# The afterlife



## Tom (Feb 5, 2015)

I've recently discovered that my world's religions lack serious depth. So maybe this will be the second in a series of threads--I don't know.

Only one of my cultures, the Barlanders, has an established afterlife. For them, heaven is a city of fire and pure gold, where they will be reunited with their kin and restored to the godlike state they believe humans once possessed. 

Since they're a northern people, I decided that the traditional fire-and-brimstone interpretation wouldn't fit their idea of hell. Instead, their concept of hell is a barren plain of ice and snow and biting wind, stretching on forever, through which the souls of the condemned are forced to wander. 

My other cultures have no clearly defined afterlives. I think it would be great if you guys would give suggestions and/or share a little about the afterlife concepts for some of your cultures. Seeing other (and probably strikingly varied) ideas might help spark my creativity. And hey, we're writers! We like to talk about our cool stuff and read about other people's cool stuff!


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## Devor (Feb 5, 2015)

Are the gods real in your world?

In mine they are real, and one of them is responsible for reincarnation, assigning the souls of the dead to the children being born.  She used to have an established system of honor and karma for doing so, and for awarding some souls passage into Nirvana, where they would escape the cycle of life.

But for reasons I won't get into, "honor" has become "a broken magic," and she has become untethered by those rules.  She now has incredible leeway in matching souls to parents, and she hopes to spend it finding a solution to her greatest problem:  The greatest souls leave the world for Nirvana, while the worst souls flourish in the world and bring suffering to the people.


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## Tom (Feb 5, 2015)

I don't think the gods are real in my world. They certainly don't interfere in the mortal coil, and as yet there's been no sign that they exist. 

However, I'm thinking of making the Barlandic religion the "true" religion, as it makes the most sense to me. If it is true, though, it's probably different from the way the Barlanders perceive it, applying more universal concepts than those formed by the environment and attitudes of the Barlandic culture. Still something I have to consider and explore in more depth.


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## Queshire (Feb 5, 2015)

I haven't done much with the afterlife. On idea I considered using was a belief that after death their souls merge together with those of their ancestors to form archetypal gestalt entities that fulfill the same role as gods.


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## WooHooMan (Feb 5, 2015)

I got five religions in my setting.
Two of my fictional religions have ancestor worship.  One of them is defined by ancestor worship.  When you die, your soul stays in your homeland and you're worshiped as a deity, basically.  However, when people forget about you, your soul dies and you're gone forever.
Third religion believes that your soul merges with the spirit of nature.
Fourth religion just has reincarnation/rebirth.  That belief is actually very important to the story's plot.
Fifth religion has no afterlife.  When you die, you're done.

All five of them are right.  Or maybe all of them are wrong.  It's one or the other - all right or all wrong.  It's established in the story that all of those religions are only partially right.

In a different story, there's an "afterlife" where your soul becomes the CPU to magic computers.  Each computer has a different soul which makes it run and all the souls are linked.

I try to avoid the traditional underworld/paradise afterlife.  In fact, I think reincarnation is more popular in fiction.  I guess writers just think it's more "mystical" or whatever.


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## Pythagoras (Feb 5, 2015)

WooHooMan said:


> Fifth religion has no afterlife.  When you die, you're done.
> 
> All five of them are right.  Or maybe all of them are wrong.  It's one or the other - all right or all wrong.  It's established in the story that all of those religions are only partially right.



I don't understand how they are all right or wrong when one of them does not have an afterlife. How can there be both an afterlife and no afterlife? If four of them are right, then one has to be wrong, or vice versa, right? Or am I missing something?


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## Pythagoras (Feb 5, 2015)

I haven't given much thought to the afterlife, actually. I do have a realm of the Dead, but I haven't spent much effort (yet) in working out the details aside from its location relative to other realms in the cosmos. I do also have a myth about how it came into existence.


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## Hainted (Feb 6, 2015)

All the stories are true, especially the ones that contradict the others. If you can't wrap your head around that then you need to stay away from religion.


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## fshamas (Feb 6, 2015)

In the story I am developing, afterlife is merely a limbo - a soul arrives there and passes on to the next life. However the lives are not based on rewards because "Why should be some souls created good forever and others bad forever" Souls are pure beings unlike characters which have a story.


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## Tom (Feb 6, 2015)

Hainted said:


> All the stories are true, especially the ones that contradict the others. If you can't wrap your head around that then you need to stay away from religion.



