# On Being Too Young (Naive, Inexperienced, Immature, etc.)



## DragonOfTheAerie (Sep 30, 2016)

All of you know that I'm probably one of the youngest active members here (that meaning teenaged) but, in hindsight, I really would rather have kept that fact to myself. I want to be a writer. Not a young writer or teenage writer or whatever prefix you can attach. 

It's a large source of self-doubt, really. There's the usual people not taking you as seriously as they would an adult, assuming you're a complete beginner, etc...but it's worse. I feel like I'm not qualified to write my stories. I feel like I shouldn't be so ambitious at this age. I feel like I'm doomed to eventually throw out everything I write at this age because I'm not mature yet and I'll feel different about everything when I am, so why try? It's depressing. I feel like I don't have the personal experience to write the vast majority of stuff I write. They say write what you know. I don't know what on earth I would be writing if I did so; I probably would have already run out of material. I've never experienced at least 99% of the things I write about, and that's okay when it's something like teleportation or riding a dragon because literally no one has experienced it. But, there are all kinds of experiences that nearly everyone has that I DON'T have just because I'm not an adult...It's pretty frustrating. For example...how do you do a romantic subplot having *never* been in anything close to a relationship? The same way you write a fight scene if you've never been in a fight? But far more people have been in a romance then have been in a fight...I haven't had time to read all the books everyone has read. I haven't had time to do so many things. 

I hadn't thought it would be such a problem, but it's actually quite a handicap. Actual, or made of irrational self-doubt? No idea. 

It's not productive to sit around and wait to get experience and wisdom before writing the things you want to write. I could wait until I'm older, yeah, but these stories are on my mind and heart NOW. My main characters are older than me, my stories are more mature than I am. How do you manage that?? How do you write about becoming a father if you've never had a child yourself?  How do you write about having a close family member die if you've never lost anyone extremely close to you? Heck, I've never broken a bone, there are a million foods I've never tried, I've barely traveled outside my own region of the country... You can imagine, you can ask, you can research, but it will only take you so far. 

Would an older person be wondering this? Or is it mainly a thing that's been planted in my head because I know I'm young? Just being young can give you a feeling of complete inadequacy. 

Ok--at risk of making this awkward--this is mostly about the romantic subplot(s) I'm planning. I mean, this whole problem of inadequacy due to youth has been weighing on me for a long time, but more so recently because of the directions my writing is going. As I said--no personal experience WHATSOEVER! With being attracted to people, yeah, but nothing past that. But, my characters are older than me, practically adults toward the end of the story. Which means I will end up writing a bunch of things I have NO IDEA ABOUT. The emotions aren't that hard, but whenever things get physical a banshee-like voice harangues me in this fashion: "THEY KNOW! THEY KNOW YOU DONT KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT! THEY'RE LAUGHING AT YOU!" "They," in many cases, being my future self. I can hardly stand to read ANYTHING I wrote 3-4 years ago, it just makes me sweat it's so bad, so I can only imagine what *this* will be like. Uuuuuuggghhhhhh. 

And, yeah, sure, I could avoid everything I don't know anything about, but I don't *want* to be restricted, not necessarily because I want to write these things and HAVE to, but because I want to be *JUST A WRITER* who can write whatever she wants and not a Newly Hatched Baby Writer. *Collective 'Awww!' from the MS community.* It kinda feels like a video game where you're on a really low level and tons of gear and stuff is unavailable to you for no reason other than that you need more xp. 

I know a lot of you say write what you know is BS, but it seems to reach a limit. I lurked on here for several weeks before making an account and read through tons of old threads, some from years ago. Someone had a question about what throat kissing felt like (or something, I don't remember) and the general consensus was "don't write what you don't know; they can tell." *"THEY CAN TELL!" echoes the Naughty Scene Police Banshee.* I wish the voices would just shut up...

The handicap isn't just that I want to write things I don't know, but that I want to do it *well.* When I'm describing a fight or a journey through a forest or a particular injury I'm like "This is good, but...It could be *so* much better if I knew what I was talking about..." I mean, it's okay to not know what it feels like to be stitched up without anesthesia (this happens a bunch in my WIP...I put my characters through a lot...) but when you're describing something much more universal, it's a much worse sin. 

I know I'm extremely critical of myself anyway. I hate posting things on here, I get the unbearable urge to delete it all every time. I hate sending stuff to people; I end up re-reading it and cringing in horror that someone actually saw this mess. I just don't know if to trust my feelings on this. Typically I ignore my feelings. Having anxiety makes you leery of your own emotions' advice. 

This makes me feel not only that I shouldn't or can't write many things, but that it's pointless to write things. I've been rewriting my WIP since I was 12 and it's now an entirely different story. My inner narrative goes something like this: "You're still changing and growing and your writing and ideas will grow and change too, and you won't be able to stick to one idea for as long as it takes to write such an ambitious project. Also, everything you write now will seem horrible to you later because you'll be so much *older* and wiser. So why bother?" In short, I feel like everything I do now is pointless because later I won't like it, it won't come to anything, and it will be terrible because I'm a teenager and will have totally different interests and perspectives when I'm an adult. Ok, that wasn't much shorter than what I said first. But it is my feelings. My parents are like "Maybe this story is preparing you for another story you'll write later!" And it breaks my heart to think that a story I put my heart and soul into is doomed to just be a means to an end because of my age. It also breaks my heart that I won't be able to develop these stories to their full potential because of my age. Or that I'll have to wait so long to be able to write them in the way they deserve. 

There's no good answer.


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## Heliotrope (Sep 30, 2016)

Oddly enough, I'm in my thirties and I still feel like this. 

But I keep telling myself that if I keep going, by the time I'm sixty I'll have been writing for almost forty years, so I'll be pretty kick ass by then.


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## Saigonnus (Oct 1, 2016)

I didn't start writing until I was in my 20s, though I did GM D&D campaigns when I was a teenager, which did require a bit of writing and a lot of creativity. 

Thus, I have no frame of reference of being a young writer with limited experience. I have being a middle-age relatively inexperienced writer. 

My advice: "Don't let a lack of experience stop you from writing." 

Anything you write now; even if it is never published, still gives you valuable experience finding your voice, finding your style and as you have life's experiences, it will simply add to what you have learned. Don't be discouraged!

Perhaps you might work on short stories instead if throwing yourself into a multi-volume epic, stories set in your fantasy world and with familiar characters, all of which could add more depth to the novels that will inevitably be set in this world. It will also be good practice. 

I hope this help alleve at least some of the stress and anxiety you seem to be feeling at the moment.


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## Heliotrope (Oct 1, 2016)

Also, Gordon Korman, a famous Canadian Author wrote his first novel when he was 12, and had it published by scholastic by the time he was 14. 

Gordon Korman - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Macdonald Hall #1: This Can't Be Happening at Macdonald Hall!: Gordon Korman: 9780545289245: Books - Amazon.ca


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## MineOwnKing (Oct 1, 2016)

It's hard to put rough drafts on the shelf, but in time you won't even remember writing them.

It's awesome that you're writing at all. 

The fact that you're actively writing and seeking advice at such a young age means you have the potential to only get better at everything, including real life stuff.

I would take a deep breath and give yourself a break. If a person listened to classical music everyday for twenty years, they might understand and appreciate music enough to become an authority on the subject, but the world would not expect them to then start composing symphonies. 

Once you master your style and plotting technique, which takes practice, you can then write generically about love and loss and still be successful. 

Having experiences in relationships doesn't help you mature enough to write better if you're not with the right person. Compatibility is key. Having said that, it's good to be with the wrong people as long as it doesn't last long enough to ruin your life, that way to know what you don't like in a partner. Loss of loved ones and other disappointments leave scars, but those are common experiences that might bore a reader if overplayed. We read to be swept away not to dig trenches and wallow in gloom. 

It's more important to study the techniques of contemporary masters of fiction.   

My advice is to write stories now that you have no intention of showing people. If you write a story that interests you but it doesn't work with your developing style, try writing about something you're less familiar with as an exercise. Continue to read as many books as possible in the genre you like, but make sure you're reading more quality work than not.

