# Super Strength and Robot Suits



## Mask (Mar 18, 2013)

This question is rather sci-fi... not sure if that's OK for these boards. I apologise if it isn't.

Seen the robot legs the military has been working on? They showed them off some time back.

I was wondering... if you had someone who was super strong due to magic/science/whichever, would that be able to combine with a robotic exoskeleton? Or, would they interfere with each other?


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## CupofJoe (Mar 18, 2013)

The answer will usually be some variant on "They will/wont if you want/don't want them to".
It's your world and you get to make the "rules". As long as you are consistent in how the "rules" apply and can write it, then anything goes. [I know blue and white Ford Anglia cars don't fly* but JKR makes them work...]
Trying to mix the mundane [exoskeleton] with the fantastic [magical assistance] could bring up wonderful conflicts and differences of approaches between characters.
Personally - I like BIG DOG!!!

* not unless you find a really good humpbacked bridge and then they do.


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## Devor (Mar 18, 2013)

Mask said:


> I was wondering... if you had someone who was super strong due to magic/science/whichever, would that be able to combine with a robotic exoskeleton? Or, would they interfere with each other?



I would expect that, at some point early on, the robotic exoskeleton stops being _muscle enhancing_ and just replaces the work of your muscles all together.  I wouldn't see them as having a cumulative effect, unless maybe the super strong guy was just able to wear the heavier tougher suit.


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## Mask (Mar 18, 2013)

Certainly, by the time you get to a gundam style mecha, your own physical strength has no bearing.

I'm just wondering how plausible it is to have strength enhancers. I'm figuring it won't be what people are developing, even if it is possible. If you had a device that helped to strengthen your punch, the extra force would add a lot of strain to your arm and body, and quite likely injure you. So, they're more likely to have a device which doesn't enhance your strength, but acts as your strength.

I had an idea for a super strong character who would also use futuristic tech to aid them... but I'm not sure if it actually would work out, as far as robot suits go (unless his super strength is a backup).


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## wordwalker (Mar 21, 2013)

Now that I think about it, there's no reason the suit couldn't combine with his strength, just as two people can split the weight of a load they're lifting. We just don't think of a suit programmed to do that because by the time you've gone to the trouble of building one, there wouldn't be any normal people strong enough to match it.

Still, you're right, throwing a punch is different from lifting. It's probably harder to mutate a body to survive using super-strength than it is to give it that much energy, and when he makes any sudden moves with that much power the shock will do terrible things to his bones. I'm not sure any exoskeleton that really works with his body, as opposed to using his movements to guide it, would be able to cushion him from that.


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## Devor (Mar 21, 2013)

Mask said:


> I had an idea for a super strong character who would also use futuristic tech to aid them... but I'm not sure if it actually would work out, as far as robot suits go (unless his super strength is a backup).



I don't see a body suit getting very far in that sense.  But I think you could look at things like steroids, cybernetic implants, robotic strips attached to your bones/muscle, that kind of thing.


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## Mask (Mar 22, 2013)

You both make very good points. I think I'll go with Devor's idea, of cybernetic enhancement. An exoskeleton can't be expected to do what cybernetic enhancement in known for, I'd say.


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## psychotick (Mar 22, 2013)

Hi,

I'd go the genetic enhancement route personally. I did for my last book anyway. The reason is simple. I always remember watching the six million dollar man as a kid and thinking wow - his arm is really that strong, why doesn't it just fall off his body when he lifts a car? Why doesn't his back just break under the strain?

If you want to enhance strength you have to enhance the entire body, and not just in the ways you think of. Want to be super strong you're also going to need bigger, stronger bones to withstand the power of your muscles. You're probably going to be needing quicker reflexes too, otherwise you could accidentally kill yourself falling over. Some sort of genetic enhancement - a la Dave Brin's augments is the only thing I can think of that can cover all the bases.

Cheers, Greg.


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## Mask (Mar 22, 2013)

Mm, I agree. Was figuring his natural strength might come from that sort of thing. Was just wondering if technological strength would be able to add to it.


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## wordwalker (Mar 22, 2013)

psychotick said:


> I always remember watching the six million dollar man as a kid and thinking wow - his arm is really that strong, why doesn't it just fall off his body when he lifts a car? Why doesn't his back just break under the strain?



I've read the book, _Cyborg_; he actually had more than the arm, legs and eye replaced. TV strikes again.


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## Devor (Mar 22, 2013)

psychotick said:


> If you want to enhance strength you have to enhance the entire body, and not just in the ways you think of.



That's a really good point, especially if you're looking at strength generally.  You need to enhance strength everywhere.  I don't think genetics is the only answer, though.

For instance, a cybernetic implant could release steroids that enhance your muscles, based on measurements of your activity/brainpatterns, while robotic grafts on your bones could help strengthen the endoskeleton.

Hey, maybe you combine that with the suit he was talking about earlier, but instead of that being the thing that enhances his muscles, it instead keeps his body cushioned and supported.


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## Steerpike (Mar 22, 2013)

I like the implant ideas, but depending on the level of detail you want, you have to trace things further down the biochemical line. Steroids, for example, have tons of side effects and are hell on the liver, so ideally you'd have an implant (maybe hepatic) that was processing any excess that wasn't being taken up directly by the targeted muscles, or implants designed to deal with other chemical products produced as a result of the steroid metabolism. You could do a lot with cybernetic implants to enhance, as long as you keep the unintended consequences in mind as well.


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## psychotick (Mar 24, 2013)

Hi,

When I said that the body needed to be enhanced in more ways I meant a lot more ways. So look at the body as an entire system. Say you enhance strength to the point where a guys say five times as strong as normal. His bones probably need to be ten times as strong (pure guesswork here) simply to take the impact of that extra strength as he say jumps up and down. His reflexes would probably have to be twice as fast (more guesswork) simply because if his muscles are that much stronger they can get him into a lot of trouble more quickly than before - ever seen anyone used to playing tennis trying badminton for the first time and you'll understand what I mean.

Coordination also needs to be boosted or our quick and strong guy is still going to hurt himself a lot miss stepping etc.

Now we come to the other bits, the metabolic stuff. He needs to be able to heal much more quickly than before and not just because his accidents are going to be more severe than normal. But typical cells wear out at a certain rate. Increased strength means increased wear on a lot of tissues, joints especially, and they need to be repaired quickly. That means among other things a vastly improved liver to break down the waste products from damaged tissues. It also means better / faster blood flow to carry oxygen and glucose to the muscles and carry away wastes from them.

Energy needs to be boosted as well, because its all very well being superstrong but it means nothing if you don't have the energy to power those muscles. That means more ribosomes and mitochondria per cell, and perhaps a faster metabolism.

Now increased energy release means a metabolism running hotter than before, so that in turn may require the body to have better cooling systems - eg sweats more easily etc.

Making supermen isn't that easy, but at least some sort of genetic intervention gives you a chance of handling the entire system instead of just boosting one feature and watching the body tear itself apart, rather like sticking a V8 in a mini and not touching the suspensionand drive train etc, and then watching the car careen off the side of a track.

Cheers, Greg.


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