# Is English the language of Fantasy Literature??



## Sheilawisz (Nov 8, 2011)

Hello everyone =)

This is the first thread that I start here in Mythic Scribes after my thread in the Introductions section, and the question that I wanted to ask you all is this:

Do you think that the English language is really the language of Fantasy Literature these days??

Almost all of the Fantasy series that are popular today are written in English, and I feel (as my native language is Castilian) that to be successful in Fantasy you must write in English and if you write in any other language you already start with a serious disadvantage =(

Two of my series are written in Castilian and only one is being written in English, so... what do you think??

Sheila


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## FictionQuest (Nov 8, 2011)

Stieg Larsson wrote his books in Swedish. English is obviously important but you should probably focus on the story and the characters in your most comfortable language. Then worry about translation later once you are confident you have something great.


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## The Blue Lotus (Nov 8, 2011)

Oh I don't know I have read a few books in Hindi. 
My editor is Dutch speaking, so she has emailed me some really great short stories that she translated. 

I guess it boils down to who your target audiance is. IF you want people in America to read it it will have to be translated into English, there is no way around that. If your target market is in spain well you have the leg up since that is your native language.  

I envy people who are able to swap languages like you can, I have tried it and failed uttlerly. 

Write in the Language that you are most comfortable in. Then translate it (Use someone who is an English Native speaker, but is Very apt at Spanish too,) if you are looking to broaden the market you can reach. 

All the best, 
~BL~


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## Devor (Nov 8, 2011)

I think English is the language of the fantasy setting, but only if you define the genre very narrowly.  Wizards and elves and faeries and dwarves represented the folklore of Britain and the cultures they interacted with, and Britain was largely the melting pot of old Europe.  It seems only natural to me that English speakers would hold closer to offshoots of that traditional fantasy setting more strongly than other speakers, and that an author working in such a setting would do better in English.

But of course, there's other kinds of fantasy settings, and there has to be something which appeals to the Castilian-speaking audience.  Do it well, and the story will translate.


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## Lord Darkstorm (Nov 8, 2011)

The reason more fantasy books are in english is probably because of the number of potential readers.  There are a few hundred million people in the US, and most of them speak english.  If you toss in england, and the fact that many countries actually teach english, it has the majority of potential readers.

Do you have to write in english to be successful?  Not really.  Although, your audience will be limited by the number of people who read that language.  Here is where I think a good story is worth more than just the words that it is written in.  Many books that are good stories have been translated into other languages, but even translated, it doesn't have the same quality of writing as the original.  Converting the words to mean the same thing doesn't always give it proper flow in the language it is translated to.   Good stories can bridge that gap easier because they are relying upon the tale being told, than just the words that are telling them.


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## Hans (Nov 9, 2011)

I think english speakers have an advantage. We have some phantasy authors here in germany, but the shelves are full of translated english works. To get a translation the other way is more complicated.
I know that some works of Wolfgang Hohlbein have been translated. But has anybody in the english speaking world heared of Markus Heitz? Bernhard Hennen? Kai Meyer?

I don't know how hard it is to get published as an english speaking author. But when you are publisht that language as an advantage.


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## SeverinR (Nov 9, 2011)

Devor said:


> I think English is the language of the fantasy setting, but only if you define the genre very narrowly.  Wizards and elves and faeries and dwarves represented the folklore of Britain and the cultures they interacted with, and Britain was largely the melting pot of old Europe.  It seems only natural to me that English speakers would hold closer to offshoots of that traditional fantasy setting more strongly than other speakers, and that an author working in such a setting would do better in English.
> 
> But of course, there's other kinds of fantasy settings, and there has to be something which appeals to the Castilian-speaking audience.  Do it well, and the story will translate.



The most common fantasy stories are based on England, Scotland, Ireland, Norse, and in general Europe, which England if not conquered it traded closely and shared the stories of Fantasy legends.
In turn, the USA has thrived on European fantasy.

Although, New Zealand is the fantasy film nation.  Is there a better terrain combonation with un-urbanized landscapes with few contrail risks in the skies?