If the internet existed when I went to college, I would have dove into writing immediately. For me it was like standing at the bottom of the ice wall in game of thrones with all the tools I needed way up at the top guarded by the men in black. 

Write to have fun regardless of your experiences or you'll bore the reader.


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## Vaporo (Oct 1, 2016)

When I was five years old, I wrote my first story. It took about three or four months, but I eventually finished "Superhero Freddy." It had taken every ounce of writing knowledge that I had at the time to finish it and, being five, I thought it was pure gold. And, of course, when I went back to look at it three years later, I saw that it was horrible, so I wrote some more stories, certain that I could do better now that I was older. Three years later, I looked at those stories and thought that they were horrible. Again, three years after that, I saw that the stories I poured my heart and soul into back then were terrible.

I think that you get the idea. I eventually realized that doesn't matter how old I get, I'm always going to look back and say "Wow. I made a lot of mistakes writing back then." So, since I know that no matter what I will look back and think it's horrible, I don't mind pouring everything I have into a story, even if I know that it will not be as good as something I will write three years later. True, It will probably never be as extreme as looking at something I wrote whenever I was five, but it will always to some degree or another.

Now, just because you've reached the end of the story doesn't mean that you have to call it done! You can finish something, show it to your family and friends for feedback, shelve it, then pull it down a few years later and improve it with what you know now. Or even just a few weeks later. It's amazing the amount of perspective you can get just by not thinking about a story for a few weeks before editing.

So, yeah. If you're going to write, you'll have to reconcile yourself with the fact that you'll never be perfect, and if you wait until you're perfect you'll never write anything.


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## Demesnedenoir (Oct 1, 2016)

Strong odds this will continue on forever. It's a bit similar to some actors who will never watch their movie again once it's released. The best idea might just be: write it, finish it (as many edits as needed), publish it (or try to), and move on to the next project. Maturing and looking back with an "ugh" is probably a given for a lot of people. 

There is some truth in it being hard to write things you don't know, especially relationships. Having lived a relatively easy life, and lost in my own worlds, as a younger person I always felt my writing lacked some authenticity. I've gone through some stuff now: I've lost both my parents (and all that entails), I got married, I've adopted two children, I've seen one of those children laying on a bed with a machine breathing for her due to seizures (she's fine now), I've started my own business, I made lots of money, I lost a lot of money, I've been in some serious ups and downs over the years and they keep on going! There will be no end to "experiencing" until they set me ablaze on my funeral boat down the Missouri River, heh heh. This certainly gives me an emotional fallback in my writing, and I find it funny to see how those things have filtered into the writing, but at some point, you gotta take your best guess and go with it.

Now, I quit the physical act of writing for a couple decades, stories were developing in my head, but I didn't put them down except some screenplays, where I learned a lot. Looking at the quality of pub'd novels, I regret that, if I'd pushed on I might be pub'd a looooong time ago, but, things have a way of working out.

Long answer turned short: just keep writing, just keep writing, just keep writing.



Heliotrope said:


> Oddly enough, I'm in my thirties and I still feel like this.
> 
> But I keep telling myself that if I keep going, by the time I'm sixty I'll have been writing for almost forty years, so I'll be pretty kick ass by then.


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## cydare (Oct 1, 2016)

My understanding of write what you know is do your proper research. You're never going to have all the experiences of your characters unless you're writing a memoir. Especially in fantasy, the situations will be...well, fantastical. 

You haven't been in a relationship. Alright. Me neither, and I AM an adult, so. (Though I have been in three major fights.) Pick up books with good romance subplots or romance as the main plot. Study them. See what works for you, what doesn't. Look up writing advice on the subject. Think on your other, platonic relationships, to draw blood for your ink from a similar vein. Practice. Someone who's been in love might have an easier way describing things, but not necessarily. As long as you don't assume you're an expert in the subject and dive into it without any attempts to learn a bit more, I do think you can do a good job.

Yes, you're changing and growing. And yes, your ideas are changing and growing too, but isn't that a good thing? Because you're starting early, you're creating a base. Though the structure may turn out to be different from the floor plans you imagined, your base is still there, strengthened by work and time, and built upon. It is crucial.

I think you're confusing age with writing experience. Someone who'd done no writing and then started later in life would still be going through the same thing. It's part of the work.


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## FifthView (Oct 1, 2016)

DotA,

Cydare's point is important, I think, and something I've said before:



cydare said:


> My understanding of write what you know is do your proper research.



A lot of people, including Brandon Sanderson, have been fairly dismissive with the idea of "write what you know," and with good reason–depending on how you interpret that phrase.

If I can write about magic, swordplay, intricate political intrigues, and so forth without ever having experienced them, then what the heck is this "write what you know" thing?

But the fact of the matter is...


We _can_ research things like swordplay; we can and probably often should research what we don't know until it becomes something we do know.


NO ONE knows everything or even everything about something.  If we assume that "know" is absolute knowledge about a given subject, then chances are very good that no one ever has that.  A man can be in a marriage for 30 years and still discover new things about marriage, his spouse, and so forth.  I know something about writing, but I also know that I don't know everything about writing.


We do know _something_ about many things or, as already mentioned, we can learn something about those things through research and observation.  Do we need absolute knowledge about things in order to write about them?  (See #2.) No.  Do you think Agatha Christie murdered people in all the ways she wrote about murder?  Nope.  We know something about unreal creatures like dragons because we know something about creatures, lizards, and so forth.


Knowledge about a subject doesn't need to be direct experience.  This is fairly obvious, this ties in with all the above, but I mention it separately because I feel that your concern relates directly to the lack of direct experience of things.   You've never been in a serious romantic relationship?  Well, you've been around a lot of people who have; or, you've seen plenty of movies and read plenty of books that involved romantic relationships. (Those experiences of viewing these things around you are essentially a type of research, even if you weren't consciously researching at the time.)


Subjective knowledge is not necessarily universal knowledge.  More on this one in a second.

So on that last point, #5....



DragonOfTheAerie said:


> How do you write about becoming a father if you've never had a child yourself?  How do you write about having a close family member die if you've never lost anyone extremely close to you? Heck, I've never broken a bone, there are a million foods I've never tried, I've barely traveled outside my own region of the country... You can imagine, you can ask, you can research, but it will only take you so far.



The error you are running into is this:  The assumption that "having a close family member die" or "becoming a father" is an identical experience for everyone who experiences those.  It's not.  People experience these things differently, react to them differently, have different thoughts about them, etc.  We are not robots walking around with the same program analyzing the world about us and experiencing things identically.

So it's not like you can "get it wrong" because you haven't experienced that identical experience.  There is no _one_ experience of each of these things against which you must compare your writing.

That said, there may be some commonalities, some things that are more likely, some things that might seem odd.  Heck, in the real world, there are real reactions that seem odd to outsiders looking in.  All you can do is try to write it plausibly and let alpha and beta readers weigh in.  Don't be embarrassed, but take in whatever observations you receive.  And by the way, it's not so bad to have a character react to things in an odd way, necessarily, and might be worse if a character reacts in a stereotypical way.  I'd say focus on writing a  character who reacts according to the other aspects of that character you've already developed:  The emotional character might have a nervous breakdown when a loved one dies, but the stoic character might have a face set in stone (while planning to avenge the death....)


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## Chessie (Oct 1, 2016)

I received my first rejection letter at age seventeen. Many more came after that. I cried for weeks thinking that I was a failure. Therefore, I stopped writing in my 20s (because I couldn't get published) and didn't pick it up again until I hit 30. All of those years creating words was lost because I didn't have not only a good support system (I come from an awful family here), and no guidance. College helped absolutely not at all and I ended up majoring in things that I could care less about. I did a lot of living: partied, finished partying, got married with children, lost my grandparents, etc. I honestly don't think many of those experiences come into play with my writing. The point being, please don't stop writing just because you're young and inexperienced.

