# prophecies



## eternaldream24 (Jan 13, 2012)

Ok, I have a few questions about prophecies. I've never written a story that contained on until now, and for some reason I'm struggling with it a bit.

1. How long should it be? I think mine is around 3 paragraphs. Is that too long? It's written kind of like a letter. It's not a verbal prophecy.
2. Does someone or something have to give the prophecy or can it just "appear." Right now, I have it that this "note" appeared under my mc's pillow. Do I need to say who put it there or can I just magically appear?

Thanks


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## sashamerideth (Jan 13, 2012)

Personally I don't like prophecies and will write around them. Most prophecies that I have seen are only a few lines long and open to interpretation. 

It's kinda how prophets work, make vague predictions then fit events to them after the fact. Or do the Nostradamus way and be so vague that anything can fit but very far in the future or with no defined time.

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## Graham Irwin (Jan 13, 2012)

A prophecy is usually important in a story when it's coming to fruition after existing for some time in the world you've created. For example, in Christian mythology, the son of god was prophesied coming to earth, and a lot of people disagreed when Jesus said "it's me". In Harry Potter, or Star Wars, you have a similar thing where the protagonist fulfills a prophecy, but the twist is that they were unaware of their significance before.

If you're dealing with a prophesy that was just made, in your story, it could certainly appear under someone's pillow. But who or what or how it got there certainly would be important. Who made the prophecy? Have others heard it? Was it just the MC, and they lost their memory of it?

If Jane wakes up with a note telling her the world will end, the mystery of who left the note would be a big question in my mind.


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## sashamerideth (Jan 13, 2012)

Graham Irwin said:
			
		

> If Jane wakes up with a note telling her the world will end, the mystery of who left the note would be a big question in my mind.



The bigger question for me would be why shouldn't I just throw this piece of paper away and buy another lock for my door.

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## Graham Irwin (Jan 13, 2012)

sashamerideth said:


> The bigger question for me would be why shouldn't I just throw this piece of paper away and buy another lock for my door.



Hahaha!!!!


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## eternaldream24 (Jan 14, 2012)

LOL. Maybe I should have my mc invest in a security system. No, but seriously, you all gave me a lot to think about. If I could write my story without doing the whole prophecy thing I think I would, but I don't know how I can. Maybe if I tell you  a bit about my story, then you can tell me what to do besides a prophecy. I'm going to try really hard to describe this in a way that makes sense.

* mc is born in a medieval type fantasy world. At 3 months old she's stolen by this evil being who goes around murdering people (especially nobility) to seek revenge for the pain he was dealt in life. Anyway, while he is trying to hurt her, the mc's "powers" kick in, and this strange symbol appears on her hand. The symbol of the saving one. She is able to brainwash him into not hurting her. He instead takes her to earth, and puts her at this house where this loving family raises her. She places a protective shield on herself so he can't try to hurt her. So, the symbol disappears, and she doesn't remember any of that, but the protective shield remains. When she's a teen the powers and the symbol come back, and she is called back to the other world to fight this guy when she's 17, which is when the protective shield vanishes. (Is that too hp like?) And the only way to defeat the evil guy is for her to die (or "semi" die) but she doesn't find out this bit of information until later.


How would I make her believe she's the saving one, and that she's the one who has to defeat this guy, without having a prophecy, or some kind of written proof?


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## sashamerideth (Jan 14, 2012)

To be honest it seems too cliche, the chosen one is a bit overdone, but hey it's your story.

I think if you add in events that make her call on powers then she can discover for herself how powerful she is. Put her in trouble, force her to survive. Give her someone to fight for, a reason to survivr. When big bad comes along, she will fight to protect herself and her reason to survive, and die.

She doesn't need to know that she is "chosen" only that she is capable.

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## Benjamin Clayborne (Jan 14, 2012)

I've always wanted to read a fantasy about the guy who is assigned by the evil king to hunt down the Chosen One named in prophecy and kill him.


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## aderyn (Jan 15, 2012)

You could have another character who could interpret the prophecy on the mc's behalf and perhaps try to convince her about her importance in the world?


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## Anders Ã„mting (Jan 16, 2012)

I think prophesies can be useful devices, provided you use them right. I don't think you should have a prophesy just to have a prophesy, but if you can figure out a creative way of fitting it into the story, it will have a stronger effect.