Is this directed at me? If so, then yes, all the religions of my world are true--when viewed through a universal lens. All have aspects that are true, and all have aspects that, though not necessarily incorrect, are influenced by the attitudes of their unique culture and may not be relevant to other cultures.

So are you saying that I should stay away from creating fictional religions, or stay away from real-world religions? Either way, I can wrap my head around it. I'm a practicing Pentecostal Christian, and have friends of all religions--Catholic Christianity, Islam, Shinto, and Judaism among them.


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## ArenRax (Feb 6, 2015)

well i have couple of ideas for an afterlife.

1st: The Underworld ruled by the 3rd King Varlan is a place where not only the souls of the dead live but where some are punished. Here ghouls, Necromancers, and other denizens that live in the shadows thrive and live in harmony. The Realm of Perpetual Night where common folk go when they have not done Too bad in life nor too good.

2nd:The Immortal elemental Fire Dragons can live forever and do but a price. for when they die there spirits go to another realm of existence where either they live a second life until they have waited the set number years to remake the flesh of their body and return to the realm of the living, the time it takes can depend on the actions of what they did in life and maybe how many times they've died and returned. This spirit realm mirrors the living realm with a few exceptions of the magical nature. floating islands, portals, and freak mana storms.

3rd: in the universe they say that gods and mortals can die or fade away but nothing ever truly dies. The Overworld is not understood but it is where one goes when their soul is shredded or the immortal essence of a god or titan is spread out  because there physical form destroyed.the Overworld also serves as a haven for those gods that are not needed anymore whether they have faded away or have been destroyed or there Immortal essence was shredded into fine pieces this is where they go. when a soul or essence is shredded/destroyed there consciousness and a small piece of them makes it to the Overworld where there Soul/essence begins to piece itself back together. This Realm also is a prison for the most Evil and dark.
This realm can be paradise, or it can be your eternal Hell.

Lastly: Nethrika was the goddess of darkness an ancient goddess who was around in the beginning but she committed crimes against other gods and so they destroyed her physical for and bloated her immortal essence so she became the Chaotic and dark realm of Nethrik where the ancient deitys of dark and evil are chained and where monsters of the most dark intent are banished.

these are only a few examples and i'm still messing around with them but i do hope you can think of something especially from what I've listed. Thinking of an afterlife can be hard but if you can get the groundwork of it done then it should be easy albeit the 3rd one is for the whole universe and all the realms of creation while the others just preside in or near a real of creation.

sorry if its super long


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## Tom (Feb 6, 2015)

Great, thanks! I would give you reputation points, but somehow I've already exceeded my quota for the day.


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## ArenRax (Feb 6, 2015)

It can be hard to think of a afterlife but if you use another for groundwork and then change it to suit your needs then it can be quite easy albeit i thought of the 2nd,3rd, and 4th all by myself with out using another for groundwork. the underworld one that came from greek mythology(because i read the percy jackson seiries) it had a scene where they described the underworld in which Heroes could live happily while regular people wandered and faded and the evil ones got tormented also there King was of course Hades the god of the underworld. a few changes like not having tormented souls and no Heroes get to live a second life and you presto! have a afterlife but of course you can also just use then just use the name  Underworld for many thing afterlife or not.


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## Tom (Feb 6, 2015)

I've heard that Hades in the original mythology was actually the most benevolent, reasonable, and level-headed of the Greek gods. It's only in retellings and adaptations that he's become a villain. I like that idea--a god of the dead who watches over his own and tries not to get entangled in the rest of the pantheon's drama.


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## X Equestris (Feb 6, 2015)

Yeah, Hades was easily one of the most benevolent gods in Greco-Roman mythology.  Aside from his kidnapping of Persephone, he never did anything really reprehensible.


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## WooHooMan (Feb 6, 2015)

Pythagoras said:


> I don't understand how they are all right or wrong when one of them does not have an afterlife. How can there be both an afterlife and no afterlife? If four of them are right, then one has to be wrong, or vice versa, right? Or am I missing something?



It's a long story - like a really long story.  Let's just say you're missing something.



Hainted said:


> All the stories are true, especially the ones that contradict the others. If you can't wrap your head around that then you need to stay away from religion.



