# 23. James Clemens Discussion



## Philip Overby (Nov 3, 2013)

Usually I know most of the authors on these fantasy lists, but I embarrassed to say some of them are drawing a blank. James Clemens is the next on the list. As I'm trying to get more familiar with authors people like, I'm interested to know if anyone has read work by him. He also writes under his real name James Rollins. _The Banned and Banished_ series seems to be his most popular fantasy work, beginning with _Wit'ch Fire_.

Any thoughts on James Clemens? (That cover looks pretty cool, that's for sure!)


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## Feo Takahari (Nov 3, 2013)

The Clemens I've read is _The Banned and the Banished_, so that's what I'll comment on.

Overall, _The Banned and the Banished_ is an unusual combination of high and dark fantasy. On the one hand, you've got a clear villain, an epic (some would say over-the-top) struggle for the fate of the world, and an unlikely band of heroes who're not quite sure they're up for all this. On the other hand, the villains and monsters are truly grotesque (one early villainess has the graphically detailed power to birth and unbirth venomous spiders), innocent people often die horribly, and the protagonists themselves often doubt whether they're doing the right thing. It's a surprisingly effective mix, allowing the reader to root for the heroes while providing genuine tension that they might screw up and get themselves or others killed.

Plenty of authors can create good characters. Relatively few authors can, in the span of a single short scene, introduce a new character to the established cast, make that character likable and interesting without overshadowing everyone else, and create reader investment in that character's fate. Of the authors I've read who can pull this off, Clemens is the third-best overall at doing it, the best who writes full-length novels, and the best who works with such a massive cast of characters. No matter what your tastes are, you're bound to find a character or three you'll love and adore, and while not all of them live long enough to get a full character arc, almost all of them are used well. (Only one of my favorites survived to the final battle, but I didn't even mind because they all died in such fitting ways.)

With all that praise, Clemens still has a weakness, and it's a serious one--he's incredibly hamhanded with what emotions he expects you to feel in certain scenes. At times it's like he's sitting right next to you, yelling into your ear "See, this is the sad scene! You're supposed to be sad! Are you sad yet?" Since the characters are so strong, you'll probably feel the expected emotions anyway, but it still gets a bit distracting.

Reading these books is a lot like watching a good Arnold Schwarzenegger movie--they're so hammy and cheesy they should be served on sliced bread, but that doesn't mean they aren't awesome. They'll make you laugh, make you cry, and maybe even make you think a little, and then you'll wipe your eyes, clear your brain, and get back to watching the carnage.

Edit: I should also note that my father, who regularly reads trashy thrillers, loves his work as James Rollins. I haven't touched it myself--it looks a bit over-the-top even compared to the stuff he's done as Clemens.


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## Philip Overby (Nov 3, 2013)

James Clemens fantasy work sounds actually pretty interesting. I kind of like cheesy 80s movies on occasion and off the wall fantasy (for example my thread about Fun, Wild, Crazy novels). I can deal with the emotional issues if what you say about his characters and world is true. I almost have a similar thing going in my own current novel. While it focuses on monster hunting, sorcery, and typical fantasy fare, it also has grotesque creatures and pretty dark situations. So maybe Clemens is worth checking out for me specifically because he may write things similar to what I am attempting at the moment.

Thanks for the insight!


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## BWFoster78 (Nov 4, 2013)

I started this series back when I would read just about anything.  I gave up on it several books in, one of the first series I ever gave up on.

Looking back to try to figure out why, it's probably the darkness.  I'm just not a fan.


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## Steerpike (Nov 4, 2013)

I liked the Wit'ch books well enough. Some of the Rollins stuff is interesting, but I'm not a huge fan.


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## A. E. Lowan (Nov 5, 2013)

I managed to get my hands on an ARC of Wit'ch Fire before it released, and didn't like it.  I don't really remember why, but I think it was his protagonist I had issues with - she kinda of struck me as whiney, but she was also very young.  The work of his that I'm most familiar with is his Sigma Force novels he writes as Rollins.  My writing partner loves good spy thrillers.  I'm not saying his are, but he does write great characters.  His biggest failing tends to be an issue with forgetting basic principles of physics.  One incident that just really drove me crazy (I don't remember which book this is from) happened when he had his two protagonists hiding from the bad guys in a crowd of tourists.  The bad guys spot them, and shoot at them, hitting a good guy with a graze to the side.  What happens to the bullet?  Beats me, because the author never says.  Bad guys fire into a crowd of people, and hit _nothing_.  In what universe?  Blargh!  Anyway, besides giant whoopsies the books are enjoyable.


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## Feo Takahari (Nov 5, 2013)

A. E. Lowan said:


> I managed to get my hands on an ARC of Wit'ch Fire before it released, and didn't like it.  I don't really remember why, but I think it was his protagonist I had issues with - she kinda of struck me as whiney, but she was also very young.



Yeah, I think Elena's supposed to be a "relatable" protagonist, which tends to mean a whiner. For what it's worth, she hits a point towards the end of book 1 where her only options are to grow a spine or break completely, and she does the former and becomes more tolerable for the rest of the series. (Still, she's not even in my top three favorite characters among the initial cast, let alone anywhere near the top of the cast as a whole.)


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