I was working on this comic script once, where prophesies basically worked as inverse memories: They could be inexact or vague, but they always came true one way or the other because causality worked both ways. There was an actual law of the universe stating that if the prophesy says you will do something, you literally cannot avoid doing that even if you try. One character actually attempted to exploit that - there was a prophesy about a hero appearing and saving a princess, so when the local princess (whom he was in love with) got kidnapped by an evil wizard, he tried to make the hero appear because he knew it was impossible for the hero to fail in saving her. (That plan didn't work out the way he envisioned, and actually ended up triggering a different prophesy.)

In another story I'm working on, a character invents a fake prophesy but then gains real clairvoyance and decides to make his original prophesy come true, because he has forseen that in doing so he can further his own ambitions. So he's essentially using his fake prophesy to make his real prophesy come true.

A manga I read had an interesting take on it: A minor character had the power to fortell the future in a very vague sense. At one point she warns one of the main characters that she has seen him in what might be a fatal situation. (Buried upside down to his waist, his legs sticking up into the air.) She had absolutely no idea how or why he'd end up like that, though.

Then another character (who knows a lot more about how time and causality works) tells him that prophesies can be counter-productive, because in knowing your future you may actually ensure it. That is to say, he might not have ended up buried upside down if his friend hadn't told him about it, thus people who could see the future would usually be better off just keeping their visions to themselves. She goes on to explain that he could actually "cheat" by making the prophesy come true deliberatelly, leading to him digging a pit and standing on his head in it. (The prophesy ended up coming true anyway, but turned out to be survivable. His exact reaction was: "I want my money back!")


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## eternaldream24 (Jan 17, 2012)

So, I just ripped up about 5 pages of my novel, the part where I mention the prophecy. Something just isn't right. I have to rethink things. My goal is to take a cliche idea for a story, and turn it into something original. I don't think I'm doing that with this whole prophecy thing, I'm not sure if I should stick with a prophecy or throw that idea out completely. 

All the comments have helped though, I'm going to use all your input to brainstorm some new creative ideas.


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## Anders Ã„mting (Jan 18, 2012)

eternaldream24 said:


> So, I just ripped up about 5 pages of my novel, the part where I mention the prophecy. Something just isn't right. I have to rethink things.



Kill your darlings! 



> My goal is to take a cliche idea for a story, and turn it into something original. I don't think I'm doing that with this whole prophecy thing, I'm not sure if I should stick with a prophecy or throw that idea out completely.



It's never a good sign if you can remove a whole plot point without really affecting the plot.


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## Graham Irwin (Jan 18, 2012)

Try starting with an archetype, rather than a cliche.


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## sashamerideth (Jan 18, 2012)

Graham Irwin said:
			
		

> Try starting with an archetype, rather than a cliche.



What would the archetype be in this case? 

I've heard other ideas, come up with one thing, it will probably be clichÃ©. Throw it away. The second Idea will probably be clichÃ© as well, only after the third thing you think of will you start coming out of the realm of clichÃ©.

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## Graham Irwin (Jan 18, 2012)

So you're saying that if we all come up with three ideas and throw the first two away, the remainder won't be cliche?

WHaaa?


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## sashamerideth (Jan 18, 2012)

Graham Irwin said:
			
		

> So you're saying that if we all come up with three ideas and throw the first two away, the remainder won't be cliche?
> 
> WHaaa?



Not a hard rule, the general idea is to question our own creativity. A little self doubt can be quite useful.

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## Graham Irwin (Jan 18, 2012)

I agree, sashamerideth, that self-doubt can be useful. But sometimes the first one's the charm. Love Me Do was the first song Lennon and McCartney wrote together. If they threw that away... Oh, you're right. That song is silly.


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## sashamerideth (Jan 18, 2012)

Graham Irwin said:
			
		

> I agree, sashamerideth, that self-doubt can be useful. But sometimes the first one's the charm. Love Me Do was the first song Lennon and McCartney wrote together. If they threw that away... Oh, you're right. That song is silly.



That's why it's not a hard rule. Still curious what archetype would be applicable here.

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## Graham Irwin (Jan 18, 2012)

I meant not that an an archetypical prophesy would be appropriate, but that if the writer wants to start with something that has been done before and turn it on its head, an archetype of some kind would be a good place to start. 

Write with archetypes, not cliches.


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## Anders Ã„mting (Jan 18, 2012)

sashamerideth said:


> What would the archetype be in this case?
> 
> I've heard other ideas, come up with one thing, it will probably be clichÃ©. Throw it away. The second Idea will probably be clichÃ© as well, only after the third thing you think of will you start coming out of the realm of clichÃ©.



Can I have those first two, if you're not going to use them?