Man, you ain't kidding.
Personally, I think contradictions (or at least, inconsistencies) are very useful in making a mythology seem more real.  After all, real-world folklore is full of contradictions and inconsistencies.  I think a lot of worldbuilders are so focused on keeping everything straight and "realistic" that they miss how useful things like contradictions can be.



Tom Nimenai said:


> I've heard that Hades in the original mythology was actually the most benevolent, reasonable, and level-headed of the Greek gods.



That's saying very little.
And honestly, he didn't get hit as hard with the whole "you're evil now" thing as say, the entirety of the Voodoo religion or the god Anubis.  
On that note, I like how the afterlife is portrayed in Egyptian mythology.  It's basically a bureaucracy.  That's something I also like about the spirit world in Chinese mythology.  I'm kind of surprise that type of afterlife isn't more common in fiction.


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## j-max04 (Feb 8, 2015)

It's always possible that one of the religion has an afterlife that plays into the storyline, eg. a religion that believes that anyone who refrains from using magic their whole lives gets to live on as a spirit and whisper advice into peoples minds. This could mean a character could provide aid from the grave.


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## K.S. Crooks (Feb 8, 2015)

- One culture could have no belief in an afterlife and view a dead body as something to only be discarded.
- Another plain of existence where everyone goes to the same place, but takes on a life based on how good they were in this one (an afterlife based on karma).
- The dead walk among the living as observers and can sometimes influence the lives of the living. How much they can do is based on their power level in being good or evil.
- People are reincarnated as animals. The more powerful you were in life the greater a species you become.
Hope this sparks a few ideas.


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## Hainted (Feb 10, 2015)

I don't care what you believe(or don't) but religion isn't about "truth" anymore than history is. Both are written by the winners, survivors, and powerful to express their own personal pov. Unless the gods are very active in your world to the point of coming down and interrupting worship to correct someone's interpretation of what they said then it's ALL true.


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## Tom (Feb 10, 2015)

Hainted said:


> I don't care what you believe(or don't) but religion isn't about "truth" anymore than history is. Both are written by the winners, survivors, and powerful to express their own personal pov. Unless the gods are very active in your world to the point of coming down and interrupting worship to correct someone's interpretation of what they said then it's ALL true.



Yeah, sorry about that. I replied while still in the grip of my initial emotional response. It was only later when I'd cooled down that I got the real meaning of your post. The fault is mine--I'm always far too quick to jump the gun. 

I agree--all the religions in my world are true. A deeper understanding of how they intersect, compliment, and contradict each other is definitely in order. It might help me work out the bugs in my view of them.


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## Hainted (Feb 10, 2015)

I was being a little snarky in the original post so I'll take a fair share of blame. Believe me I put on my thick skin before getting on the internet. My point was  that belief will overpower any facts or truth  that may come up about your religion. It's human nature.


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## Tom (Feb 10, 2015)

I admire you for your thick skin. I've never developed mine. My temper lurks too close to the surface.

My problem with my religion-building stems from the fact that I write from a very close, personal POV. Sometimes when I take an authorial step back, I become disoriented by the big picture. When I wrote my world's religions, I wrote them from the point of view of people who followed them, but then tried to figure out how they would realistically fit into the world. 

It...eluded me.


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## WooHooMan (Feb 11, 2015)

Tom Nimenai said:


> My problem with my religion-building stems from the fact that I write from a very close, personal POV. Sometimes when I take an authorial step back, I become disoriented by the big picture. When I wrote my world's religions, I wrote them from the point of view of people who followed them, but then tried to figure out how they would realistically fit into the world.
> 
> It...eluded me.



I'm developing a religion and I'm having the same problem.  So, now it's not fitting into the story and it's like "why do I still have this in the setting at all?"


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## Hainted (Feb 11, 2015)

I haven't tackled religion in a big way in my stories, yet. I've got a few names and organizations, but until a religion becomes a central part of a story or character I'm just playing it loose. My biggest challenge religion wise is a story I've got planned about Golems, and their status in the world. Are they just tools, or do they deserve some rights like animals, or are they true living creatures? It's twisting my head around trying to make sense of it all.


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## Legendary Sidekick (Feb 11, 2015)

WooHooMan said:


> I'm developing a religion and I'm having the same problem.  So, now it's not fitting into the story and it's like "why do I still have this in the setting at all?"


I would say don't put the religion in if it doesn't fit, or don't force it in.

