This is a discussion on "Time-travel troubles?" in the Writing Questions forum.
Ok...your goal is to have them come back to a place that is 'untrashed', be it before they left or shortly thereafter.
So...cheat. They come back after they left (avoiding time travel paradoxes) - and their place is untrashed...no explanations given, leaving them to wonder *who* fixed it up...or why. Let them ask the questions, but don't give them answers. Preserves a bit of mystery for the next book.
The ability to travel into the past is inherently paradoxical. Pretty much the only way around that is to ignore it.
There's no reason your travelers have to be able to return to a time before they've left… you can simply say that isn't possible, even for the Fae to accomplish. Alternately, they might be able to accomplish it, but may not be willing to do so, for reasons of their own—such as the negation of whatever it was they wanted the characters to do in the first place: it would screw up their timeline as well, by erasing the initial event. This may not lead to the resolution you want, however—in which case you're stuck accepting the paradox. (Your characters' wishes have nothing to do with the matter: you're their boss, after all.)
They could be returned within moments of the time they depart, to a different location, from which point they have relatively greater freedom to attempt to resolve any outstanding matters in some other fashion. Or they could be returned to any other future time they consider convenient, including decades after everyone's forgotten about whatever mess was caused. Or they could be dumped right back when they were, and get saddled with the cleanup, whether they want to be or not.
Barring any of those, you're stuck deciding for yourself what happens when time travelers erase events. It would probably be a lot simpler, and cause fewer headaches, to say that the Fae threw in a magical repair service gratis.
Splitting timelines is the biggest cop-out in the universe: apart from the massive violations of basic laws of thermodynamics—an entire new universe created out of nothing, simply because one event is different?—if it's possible for events to generate new timelines, this renders all actions and choices ultimately meaningless… no matter what you do, there's another universe created in which you didn't, or failed. Not the most ennobling of resolutions.
As for the watch: why does it stop? If it's a spring-wound one, it should go right on functioning normally… it doesn't know anything about correlations between worlds, only that its spring still has tension in it or not. In other words, it perceives the passage of time the same way the characters do, regardless of world. If none of the characters thinks to check the watch until later, they're stuck making their best guess as to when they left. But if it doesn't continue to work, then neither should anything else that functions on the principles of springs… like, say, bows. If it's digital, and you've decided electronics don't function in Faerie for whatever reason, then the watch won't merely stop keeping time, it won't display anything whatsoever.
I have taken all knowledge to be my province. Tariff rates and immigration policies forthcoming.
Is it possible that your characters have picked up some magic during their time in Faerie? Specifically, a spell or item that lets them disguise themselves? That could lead to some awkward (or humorous) moments when they encounter their earlier selves, who of course don't recognize their later selves.
That would work, except that there won't be a next book.Originally Posted by ThinkerX
That is an excellent point. Several, actually. XDThe ability to travel into the past is inherently paradoxical. Pretty much the only way around that is to ignore it.
There's no reason your travelers have to be able to return to a time before they've left… you can simply say that isn't possible, even for the Fae to accomplish. Alternately, they might be able to accomplish it, but may not be willing to do so, for reasons of their own—such as the negation of whatever it was they wanted the characters to do in the first place: it would screw up their timeline as well, by erasing the initial event. This may not lead to the resolution you want, however—in which case you're stuck accepting the paradox. (Your characters' wishes have nothing to do with the matter: you're their boss, after all.
Out of those, the last suggestion would be best. Having them return decades after they left would be bad. What would people think had become of them in the meantime? They might not have a home to come back to -- it might have been torn down in the inbetween years, or have someone else living in it by now, which would cause even more hassle than any of the other ways it could go.
Indeed.
Yeah, true. :/
My reasoning behind that is that Faerie mucks up modern technology, as you said. That's a good point about digital watches; I hadn't thought of that.