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## Amanita (Nov 9, 2011)

> But has anybody in the english speaking world heared of Markus Heitz? Bernhard Hennen? Kai Meyer?


I'm not sure, if they've missed much if they haven't. 
To me, it's rather obvious that there's little interest in translating stories using concepts established by English-speaking authors from other languages. The English-speaking crowd has plenty of these themselves and many of them are better, because they're closer to the source. And some concepts are just difficult to use in other languages. There's no good German word for "Dark Lord" for example and there are other concepts where this applies as well.
If a story is really outstanding it will get translated though. A recent example are the Russian Nightwatch books which has even been turned into an international film. 

I don't think that anyone should refuse to use their native language because they believe, there story might be more marketable if they write in English. 
Fantasy direly needs more diversity and using your own language (and cultural background) is a start. The belief in elves/fairies for example is mainly a British or if I'm correct rather Irish thing which might be the reason why for me, those have never been a necessary part of fantasy. 
The last thing we need, in my opinion, is fantasy writing which is like popular music, everyone doing the same stuff in English no matter if they're actually good with the languag or not, because that's how it's done. 
Please not.
Fantasy needs different approaches and if possible from non-western countries as well.


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## Sheilawisz (Nov 9, 2011)

Hello everyone and thank you for your posts =)

I think that writing Fantasy in English has an advantage because English is the international language of today, but that's not why my Joan of England series is actually being written in English instead of Castilian like my other series... That series takes place mainly in the England of a parallel Earth, so English was the natural and only choice for that story

About the cultural background, I really don't care- My surreal series take place in completely different worlds and universes without humans, elves, fairies, giants, dwarves and all those creatures, so from a cultural point of view they are... something else... I am not sure whether the American fantasy readers would like my Joan series or not, but the others shall remain in Castilian because I think that any translation always damages the original work



The Blue Lotus said:


> I envy people who are able to swap languages like you can, I have tried it and failed uttlerly.


 Thanks for that, but please consider that I have been learning English for my entire life and when I write stories with it I still have the feeling that the language is always one step ahead of me... I never feel like I can really grasp it!!

Sheila


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## The Blue Lotus (Nov 9, 2011)

Amanita said:


> I'm not sure, if they've missed much if they haven't.
> To me, it's rather obvious that there's little interest in translating stories using concepts established by English-speaking authors from other languages. The English-speaking crowd has plenty of these themselves and many of them are better, because they're closer to the source. And some concepts are just difficult to use in other languages. There's no good German word for "Dark Lord" for example and there are other concepts where this applies as well.
> If a story is really outstanding it will get translated though. A recent example are the Russian Nightwatch books which has even been turned into an international film.
> 
> ...



I agree that diversity needs to be injected, however... Writers write for one of two reasons. 1) They write for the pleasure it gives them. Or 2) They write for money.... if one is writing for the money, you have to ask yourself. _Where does my target market live?
_ 
One can not write a novel in Spanish and expect it to fare well in America. One could however, write a novel based in a Latin country, with Latin elements, beliefs, mythology etc, in English and it will do just fine. Barring a few provisions of course.

There are a lot of peope these days who are trying hard to break the cycle of Sparkely vamps, and Watered down story lines, all set within predictably boarding places. Take a hard look at the Showcase here... There are tons of posts with fantastic settings, in places one would not expect. The people here never fail to amaze me with the ammount of time and care that they put into each and every word. I can't think of anything I have read that is predictable, or carbon copy, AKA "Mainstream".  


I personaly have been working on a story line that is set mainly in Southeast Asia, the US, and a few other places. All these stories are singular in the fact that while written in English, I wish to give each line of the whole their own culture, flavor, history, and mythology. I do that by drawing lines from that regions very real myths. 


 I have a friend whom is a well known ( in some circles ) fantasy author in India, who writes purely in Hindi, not the new Hindustani stuff, but old pure Hindi. His work does very well. My self I use what he calls "Hinglish" but that is a story for a later date.  