It sounds like you have a lot of support from your parents. That's wonderful. Take this time to READ & create. Take this time to get good, hone your craft, find your voice. If you want to be a professional writer, let me tell you that life is no easier on this side. Depending on the route you take (trad or Indie) it's hard, hard work. Self-doubt is a given. Emotional roller coasters come with the gig. One day you hate your work, another day you love it. Except there's no time to delete and start over. There are deadlines, readers waiting for more books, other authors you partner up with to market books, finding editors, getting covers, social media...all the while needing to put in fresh words of an awesome manuscript every day. 

The feeling of being a fraud is something all writers share regardless of where they are in this journey. I read about it all the time in my Facebook group. Authors post constantly about their struggles (and successes) but we're all in our adult years. I'm in my 30s and I still feel like a hack on the daily. So...keep writing. Read. A lot. Reading is probably the most important thing you'll ever do in this business. Read what you love to write. 

As a sidenote, have you considered posting your work on Wattpad? There are many young writers on there encouraging one another. The comments you get won't be mega helpful but it does provide a larger audience to be read in. That might satiate some of your desire to be published NAO.


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## Netardapope (Oct 1, 2016)

DragonOfTheAerie said:


> All of you know that I'm probably one of the youngest active members here (that meaning teenaged) but, in hindsight, I really would rather have kept that fact to myself. I want to be a writer. Not a young writer or teenage writer or whatever prefix you can attach.
> 
> It's a large source of self-doubt, really. There's the usual people not taking you as seriously as they would an adult, assuming you're a complete beginner, etc...but it's worse. I feel like I'm not qualified to write my stories. I feel like I shouldn't be so ambitious at this age. I feel like I'm doomed to eventually throw out everything I write at this age because I'm not mature yet and I'll feel different about everything when I am, so why try? It's depressing. I feel like I don't have the personal experience to write the vast majority of stuff I write. They say write what you know. I don't know what on earth I would be writing if I did so; I probably would have already run out of material. I've never experienced at least 99% of the things I write about, and that's okay when it's something like teleportation or riding a dragon because literally no one has experienced it. But, there are all kinds of experiences that nearly everyone has that I DON'T have just because I'm not an adult...It's pretty frustrating. For example...how do you do a romantic subplot having *never* been in anything close to a relationship? The same way you write a fight scene if you've never been in a fight? But far more people have been in a romance then have been in a fight...I haven't had time to read all the books everyone has read. I haven't had time to do so many things.
> 
> ...


Hello, DragonOfTheAerie, this is a fellow teenager here (I'm 17) and I get exactly what you feel. Being our age kind of means we're inclined to be more doubtful of ourselves since we've experienced less, and adding the self-loathing that comes with writing as a hobby only doubles that doubt. But it's natural. When I see the stories of others, I get the feeling that they have a true understanding of writing people that I lack due to my age, and it get's me feeling just like you.

Sometimes I feel like many of my "advice" is obvious stuff that other people know, but one thing I learned to understand is that our age gives us a perspective. Even if it's not a grandiose perspective, it's one that's unique to us and that even older people can learn from. It's all a matter of realizing that everyone is seeking to learn from other people (in both real life and writing circles) and there is no age requirement for giving good posts, advice, or writing. It's all a matter of training, some people need to train more, and others less. I hope this might at least give you a little more faith in yourself, and if it doesn't, at least that you're not the only youngster prowling about these forums.

P.S.= If it helps, know that the fact that we've started writing at young ages only means that we'll have more time to perfect our craft. So if you're not overly confident now, then that confidence will build in our futures!



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## Svrtnsse (Oct 1, 2016)

I'm trying to get in shape (again), lose some weight, and stay healthy. One of the things I do for that is I go to spinning class. It's rough. It's a pain and it wears me out. I've done it on and off for a few years and I've come to a realisation. It never gets any easier, you just go faster and harder and push yourself more. No matter how good shape I'm in I'm still just as worn out after a class.

I think the same goes for writing - and for a whole lot of other things in life.

It's kind of the same as I saw a few other people say: it doesn't get easier, you just get better, and you raise the bar.

As for the Fraud Police, or Impostor Symptom, as I believe it's actually called, it's get easier as you come to understand it's happening to everyone. Everyone's winging it. Everyone's faking it. Everyone's worried they'll get found out.

No one who becomes a parent for the first time has ever had a kid of their own before. No matter how many books they read or how much good advice they receive, they're still going to end up in situation they have no clue how to deal with, and then what options are there? You either deal with it or, well, you deal with it.

Makes sense?

I don't know. I've never had kids. I just made it up, but it seems to me like it'd make sense. Anyone?

You don't need to have first hand experience of something in order to write about it. It might help, but what helps more is having experience writing. There are tons of tricks you can use. Some of them you can read about and learn from others. Some of them you will figure out on your own as you go, and they may be new tricks that no one ever used before. They may only work for you, because you're the only one who understands them. That's fine. The point is that if you don't write, you won't learn how to write better.

Example time:
A while back, I had to write about someone enjoying a cup of warm whisky. I do drink whisk myself, but I'm not a discerning taster. I could go on about how it's nice and peaty and smokey and full of undertones of honey end tar or whatever. I don't really have any sense of what that means myself. I just drink it.
What I did instead was I described images that I'd associate with you'd see in whisky commercials on TV, like this: 


> She move the cup to her nose, closed her eyes, and let the fumes find their way into her. A campfire by a forest lake. Morning mists rising from the valleys. Pipe smoke and sheep and walking over ground covered by fallen pine needles on a warm summer night.
> [...]
> Touching the cup to her lips she tilted it ever so slightly and sipped the warm liquid. Gold and brown, and moss covered rocks. Fire in the hearth, stew in the pot, and a good friend with no need to talk.


As you see. The above description has absolutely nothing to do with whisky, but it kind of works anyway. 

If you keep writing, you'll figure out your own tricks, and you'll build your own experience of writing. Experience of life will happen as you go, whether you want it to or not.

Also, just to clarify, and because I sometimes get these things wrong: the above is intended to be encouraging, not discouraging.


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## mulierrex (Oct 1, 2016)

I agree with Netardapope. Also a teenager here, but again, I pretty much agree with everything they said.

Are authors who write characters who are archers expert archers themselves? Are authors who write queens royalty themselves? Are authors who write about being a wizard wizards themselves? I could go on, but for all of those, including the ones you said, the answers range from probably not to definitely not. It isn't nonfiction. You don't have to have ever had a dreamy, fairy tale, life-altering romance in your life to be able to write a romance subplot. That just isn't realistic! Research can take you far, but it doesn't have to take you "only so far" as you put it. There's plenty to be learned. And it just simply isn't true that people can tell if the author doesn't know what they're talking about, and it's because there's no way to tell. They're just writing something, not doing it. Those are two completely different things.

And again as Netardapope said, you have time, and so do I, and so do they. Everyone here (hopefully) has time even if they just decided they wanted to write at age fifty. You don't have to publish a novel anytime soon, DotA. 

I sit here now after reading this comment feeling the same way you do, cringing, thinking about deleting it, but I'm not going to.

EDIT: That's a nice bit of prose, Svrtnsse. I've never drank whiskey either, but I could read that and assume you were right.


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## skip.knox (Oct 1, 2016)

Yeah, they'll know. There will always be things you don't know about. No, that's not quite right. There will always be things about which you know a little but someone else knows a lot. And that wretch will write a review.

There's no fixing this. You an ameliorate it. You can do research, gain experience, get feedback from your beta readers, but in the end, and this I absolutely personally guarantee, you will wind up saying your character made the Kessel run in fourteen parsecs. 

You feel anxious. You are sometimes downright embarrassed, even despairing. Welcome to the club. Everyone feels that way. (not quite. Hacks don't. My definition of a hack is not someone who writes badly, it's someone who writes good enough and doesn't care)

I'm not going to say don't feel that way because that'd be stupid. You feel that way. But I do have a question. Just one. I'm genuinely interested in the answer.

Can you stop writing?


