# Monotheism in Fantasy Worlds- Thoughts?



## Mindfire

I've noticed that fantasy worlds tend to either be polytheistic or make no mention of gods or religion at all. 
While this is reflective of the pre-Christian world that most fantasy has been modeled on since Tolkien*, is there really any reason not to have a monotheistic world? 

I ask because I have a monotheistic fantasy world with four major nations: one of them is largely atheistic, another is polytheistic but their gods aren't "real", and the latter two worship the true deity, who has revealed himself to them under different names. This setup is very different from the approach to gods/religion I've seen in the books I've read. 

Is there some kind of taboo against monotheism in fantasy? Would it be considered (too) political to have a One God in my books? What do you guys think?



*Tolkien's Legendarium actually _does_ have a One God, Eru Illuvatar, but it also has lesser gods/demiurges, the Valar and Maiar, making it technically polytheistic. His friend C.S. Lewis's books are unabashedly monotheistic, but they're also widely regarded as "exclusively" Christian. While I am a Christian and my beliefs influence my writings, I don't want my books to be seen as propaganda. :/


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## virtualmayham

Ok, well that's true in a sense.  There are some books that explore monotheism without becoming "propaganda".  For example. A Song of Ice and Fire has multiple gods.  Some of the gods are known as the Seven.  They are not 7 gods, but seven aspects of one god, like in Christianity.  So yeah, that's not completely true, and you can have one god.


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## Queshire

Like anything it can work, but I suggest being very, very careful. I suggest having the god reveal himself to all the nations, and then have the atheist and polythestic nations CHOOSE not to worship 'im. For the polythestic ones it could be just tradition / prefrence, while the athesists ones might think that the god's not a god but simply a being orders of magnitude greater then humans, like an elephant to ants, and they might think that's no reason to worship 'im


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## ThinkerX

The main empire on my main world is monotheistic, and can trace a warped descent back to christianity.  The church actually weilds immense power; a couple of imperial provinces are effectively church fiefs, the church has its own military, and is authorized to investigate and prosecute certain types of crimes.  A few times, there have even been full fledged inquistions.  (This situation came about because of weak emperors in the past cutting desperate deals with cunning Patriarchs to save their hides, and became institutionalized since then.  And yes, there was a time or two when church and imperial armies did tangle with one another on the battlefield).  

Thats my world.

Elsewhere...best example I can think of is Kate Elliots 'Crown of Fire' series (also based on a warped version of christianity).

For that matter, you take a careful read through some of the more bizarre escapades in church history, and you'll have the material for all sorts of tales - like the 'corpse synod', where one particularly odious Pope had the body of one of his predecessors exhumed and put on trial - literally! Or the various Anti-Popes, some of whom are stranger than many fantasy characters.  Or the popes who literally turned the vatican into a brothel.  Then there are the infamous 'Four Questions' put forth to prospective bishops (can't repeat them here, they fall into the XXX catagory with a side helping of disgusting).  That is even before you get to the shenanigans of later day (protestant) church leaders.


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## Jabrosky

I don't have a problem with monotheism in fantasy _per se_, but many religious traditions can be more complicated than the Western dichotomy of monotheism and polytheism. Part of the issue is how gods are defined in the first place.

Take traditional African religions for instance. Many of them _could_ be considered monotheistic in the sense that they teach that there is one single Creator deity, but this Creator is often so distant from humans that most spiritual activity is focused instead on venerating ancestors or clan totems. In some of these same religions rulers such as kings are considered god-like as well. Depending on how you define a god, such African religions can be seen as either monotheistic or polytheistc.

In fact, if I may go on a slight tangent, what we know as ancient Egyptian religion is probably descended from this widespread African tradition. Most Egyptian gods began as totems associated with specific villages or clans, but some were ancestors believed to have once walked the earth (e.g. Ausar/Osiris and Aset/Isis) and there was usually one Creator (who could be either Ra, Amun, or Ptah depending on doctrine). Pharaohs were also considered god-like and could become actual gods after death. Basically what happened is that once the Egyptians unified into a single nation-state, they combined their various deities into one hulking pantheon.


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## Penpilot

I don't think there are taboos against it. I vaguely remember reading a book that had a monotheistic world, but I can't remember the title. Any way, I speculate one of the advantages for a polytheistic world is it's obviously different than the monotheistic western world and sets itself easily apart from it. When you have a fictional monotheistic society many people, including myself, will lean to making a one-to-one association between the fictional god and the biblical one even if that's not what you want.