I like to have religion as something important to a character, but it's importance in the story itself varies.

One example is two characters who are being played in RPGs on this site.

My Dragon's Egg character is a Joan-of-Arcish barbarian who is inspired by her valkyrie guide. Having seen proof of her religion, she's become very enthusiastic in battle and does all in her power to please her goddess in hopes of earning her wings. I haven't gotten around to writing a story with her, and sometimes I wonder if the story would end with this character dying and getting the wings she so desires. Just thinking of that gave me visions of what the valkyrie's corner of the afterlife would be like: mostly whites and golds, flowing water, some natural structures and some that appear to have been built. Whether I would show that in the story would very much depend of whether the MC's death would be the end of her told adventures, or whether she would be sent back to the human world with a winged body (perhaps centuries later).

My Winds of Ysgard character hasn't been played, but I've written short stories with her. The only mention of religion I can think of is a moment of impatience, in which she says, "For the love of the virgin goddess..." That's a reference to Artemis, but I never mention the goddess by name. She's a huntress so she follows a hunting goddess. But she's not a zealot like her friend mentioned above, and her goddess does not intervene (whether or not She exists). Aside from the character vaguely referencing her goddess when she complains, religion doesn't come up in her stories--at least not the stories I've written so far.




In a story I wrote years ago, I had some angels who intervened. There was a battle in which the angels were fighting a large army of undead. The demons were attempting to desecrate the church, as the angels (a male archangel and female angel of death) had the power to resurrect on holy ground. They were protecting the priest, and as his death would mean a successful desecration--ridding the angels of their means to cheat death on the island--they fought recklessly and died and resurrected several times. The angel of death could make swords of light appear and she was throwing her swords like the Gauntlet valkyrie. The archangel had to do the Luke Skywalker thing to bring the hilt of his flaming sword back to his hand, which took a bit of time, forcing him to fight unarmed. The angels had limitations, one of them being the ability to summon Angel Armor, but only a single suit each. They used their armor to protect a child, so they had to fight naked after the first death and resurrection. The priest asked them to cover up after the battle was over.

Well... it was my first novel, but I did have fun with that scene.


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## ChasingSuns (Feb 20, 2015)

I also say that if a religion (or anything else for that matter) doesn't fit into your world, then don't force it. You'll find a way to organically fit in things like religion and whatnot.

In regards to an afterlife, in my current story there is a city of wizards. These wizards don't believe in a deity. Instead they believe that all things are part of the universal magical energy of the world, and that when a person dies they become part of that universal energy. Kinda like certain Eastern beliefs or the concept of the Force. But I would definitely take a look at each of the cultures in your world and see what kind of afterlife fits them. For example, for a warrior race like the Vikings you might go with something like Valhalla, or perhaps take a Greek approach with different regions in the afterlife. It all depends on the cultures.


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## phantommuseums (Feb 22, 2015)

I would read some of Joseph Campbell's works. He breaks down the purpose of myths in religion, and how they come to form from different societies (how hunting societies develop religion, how farming societies develop religion, how metropolises develop religion). 

George Lucas was really inspired by Joseph Campbell's work--it really breaks down the function and origins of religion, all types of religions. 

Heck, Dune is a great example of a science-fiction about the science of religion. 

Do it. The thing is, religion is an awesomely human thing, more human than god, actually. Don't stay away from religion, because it's a part of human life. If you can't be inspired from human life, then you're really blocking yourself off. Go for it.

But do read/listen to Joseph Campbell's lectures. It'll inspire you. It's the skeleton of religion really.


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## phantommuseums (Feb 22, 2015)

Also, here's another idea: spiritual experience, (the essence of all religious belief) is the experience of _awe._

So if you think about it, people develop philosophies and religions to better understand their awe-inspiring world, correct?

Therefore, the landscape inspires the people, which creates the philosophy.

Can you think of any landscapes in your world that would generate a feeling of awe? The way the stars move perfectly mathematically? The way a river floods in perfect time every single year? The way the tides pull in and out on a perfect measure of time? _That's_ the basic awe that makes people wonder, "Is someone controlling this?"


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## Mythopoet (Feb 22, 2015)

phantommuseums said:


> I would read some of Joseph Campbell's works. He breaks down the purpose of myths in religion, and how they come to form from different societies (how hunting societies develop religion, how farming societies develop religion, how metropolises develop religion).
> 
> George Lucas was really inspired by Joseph Campbell's work--it really breaks down the function and origins of religion, all types of religions.
> 
> ...



