A Tale Too Long to Sell?

[F.E.O. Tragicomix]

I like a fantasy novel with elements of mystery and intrigue woven in and now I've written one. My manuscript is not "fluffy"--granted at this point anyone reading my post is going to have to take my word for that--but between the world building, character development, pure plot driving, and weaving in that intrigue and mystery the thing is twice as long what literary agents generally consider for a debut book.

I'd love to hear from anyone else having this issue or something like it.

Disclaimer: I'm not saying it's impossible that multiple edits (by me and by others so far) have failed to catch all potentially removable items from my manuscript, just that I've gotten to the point where I have a good deal of faith in what I've done.

 

[Zero Angel]

I like a fantasy novel with elements of mystery and intrigue woven in and now I've written one. My manuscript is not "fluffy"--granted at this point anyone reading my post is going to have to take my word for that--but between the world building, character development, pure plot driving, and weaving in that intrigue and mystery the thing is twice as long what literary agents generally consider for a debut book.

I'd love to hear from anyone else having this issue or something like it.

Disclaimer: I'm not saying it's impossible that multiple edits (by me and by others so far) have failed to catch all potentially removable items from my manuscript, just that I've gotten to the point where I have a good deal of faith in what I've done.

How long is it? Everything I've heard puts the wanted debut word count around 100K. If you're twice that at 200K, then you're right around most sci-fi/fantasy novels

My first novel was 190K, but was not picked up by any publishers and self-print editions are prohibitively expensive. One possible option is turning it into a two-book series if you have logical starting/stopping points and are willing to add a little more to the second half. I am eventually going to split my first novel into a trilogy set to be released after Book 3 comes out.

 

[F.E.O. Tragicomix]

It's in the 200k neighborhood.

...And I've been told just that...agents don't want more than 100k for a first book and that many words should only be for fantasy manuscripts and it's pushing it.

Splitting the book isn't possible, unfortunately, without losing significant impact. It's an option I have explored.

Did you end up self publishing?

 

[psychotick]

Hi,

My first fantasy Maverick was 186,000 words (and every one of them a gem! - In theory.) My current one is currently sitting at 237,000 words as it goes through editing. I did think for a while about splitting Days of Light and Shadow into two books, but there's no natural break in it and I thought I'd just pee off my readers.

Cheers, Greg.

 

[Chilari]

Self publication is a possibly route. While print publication might not be on the cards as it's rather expensive, print on demand services might work for those of your readers who prefer the dead tre variety of book, and there's obviously e-book for the rest. So you might try looking into that.

If you've got your heart set on traditional, it might be worth approaching publishers directly (the ones that accept unsolicitied manuscripts anyway) and see where that takes you, if you're struggling with the literary agent side of things.

Alternatively you could try splitting the novel, not into two as has been suggested and as you've stated you've attempted already, but into shorter installments, and release as a serial novel in six to ten parts as e-books at 99c each or somesuch.

With the flexibility of modern publication brought about thanks to the internet and e-books, don't let the length of your novel hold you back from publishing it.

 

[F.E.O. Tragicomix]

With the flexibility of modern publication brought about thanks to the internet and e-books, don't let the length of your novel hold you back from publishing it.

Thanks, I think I needed to hear that.

My hope is for the traditional route to work out somehow, not because I want the recognition but because I know I'm no salesperson. I went to business school. I know how much time and effort and energy goes into just the promotion portion of any new business (never mind the rest of it). I know too many people whose lives got consumed by such things. That said, I'm sure that I want to spend my mental energy and creativity writing and let and agent and publishing house handle the promotion aspects.

Chilari, you're the second to suggest I try my luck with publishers directly. Serious question, why would a publishing house take a chance on something an agent wouldn't? I honestly don't know a lot about the process.

 

[Chilari]

I can't say I know a huge amount about the process either, mostly just what I've read, but if a publishing house accepts unsolicited manuscripts, which many don't, by the way, then it's worth a shot. As for why they might take it without an agent, I'd suggest most likely because an agent knows what a novel is worth whereas a first time writer does not, and an agent knows how to negociate and understands the contracts while an unpublished author does not. Basically it means more money for them because an author doesn't have the experience and knowledge to negotiate a more favourable contract or eliminate conditions of the contract that treat them unfavourably. So if you do go straight for a publisher, you might want to try to get an agent involved down the line (saying a publisher is interested will make that easier) or read up big time on publishing contracts and what is normal when an agent is involved before signing anything.

 

[Zero Angel]

Did you end up self publishing?

I ended up publishing on Kindle and Nook. I am still working on the print side, but that is more as a marketing tool for the eBook ('cuz the profit margin is tight in print-on-demand).