Generally, I don't think it'd be considered too political, but I think it depends on how hard the story thumps on any of the similarities between the story god and the one from our world, and how well you go about differentiating the two from one another. Personally, as long as the book isn't preaching, I don't think I'd have any issues with it.


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## Rullenzar

I don't believe it's a tabooed subject, i think it more comes down to the authors stance on the topic. It also depends on the type of fantasy, some may be suited more then others. I myself have seen some type of god worship in the majority of the novels I've read. A dark elf worshiping a dark god, Game of thrones, Tolkein, prince of nothing to name some more common ones. You seem to have your adaptation of it down solid so I don't think you have anything to worry about.


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## Saigonnus

I think by and large, most fantasy writers tend to use a polytheistic approach like much of the D&D stuff where the Gods represent different facets of society. The one I could remember was from Forgotten Realms and was Mystra, goddess of magic (which kind of served to make wizards needing to be "religious", Cyric the Mad, God of Chaos and others. Truthfully I used something like that for my original gaming world, but not for my WIP. I use a single God/Goddess, whose form really varies depending on the worshipping culture so can be male, female, human, animal or whatever. 

For example, the Ruaka (small and furry gnomelike creatures that live in burrows beneath trees) revere Arwauk who takes the form of a large Bear and is often seen walking around their communities. They find bears holy, so never hunt them and also have somewhat of an affinity for them as well thus are never prey to the bears. 

The Talutah Ooljee, or Druids are more for a generalized sense of nature being their deity and thus the Goddess manifests in a warm spring rain, or an orange moon or the mysterious flickering lights often visible in their groves and tree cities. 

The island people generally see their god Ipashur as a bald and bearded sea-farer in brightly colored silks and bedecked in gold and silver jewelry. He protects them with fair winds, keeps them safe from the fierce storms and keeps their families secure when they are out fishing.

As long as you are consistant within the story, no one should really care one way or another whether you have one God/Goddess or twenty-five. If it isn't preachy and detailed about the inner workings of the religion (unless of course it's important to the story) than just run with it.


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## Amanita

I absolutely don't see any reason why there shouldn't be a monotheistic fantasy world. I'm quite sure I've seen it in a few books even though I can't really name them anymore. It is true that monotheistic societies in many of those books have been largely made up of misogynist antagonists but that doesn't mean something else can't or shouldn't be done with it. (This probably has to do with the authors' issues with real life religions as well which I generally don't like to see in fantasy books.) With many setups that greatly resemble medieval Europe a similar religious background would actually make more sense than some other things presented. The Church did play an important role in shaping medieval society after all.


> I ask because I have a monotheistic fantasy world with four major nations: one of them is largely atheistic, another is polytheistic but their gods aren't "real", and the latter two worship the true deity, who has revealed himself to them under different names.


Are the two nations worshipping the "real" deity superior to the others in moral and other ways? Than this will be a clear message from your side. You're free to write you story that way of course. Some people are going to like it and others are not.


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## Morgoth

I don't see any reason why a fantasy story shouldn't have a one true god. I haven't read many stories that have only one real god and personally I preffer ones that have multiple deities. I find gods that embody some attribute and interferre with mortal events more interesting. 



> I ask because I have a monotheistic fantasy world with four major nations: one of them is largely atheistic, another is polytheistic but their gods aren't "real", and the latter two worship the true deity, who has revealed himself to them under different names. This setup is very different from the approach to gods/religion I've seen in the books I've read.
> 
> Is there some kind of taboo against monotheism in fantasy? Would it be considered (too) political to have a One God in my books? What do you guys think?



Just wondering, why has the true deity revealed himself to two nations and not the others? Surely if this god revealed himself to the atheist nation they couldn't possibly continue to be atheists. Does this god not want them to believe in him?

If your story has the true god nation better in all ways then the other nations I think some people might see this as saying...I don't know, believers are better then atheists or something. I don't know what your story is about but I'd avoid that.


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## myrddin173

I really don't think there is a taboo on monotheism.  I know I have read a number of books with monotheistic religions, A Song of Ice and Fire has been mentioned.  The Ranger's Apprentice series also has a monotheistic religion for the main country but that could be because it is heavily based on Europe/Britain.

In one of my worlds the three "human countries" all have monotheistic religions based on different branches of Christianity (Anglicanism, Protestantism, and Catholicism).



Mindfire said:


> Tolkien's Legendarium actually _does_ have a One God, Eru Illuvatar, but it also has lesser gods/demiurges, the Valar and Maiar, making it technically polytheistic.