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## Chessie (Oct 1, 2016)

You can learn A TON about writing romance just from reading books and watching movies/sitcoms. They all have the same plot structure: hero 1 + hero 2 live lonely without each other, they meet & there are fireworks, they resist temptation to one another but eventually fall, they fight due to insecurities and break up, realize that they truly love each other, one of them seeks out the other to make up, they make up and live happily ever after. That's all there is to it.


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## Svrtnsse (Oct 1, 2016)

mulierrex said:


> I sit here now after reading this comment feeling the same way you do, cringing, thinking about deleting it, but I'm not going to.



Good!
That's another part of gaining experience as a writer (and as a person): Putting things out there for others to see and judge you by, even if you feel it may not reflect an image of yourself you're comfortable with.


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## Penpilot (Oct 1, 2016)

You're never good enough until you are. What age that happens, well, who knows. 

There are stories I write now that I know I couldn't write when I was 20, but at the same time, there are stories I wrote when I was 20 that I can't write now.

You can't control how old you are, and you can't rush growing and maturing as a human. So don't worry about those things. Just write.

Don't have the experience in something? Pretend, try and fake it till you make it. 

One thing you have over older writers is you have lots of time to fail. I know that's not necessarily an encouraging thought, but if you think about it, if someone starts writing when they're 30, they still have to learn the basics and fail and fall and gain writing experience regardless of their maturity and life experience. 

You're a teen. You can get a head start on the falling down. You can get a head start on being technically sound. And as long as you push yourself to do the best that you can, you will learn. And I repeat fake it, fake it, fake it until you make it.

Who knows, you might be really good at faking it and people won't be able to tell. 

Have you ever heard of Jim Butcher. His Dresden Files books take place in Chicago. When he started writing the series, he'd never been to Chicago, but he faked it well enough that people thought he'd lived there at some point in his life.


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## DragonOfTheAerie (Oct 1, 2016)

Thanks for all the thoughtful replies. (I'm pleasantly surprised by how many people here actually are my age.) 

And, yeah. I doubt these insecurities will ever shut up or go away. I figured it wasn't a unique or isolated experience. Things are especially acute, though, when you're this young. It makes the insipid little voices sound so much more reasonable. You feel like you have a profound lack of authority compared to those voices, you're just not qualified to contradict them. Also, it's so much easier to blame your own faults on your age. I suppose this may be a side effect of being in a community full of people far older and more experienced than you, but hey, i came to learn, and i like diversity. 

And, is there a solution to being a teenager...? not really. Soo...what then? It always comes back to "yeah, this is a problem, but CAN you let it stop you, CAN you stop? Or do you just keep on keepin' on?" I can't stop. I know that much. Writing is so much a part of my identity that if i lost it i would lose myself. So, my options are basically "find a solution" or "fail to find a solution and write anyway," At least i'm getting better. 

In terms of romance--I figure the best thing i can do is read some good romance, written by someone who really knows their stuff. When i write romance i know i am either being an embarrassment or a really good fraud. Let me put it this way: The other day i wrote a 3-page scene (actually two scenes stuck together if we're being technical, but when have i been technical about anything?) that included a passionate make-out session between my MC and her love interest. Something I, to put it lightly, really don't have the qualifications to write. Moreover, i feel like every other writer does. My best friend was impressed. She said it sounded like i was drawing from experience--she could almost be fooled--i thought, okay, great, but you're no more an authority on the subject than i am...It can't be that hard to fake, can it, though? 

I thought back to my WIP...

-getting arrested and put in prison
-knife fight
-prison break
-getting patched and stitched up after said prison break
-humanoid owl attack 

Have actually experienced literally 0% of everything in those some 14,000 words (so far.), and i didn't even make a complete list. I don't think anyone has personal experience with a humanoid owl attack. I fake everything, i'm telling you. Fantasy writers in general...

I'm intense about research. Very haphazard and not very motivated, but intense. The way i figure, there are four degrees of research: 

1st: actually experience a thing for yourself 
2nd: talk to someone who has experienced the thing 
3rd: read about the thing in other books
4th: draw from your own experience to cobble together an idea about what a thing *might* be like 

Thing is, none are actually better than any other. You can just make something up and be more convincing than someone who has lots of experience with the thing. Honestly, i think we're all working on the 4th level 99% of the time. Knowing how to write well seriously helps. Also, knowing how to engage the READER'S personal experience, making them subconsciously insert THEIR knowledge into the text...that's a great skill to have. 

Can I fake almost anything? Quite confident I can. Am I doing it? Ahh, there's the problem...

I've thought before that, having about 5-6 years of writing experience, i'll be as good as any writer with the same amount of experience, whether they're my age or 68. And lately i've been doubting that. like, older person will have more knowledge and experience than i do, so...

I can't stop wondering if there is something _inherently_ lacking in my writing because i'm so young.


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## DragonOfTheAerie (Oct 1, 2016)

Fact is, many of the things i'll end up writing about in projects i'm working on or planning are things i have very little qualification to write, and i fear readers picking me apart like a horde of angry crows. Childbirth, for instance? I'll be writing possibly *two* childbirth scenes but what do you do if you've never given birth yourself or even seen it happen? (I know plenty of people who have done either or both, but it's actually rather hard to drag anything out of them. Awkward subject maybe? Why should it be? My mother just said "it's something you have to experience yourself" and left it at that.) Apparently, researching has as much to do with prying useful information out of unwilling people than anything. (I have, however, completely traumatized myself listening to mother's testimonies about childbirth. Do they compete for worst horror story or something? Is there a prize? I never have been thrilled at the idea of having kids (my friends want kids, i honestly don't understand) and i pray to every force in the universe that the reputed "baby drive" never hits me. Tangent. anyway.) 

Given the things i must research, i foresee lots of bloody youtube videos in my future, if i'm serious about it.  

Again, an older writer wouldn't worry about this as much, but being my age around much older writers who have gone through things like this, trying to write things like that is very scary because all the other people are Looming, Towering Pillars of Authority and you're down here like *faint peep*.


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## mulierrex (Oct 1, 2016)

Unless going into detail for those two childbirth scenes is really going to be that important to the plot, I don't really see why you have to know so much about childbirth. Do those scenes have to be drawn out? Is it important that your MC experiences them deeply and intimately (unless it's her giving birth either time, then my advice here is useless)? Because personally I don't think it'll be necessary to go into extreme detail over two childbirth scenes. Just describe in general what's happening; there's no need for the gritty details. Obviously I don't know the importance of the children being born but the aftermath seems like it'd be more important.

Also, I like your four stages of research.


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## DragonOfTheAerie (Oct 1, 2016)

mulierrex said:


> Unless going into detail for those two childbirth scenes is really going to be that important to the plot, I don't really see why you have to know so much about childbirth. Do those scenes have to be drawn out? Is it important that your MC experiences them deeply and intimately (unless it's her giving birth either time, then my advice here is useless)? Because personally I don't think it'll be necessary to go into extreme detail over two childbirth scenes. Just describe in general what's happening; there's no need for the gritty details. Obviously I don't know the importance of the children being born but the aftermath seems like it'd be more important.
> 
> Also, I like your four stages of research.



In one scene, it's the MC's (or, one of the MC's) wife who's giving birth; in the other, it's a more minor character. I suppose a ton of detail isn't necessary, but then again i don't want to get anything _wrong._


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## Demesnedenoir (Oct 1, 2016)

Childbirth is an excellent example of something that one mother could write one way, and another a second, and another a third... and on and on and on. Even the emotion of looking on their child the first time will vary substantially depending on mindset. Pain can only be described so much, and for particular sensations, I'm sure it's been written by real mothers which can give inspiration on how to handle it. But me, as a man, when approaching this or a multitude of other things, I tend to focus not on the physical but stick to the emotions... I know the emotions of the character, therefore they are more difficult to argue.

