# Creating prayers and/or religious ceremonies



## Bearman1 (Jul 24, 2014)

So I am currently building a religion for my WIP but I am unsure how deep I need to go. 

The religion is very much based on christianty, only with a very active god affecting the world. 

A MC is about to pray to this god only I am unsure how to word it and this got me thinking. 

How many of you add in these kinds of details, creating your own prayers and/or ceremonies and such for your worlds?


----------



## Mythopoet (Jul 24, 2014)

Well, if you're basing your religion on Christianity then you should be aware that there are two radically different prayer styles in Christianity. There's the Evangelical "pray whatever comes into your head as you go along" style (prayer pantsers?) and the more formal style where you use pre-existing pre-memorized prayers like the Our Father or the Ave Maria. So you could go either direction, you could write up some impressive sounding prayers for your characters to use that are established within the religion, or you could have your characters just pray by the seat of their pants when necessary. You could also mix it up between the two to make it a bit unique. 

My world is pretty heavy on the religion so I create lots of rituals, ceremonies, prayers, etc. I find it fascinating to explore how various cultures deal with the sacred.


----------



## Terry Greer (Jul 24, 2014)

I don't want to offend anyone, but I'm an athiest, and I've always taken the view in my novels that religions are often misrepresentations of real events. Religions in my stories are therefore built on the equivalent of centuries of 'Chinese whispers', wishful thinking, false logic and other human failings. Basically they're all wrong - and as long as I know how they got it wrong I can interpolate from that. (Note this is true even in stories where I do have gods - after all how does a mortal know the true intent of a god?)


----------



## KC Trae Becker (Jul 24, 2014)

Terry, your view, while fine for an atheist, is a bit cynical for the average believer. But pointing out that religions always have flaws because humans always mess things up is an interesting perspective. This idea may just be a key tool to help make any constructed religion feel more realistic.


----------



## Mythopoet (Jul 24, 2014)

It's also worth pointing out, in light of Terry's post, that religion does not simply equate to beliefs in a God or gods. Religion is more accurately the relationship people have with what they hold sacred.


----------



## Queshire (Jul 24, 2014)

My top priority if I was in your shoes would be to look how to make the religion clearly and obviously distinct from Christianity even though you're taking inspiration from it. Your audience is more likely to have strong feelings regarding Christianity than if you based it on other religions. While I don't necessarily agree with Terry's view point he does offer an interesting way to come up with a distinct religion. What if you religion-ize stories from history or secular folktales. What if you took WWII and made it into a battle between tribes of spirits and tribes of demons instead of countries? What if the central figure of your religion wasn't Jesus but Johnny Appleseed?


----------



## Jabrosky (Jul 24, 2014)

I simply say my characters murmur their prayers to their various gods under their breath. I don't even type out those prayers in full.

That said, even though I'm an atheist myself, most of my characters are what you would call religious. That's what the cultural settings of my stories almost always require.


----------



## skip.knox (Jul 24, 2014)

My general rule is this: add only the level of detail the story requires. 

It's a simple rule, bloody difficult to practice, but I hold it before me as a light in the darkness. In this case, if the story needs the reader to hear a prayer, then write a prayer. If the story needs only that the reader knows the character prayed, then that's all you need to write.

That said, while world building, go ahead and play around all you like. World building is a hobby, a nice adjunct to the serious work of writing. As with a hobby, sometimes you might even get some unexpected benefits or insights you can use. But don't mistake the hobby for the job.


----------



## Bearman1 (Jul 25, 2014)

I defintely like what you are saying Terry about people being wrong about religions and that is something I am working into my novel. My MC is seriously wrong about his god's intentions, which ends up as a major plot point for him. 

I like the idea of having all of the details mapped out behind the scenes, even if they never come into the novel. One of my friends who is beta reading my chapters always likes to ask for extra details and I feel a little lazy if I don't know the answer to some of his questions. 

I have actually planned out some culture-wide prayers today that may or may not be used in the actual story. For the time being I think I will just have my MC say a prayer and not give the actual wordings. 

The act of praying is more important than the words of the prayer at this point of my story.


----------



## Ayaka Di'rutia (Jul 28, 2014)

skip.knox said:


> My general rule is this: add only the level of detail the story requires.
> 
> It's a simple rule, bloody difficult to practice, but I hold it before me as a light in the darkness. In this case, if the story needs the reader to hear a prayer, then write a prayer. If the story needs only that the reader knows the character prayed, then that's all you need to write.
> 
> That said, while world building, go ahead and play around all you like. World building is a hobby, a nice adjunct to the serious work of writing. As with a hobby, sometimes you might even get some unexpected benefits or insights you can use. But don't mistake the hobby for the job.



I agree with skip on this.  This is something I've practiced in my own fantasy stories, and I'm hoping I don't overdo it for the general audience, whether or not they're religious.  And while I'm inspired by my religion to include religious beliefs for characters, I've tried not to make it so similar that it becomes blatant and preachy; I'm trying to build a world and its characters and tell a good, uplifting story, not preach my religion.

