# Age of gunpower setting?



## hots_towel (Jan 23, 2014)

Recently i've been heavily contemplating reskinning my WIP from a medieval low fantasy to a.....Renaissance Low fantasy. After thinking over my major plot points ( i have yet to read over each detail to see how this setting would conflict), the transition wouldnt change up the plot points too much. There are a few factors keeping me from doing this though, but I would like your opinions on this. 

My first reason is, I don't think its a very popular setting. People (or atleast people I know) look at the 16th/17th century and immediately deem it something they wouldnt care about. I feel there are a lot of other people who would feel the same way. 

my second reason is, I would have to research an entirely different era. Lately I've been reading other general fantasy novels to get a feel of how other authors introduce a new world. i've been reading up on lifestyle of the typical middle ages castle and village life. There's also the military aspect that I have to rethink. While it opens up new possibilities, it warrants much more research. 

This isn't TOO much of a good reason, but one of the factions in my WIP is heavily influenced by northern Europe in the middle ages/dark ages (you know, vikings, barbarians, all that good stuff every fantasy has). However, im not sure how they would look in a world where everyone is entering gun powder and they are still in garb resembling centuries ago. 

TL;DR: What are you opinions on a fantasy setting set in an age with gunpowder


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## buyjupiter (Jan 23, 2014)

I like the idea, as there are a lot of pseudo-medieval fantasy stories out there, and I can think of very few that are set during the late Renaissance/Early Modern. (Nothing wrong with Medieval Fantasy, just noting there's a lot.)

I really like the time period. You get the Reformation to play around with, the Thirty Years War, Elizabeth I, Henri IV's assassination, the Low Countries feuding with Spain, the Three Musketeers was set in this time period, merchant navies start to come into play...the opportunities are endless. (You might reference Eric Flint's _1632 _ series as a starting point for things to research. In addition to being very well researched, the novels go into a lot of depth of what 17th century Central Europe was like. With the addition of time-shifted Americans from West Virginia. It's alt-history.)

Since you mentioned that you're mainly focused on Northern Europe, I would definitely suggest looking into the Thirty Years War in depth. That's really the only time Sweden kicked Europe's butt. Sweden. (You could argue Vikings, but that's a generic term for time period as well as culture spread across Northern Europe. Or you could argue that Alexander Skarsgard kicks everyone's butt. I won't argue with that.)

You can still have your castles and normal village life without much change from the Medieval period, at least in the earliest parts of the 16th century. And really, village life didn't change much from Medieval to Early Modern (which is what the 16th/17th century would be for most of Europe--excluding Russia/Russian-dominated territories, and England). 

Tailoring does become more important in the late Middle Ages to early Renaissance, but only for the nobility. As a whole, you still don't get really super structured pieces until the mid-1600s? (Fashion history experts please correct me if I'm wrong.) For the rest of society, you get your basic dress & trousers/shirt combo. (Most countries had Sumptuary Laws that forbid the lower classes from adopting garment types/colors/materials reserved for the nobility.)


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## Chilari (Jan 23, 2014)

My WIP is set in the age of gunpowder/colonisation. Muskets and pistols appear in the story. I needed a period of colonisation to set the stage for what I wanted to do with it - a penal colony abandoned by those in charge following a deadly plague. It gives me the isolation I want, with the nebulous outside threat I want, to tell the story. I tried the same story in various different settings before, using wars, natural disasters and so on to set the stage, but this way works a lot better and is closer to the original vision.

If you're looking for a better idea of the context, try reading the Sharpe books by Bernard Cornwell, or watch the TV series (available on Youtube) starring Sean Bean (he doesn't die!). Also try the Aubrey-Maturin books by Patrick O'Brian, if you've got anything set on the sea. They're a bit slow paced, but beautifully detailed and they have brilliant characterisation.


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## crash (Jan 23, 2014)

Do it! Write it now! Late Renaissance, early modern period Europe is so amazing and there's so much stuff going on at the time! I like it when people get creative with the settings.


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## hots_towel (Jan 23, 2014)

buyjupiter said:


> I like the idea, as there are a lot of pseudo-medieval fantasy stories out there, and I can think of very few that are set during the late Renaissance/Early Modern. (Nothing wrong with Medieval Fantasy, just noting there's a lot.)
> 
> I really like the time period. You get the Reformation to play around with, the Thirty Years War, Elizabeth I, Henri IV's assassination, the Low Countries feuding with Spain, the Three Musketeers was set in this time period, merchant navies start to come into play...the opportunities are endless. (You might reference Eric Flint's _1632 _ series as a starting point for things to research. In addition to being very well researched, the novels go into a lot of depth of what 17th century Central Europe was like. With the addition of time-shifted Americans from West Virginia. It's alt-history.)
> 
> ...


this definitely helps. I was kinda aimless about where I was supposed to look or what i was supposed to look up to get the right research, but those are great starting points. Thanks! as for the vikings things (and i just remembered a chariot scene set in a separate part of my world), i guess I have to sacrifice some things if I really want that setting. hopefully it pays off haha!