A different example. I know the sensation of being surprised by a person grabbing my shoulder and my making a defensive maneuver that put me within a split second of breaking that person's arm at the elbow... but it was my older sister and I knew it wasn't a real attack whomever it was, so I never intended to cause pain. Now, if I write that scene to a more violent conclusion, I still don't know what it's like to break a person's arm like that, the sound, the feel, etc., so I stick to the emotion of the moment... terror? cold-blooded? anger? The character's emotions I know for fact, it's my character.

Personally, I don't think you're giving your creativity enough credit. Yes, you will get better at it, and much of that will be due to experiencing things, but that shouldn't stop you from writing forward.


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## Demesnedenoir (Oct 1, 2016)

DragonOfTheAerie said:


> I can't stop wondering if there is something _inherently_ lacking in my writing because i'm so young.



Yes! No! Maybe! Splunge! (if you don't get that, google Monty Python Splunge) 

Every writer will inherently be lacking in some facet or another. And here's the thing about your example, 5-6 years of experience at your age compared to a 68 year-old is going to give each writer advantages in different ways even if they are theoretically equal in writing skill. Relating to a younger target audience is one, the younger writer can have an advantage here IF their life experience dictates it. The writer needs to know how to take advantage of the life experience they have and fudge the rest, LOL.

Being older, I do think it's tricky to get around life experience for a writer. There are reasons why people can often tell early works and mature works from the same author, and not just in the writing style, but it doesn't keep the young from success. Worry less, and Just keep writing.

And think of it this way! You better be writing now, because we just don't know long it'll be before our coming robot overlords replace all biological writers with AI that can write "perfect" stories for every market category, heh heh.


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## Penpilot (Oct 2, 2016)

When you fake it, there a couple of things you can do. You can research you arse off or can be vague enough and only drop in one or two very specific details that will make it sound like you know what you're doing.

The more details you put in, and the more specific you are, the more details the reader has to figure out if you really know what you're talking about. If you slip up just once, you can expose yourself.

My background is computer science. I know how to speak and think logically. One time I was at the hospital with my Dad, who doesn't speak English, and when the doctor came, I told him all my dad's symptoms and relevant medical history in a clear logical manner.

The doctor paused and asked me if I was a medical student. At that point I sort of had him fooled. If I said yes and walked away. He wouldn't have been any wiser, but if I tried to speak on medical terms with him, the gig would have been up. But if I knew one very specific thing to say that was spot on, I think I could have fooled him further.

Just something to think about.


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## skip.knox (Oct 2, 2016)

Why don't you want to get anything wrong? Never mind; I know. You don't want to get laughed at. Fair enough.

But it probably won't get that far. You will have beta readers. They should catch at least some of that stuff. Then you will have an editor, who also should catch that stuff. 

I'm not saying don't do the research, but I am saying that you should simply do your best research, then go ahead and do your best writing. No one writes alone (or, if they do, they're foolish).


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## Chessie (Oct 2, 2016)

I agree with Des about not giving your creativity enough credit. All of us here make shit up for our stories. Right now I'm writing a book set in 1947...and I grew up in the 80s/90s. I've had to do tremendous amounts of research about the culture and way of life in America late 1940s. Truthfully? This is my first novel set in normal times and history. Everything else I've written (save for when I was ghosting) has been fantasy. So I've had to learn some things about writing historical fiction, too. So see? I have no experience about something huge in this novel: setting and culture. I've also never been to Portland. The story takes place in Portland. I'll be traveling there at the end of this month, but by then the novel will be complete so...

What I'm trying to say is this: we writers rely on making shit up in order to exist. Just because you're an adolescent doesn't make your voice any less important, or your creativity at a level below than that of an adult. I'm sorry that you're insecure around the rest of us...but just because we have kids or beer bellies doesn't mean writing comes any easier for us. About the only thing I can relate to in my WIP is the romantic aspect...but even that's a bit skewed because dating was so different in the 40s. 

There has to be more than one thing you can relate to in your stories. And I bet even those things aren't your strengths. I've never read your writing so I can't speak to your prose, but remember this please: writers are storytellers entertaining an audience. You are a storyteller. What's real in your head and imagination can, and will, become real on the page, too. Are you also frustrated because you believe your skill is lacking compared to others here? Please don't short yourself that way. We've all been teenagers, too!


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## Svrtnsse (Oct 2, 2016)

I was thinking about this earlier in the morning and I came to think of something said by Greg Street (aka GhostCrawler, former lead system designer on World of Warcraft). It's not related to writing, but rather to the perception of right and wrong as compared to good and bad.

This was in the context of game design and it went something like this:



> There's a sense/feeling within our player community that it's worse to be wrong than to be bad. It's very important for players that they have all of the items that have been declared "best" and it is very important to them that they have all of their skill points distributed in the optimal way.
> If you don't have your character set up in the way detailed by [relevant authority] other players will ridicule and laugh at you.
> 
> Having the wrong set up is much worse than being a bad player. Others will see if you have picked the wrong skill points and they'll mock you for it, but they can't tell and don't care whether you actually know how to play or not.


Not quoted verbatim.

The essence of the message, the way I see it, is that there's too much focus on the wrong thing. It's easy to look at facts and point out that something is wrong. It's a lot more difficult to look at how someone performs and tell whether it's good or bad. This is true in the game, but I believe it's true in the real world as well.

It doesn't matter how well optimized your character is; if you stand in the fire you will still burn.

If I make a statement and say "it takes four minutes for light to travel from the earth to the sun" then it's easy for someone to look that up online and claim that it's wrong.
If I describe the feeling of seeing my daughter perform in her first school play there's no way for anyone to check if I described that feeling correctly or not. All they can do is compare with their own experiences or expectations. 

No one will be able to check if your description of your feelings are correct. They can only decide if they believe you or not. To convince them about that takes skill, not facts.

One way of doing this is to put yourself in your writing. Open up and give of yourself and your own feelings and beliefs. Don't write about what you think it would be like for someone in that situation. Write about how you would feel in that situation.

This is, unfortunately, really really difficult on both the personal and emotional level. It takes a lot of guts, and it doesn't get any easier, but with practice you get better at it.

If you write well enough, and with enough conviction, your reader won't care about silly little details like facts and realism. They'll believe what you tell them and feel what you want them to feel. At least, that's the theory, and it's got some good support - check the 8th point here: Neil Gaiman?s 8 Rules of Writing ? Brain Pickings

To sum things up: Don't worry about getting everything right, worry about not standing in the fire.

EDIT:
It takes about 8 minutes for light from the sun to reach the earth.
I don't have a daughter.


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## DragonOfTheAerie (Oct 2, 2016)

I think in the end, we all have the shared experience of being human, which we can all use as a reference, and be certain our readers can relate to it. Some of us don't fully understand the pain or joy of specific things, but pain or joy itself? yes.

My dreamy bit of philosophizing for the day, lol...


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## FifthView (Oct 3, 2016)

DragonOfTheAerie said:


> I think in the end, we all have the shared experience of being human, which we can all use as a reference, and be certain our readers can relate to it. Some of us don't fully understand the pain or joy of specific things, but pain or joy itself? yes.
> 
> My dreamy bit of philosophizing for the day, lol...



"Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto", or "I am human, and nothing of that which is human is alien to me." (Terence; there are more pleasing translations.)


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## Demesnedenoir (Oct 3, 2016)

While not being precisely on topic, Lionel Shriver's controversial keynote does in a sense touch on the fears of the writer. I don't have a clue about Shriver's writing, but I think she's spot on. If you haven't read that, google her Brisbane transcript. 

Although the topic is fiction and identity politics, there is a connection between your fears and the current PC concerns of writers. 

Lionel Shriver, from the Brisbane Writer's Festival: "Which brings us to my final point. We do not all do it well. So it’s more than possible that we write from the perspective of a one-legged lesbian from Afghanistan and fall flat on our arses. We don’t get the dialogue right, and for insertions of expressions in Pashto we depend on Google Translate.