The humans haven't spent nearly enough time in Faerie to have picked up any magic of their own. They would have to have been there for hundreds of years, during which time they would have become partly Fae themselves. There are no magic items they'd be able to use for a disguise; the illusions and disguises the Fae create for themselves are cast of their Glamour, which is inherent in their very being. They cannot work such magic on mortals.
Personally, as a reader I'd prefer to have them come back and have to deal with the situation they left behind. Having them come back a few minutes earlier in time strikes me as a bit of a deus ex machina with respect to those conflicts, and I think I'd be likely to view it as an easy out by an author who didn't want to deal with the issues the characters encounter on their return.
"With age came wisdom. Sometimes wisdom came with an ass kicking, too. And nothing could kick ass like the whole world." -The character "Horn" ruminating on his circumstances. The Decaying Mansions of Memory, by Jay Lake.
You, too, can get a copy of Lorelei and the Lost and Found Monster from Amazon.com.
That's a very good point. Though it's not so much a conflict type of mess as a vandalized house type of mess. I can see how the humans would want to not have to deal with it, as it wasn't them who made the mess -- it was all the fault of the Fae who arrested them. I'm tempted in this instance to let the Fae clean it up, as Ravana suggested.
Hello Ireth, here you have my humble opinion... I hope it can help:
The only occasion when I have accepted time-travel issues in a story, and liked them to certain point, was in Prisoner of Azkaban and in my opinion you should try to fix this that way, because it was not too complicated and did not generate too many paradoxes and awkward situations =)
Still, I did not really approve of Rowling's use of time stuff (as I call it) in Prisoner of Azkaban.
Time-travel always causes paradoxes when used in the traditional ways seen in many stories, there is really no way to get around this in my opinion... So, these are my views about Time Stuff:
If you travel to the past somehow, you would not be travelling to the past of your own universe: Instead, you would have travelled to an entirely separate universe that just happens to be a perfect replica of the past of your own world. I believe that there are no time-lines and also no way to travel to the past simply because the past does not exist.
This is why in my own stories my Mages never travel to the past- The past does not exist in their universes, but they could indeed travel to another universe that would be a perfect replica of the past.
If you want to include this time-travel characters and situations in your story, you should try something similar to Prisoner of Azkaban and try to keep it as simple as possible =)
First think about what kind of story you're telling and what type of ending you want. If you want the happily ever after ending with all smiles, don't over think it. It's the end all the real problems have been dealt with. This really has nothing to do with the story or plot anymore, so you're allowed to cheat a little and tie things up in a nice bow and just say they arrived back exactly when they left. No paradoxes. Nobody seeing or missing them. It's all cherries and ice cream. 'And They Lived Happily Ever After. The End'. If this is what you want, it's fine.
If you want a darker ending, you can deal with the consequences of paradox and the results of them leaving and have the end be messy to deal with. If you plan a sequel maybe the paradox is a starting point for the second book, but even then you don't have to deal with it. If you just want a happy ending, have it and leave it at that.
Last edited by Penpilot; 8-6-12 at 2:58 PM.
-Never give up on a dream just because of the time it will take to accomplish it. The time will pass anyway.
-A society which emphasizes uniformity is one which creates intolerance and hate.
Well, the climax looks to be rather dark, so I think I want the ending to be a tad bit lighter to offset it, though by no means is it going to be all puppies and rainbows. They're going to have stuff to deal with in the resolution that stems directly from the climax, so letting them off the hook as far as their trashed house would be preferable. There will be no sequel, as this is the second book in a duology, but I might leave it a bit open-ended to show that yes, life does go on, and it's not all wrapped up in a big red bow when the last page is turned.
Well there are many different ways time travel has been done in films, back to the future has consequences while Terminator does not. Why not have it so when your characters return to the normal time, they can prevent their former selves being captured in the first place?
If the Fea can send people back and forth through time, maybe they have means to hold a paradox? Wether of not they will hand this over willingly, who knows?
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