Joseph Campbell is completely overrated, imo.


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## phantommuseums (Feb 22, 2015)

Mythopoet said:


> Joseph Campbell is completely overrated, imo.



I'm sure there is a different, more underrated philosophy in the Perilous Realm.


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## WooHooMan (Feb 22, 2015)

I think phantommuseums is on the right track.  In a strange, indirect way, Campbell is one of the biggest influences on fantasy.  More so than Tolkien.

I can't really say that his work is terribly useful for creating a religion since it was meant as a tool for _comparing_ mythologies, not inventing them but reading his stuff pointed me in the direction of other writers whose works I used as the basis for my fictional religions/mythologies.  His stuff is as good a starting point as any.

Though I think at the end of the day, history and real-world religions is the best place to look to for inspiration.



Legendary Sidekick said:


> I would say don't put the religion in if it doesn't fit, or don't force it in.
> 
> I like to have religion as something important to a character, but it's importance in the story itself varies.



I'm pretty much trying to do what it sounds like your doing.  Religion does fit, I just needed to figure-out how.  It's all good now.


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## Mythopoet (Feb 23, 2015)

WooHooMan said:


> I think phantommuseums is on the right track.  In a strange, indirect way, Campbell is one of the biggest influences on fantasy.  More so than Tolkien.



Oh dear God, I hope not. Campbell interpreted mythology through a distinctly modern and narrow worldview, which makes his work particularly useless in the long run, no matter how popular it was at the time. As a mythologist, Campbell was terrible. His work is full of cherry picking examples, bad logic, his pet philosophy, and ridiculously generalized conclusions. Which should be obvious to anyone who has read actually read the mythologies he talks about. As a long time lover and reader of mythology, in my opinion Campbell's legacy should be expunged forever. If you're interested in mythology, don't go to Campbell, go to the source. Read the mythologies yourself. 

But now that I think on it, this makes some sense. This may be why I hate contemporary fantasy works so much compared to classic fantasy.


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## Russ (Feb 23, 2015)

Mythopoet said:


> Oh dear God, I hope not. Campbell interpreted mythology through a distinctly modern and narrow worldview, which makes his work particularly useless in the long run, no matter how popular it was at the time. As a mythologist, Campbell was terrible. His work is full of cherry picking examples, bad logic, his pet philosophy, and ridiculously generalized conclusions. Which should be obvious to anyone who has read actually read the mythologies he talks about. As a long time lover and reader of mythology, in my opinion Campbell's legacy should be expunged forever. If you're interested in mythology, don't go to Campbell, go to the source. Read the mythologies yourself.
> 
> But now that I think on it, this makes some sense. This may be why I hate contemporary fantasy works so much compared to classic fantasy.



Although I don't want Campbell expunged from the record, I agree with many of the sentiments in this post.

If you want to understand historical mythologies and religions to inspire your own, you don't need to read through the filer of Campbell.  Go right to the source.


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## Mythopoet (Feb 23, 2015)

Russ said:


> Although I don't want Campbell expunged from the record, I agree with many of the sentiments in this post.



Ok, that part might have been a bit harsh. But too many people look at Campbell like he's the be all and end all of mythological study. It's really very disturbing.


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## phantommuseums (Feb 23, 2015)

God forbid if I give a recommendation about one mythologist, it's the end all be all.

Of course go to the source of the myth. But what if that doesn't make sense to you? What if you wonder WHY one culture has a mythology based on animals, and the other based on cosmology? How has this myth effected a group of people, their psyche, their social order? This is why I suggest Joseph Campbell, but if you can find other and better mythologists, please inform me of what I am missing out on.

What I'm saying, is that the myth makers were people just like us. I was suggesting that Tom look into analyses of the people writing the myths along with the myths themselves. My apologies if I offended anyone.


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## Mythopoet (Feb 23, 2015)

phantommuseums said:


> God forbid if I give a recommendation about one mythologist, it's the end all be all.



You can recommend whoever you want. And I can post my opinion about your recommendation if I want to. That's how forums work. 



phantommuseums said:


> but if you can find other and better mythologists, please inform me of what I am missing out on.



