# Law Enforcement Ladder



## Addison (Nov 11, 2013)

Hi everyone!

In the process of my WiP I found that I may have hiccuped. I know what cops, sheriffs and FBI do but the hierarchy, so to speak, is what I'm not so clear on. I know that, in a given case, the FBI has jurisdiction and the local law enforcement, police or sheriff, must listen to them. 

But in another case would the police listen to the sheriff or would the sheriff listen to the police? Then there's CIA, federal Marshalls, foot patrols, detectives, military police etc. 

So in this totem pole who's on the bottom and who's at the top?

Ooh! And rank. I know a deputy works for the sheriff. And in the police force you start as a cadet, but what's the next and the next after that?


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## GeekDavid (Nov 11, 2013)

CIA is not even on the totem pole. They're not supposed to have anything to do with what happens inside the nation, only outside.

FBI generally only steps in where the crime is federal in nature (i.e. codified in federal statute and not state statute) or when the fugitive has crossed state lines. The second happens far more often than the first. Of course, areas like where I live, where the state line pretty much runs right through the middle of the urbanized area, the police departments tend to cooperate and don't need FBI help.

US Marshals are tasked with recovery of fugitives on the run, sometimes for years or decades.

I could be wrong on this, but I don't think FBI or US Marshals are empowered to enforce state or local laws, or if they are they generally don't bother with it. You're not likely to get pulled over for speeding by a US Marshal.

With that said, the hierarchy generally goes city-county-state. A sheriff's deputy can generally override a city cop, and a state policeman or trooper (or even other terms, Washington has the State Patrol, not the State Police, and California Highway Patrol is the state police agency there) can usually override them both. But some states are different.

As far as rank goes, generally it's: officer/deputy/trooper/patrolman for the lowest rank out of the academy. Officer for city PD, deputy for sheriff, and trooper/patrolman/officer or whatever for state police depending on what they're called. Above that some agencies put the equivalent of corporal... some call them corporals, some call them senior officers, some call them what have you. After that you have sergeants, which is pretty universal, then lieutenants and captains. At captains and above you're getting away from the man on the beat and into the management and bureaucracy.

Oh, and detective isn't a rank, it's a job. It generally designates an officer, sergeant, lieutenant, or what have you whose job isn't to drive a beat but to pursue the investigation of a given crime. Small towns have generic detectives, big cities break them into homicide detectives, burglary detectives, gang detectives, etc. You also have detective sergeants, detective lieutenants, and so on.

Wow! That's an infodump!


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## Devor (Nov 11, 2013)

It's not about "who's on top."  It's about jurisdiction.  Whoever has it is the one that matters.

"Sherrif" is the ambiguous one.  It refers to county authorities.  Police refer to the local municipalities.  So in rural areas you only see the sherrif, while in others you see both and the two are nearly identical, while in some cities, like NYC, the sherrif is completely off the map, mostly relegated to dealing with custody battles and deadbeat parents.  It depends on how much local laws diverge from state and county.

The FBI investigates federal crimes.  Most crimes are local, or state, so the FBI doesn't have jurisdiction.  But anything which breaks federal laws - like drugs - or any crime which crosses state borders, or deals with terrorism, brings in the FBI.  They take control, sure, because they have the most resources.  But if a local crime was broken, the local authorities still investigate.

It's my understanding that the Federal Marshals deal with tracking fugitives, people who are known to be running or hiding from the law


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## GeekDavid (Nov 11, 2013)

Devor said:


> It's not about "who's on top."  It's about jurisdiction.  Whoever has it is the one that matters.
> 
> "Sherrif" is the ambiguous one.  It refers to county authorities.  Police refer to the local municipalities.  So in rural areas you only see the sherrif, while in others you see both and the two are nearly identical, while in some cities, like NYC, the sherrif is completely off the map, mostly relegated to dealing with custody battles and deadbeat parents.  It depends on how much local laws diverge from state and county.



Yep.

While a sheriff or state policeman can pull over a speeder in a city with their own police department, in most instances if you call for the police in an incorporated city you'll get a city police officer responding. If you call for a cop in an unincorporated but urban area, you'll likely get a sheriff's deputy. If you call in the boonies it's probably either a sheriff's deputy or state policeman that will respond.

However, all those rules have exceptions. The fairly recently incorporated town of Spokane Valley, for example, has Spokane Valley Police, but they're all Spokane County Sheriff's deputies with different shoulder patches and cars with different paint jobs. In essence, the SVPD is an arm of the SCSO. In the silicon valley area of California I grew up in, several of the smaller incorporated towns didn't have police at all, but relied on the Santa Clara County Sheriff to provide policing. In one the police and firemen were part of the same department called (if memory serves) Public Safety. You could actually see a cop car pull up to a house fire in that town, watch the cop get out and put on a fireman's jacket, and start helping to put the fire out.