That depends on your interpretation.  He describes them as "angelic beings."  Christianity has angels and its not called polytheistic (well some do, but not because of that).


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## Steerpike

I agree that there is no taboo.

Also, I would stick with your original conception. I think it will work just fine, and I'd be suspect of advice that tells you, in essence, to re-write your story in the way the person giving advice would write it.


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## Anders Ã„mting

Well, see, this depends. Of course there's nothing wrong with having monotheistic religions, and I wouldn't even say there's anything wrong with having the monotheistic religion be the "correct" one, in that there really is only one God in the universe in question.

On the other hand, there are going to be more then one religion, and some may very well be polytheistic, animistic, imperial cults, etc.  Also, there will be schisms, sects, and people worshiping the same god but under different names. You will have multiple religions that all belong to the same "family", being tracable back to one proto-religion. There will be religions that assimilate other religions, resulting in different customs or enterpretations, or religions that ended up heavily edited or censored to fit a certain political purpose, etc. Religion is ultimately a very human phenomenon.

A good example of what I find a rather poor take on monotheism would be the Wheel of Time: here we have a world were everyone, regardless of culture and tradition, holds this vague and undefined kind of belief in "the Creator" and the concept of "Light", but there seems to be no real organized religions beyond that. It's like everyone in the whole world agreed that "_someone_ created this universe, let's just leave it at that." Which is pretty unrealistic when you think about it. (Not to mention dull.)

Even if you only have one god, period, there will be as many different ways of worshiping him as there are different people in your world. And that's a good thing, because it gives your world more flavour and says something about how all those people see their world.



virtualmayham said:


> Ok, well that's true in a sense.  There are some books that explore monotheism without becoming "propaganda".  For example. A Song of Ice and Fire has multiple gods.  Some of the gods are known as the Seven.  They are not 7 gods, but seven aspects of one god, like in Christianity.  So yeah, that's not completely true, and you can have one god.



That kind thing is fun playing around with. One of my settings have a religion closely resembling the Judeo-Christan model. They technically worship a trinity of dieties, but they are all the same god except with three separate identities. (One male, one female and one genderless.) They each represents different aspects of the diety and are prayed to in different circumstances. 

Another major religion in that setting also only has one god, but he actually changes identity from benevolent life-giving god to ferocious war god depending on the state of his patron nation - if the nation goes to war, he actually becomes a different god and remains that god until the war is over. He also has an additional identity that only exists in dreams. (Because the people in question believe dreams and waking are separate existances.)


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## Xanados

I don't see the problem with monotheism in fantasy. The society from which the protagonist of my new short story comes is wholly monotheist.


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## Legendary Sidekick

I lean toward monotheism in my stories, but have plenty of angels and demons. I enjoy having multiple heavenly beings, rather than multiple gods, because--for me--it's more palatable to make angels imperfect than to have flawed gods, like in the Greek Myths. (I mean as a writer. As a reader, I love Greek Mytholgy and its corrupt gods and petty goddesses!)

I tend to keep The One God nameless and distant when I write. I intentionally keep the truth behind the religion vague and focus more on the moral issues within the story. Not that anything I write is ever all that serious.

So that's a "yes" on the poll from me.


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## Devor

I voted "no," but I don't really mean it.

If you have a monotheistic religion, you either need to be very careful to avoid your readers reacting to things which they see as being implied real-world connections, or you need to embrace it and intentionally make those implied real-world connections.

If I were to make a rule, the rule would be to avoid having a clear monotheistic religion.  But I believe rules are for people who don't know what they're doing and are made to be broken by the experts.


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## Mindfire

Morgoth said:


> IJust wondering, why has the true deity revealed himself to two nations and not the others? Surely if this god revealed himself to the atheist nation they couldn't possibly continue to be atheists. Does this god not want them to believe in him?
> 
> If your story has the true god nation better in all ways then the other nations I think some people might see this as saying...I don't know, believers are better then atheists or something. I don't know what your story is about but I'd avoid that.



Well, this gets into backstory, but he actually did. Brace yourself.

The four nations used to be one nation that all worshiped the same god. But they grew arrogant and started abusing their power and resources. This is what created the desert. As they grew complacent, they didn't take care of the land and over time, similar to that Dust Bowl thing, it turned into desert. As a punishment for their negligence, their civilization was destroyed in a sandstorm. 

After this event, they split into two factions: one faction decided to continue in rebellion, left the desert and traveled to better lands in the north, where they chose to go their own way and make their own gods since they believed the One God had abandoned them. The other faction decided to remain in the south and rebuild and remain faithful. 