I maintain that one should write in the language they are most familure with, and then if they like, translate using help where things get a bit muddled. 

As for Faries being an Irish thing, I can name at least half a dozen countries that each have their own myths about Faries...  There is a lot of matterial out there that can be used if we take the time to dig it out.


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## The Blue Lotus (Nov 9, 2011)

Sheilawisz said:


> Thanks for that, but please consider that I have been learning English for my entire life and when I write stories with it I still have the feeling that the language is always one step ahead of me... I never feel like I can really grasp it!!
> 
> Sheila




Yeah I know the feeling... And I grew up speaking English. It is my first language and yet, sometimes, words still fail me... 
So don't be too hard on yourself!


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## Amanita (Nov 10, 2011)

The Blue Lotus said:
			
		

> One can not write a novel in Spanish and expect it to fare well in America.


That much is obvious.  
There are plenty of people in European countries who aren’t comfortable enough with the English language to enjoy reading books written in it. That’s why I think that they should have original works in their own language to read and not merely translations. 
I also have my doubts that American publishers will be too keen on bringing out anything by an author from another country who doesn’t have English as their first language as well. There are so many established and potential American fantasy writers that there’s no need to look so far. 
If a book is really outstanding enough to be picked up under these conditions, it might also get an official translation if published in another language. 



> There are a lot of people these days who are trying hard to break the cycle of Sparkely vamps, and Watered down story lines, all set within predictably boarding places.


That’s definitely true as far as the Showcase is concerned. About 90% of the stuff on book store shelves sadly enough is about either Elves, Orcs and Dwarves or Vampire romance.


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## Sheilawisz (Nov 10, 2011)

The Blue Lotus said:


> Yeah I know the feeling... And I grew up speaking English. It is my first language and yet, sometimes, words still fail me... So don't be too hard on yourself!


 That sounds very strange to me, but I believe you =) I sometimes feel envious of you native English speakers even though I love my own language!! I just can't get out of my mind the idea that English is the superior language, the one and only, the best of the world because that's what they would always tell me while I was growing up...



Amanita said:


> I also have my doubts that American publishers will be too keen on bringing out anything by an author from another country who doesn’t have English as their first language as well. There are so many established and potential American fantasy writers that there’s no need to look so far. That’s definitely true as far as the Showcase is concerned. About 90% of the stuff on book store shelves sadly enough is about either Elves, Orcs and Dwarves or Vampire romance.


 That's why I am seriously considering to self-publish online my Joan of England series when I finish it =)

And about the creatures, no elves, orcs, dwarves or vampires in my worlds!! In my stories the common people are not even humans, they are a strange species with fangs, tail, claws instead of hands and powers that come from radiation inside their bodies... You can also find huge snake-like dragons with magical powers, 16meter-tall monsters that spit napalm and wield swords and super mages that nuke cities left and right without a care in the world =)

Sheila


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## Terra Arkay (Nov 10, 2011)

Well since English is the most spoken language (I think), yeah but it also depends on what language you're most comfortable with.


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## Lord Darkstorm (Nov 11, 2011)

> I sometimes feel envious of you native English speakers even though I love my own language!! I just can't get out of my mind the idea that English is the superior language, the one and only, the best of the world because that's what they would always tell me while I was growing up...



More like the most confusing language in the world.  The rules are complex, and often times confusing, it gets brutalized by almost every different social group in some ways.  I cringe every time I hear someone say "My bad" over "I'm sorry", or something that is actually accurate.  It took me thirty years to realize I could read and speak english, and could even recognize good writing over bad, but I didn't understand it.  Just because I think in it doesn't mean I have a solid grasp on all it's aspects.  I do ok, but I'm a long way off from and expert.

Honestly, what most people forget is that it's the story that makes the book good, not the language it is written in.  I know Orson Scott Card has had many of his books translated into dozens of other languages.  Not because his words were the best ever, but the stories were good, very good.  

Create good stories, and those of us who enjoy them, can do so even with a translated version that isn't as perfect as it could be if done natively in english.