Halfway through the novel, suddenly the protagonist has lost the right leg instead of the left one. Our idea of lesbian sex is drawn from wooden internet porn. Efforts to persuasively enter the lives of others very different from us may fail: that’s a given. But maybe rather than having our heads taken off, we should get a few points for trying. After all, most fiction sucks. Most writing sucks. Most things that people make of any sort suck. But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t make anything.

The answer is that modern clichÃ©: to keep trying to fail better. Anything but be obliged to designate my every character an ageing five-foot-two smartass, and having to set every novel in North Carolina."


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## DragonOfTheAerie (Oct 13, 2016)

I'm going to derail the other thread with my despairing, so I'd like to put this out there here, at risk of sounding even more like a drama queen. (Who are we fooling? I am a drama queen.) I still think it needs to be said, or at least I need to say it to something other than the inside of my skull. 

I do understand the great merit in gaining life experience and using it to inform your writing. I also understand that I am at a disadvantage in some ways, due to not having as much experience (writing and life, mostly life) as others do. I understand that I'll get better. My writing will grow, improve and expand as I grow, improve and expand. I haven't yet reached my full potential...no one ever does...and I have a lifetime of writing and improving ahead of me. It should be an optimistic outlook from here. Lots of time to sharpen lots of my skills, lots of possibility and opportunity. It should be anything but depressing. 

However. I'm far from where I want to be. (Aren't we all? But this is a different kind of far.) I'm not yet as experienced or capable or qualified as almost any published author or anyone here, on account of not having been alive long enough. They all have an advantage I don't have, an enormous advantage it seems. I'm crippled right now. And I cannot remedy it. I can spend long hours at the computer typing, improving the craft itself (and I do!), but that's not going to give me more life experience or perspective. All I can do about that is live. And living takes a long time. 

 The book I (temporarily) quit recently still smolders, ready to be picked up again when the time is right. Thing is, I'm not qualified to write it. Perhaps this why it was so impossible for 15 year old me to tackle; I don't know. The characters are older than me, they go through things I have never been through, they are shaped by experiences I don't yet have. I no longer feel able to write that story. I feel like I will fail it. I feel like it will inevitably fall painfully short of what it could be. All the emotions will be bland and inauthentic. Everyone will be able to see right through it. Because of these doubts, my Golden Idea might be in hibernation for a long time. Forever even. Who knows if I will even want to write it once I'm in my 20s or 30s. It's a scary thought, the story never actually being written, but it's a real possibility. Who knows. I might look back on it in five years and think, "What a bunch of childish BS; I'm glad I cut that tumor out." (Drama queen, remember? I don't think I'll stop being that ever.) Not knowing what future me is going to think is a scary idea sometimes. But the fact remains that I don't feel qualified for it now and if I want it to not suck im going to have to stick it in a box somewhere until I'm qualified enough, which could be...years.

For someone my age, five, ten, fifteen years sounds like a long time. 

Until recently, I didn't think this way. I thought skill and practice of the craft of writing itself would make up for any other deficiency. So, I worked my butt off, I was committed and stubborn. But, apparently that's not all there is to it. A frustrating discovery for someone who doesn't really have anything but the craft itself to work with, to be sure. 

Basically, I realized that just because I had the skills down didn't mean I was as good as an adult writer. Despite working my butt off for it just as much. More even. The adult has an adult perspective that I cannot fake. 

 The stories I care about, that truly ensnare me, the stories that fill my head and heart...those are the same ones that venture far beyond me and what I've been through. This is what makes it so frustrating. The advice I'm usually given is to spend time practicing and improving the craft, to go and find some fans on Wattpad (which, yeah, I might try that), to not take myself too seriously at this point, to be content writing stuff that won't matter in the large scheme of things. Ok, maybe those exact words were not used. But that's the implication, that the work of now is just practice. I won't publish anything I write now. It sucks anyway. And I can't fix it by pounding away at the writing alone. I'm just too young. Too inexperienced. Too unqualified. Is it true? Probably. Is it something I need to accept? Probably. Is it crushing and infuriating? Absolutely! 

If ten, twenty years of 'practice' is what it takes, sure. I'll do it. I'll wait thirty, forty years for my manuscripts to see daylight. I'll wait, gladly. But I dare to hope that there's something else out there for me at this stage in life. 

If you've been on my Writer's Work thread you know I'm failing to bond to my current story. I'm throwing out excellent wordcounts, but it's just a job. I like my main character, but I know the book is bad (I didn't plan), will never go anywhere and I really don't care about it. It's just something I'm doing while I'm waiting to be able to write the other story (or any story I truly care for) and honestly I am TRYING to care about it but I'm not sure if it's working. I think maybe it's working a little. Maybe? Anyway, I enjoy writing itself, I really do, but...I hope my writing is destined for more than just sitting in a box in my closet. Ten years more of books destined only for closet boxes (and maybe the eyes of close friends and family)...I mean, I guess I'm up for it. Anything for the writing dream, right? But isn't it a little discouraging...? Maybe I could publish it but I feel like I shouldn't try because i will look back on it later and cringe at its transparent childishness. I just want to vaporize the golden idea right now because I feel so ashamed of how excited I was about it and what high hopes I had for it. I'm ashamed of all my ideas already, sure they're foolish, and embarrassed of all the people I shared them with. Why didn't I see how ridiculous it was? Why didn't anyone in my life bring me back to earth? What if those people have just been trying not to break my obviously very breakable heart? I'm probably catastrophizing by now. But I can't write anything in that Golden Idea book at this current time to the level of authenticity and depth I want it and I wish I had figured it out earlier so I hadn't wasted two valuable years on it. 

I feel stupid and ashamed for trying to write about adult things as someone who isn't an adult. 

And yet, the characters are still here in my head, very real. 

Look, I've been drunk on ideas of publication and writing great stories and making people happy for much of my childhood, and maybe I just need more time to come to terms with reality, I don't know. I just don't know. Is publication what I even want? I don't think so, not deep down. But what do I want? 

To feel like a legitimate writer able to write books as good as any? To have readers and bring joy to them? To feel like all my hard work is worth something? 

I don't know where this depression has come from so suddenly. It's made me doubt everything. 

I don't know why I'm writing this, since the only thing anyone can tell me is to "just write." I'm doing that. (Visit my thread in Writer's Work.) I have no idea what to do except KEEP doing that. Heck. I'll keep doing that.


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## Demesnedenoir (Oct 13, 2016)

Danged nab drama queens anyhow, heh heh.

I'm still working on my golden idea from when I was fourteen-fifteen... I took a lot of years off in actual writing (head work, but not much on paper for story, more world building and story collecting) and the story really is the world... I've always seen the writing as an epic series of not necessarily directly connected books, taking the world right up to its destruction. I figured it was a thirty book project then, I suspect it still is. And I have lots of other far more simplistic ideas, but, this is the one. Now, it has evolved, oh dear has it, and a lot of that is aging, life experience, and furthered education, yadda yadda. You've the internet, something I didn't even dream of, so that's a helluva step ahead for you. 

The one beautiful thing about writing is it's not a pro sport, if you don't feel like writing in your 20-30's, fine, you can still do it in your forties or beyond, LOL. I said that alot, because, in my 20's and 30's, I really didn't write much, it was there, but waaay too much going on... now, it's back. I'm going for it. Might explode on impact, but what the hell.

You don't HAVE to keep writing. There is more than one way to skin a dragon.


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## Penpilot (Oct 14, 2016)

First, you're express yourself very well, regardless of age, and it shows in your posts. Second, Neil Gaiman, he held onto an idea for a very long time because he didn't think he was good enough to write it. Then one day he said, I'm not really getting much better, so I might as well get on with it. That story turned out to be the Graveyard Book. So you're not unique in your predicament. 

Can't write this story? Not mature enough? Then just write something you think you can handle.


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## La Volpe (Oct 14, 2016)

I'm going to say almost the exact opposite of what PenPilot is saying.

You're always going to be better than you were a year back. If you're 50 years old, you could still hold off on your idea and think that you just need a little more practice. I.e. you might end up never writing it.

