second question, there is an emerging niche market called "new adult" which appeals to people who like the style and themes of YA but find more adult content appealing, i.e. dealing with adult problems, and more explicit sex. Actually, i think it's mostly just the more explicit sex.

YA is a gradient in terms of content, actually. You have 'lower' YA that will generally avoid the sex and grittiness, usually with protagonists ages 15-16, then you have 'upper' YA with the more mature content. Hunger Games and Twilight are probably on the lower end. Harry Potter, which i keep hearing mentioned, is actually more of a Middle Grade than anything. It's hard to place because its audience is so wide (and the story evolves so much) but at the beginning it's actually something of a children's book.

That said, Sturgeon's Law applies to YA as much as anything.
 
To write excellent YA you have to delve deep into what it means to be a teen. There are a ton of writers that assume all teens are stupid and innocent about reality and so obsessed with the opposite sex it takes priority over everything (ok, that last part might be a little true).

Well and that's the problem. From what I've seen, far too many writers doing YA–and I don't mean those best-selling authors, typically, but the stuff I run into when browsing the indies on Amazon–really do make the assumption that a simplistic, on-the-nose, caricature-filled approach is perfectly fine. Or else, they don't know any better.
 

Holoman

Troubadour
I think there are only two real differences between YA and adult fiction. And one isn't content. YA can be just as gritty and depraved as adult fiction.

But in general YA has
- Younger cast, in the age group the audience can relate to
- Simpler language, so that most teens can understand it without a Dickensian vocabulary

Apart from that I've not noticed a huge amount of difference.
 
Also, I would like to say that adults are no better at telling a good book from an awful one than teens are. Just look at the popularity of 50 Shades.
 

Demesnedenoir

Myth Weaver
When I say YA is easier, understand I separate writing from story-telling, too. They are blended, but, I can say Rowling is obviously a great story-teller who's writing meets her audience's expectations. I can't stand her writing, but I will assume the stories are good, LOL. In fairness, I will say the same about most big-selling fantasy writers. Most writing in most genre fiction is... not great. Romance, western, spy, fantasy, mystery... whatever. Genre fiction is more about story than anything else, while Children's, MG, NA, Adult, and YA are marketing categories, and sometimes a way for parents to (hopefully) keep an eye on what their kids are reading. That's fine, but it's also fine to understand that fiction targeted to younger audiences is going to get snubbed by older more literary folks.

YA is not going to be considered as part of the higher literary canon, unless it is a literary book that happens to be YA, maybe... Rowling will be sneered at by a great many literary folks, this is just a fact. And why would she care? She can drown her sorrows in piles of cash, LOL. Fantasy will forever struggle to be counted amongst literary greats, how long before Tolkien was even grudgingly counted? and then only by some. Literary that happens to be fantasy, will get a bit more of a pass, but really, not much of one. YA fantasy? Sorry. Some people will move big successes like Potter on par with adult fantasy, but most older writers probably aren't going to do so, let alone lesser pieces of writing. And the real literary snobs? Forget about it.

And just because someone doesn't like it being said it's easier, doesn't mean it isn't. Which writing style is easier to write, Where the Wild Things Are, If You Give a Mouse a Cookie (a brilliant children's book, I think), Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, or Blood Meridian? Maybe throw a Faulkner and Twain in there. Sorry, it's an escalation. None are easy, per se, but the difficulty levels grow.
 

Laurence

Inkling
Apologies, I didn't mean to sound condescending. The reason I want to know what makes people choose to write YA is because I'm undecided on whether my WIP will be or not. I suppose wanting to/being able to connect with teens is the main criteria (other than wonga).

This is why I also asked for examples of books that are on the cusp as I feel like my WIP will be too.

Can anyone link to or summarise any grittier YA novels?
 

Demesnedenoir

Myth Weaver
Plots will tend to be more linear and with fewer POV characters, from what I understand, in particular when comparing fantasy age groups. But older YA is going to be different than younger YA, too. A lot of this has to do with the trend of first person YA books, where books with more than one, or maybe two, FP POV's get annoying to read. And while they can be just as violent and disturbing and sexual (for the most part) the underlying theme of YA stories tends to fit the life period of the young adults marketing is after.

I think there are only two real differences between YA and adult fiction. And one isn't content. YA can be just as gritty and depraved as adult fiction.

But in general YA has
- Younger cast, in the age group the audience can relate to
- Simpler language, so that most teens can understand it without a Dickensian vocabulary

Apart from that I've not noticed a huge amount of difference.
 

Laurence

Inkling
I think what's really behind my question is that I just don't understand how you decide your cut off point.

I didn't ask why someone would write children's literature because that's a completely different kettle of fish, whereas, personally, I think a lot of teens have the same emotions, issues and thrills as adults, so I feel like there's not much call for splitting the two up. Just scrub the Dickensian language from the whole lot!
 
You'll notice that a lot of themes in YA parallel real experiences that are common to all teens. a lot of YA characters' goals revolve around finding freedom or finding identity. Almost all, in fact. This is why dystopia is so popular in YA; teens relate to characters struggling to reconcile their personal identity with what society says they "should" be. Also, romance subplots are strong, and it's not just for wish-fulfillment reasons: romantic/sexual pursuits are beginning to become a part of the target audience's life, and teens relate to the experiences of characters who are discovering love and sexuality.

The first person perspective is popular, probably because it's more personal. (I write in first person because I like the intimacy of it. I like to be able to hear my characters' voices and see the world directly through their perspectives. The story is filtered heavily through the lens of the character's perspective and I like that.) The present tense is also used a lot, but I think this is a fad copying the Hunger Games more than anything.
 
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