I've read other stories (fantasy and speculative) that I found awkward because I felt they put way too much emphasis on the religious practices in their stories. (Part of it was that the authors are of my religion, and got inspiration from our practices, and it bugged me on one end because I find those practices very sacred and not to be lightly written about in fantasy fiction.)  The religion in those stories important, but in at least the case of the fantasy trilogy I read, it downplayed on the plot, and even the characters, too much.

Like any device, use as needed for the plot and the characters.


----------



## Mythopoet (Jul 28, 2014)

skip.knox said:


> My general rule is this: add only the level of detail the story requires.



Not to argue the point, but just to throw out a different perspective...

I find stories and worlds that only add the level of detail that is required to be boring and joyless. How do you immerse yourself in such a world or story if all that is there is what is necessary?


----------



## Nihilium 7th (Jul 28, 2014)

Mythopoet said:


> Not to argue the point, but just to throw out a different perspective...
> 
> I find stories and worlds that only add the level of detail that is required to be boring and joyless. How do you immerse yourself in such a world or story if all that is there is what is necessary?



I'm inclined to agree with you on this. I think there is a difference between having just enough and giving just enough. It doesn't hurt to have prayers and the like, in fact it adds depth to the world; it is up to you however if giving the readers a display of religious ceremonies in your specific story is fitting. You don't even have to have someone recite an entire prayer; "Brother Richton mournfully whispered the 13th Dirge of the Daughter." sounds better than "Brother Richton mournfully mumbled a prayer." in my opinion.


----------



## Svrtnsse (Jul 28, 2014)

The anfylk race in my setting was created by Anna, Goddes of Lazy Afternoons and Other Simple Things.

The main form of worship among the anfylk is the smoking of the pipe.


> The most holy of all forms of worship, among all different breeds of anylk, is the smoking of the pipe. Comfortably relaxed while puffing your pipe is considered the ultimate form of praise and devotion among anfylk.



The different anfylk breeds also favor various other kinds of worship:

Spring:


> Apart from smoking the pipe the main forms of worship for Spring Fylk are dancing, singing, lovemaking and tending to bonsai trees.



Summer:


> Summer anfylk are as a rule highly religious. The most commonly practiced form of worship is the family picnic on Restday.
> ...
> The daily afternoon nap is a central part of summer anfylk worship and something that’s commonly practiced even by summer anfylk not actually working outdoors. In modern society this is often a source of conflict between summer anfylk [employees] and non-fylk employers.



Autumn:


> The solitary nature of the autumn ane is reflected in their preferred form of worship. They enjoy visiting beautiful scenic locations where they can enjoy a nice view. Worship often takes the forum of quiet contemplation rather than outright relaxation.
> 
> Angling is another favorite form of worship, both from a riverbank or bridge and from small boats. In some parts angling is also used as a form of divination used to determine the will of Anna. Generally it is seen as a good omen if the god sees fit not to disturb the angler with things such as biting fish.



Winter:


> In the midst of winter, when the storms are coming in and it’s too cold for any but the strongest hunters to leave the home a rare opportunity of worship prevents itself. To lie in bed is in and of itself an act of worship; but to lie in bed safe under warm furs while the midwinter wind howls around the hut is truly a holy moment in winter fylkin doctrine. Whether alone or with a loved one doesn’t matter. What is central is how the raging forces of nature contrast against the safety and comfort of one’s own bed.


----------



## Legendary Sidekick (Jul 28, 2014)

That you have a Goddess of Lazy Afternoons, and that she is lazily worshipped, is awesome!



About level of detail…

I think as a writer, I tend to ask, "Am I putting fluff in my story?" I tend not to care when I put my _reader_ hat on. GRRM's books have me believing that _The Bear and the Maiden Fair_ is a popular song at taverns all over Westeros. Did I need to know that to enjoy the story? Maybe not, but that made the world a little more real for me. So it turns out I like fluff.

I think it's a matter of extremes where too much of the cute stuff distracts from the story, where none at all is boring and joyless, as Mindfire put it.


----------



## SM-Dreamer (Aug 3, 2014)

I love detail. I love being so immersed in the story, not just from the character, but from the world itself, that I care about it, and when I finish reading, am left wanting _more._ Like I want to step through the book and be in the world.

And if the writer only put "as much detail as needed" I'll likely lose interest. There's a big difference between only revealing as much detail as necessary, and only having as much detail as necessary. One's an iceberg, the other's just, well, not (my analogy failed me as I was writing, apologies).

As to prayers and ceremonies, I like revealing the religion as it would pertain to the characters interacting with it. I'm not terribly good at making up religion rituals (in part because I never had a religious upbringing, so I don't have any personal experiences/images to work with, only researched ones) so I will read similar real world ones and use them as a template.

I read a book on Mesopotamia and it had a couple of prayers in it that I thought were fascinating.


----------



## Mythopoet (Aug 3, 2014)

SM-Dreamer said:


> I read a book on Mesopotamia and it had a couple of prayers in it that I thought were fascinating.



I have a volume of Ancient Egyptian literature that of course contains many prayers and invocations and spells. They are amazing. I love the way the Ancient Egyptians wrote. 

I also get a lot of inspiration from the spells and invocations used in a lot of anime that feel very much like prayers.


----------