There's a quote by Annie Dilliard that I've always tried to follow:
"One of the few things I know about writing is this: spend it all, shoot it, play it, lose it, all right away, every time. Do not hoard what seems good for a later place in the book, or for another book; give it, give it all, give it now. The impulse to save something good for a better place later is the signal to spend it now. Something more will arise for later, something better. These things fill from behind, from beneath, like well water. Similarly, the impulse to keep to yourself what you have learned is not only shameful, it is destructive. Anything you do not give freely and abundantly becomes lost to you. You open your safe and find ashes."

I'd apply this to your situation as well. You're holding on to your Golden Idea, thinking that it is the best thing you'll ever write. Which is not the case. That doesn't mean your Golden Idea is "Bad" or "Good for a teenager". Look at any author with a couple of books under her belt. Compare the first and last books she wrote, and you can see the improvement. That doesn't make the first book terrible.

You seem to think that when you look back in a couple of years, you'll think your previous stories were all lame and childish. But every author I've ever heard talking about their first books usually have good feelings about them.

So what I'm saying is this: Write the story you want to write now, to the best of your ability. More ideas will come. More Golden Ideas probably, if your pattern holds. But the only way to get to those is to finish your story.

As a side note: Saying that teenagers can't write stories about older people is like saying men can't write about women. Or people with sight can't write about blind people. Or South Africans can't write about North Americans. In short, you'll be fine. Personally, I think that skill, practice, and the craft of writing will make up for your "deficiency" of being young(er). I'd add "good research" though.


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## Russ (Oct 14, 2016)

DOA:

Writing is a very tough business.  

Firstly I respect you for writing frequently.  There is nothing wrong with treating it like a job and getting words on the page. You will build skill and discipline that way.

Secondly, you have very good writing skills from what I can tell.  I remember your first piece in the Showcase here.  IF you feel down go back and look at people's positive reaction to it.

Unfortunately, not only is writing tough, life is too.  When I was a young lawyer I was faced with lawyers with far more skill, experience and resources than I had.  I guess I could have quit law to become a construction worker, but then I would have been surrounded by guys with more experience, strength and skill than I had at construction.  Such is life.

Choose what you want to do and do it to the best of your ability.  Be realistic about your capacities, and analyze your strengths and weaknesses.  Work to your strengths and work on improving your weaknesses.  When you are finished with that process it is time to  make funeral arrangements.  

Be realistic in what you take on.  Recognize what projects might be beyond your current skill or resource level.  IF something is beyond your current skill level look for ways to raise your skills up to where they need to be.  

Keep writing, and try to enjoy it.


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## Demesnedenoir (Oct 14, 2016)

I should also add... You SHOULD keep on writing, live and write and find your path. But it doesn't necessarily mean write obsessively. We all get where we're going in different ways... some just walk whackier paths than others.


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## Michael K. Eidson (Oct 14, 2016)

DragonOfTheAerie, please, please, please, do not despair. You can be your own worst enemy if you let your fear of failure stop you from trying. If you want something badly enough, then do not accept defeat. Work at it, work at it, work at it. Do the absolute best that you can in the present, because the present is all you have.

Be observant. Everywhere you go and everything you see can inform your writing. A trip to the mall can be research; watch the interactions between people and pay attention to the smallest gestures, the body language, the volumes of voices, what makes people laugh or cry or pout or swing a fist or give a kiss or push someone. There is more to romance than being in love. Relationships are complex and every relationship is unique, but there are commonalities.

Whenever you have opportunity, write. Write until your fingers go numb and your head feels like it will explode. Finish that first draft and when you are done, set it aside for a week or two or several, and then revisit it. Read it. Revise it. Read it again. Revise it again. Find everything that bothers you about it and cut it out or rewrite it or decide that it is okay after all.

Work on your story, the story you want to write, the one that is aching, yearning to come out of your head to take form in text. Let it flow out of you when it will, and wrangle with it when it is stubborn. Get to know all of your characters, every step they take, every thought they think, as Sting sings, every breath they take. Experience their realities until they become second nature to you. _They_ will tell you if what you have written is false. Listen to them and _they_ will tell you _their_ truths.

When you've done all that, then elicit the help of beta readers. They will tell you what feels wrong to them. Take their feedback and do not let it bring you down. They are trying to help. Study what they tell you and try to understand where they are coming from. Look for the nuggets of truth about your story hidden in their feedback, and use it to make your story better.

That's how it's going with my debut novel, anyway. I still need to get an editor and possibly make more revisions. And after all this work my story still might not be well received by its target audience. But I'll be proud of it and eager to write the sequel, no matter what anyone else has to say about book 1. Because I know I will only get better. I will learn from what's said about the first book, positive and negative, and use it to make book 2 better than book 1. The only authors judged entirely on their debut novels are those who only write one book.

You'll come up with your own processes, but the point is, there's a lot involved in writing a publishable novel. And at every point in the process, you might feel like giving up, because it at times feels overwhelming. You have to tell that nagging voice that, yes, it might be right, but you're going to do the best you can and move forward. If you stand still, if you make no progress, then you're wasting precious time. Because the present is all you have.


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## Azora (Oct 14, 2016)

I'm young too and I think about that all the time. I just tell myself that if I stop now, I wont be better in the future. So I write to get better and better so by the time I'm older and people take me seriously, I will be really good. That is what keeps me going. When it comes to the whole romance thing and fighting thing, I understand that if you've never been in a romantic situation its hard to write about, but with fighting (which I haven't been in many fights, and definitely no sword fights) I research it. If were talking weapon combat, I study medieval sword fighting and that kind of stuff.


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## DragonOfTheAerie (Oct 15, 2016)

Thanks for listening and responding, guys.

And, well...All of my writers panic episodes conclude in the same way. I can either quit writing or keep writing. And I can't quit so I keep writing. I keep writing whether I feel euphoric or whether I feel despondent. I can't not write no matter how severe my current situation seems. There's never a thing I can do except just keep on keepin' on. 

My Golden Idea (as I find it convenient to call it) is ambitious and scary. I don't feel ready to write it *just yet*, that's why I'm writing some other books (three in total, according to the plan) before returning to it. I probably will be 17-18 before I go back to the Golden Idea. Will I be able to write it then? I don't know. I could wait. I could wait until *the right time*, after my skills are much better, after I've had all the experiences I worry I won't be able to authentically describe...but, the story comes when it comes. It's on my heart because it needs to be written, and that alone should qualify me. I don't think there's any point in waiting to get better. I'll write it when it comes. (The series could take twelve years to write and edit by my calculations, so there is that.) Why worry? 

Meanwhile, I don't know where my current projects might go but I'm excited for them, even if they're not the Golden Idea. 

I'd like to pose several questions and ideas, though: 

First, I'd really like to keep putting things in Showcase for serious critique because I know there are lots of people more experienced and knowledgeable than me here that I can learn from. Im here to learn. Not sure what to post though.

The Top Scribe competitions have already put me outside of my comfort zone a lot, and I feel like it has helped me, so I'll keep doing those. Also, I might post older top scribe entries in showcase (after editing) for critique...thoughts? 

Second, does audience play a role in this (being qualified?) I'm probably writing YA or NA (new adult.) I don't really know what it will be, but it seems like it could do well on the YA market. It is somewhat a coming of age story, a story of growing up...Does that help my situation? I *am* a YA. I read YA. I feel like I should be able to write for people my own age just fine...better, even, than adults. But I don't know what it is, I said already. It might be better suited to the adult market with some tweaks. So...thoughts on this?

Third, might writing things outside of my own experience and comfort zone be *good* for me? Might just writing and practicing writing a wide variety of topics I feel less confident in improve my writing as a whole? They say to write outside your comfort zone and challenge yourself. If you don't stretch, you won't grow. When I think about it, it seems like a terrible idea to refrain from writing about something just because you don't feel like you can write about it accurately. TERRIBLE idea! You have to write hard things that stretch your abilities and imagination so you'll learn! Right? Why didn't I think in this way before?


