# David Brin on writing and criticism



## Steerpike (Apr 28, 2012)

Interesting short video:


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## Christopher Wright (Apr 28, 2012)

Brin is awesome. He always comes across as amazingly arrogant, but he's so utterly charming about it I never care.


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## gavintonks (Apr 28, 2012)

Delightful thanks for sharing


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## Devor (Apr 28, 2012)

It took 3 minutes for him to say "Relationship with the reader," and I don't really accept sado-masochist as a useful answer.  At 6:30-ish he talks about seeking criticism and hearing it with a 3-foot pole, but doesn't talk about how to know which criticism to listen to.

At 8 minutes he starts to talk about a creative writing class as a motivator and resource.  He makes some good points.  I recommend people skip to that.

Most of the first half is him trying to sound uselessly smart.


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## Steerpike (Apr 28, 2012)

I like Brin's writing a lot. He's a smart guy and puts a lot of thought into his science fiction. I don't know if he was arrogant before he earned all his degrees and awards and his fellowship, but I do agree that he is that way. Nevertheless, his work stands on its own in my view. I think he is right about the need for criticism, and found the way he approaches it to be interesting.


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## JCFarnham (Apr 29, 2012)

I used to have professors who like him spoke in grand metaphor and questions ("so why is this?")... didn't like it much. It gets me saying "get to the point" in my mind. I have no doubt about David's intelligence, or his skill, or that he deserves all those awards, but that ego... yikes. 

He's doing that thing that certain authors (and even scientists I suppose) do. "I've done something awesome, so I'm going to talk to you, lowly mortal, as though my opinions are the absolute underlying fact of the universe" ... even though they're just opinions coated in metaphor and bamboozling imagery.

I'd love to get past this and disect the information he's trying to impart--hey the man's a bestseller you'd be mad not to--but he lost me a "skilled technicians". Readers are readers are fictions lovers are readers. 

Anyone care to fill me in on the important bits


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## Devor (Apr 29, 2012)

JCFarnham said:


> I'd love to get past this and disect the information he's trying to impart--hey the man's a bestseller you'd be mad not to--but he lost me a "skilled technicians". Readers are readers are fictions lovers are readers.



That's the marketing degree talking, I think.

The only thing he said which you might not have heard elsewhere is that taking a writing class can help by giving you feedback, weekly deadlines, and the opportunity to buddy-up and workshop with the top students in the class.


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## zizban (Apr 29, 2012)

I love how he does this video in front of the Hugo he won.


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## JCFarnham (Apr 29, 2012)

Devor said:


> That's the marketing degree talking, I think.
> 
> The only thing he said which you might not have heard elsewhere is that taking a writing class can help by giving you feedback, weekly deadlines, and the opportunity to buddy-up and workshop with the top students in the class.



Considering I have a marketing degree you'd have thought I'd be able to cope with it haha


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## Devor (Apr 29, 2012)

JCFarnham said:


> Considering I have a marketing degree you'd have thought I'd be able to cope with it haha



Maybe.  But marketing is all about getting the message across quickly.  Like the sado-masochist thing.  If he had just said a few sentences:

_We need to build a relationship with our readers.  Sado-masochism.  We want them to ruin their lives because they're addicted to our work!_

It wouldn't have been a thing.  Could be a great bit.  I see a funny commercial forming in my head.  But he goes on and on about it.  You need to think about adding value to the listener.


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## JCFarnham (Apr 29, 2012)

zizban said:


> I love how he does this video in front of the Hugo he won.



How did I not notice _that_? The man certainly has man parts I'll give him that.



			
				Devor said:
			
		

> You need to think about adding value to the listener.



But that's the thing isn't it. He could have said it simply, but he knew that he needed to do something to stand out from every other advice video out there. Just so happens he chose showing off his Hugo and using interesting language. If anything that tack exists for him to drum up interesting in his fiction; "If this man _speaks_ like this, his books must be equally eloquent".

Just goes to show, you _never_ stop marketing. Its not a one time thing, or a thing to be turned off and on when you need it, it's constant. Even if we don't learn anything in particular about the subject he's talking about, we can at least learn something from the _way_ in which he talks about it.


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## Devor (Apr 29, 2012)

JCFarnham said:


> But that's the thing isn't it. He could have said it simply, but he knew that he needed to do something to stand out from every other advice video out there.



That's the thing.  It plays into his brand, alright, but it's not actually a good advice video.  This kind of video needs to be either _fun_ or else _packed_ with information (or both).  The video is neither.  It's mostly standard advice coming at the tail end of a monologue.  He needs to play up the Hugo and his reputation just to convince people to watch it.

((edit))  I'm sorry, I understand people enjoy his books and I don't mean to offend anyone by disliking his video.  I can be done.


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## Steerpike (Apr 29, 2012)

LOL. I didn't notice the Hugo either. Well, he does have a bit of a reputation for pomposity. Nevertheless, great books. The Uplift War and others in that series were a lot of fun.

@Devor - I wouldn't worry about it. I don't think anyone in this thread is likely to be offended. Maybe if Brin drops by....


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