I find that most things people think are clichÃ©s actually aren't clichÃ©s, but more often underdeveloped ideas.


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## sashamerideth (Jan 18, 2012)

Anders Ã„mting said:
			
		

> Can I have those first two, if you're not going to use them?
> 
> I find that most things people think are clichÃ©s actually aren't clichÃ©s, but more often underdeveloped ideas.



Meh, any idiot with half a brain can come up with a hundred ideas a day. Takes talent, determination and knowledge to turn an idea into a story.

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## Graham Irwin (Jan 18, 2012)

sashamerideth said:


> Meh, any idiot with half a brain can come up with a hundred ideas a day. Takes talent, determination and knowledge to turn an idea into a story.



Also easy to throw negativity around on forums all day. Takes honor, tact, and respect to post anything in the way of encouragement or support.


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## sashamerideth (Jan 18, 2012)

Graham Irwin said:
			
		

> Also easy to throw negativity around on forums all day. Takes honor, tact, and respect to post anything in the way of encouragement or support.



You trying to say something Graham? Cause I will rip your spleen from your gut and draw my picture on... Wait, this isn't the thread about excessive gore is it. 

It's true that ideas are easy, stories are harder. I have had half a dozen ideas already, but most aren't useful for what I am writing, as a published author, you must be familiar with this as well. I do try try to encourage and help, haven't beat some of the mods on post count without offering help and encouragement. 

Anyhow I just had an idea that will work in one of my stories, going to take note of it and explore the idea. Catch you on the flip side.

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## Anders Ã„mting (Jan 18, 2012)

sashamerideth said:


> Meh, any idiot with half a brain can come up with a hundred ideas a day. Takes talent, determination and knowledge to turn an idea into a story.



Sounds like your ability to generate ideas is your strongest point as a writer, then. That's fine - I used to be in that stage of my writing as well. 

These days I don't get ideas quite that often. But in return, the ones I do get are usually good ones.



Graham Irwin said:


> Also easy to throw negativity around on forums all day. Takes honor, tact, and respect to post anything in the way of encouragement or support.



You, I like. Let us be not-enemies!


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## sashamerideth (Jan 18, 2012)

Anders Ã„mting said:
			
		

> Sounds like your ability to generate ideas is your strongest point as a writer, then.



Thanks for the compliment  I have been seeing someone that already has two books going to agents and publishers, hoping she gets someone to take her up. She's got a head full of ideas, much more and better ones than mine. She's a kind of inspiration for me. 

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## CicadaGrrl (Jan 21, 2012)

Oh, I'm books behind my ideas.  The ones I think are tenable.  Of course they have folders and I jot notes into them every now and then, but I'm in the second book of a trilogy at the moment.  

Actually, my book coming out on Feb 15, _Shining in Darkness_[/I], the culture has a huge focus on a prophecy that not only comes, but comes again and again in a war that can't be won.  There are those who can see into the future, who add to the masses of prophecy lore, and it does keep happening so there has to be something to it.  But a lot of what exactly the High Priestesses and Priest put out there for average priestesses and priests to teach to teachers to teach kids--that information may be selected for politics more than anything else.  So the question is, what is spiritually true, and what is mortal?  I actually hate prophecies.


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## AryaPotter13 (Jan 27, 2015)

Hello!
I am currently writing a fantasy novel with my best friend Oona Clark, and there are going to be three prophecies in it, the endings all the same, mostly because the main character is going to be offered a choice between three destinies, and while they all end similarly, they are vastly different.
KEDme, from Fanfiction.net gave me permission to use parts of the prophecy he/she (I'm not sure which) wrote for The Serpents Shadow, since I am absolutely rubbish at poetry and the like.
Here is the prophecy I am using for the book:
Through the mist, the darkness grows,
The Shadow of the Serpent goes,
Stronger, steadier, formless in stealth,
Anger, desire, self-loathing, wealth,
The brave, the noble, the pure of heart,
The wise, the gentle, the loyal art,
Forsaken to it’s almighty power,
All is lost upon the midnight hour,
But hope springs forth if she holds true,
Victory comes to the chosen few,
Into the darkness the child, the foe,
The heroes return that destiny knows,
The battle rages, the pieces set,	
Out of the depth of hell they met,
The plume of the serpent,
The jewel of the eye,	
The feather of tears,
The gift of the sky,	
The ghost of the past will be your guide,
But only when wand and sword collide.
I was wondering if any of you could help me with writing the other two prophecies, or at least give me some advice.
All the best,
Arya


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