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## Johnny Cosmo (Nov 11, 2011)

> Well since English is the most spoken language (I think), yeah but it also depends on what language you're most comfortable with.



I don't know if it's the most spoken, but the most widespread.


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## Sheilawisz (Nov 12, 2011)

Lord Darkstorm said:


> More like the most confusing language in the world.  The rules are complex, and often times confusing, it gets brutalized by almost every different social group in some ways.  I cringe every time I hear someone say "My bad" over "I'm sorry", or something that is actually accurate.  It took me thirty years to realize I could read and speak english, and could even recognize good writing over bad, but I didn't understand it.  Just because I think in it doesn't mean I have a solid grasp on all it's aspects.  I do ok, but I'm a long way off from and expert.


Lord Darkstorm, you have just helped me to feel much better and confident about my English language skills... Thank you =)


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## Ophiucha (Nov 14, 2011)

Language is a tough one, when it comes to what it's best to write in. Language is inherently tied to culture - if you are influenced primarily by English-language fantasy works (Tolkien and whatnot), at least in regards to this story, then it does stand to reason that there'd be a good cause to write your story in English. And, from your posts, it does seem that you are good enough at English to write a decent book in the language. So I say, go for it. I think it is worth touching on this a bit further, since it's something that fascinates me - the language of a work.

I should say that I don't know a thing about Spanish beyond the colours, so I'm not gonna say anything specific to your background, but I've got a few things to consider. For one, there is this fantastic perspective in this article, I Didn't Dream of Dragons, which inspired me to hunt down any and all foreign fantasy books I could find. And that language is tied to mythology in many ways. There's always something lost in translation, you know? As you mention that you want to write the story set in England with English characters and presumably English myths, it is definitely beneficial to write it in English. I am writing a story about a fantasy counterpart Russia right now, and every day, I think about scrapping the whole thing and starting over in Russian (even though I am not as fluent in it, not as comfortable with it), because there are so many words and ideas that I need to leave in Russian for the full effect.

Even small things. Most Americans know what a Tsar is. They can figure out Tsaritsa after I refer to the tsar's wife by it for the fifth or sixth time. Once you involve their child, their aristocrats, etc., the titles become many, and at some point, it becomes a question of "should I just call their daughter 'princess' (or grand duchess or whatever)?" But then, I call her father Tsar. Should I just call him King Fyodor. Fyodor, that's just Theodore. Where does the translation end? The creatures come from Slavic mythology, as well. And though many had... similarities to English faeries, they aren't all quite the same.

I think about this a lot when I'm reading works about fantasy!China and a dragon pops up. We use the word dragon because they are similar, it was an easy thing to translate it to. But they aren't the same, by any means. Even though I think most readers will read 'dragon' and see the long dragon (unintentional pun) with the catfish whiskers and no wings, the connotation held is still of the Western dragon. People still see the word and think of a firebreather, which most East Asian myths lack, and it... even though we all understand the word 'dragon', there's part of me that wants the author to use another word.

This is all way off topic, now... I say go with English, if you can. But, I guess, ultimately, write in the language you are most comfortable with. If you keep finding yourself stumbling over words or thinking of a better way to say something, a way you can't manage in English, then by all means write in the one you are more comfortable with. Ultimately, writing is something you should enjoy and something that you can craft to your liking, no matter the limitations you'll face one way or the other. I don't think you should feel obliged to write in English, but if your story takes place in England and you want to write it in English, then please do. Go with what you think is right, as a writer.


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## Sheilawisz (Nov 15, 2011)

Hello Ophiucha, and thank you for that great post!! =)

I decided a long time ago that my Joan of England series would be written in English and that is not going to change, as I have already finished the first two novels and half of the third and last... That's the series that I really want to publish someday, as my other stories are way too strange and surreal to be liked by Fantasy readers of today

About the cultural backgrounds of any language and how it could be applied to a Fantasy story, I really don't care- I create my own worlds after all, and I celebrate imagination and not the cultural background of any language or country =)

Sheila


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