I can't say I know a huge amount about the process either, mostly just what I've read, but if a publishing house accepts unsolicited manuscripts, which many don't, by the way, then it's worth a shot. As for why they might take it without an agent, I'd suggest most likely because an agent knows what a novel is worth whereas a first time writer does not, and an agent knows how to negociate and understands the contracts while an unpublished author does not. Basically it means more money for them because an author doesn't have the experience and knowledge to negotiate a more favourable contract or eliminate conditions of the contract that treat them unfavourably. So if you do go straight for a publisher, you might want to try to get an agent involved down the line (saying a publisher is interested will make that easier) or read up big time on publishing contracts and what is normal when an agent is involved before signing anything.

I'd recommend at least hiring a lawyer to review the contracts. You can do this without selling your soul (or 7-15% of it anyway).

My biggest recommendation is to just keep writing. Write write write. If you write short stories then try to get those published traditionally, but if not think of them as marketing tools and either e-release them or make them available for free. Same thing with novellas and other novels, set in your fantasy world and without. I think as writers a lot of us approach it with this idea that there is just one thing for us and that one bestseller is what we are looking for. But it is a full-time job like anything else where we really need to produce in order to begin to make money.

Everything about the non-stellar success stories I've read into has always suggested that people that can write for a living write a lot. They usually don't get to go full-time into writing (unless they started that way as they were still parasitical beings...err, I mean children/college students) until they've had several stories out. Those may be ghostwritings, film/TV writings, or several original books.

Remember that our backcatalogue will never expire in the eWorld, and you can continue to earn revenue from books written years ago.

 

[BWFoster78]

My hope is for the traditional route to work out somehow, not because I want the recognition but because I know I'm no salesperson. I went to business school. I know how much time and effort and energy goes into just the promotion portion of any new business (never mind the rest of it). I know too many people whose lives got consumed by such things. That said, I'm sure that I want to spend my mental energy and creativity writing and let and agent and publishing house handle the promotion aspects.

My understanding is that an author pretty much needs to do his own promotion rather he's doing it traditional or self, though you get a bit of help from a publisher.

 

[Leif Notae]

My understanding is that an author pretty much needs to do his own promotion rather he's doing it traditional or self, though you get a bit of help from a publisher.

This is correct. The publishing houses are doing everything else and expect you to hit your numbers within 3 months (sometimes less). If you don't, they take the advance and you have a stigma of not being able to sell books.

The lesson here is to do the self-pub route. If you do well enough, the big boys might call you up and give you a contract. Think of this as the minor league system for baseball.

 

[TWErvin2]

There are a number of publishing houses that focus on fantasy that accept slush submissions:
DAW, Tor, Baen, Ace/Roc for example, in addition to smaller publishers. Often with smaller or ebook publishers, agents are not required. An agent will likely garner more interest from publishers, even if they accept unsolicited submissions. And an author is likely to get a much much faster response when being represented by an agent.

A novel that is 200,000 words is going to be a tough sell. While many epic novels are that long, often the major publishers offer those contracts to authors that have proven themselves in the market place. And, while it's not impossible, having such a long novel adds an additional hurdle, a high one, to an already long-odds journey to reach success.

Dividing a novel into two isn't necessarily a solution, mainly because the structure of a novel doesn't lend itself to that. Each novel would have to have its own story arc and in itself be a satisfying read. Just stopping at chater 37 because it's about the middle and then making chapter 38 of the second novel, maybe with a little re-writing to get it started, probably isn't going to work. And sometimes trying remove content (such as plot lines) can have a really big ripple effect, causing such necessary major revisions, that it'd be easier to write another novel.

A couple of choices to consider:
Finish the novel and send it out there (agent/publisher), expecting rejections, but one never knows.
Put it away for now and bring it out once you've established yourself with another novel or two you wrote and had published.
There is the option others have suggested--self publishing.

In any case, whether you take any of those options, you'll probably be writing another novel anyway. The only route I'd recommend against is finding a subsidary publisher, or finding a small press that is nothing more than an 'author mill' that 'publishes' basically anything sent to them, with little serious editing, cover art, marketing support, etc.

One thing that can help in approaching publishers/agents, is to have a rock solid cover letter or query letter, and an awesome synopsis. Also the first few chapters really have to shine. Yes, I know that should be done anyway, but when an agent/publisher reads 'my 200,000 fantasy novel' it can be a fast turnoff.

Just my two cents...Good luck!

 

[F.E.O. Tragicomix]

Thank you, all of you, for the wonderful advice.

You've given me a lot to look into.

Thanks again!