# Magic for overall effect



## Garren Jacobsen (Nov 10, 2011)

A few months back I remember reading a blog post by the esteemed Brandon Sanderson that dealt with this question I am about to pose. He stated in his post that there are three ways an author can use magic. One is a magic system that is detailed and completely laid out with rules and limitations clearly defined and never strayed from. The second is the exact opposite. A system that is comeplety not understood but is there and it is powerful. The third way is a hybrid of the two systems. 

Now as I considered this I came up with a question about how this would affect the "feel" of the novel and I wondered also if magic could be different for three different people in the same world? I pose the same questions to you all. Also if you make a position if could please substantiate the claim. I will also be giving my opinion on the matter after a couple of responses.


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## Devor (Nov 10, 2011)

Brian Scott Allen said:


> Now as I considered this I came up with a question about how this would affect the "feel" of the novel and I wondered also if magic could be different for three different people in the same world?



I think I'm doing something a little close to it in one of the works I'm working on.  As a mythological piece, there's gods who have immense and undefined power, their servants who have immense and undefined power subject to certain limitations, and several more limited forms of magic that commoners have access to.  But all of them are sort of intuitive.  We've heard of charms before, we have an intuition as to what wearing one might mean.  We know gods are powerful.  That kind of thing.

So my answer is, sure, why not?  I think three magical "systems" can be a lot to explain (in all the myriad of subtle, non-explainy ways authors can explain them) if the systems don't have that same intuitive tradition behind them, but in a fantasy world there's going to be that pent-up information of some kind which you need to let out there.  If it's right for the world, why not?


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## Garren Jacobsen (Nov 10, 2011)

Let me rephrase the question to add a different spin on it. What if the magic was the same system but POV characters perceived it differently? So to one character it would appear without limits, to another it would have strict limits, and to another it would have some limits. Would you consider this a possiblity even within the same world?


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## Benjamin Clayborne (Nov 10, 2011)

Yes, because you just described science. Some people understand the rules of the physical world very well. Some people don't understand it at all, and everything seems like it's controlled by spirits and magic. Some people have a hybrid understanding; they know that there are rules, but they're fuzzy and poorly-understood.

You can do that in fantasy fiction, as well: imagine the Mages' Guild, whose members all understand how magic works down to the smallest technical detail; and then there's the mud-hut commoners, to whom it's all inexplicable, er... _magic_. Then there's the nobles, who know that the mages have some system but don't really know what it is.


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## Telcontar (Nov 12, 2011)

If you create a 'magic' along the lines of your first definition, then as Benjamin said you are creating a science, not a magic system. It may be powerful and cool, but it isn't mysterious. Only the unknown can be mysterious. The more you define your magic, the less mystery you leave your world for that facet and thus it starts to feel more concrete, more sci-fi than fantasy if you take my meaning. 

I prefer the hybrid approach, though I fear that defining magic even a little bit will prevent me from reaching the truly mythic, epic feel of Tolkien that I've always wanted to capture. Oh well. You can still have elements to your world that are shadowy and ill-understood. Robert Jordan did this pretty well by simultaneously having the One Power (pretty much completely defined, more science than magic) as well as strange facets to his world that seemed separate from that power, like whatever strange force caused the rise of Shadar Logoth.


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## sashamerideth (Nov 14, 2011)

I like the seperate kinds of magic, I already have one well defined set, with rules and limitations, my main characters at the start all have some degree of it. But I think that I will introduce other people, with magics that just don't make sense with my rules, and will confuse my older characters.


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## Thalian (Nov 14, 2011)

Benjamin Clayborne said:


> Yes, because you just described science. Some people understand the rules of the physical world very well. Some people don't understand it at all, and everything seems like it's controlled by spirits and magic. Some people have a hybrid understanding; they know that there are rules, but they're fuzzy and poorly-understood.
> 
> You can do that in fantasy fiction, as well: imagine the Mages' Guild, whose members all understand how magic works down to the smallest technical detail; and then there's the mud-hut commoners, to whom it's all inexplicable, er... _magic_. Then there's the nobles, who know that the mages have some system but don't really know what it is.



This is about as good an answer as can be given.


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