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## Demesnedenoir (Oct 15, 2016)

YA is your current wheelhouse, it's what you know and live, so to speak. But by all means stretch your synapses until they threaten to break, but writing in your strength is hard to fault.

And post things to showcase, although I haven't paid much attention to that of late, I try to limit the amount of time I waste on MS, LOL. And if you're ever interested in my brutal opinion, you can always direct message me, muwahahahaha.


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## DragonOfTheAerie (Oct 15, 2016)

Also, I've been thinking about the fact that I *can't* experience firsthand every possible human experience. There are some things I'll never know about no matter how old I get. I'll always be female, but does that mean I can't write from the point of view of a male? I might never lose a close friend to suicide. I might never have a limb amputated. I hopefully will never kill someone. (Those things happen to my characters.) No matter how old I get. I might never have children. I might never experience things that LOTS of people experience. Does that disqualify me from writing those things? I don't know, but I don't care. I can research, I can try to understand the experiences of others, but at the end of the day I just have to write it regardless of my doubts.


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## FifthView (Oct 15, 2016)

DragonOfTheAerie said:


> Also, I've been thinking about the fact that I *can't* experience firsthand every possible human experience. There are some things I'll never know about no matter how old I get. I'll always be female, but does that mean I can't write from the point of view of a male? I might never lose a close friend to suicide. I might never have a limb amputated. I hopefully will never kill someone. (Those things happen to my characters.) No matter how old I get. I might never have children. I might never experience things that LOTS of people experience. Does that disqualify me from writing those things? I don't know, but I don't care. I can research, I can try to understand the experiences of others, but at the end of the day I just have to write it regardless of my doubts.



Yep.  Also, everyone regardless of age has a past and a wealth of experiences no one else has.  Attempting to "catch up" by having those same experiences that others possess would take multiple lifetimes and even then might be impossible. (Heh, I can't truly imagine, with absolute fidelity, what living multiple lifetimes would be like.  And intellectually I doubt that I can truly know the full scope of the experiences others have already experienced.)

I'm a little caught between two contrasting views.  I'm 100% in favor of throwing doubt and caution to the wind and allowing myself to imagine other lives, utilizing my own experiences to this point in my life to extrapolate those fictional lives.  But I also believe in the idea that, at any given point in my life, I might be _unready_ to write some things.

I've experienced that realization that I'm not ready to write something.  So for me personally, I can't deny that adding years to my life has been necessary before tackling a story.  But ultimately, I believe making those decisions is a personal choice; no one else can tell you where you fall, whether you should wait or charge ahead and write a given story.

Maybe charging ahead is a more trustworthy approach when you feel doubt.  At the very least, you might learn whether you are now ready to write the story or are unready.  If you stop before trying, you might never know.  In my own life, I have come to think that maybe the doubt is itself a signal of being unready to write a story.  At the same time, I've chastised myself often enough whenever I've come to suspect that my doubt was merely a delaying tactic because I didn't want to discover my limits.


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## Ronald T. (Nov 26, 2016)

It's easy to see that you're already an accomplished and thoughtful writer, Dragon.  If you don't let doubt and depression stop you, who knows how far you might go with your writing career.  I only wish I had been wise enough, and educated enough, to start writing at a much earlier, just as you have.  

But I went to almost twenty schools during my educational period (three schools in one year, twice), and often what my last school was just beginning to teach me was already covered in my new school.  And because I was an extremely shy kid, I was afraid to ask questions and ashamed to admit to my new teacher and a room full of fellow students that I didn't know what they were talking about.  So I wasted much of my early education.  

I mention this to let you know that you are so far ahead of where I was at your age, I am deeply impressed with what I can see of your abilities as a writer and your desire to be proficient as an author.  I just wish I had started at such a young age.  You have so many years to grow your skill level, which already shows great promise. 

It wasn't until I reached my mid-thirties that I developed a desire to write novels and to create unknown worlds, just as my favorite authors did.

I wasn't even a reader until after I was married.  My beloved wife encouraged me to become a reader, and introduced me to the magic worlds of SF/F.  I spent years immersed in these stories, and stood in awe of authors that could tweak my emotions with such great skill.  I wanted to learn how such magic was achieved.  But I realized I needed to increase my knowledge.  So, that was the beginning of my self-imposed education on how to become a great writer.  And even if I couldn’t reach greatness as a great writer, at least I could become an adequately good one.  

I studied Northern Mythology with a passion: The Niebelungenlied (also called Ring of the Niblung); Sigurd the Volsung;  the Poetic Edda; the Icelandic sagas; tales of The Round Table; and endless other resources, including books like The Devine Comedy and so many other fantastic historical and mythological texts ― many on which Tolkien based his classic “Lord of the Rings”. 

In other words, nothing is free.  So never stop doing research, never stop reading the work of other authors, and never stop writing.  The rewards grow exponentially.

I'm 68 years old, and I will admit I have a lot of experience and ability in areas not related to writing.  But little of what I write is based on personal experience.  I’ve never used a sword to kill anyone; never beaten anyone nearly to death with my fists; never faced a conjured assassin-specter; never fought a dozen stone-sculpture warriors.  

But I can imagine doing so.  And that’s the magic of good writing.  However, the most important part of imagination is in making it feel genuine.  Which means you must have the ability to access the depths of your heart and soul.  You must be able to feel what a character is feeling at a particular moment, in a particular event, and have the talent to make a reader see and feel what you see and feel.

My point is this.  If it required personal experience to write about a particular subject, then how could stories such as Star Wars, Star Trek, Guardians of the Universe, Blade, Ben Hur, Miracle on 34th Street, and so many others, exist?

Life experience can be valuable, but it’s not the “end all, be all” to being a great writer.   A good writer has a particular gift, and that gift is their ability to place themselves in any situation by using their imagination.  It need not be something the author has actually experienced, but it must be genuine.  A reader will almost always sense false emotion in the characters…in the story itself.  

Knowing what certain physical acts feel like is only a small part of life.  How those acts make you feel emotionally is far more important.  The physical aspects of life fade with time, like how we eventually forget how painful something was.  But it’s not the same with the emotional side of the equation.  If that weren’t true, after a woman gave birth to her first child, she would never go through it again.  In truth, she seldom forgets the emotions surrounding that birth.

What I’ve learned about writing is this:  it’s based 98% on four things; technical skill; a strong voice; a great ability to use your imagination; and how good you are at observing the world and the people around you as they go about their lives.  

Observe, retain, and reflect. 

Observation of our world and the people in it has given me more tools for creating characters than any book I’ve ever read. 

But I want to say this, Dragon.  You’re already far ahead of most writers who are many years older than you.  For your age, your skill level is amazing.  And it’s easy to see you’re desire to be a great writer is strong.  Just make sure you don’t push yourself so hard you burn out.  Patience is a virtue worth developing.

Keep reading, and studying, and practicing, and before you know it, your dreams will start to come true.  It just takes work and time.

I wish you all the best in your life and in your writing.


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## Jackarandajam (Nov 27, 2016)

Read everything, always. 
Write down why you loved books, and why you hated them. Don't be afraid to hate a book that everyone else loves, and don't be afraid to recognize the beauty in a book you hated. 
Read them as a writer, because that's what you are.
Reap from a thousand different sources what you're trying to say, and how you're trying to say it.
Then say it.
Then try again.

Being a writer isn't a hobby; anyone can string words together.
Being a writer is a psychological disorder, and you have it.

Write everything. Write sci-fi, fantasy, poetry, and non-fiction. Write absurdity like Carroll, and Nihilist dogma like Palahniuk. 
There are workouts, and there are competitions; no athlete is successful without practice or studying the greats that came before.

You have time, you have no time.

You have time to become a master. They say it takes 10,000 hours to master something.
Keep going.

You have no time to capture how you feel about things right now. You have no time to document yourself.
You have no time to start, and you already have.
Hell yeah.
Keep going.

Write.
Learn.
Repeat.

Being a writer isn't a destination,; it's a lifelong struggle of joy and self-doubt and frustration and celebration.

This is our life. 
A belated welcome to you.


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