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## hots_towel (Jan 23, 2014)

Chilari said:


> If you're looking for a better idea of the context, try reading the Sharpe books by Bernard Cornwell, or watch the TV series (available on Youtube) starring Sean Bean (he doesn't die!). Also try the Aubrey-Maturin books by Patrick O'Brian, if you've got anything set on the sea. They're a bit slow paced, but beautifully detailed and they have brilliant characterisation.


thats for the help! and yes, i can think of one event right away where there is a scene that involves seafaring. so I'll give those books a look over, even if the part im thinking of is only in one planned scene so far haha.


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## skip.knox (Jan 23, 2014)

I love O'Brian, but his stories are Napoleonic era, which is a bit later that what hots_towel is talking about. Plus, there are any number of fantasy stories set in that context. For that matter, there are plenty in Elizabethan England. More fun, imo, would be 16thc on the Continent. The 17thc gets even better, with the Dutch Revolt, the 30YW, the Great Northern War, etc. Plenty o' wars.

But also: Scientific Revolution (which can make low fantasy fun), witchcraft craze (see previous), a boom in alchemy, astrology and secret societies (ibidem), exploration of the New World, and the whole so-called military revolution.

Here's another possible advantage. People (well, okay, Americans) tend not to know much about the era, especially outside of England. I teach medieval subjects but also the Reformation era, and I have found students need a lot of hand-holding for this period. The plus side is your reader will bring many stereotypes with them to any medieval setting, but not so much for the 17thc. Probably the strongest would be the Three Musketeers stereotypes. I should think an author could have a freer hand, particularly if the setting was in the newly-forming Switzerland, or the newly-forming Netherlands, or in Poland or Austria. You would give away Vikings, but you'd gain Turks!


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## hots_towel (Jan 23, 2014)

skip.knox said:


> Here's another possible advantage. People (well, okay, Americans) tend not to know much about the era, especially outside of England. I teach medieval subjects but also the Reformation era, and I have found students need a lot of hand-holding for this period. The plus side is your reader will bring many stereotypes with them to any medieval setting, but not so much for the 17thc. Probably the strongest would be the Three Musketeers stereotypes. I should think an author could have a freer hand, particularly if the setting was in the newly-forming Switzerland, or the newly-forming Netherlands, or in Poland or Austria. You would give away Vikings, but you'd gain Turks!


if i decide to go along with this, then yes, I will be sad about conceding my vikings  the closest i can do without it being laughably unbelievable would be to make them nordic-esque tribes men with guns lol. of course I would set this during a time where firearms units still only make up a fraction of an army (along side traditional missile units). of course this is all just 1 aspect of the story. 

and you're right about this era not being popular in here in the states. Ancient history was covered in 6th grade for me. i doubt anyone i went to school with remembers anything about that time period. Middle ages were covered in 7th grade. anything after that is europe starting from 1800's or America starting from its founding. Thirty years war is covered only AP classes


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## Malik (Jan 23, 2014)

Michael and Linda Pearce have a series called "Diaries of a Dwarven Rifleman" set in a proto-gunpowder fantasy world. Big fun and it's a genre idea that's barely been scratched at.


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## ThinkerX (Jan 24, 2014)

'The Thousand Names' is a 'gunpowder' tale set in a independent fantasy world with a bit of magic thrown in.

The 'Iron Elves' books (not sure if that's the series name or not) are also Gunpowder fantasy with a fair amount of magic.

For that matter, the various stories in my world include the introduction of gunpowder, though as bombs, not firearms.


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## Myth Stalker (Jan 24, 2014)

Warhammer is one of my favorite fantasy series to read. Brunner the bounty hunter is definitely one of the coolest characters I've read. Personally, I dislike the Warhammer game but the lore is incredible. Firearms and cannons are a staple. I would suggest reading some of the Warhammer lore if you want a good feel for gunpowder themes and different reactions to firearms from characters.


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## CupofJoe (Jan 26, 2014)

If you want a look at what 1620 Britain has been reconstructed as have a look at the show.
Tales from the Green Valley
Most if not all of the episodes seem to be on YouTube.
I suppose I should point out that there is an official DVD available.
The same team has gone on to to similar reconstruction for the 1500s, 1850s, 1910s and 1940s.


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