I can recommend that if you are searching for meaning in ancient Egyptian beliefs and stories, there are two books by Egyptologist Jan Assmann that are simply fantastic:

Death and Salvation in Ancient Egypt
The Search for God in Ancient Egypt

These two books (along with a compendium of Ancient Egyptian literature that allows me to read the original translated works themselves) utterly changed my understanding of the Ancient Egyptians even after many years of being obsessed with their culture. I highly recommend them to anyone who is interested in an in depth and meaningful look at what the Ancient Egyptians thought and believed. 



phantommuseums said:


> My apologies if I offended anyone.



You didn't offend anyone. But don't get upset if people express opinions that differ from yours on an internet forum. Discussion is meaningless if there aren't different viewpoints being expressed. That's what this is all about.


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## WooHooMan (Feb 23, 2015)

Mythopoet said:


> Oh dear God, I hope not. Campbell interpreted mythology through a distinctly modern and narrow worldview, which makes his work particularly useless in the long run, no matter how popular it was at the time.



Hey, I didn't say he deserved to be a big influence.  I just said I think he is.
He's influential and accessible so he's as good a starting point as any.



Mythopoet said:


> discussion is meaningless if there aren't different viewpoints being expressed. That's what this is all about.


But this thread isn't about that.  It's not a discussion about the merit of Campbell as a mythologist.  Let's not get too off topic.


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## Creed (Feb 24, 2015)

Afterlifes are fun and meaningful constructs in a fantasy world if the author chooses to include them. For me it’s as simple as looking at the main themes within a given culture and from there building up a cohesive, intriguing, and believable afterlife. My Universe has three main planets, which gives me tons of opportunity to craft religions. I’ll only mention a few, though.

Furthermore, back two pages or so when you guys were talking about the truth behind religions, for me it’s important to have some idea of a history behind that religion. Especially when it comes to ancient history, back to the birth of the Universe. Knowing how my Universe was created, what key players are involved from there on, and how the Universe will ultimately end has allowed me to sprinkle religions across planets with grains of truth, which can act as foreshadowing devices as well as tidbits to those who pay close enough attention (the sort of thing which I love in series like the MBotF).

One culture of mine in is heavily tied to nature and night. As a result they believe the body is only a natural vessel for a soul which returns to the earth. The soul, however, enters a realm of darkness with what they are buried with (food and a weapon) for the Night Walk. During the Night Walk, the family mourns. It is forbidden to speak the name of the one who has died once the body is buried, for it is seen as a call that brings the soul back from its journey (this is supposedly what causes ghosts) until a full cycle of the moon has passed. By then, the soul has entered the night sky, and has become a new star.

Another religion is steered by the principle of the Absolute Solitudes, the five moons of the night sky and what they represent: Truth, Faith, Glory, Passion, and Salvation. Their hell is an absolute one- Mir’IlleshSinn, the Sleepless Place. It’s a blasted wasteland under an eternal sun, with horns of silver for trees and shards of it for grass. The damned wander under the blinding light, the boiling heat, their ankles torn to pieces. Mages and pagans go there (the Penitent are church-owned mages who can earn their way out of this fate- one of my characters is promised this and she dreams of going to Mir’IlleshSinn, it was a somewhat disturbing passage to write).

Another culture tied heavily to nature worships the embodiments of Sea and Sky, along with other symbols like Shore and Stars. They believe in cycles, and as such it makes sense that reincarnation is part of their culture. It depends. Most burn corpses (practicality would dictate this would be to avoid sickness) to allow the souls of the dead to climb the Sky, and either become a Star (same idea as first example, same cultural stem, different planet) or an animal. Evil men have spirits of the dark waters in them, and so this culture buries the evil men under the weight of stone, with stakes driven through their bodies, and pass water onto them (both pouring water and urinating on them). This way their souls (and the Sea) cannot climb the Sky and reach the stars. This ties in with certain beliefs regarding the serpent Uroboros who features in the Universe’s actual history, and is incorporated in different ways in cultures on different continents on different realms.

I hope that’s not too long, but it illustrates my kind of method.

_(Also I fully support looking to real mythologies as well as anthropological/psychological/philosophical analyses them. As Mythopoet said, "discussion is meaningless if there aren't different viewpoints being expressed. That's what this is all about." That's true for forums and world views. The more angles you understand an object (i.e. a myth) from, the more you'll learn.)_


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