The best thing you can do, Addison, is to get in touch with the local cops in the town your story is set in -- if it's set in a real town. Usually the police are willing to share information with the public, and they can give you a lot of good facts about how law enforcement works in that part of the country. If you're setting the story in a fictional town, call the police in the town your fake one is based on, and do the same thing.


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## Addison (Nov 11, 2013)

Thank you both. So, with your own knowledge-as I can't believe getting a straight answer from a real officer-if a monster was terrorizing the city wrecking buildings, tearing up streets and scaring the entire populace, would that be a reason to call the FBI? Or maybe the military, as the monster is fifty feet high, muscles decked in spikes and claws and is apparently invulnerable. (Contemporary fantasy, all cities have a magical arm of the law.)


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## GeekDavid (Nov 11, 2013)

Addison said:


> Thank you both. So, with your own knowledge-as I can't believe getting a straight answer from a real officer-if a monster was terrorizing the city wrecking buildings, tearing up streets and scaring the entire populace, would that be a reason to call the FBI? Or maybe the military, as the monster is fifty feet high, muscles decked in spikes and claws and is apparently invulnerable. (Contemporary fantasy, all cities have a magical arm of the law.)



National Guard would be the most likely. They have no law-enforcement authority but can (and do) intervene in the case of disaster, which this would be.

*Edited to add*: Oh, and you can trust the cops to tell you things like this. I've known dozens of cops in my lifetime, and underneath the uniform they're your basic human, they just have a different kind of job. They want people to understand what they do just like anyone else does.


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## Devor (Nov 11, 2013)

Addison said:


> Thank you both. So, with your own knowledge-as I can't believe getting a straight answer from a real officer-if a monster was terrorizing the city wrecking buildings, tearing up streets and scaring the entire populace, would that be a reason to call the FBI? Or maybe the military, as the monster is fifty feet high, muscles decked in spikes and claws and is apparently invulnerable. (Contemporary fantasy, all cities have a magical arm of the law.)



FBI.  National Guard.  Homeland Security.  Certainly you'd call the cops, too.

Inside the US, the military cannot get involved without a direct order from the President, and that never happens.


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## GeekDavid (Nov 11, 2013)

Devor said:


> Inside the US, the military cannot get involved without a direct order from the President, and that never happens.



Very true, but the National Guard is under the command of the governor of the state they're based in -- the Idaho National Guard is under the command of the Governor of Idaho, for example. And they get called out by governors in case of disaster quite a bit.


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## GeekDavid (Nov 11, 2013)

Oh, one more thing, since we seem to be straying in this direction anyway. You should study up on the Posse Comitatus Act so you don't create a situation that's totally unrealistic.

Basically, it makes it illegal for most armed forces of the US from acting in any law enforcement capacity. The National Guard can be exempted if the Governor of their state signs off on it, the Coast Guard in time of peace are considered part of Homeland Security so they're not covered by it either, and of course military police can act as law enforcement towards other members of the armed forces.

In order to maintain some semblance of reality, you should probably try to keep anyone you identify as an Army officer from trying to arrest someone unless they're also in the Army and the arresting officer is a military policeman.


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## GeekDavid (Nov 11, 2013)

There's also a lot of good info here. Law enforcement in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Addison (Nov 11, 2013)

Wow! Thanks for all your help David. Now I have that part of the story all figured out.


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## GeekDavid (Nov 11, 2013)

Not a problem... I'm so often on the receiving end of advice and info, it's nice to be able to share some of my knowledge.


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## wordwalker (Nov 12, 2013)

Addison said:


> if a monster was terrorizing the city wrecking buildings, tearing up streets and scaring the entire populace, would that be a reason to call the FBI? Or maybe the military, as the monster is fifty feet high, muscles decked in spikes and claws and is apparently invulnerable. (Contemporary fantasy, all cities have a magical arm of the law.)



In a situation like this, they'd probably call EVERYBODY short of the military itself within three minutes, and they might not need too many more minutes to escalate it to the military too, including calling in the President. Or, a lot of people would try to push it that high that fast anyway.

But maybe not so much for a world like yours. If this is a _kind_ of problem they've seen before, no matter how much bigger, they'd be more likely to keep it in the usual channels people have said --whichever level of cop was in charge, plus National Guard and every other police type that charged in to help.


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