Eventually the northern faction began to think themselves superior the the southern faction and invaded them, intent on making them into slaves. The southerners were not expecting an invasion and were unprepared. They split into two groups: one group retreated into the desert and their descendants became the Mavarians. The other group retreated in to the dense jungle, and their descendants became the Mako. Their god gave them magic powers in order to help them defend themselves from the invaders and to make life easier for them in their hostile new homes. But he also limited their powers to prevent them from abusing them. 

The northerners realized that pursuing into the desert and jungles would be a bad idea, so they were content to remain in the lands they had already subdued. Most of them returned north, but some of them colonized the southern territory they had acquired and managed to transform it into a fertile country. The resultant agricultural success brought economic stability that allowed them to pursue the arts and sciences and claim independence, seperating them from their northern mother country. 

As a symbol of their independence they abandoned the northern pagan religious system, but they also didn't want to adopt the monotheism of the southerners, because they deemed them inferior. Their rulers decided this would be a good opportunity to grab power, so they wouldn't have to constantly share power with a religious sect. They issued a declaration that the gods did not exist and banned all public worship. They funded the arts and sciences with a bias towards atheism. After a few generations the idea that there were no gods became accepted as fact. 

The southern colonists who abandoned the gods became the Elyssians, whereas the northern faction who retained their religious system became the Beorgians and their priests over time grew in power until their authority rivaled the Czar of Beorgia himself. The Elyssians take this as evidence that they were right in rejecting religion, as they think it creates a dangerous division of loyalties between the gods and the state.

Thus one nation evolved into two nations and those two nations evolved into 4 nations: two monotheistic, one polytheistic, one atheistic.

Does that make sense?

And I'm not at all trying to say that believers are better than non-believers. While I admit I have a bias towards the Mavarian and Mako cultures, sympathetic non-believers are also prominently featured in my main cast.


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## Mindfire

Amanita said:


> Are the two nations worshipping the "real" deity superior to the others in moral and other ways? Than this will be a clear message from your side. You're free to write you story that way of course. Some people are going to like it and others are not.



Superior? Well, not quite. The Mavarians and the Mako are kind of my two favorite children as far as my nations go, but I wouldn't say they're superior. Their worship of the One God of this world does _not _make them immune to corruption, and I've made that clear. Their singular advantage over the other two nations is magic, which was a gift to help them survive in their harsh environment because they live in the most untamed regions of the world, fraught with dangerous bloodthirsty predatory monsters. But their powers have very clear and strict limitations which are fairly easy to exploit when abused. Their powers are also tied to their spirituality and can fade or become weak when they are used improperly. 

In terms of organization they are arguably inferior to the other two nations. They have no organized military, zero naval presence, and as far as governments go, the Mavarians are a largely nomadic, family-centered society. They have a king, but he has relatively little power compared to the family elders. And the Mako are a tribal society with little interest in the affairs of the outside world. The only reason they haven't been conquered is that their environments act as natural fortresses. By comparison the other two nations have strong armies, virtually absolute control over seas, well-regulated economies, and powerful governments. So I wouldn't say there's any "superiority", I would argue that each nation has its own well-balanced strengths and weaknesses.


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## Shockley

I wouldn't say there's a particular problem with monotheism, but I do think it limits the fantastic potential of your story. Still, if done right, there shouldn't be a problem with it.

 On a total side note, there's no reason I can think of for multiple nations not to have multiple religions, or have disputes over the proper worship of religions. One of the problems I have always had with fantasy worlds (and this probably stems from D&D requiring it for the benefit of player characters) is that religions tend to follow a fairly strict set up: These are the Gods that are worshipped. This God is evil, this God is neutral and this God is good. It's very simplistic, and while it is something that I think can and should be expressed in narratives and in character dialogue, I think it's something that can and should be explored within the story itself. As C. S. Lewis once laid out, people don't commit evil for the sake of evil - and that should apply to characters as well, especially their religion. Nuances are always better, and part of that nuance can be the perceptions of others towards that religion.


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## Agran Velion

I don't see a problem with it all, when I read about a pantheon of gods, I don't automatically think the author is trying to promote Greek or Egyptian mythology. I'm also leaning towards Legendary Sidekick, as I prefer to have an unclear single god and have flawed angels (or in my story, Saints) take the place of a pantheon.


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## Rullenzar

Henotheism is sometimes considered a sophisticated version of monotheism in that it allows the worshiper to believe in essentially one Supreme Being and still appreciate and not limit the names, expressions, or manifestations used to describe it.-_http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henotheism:_

Was doing a little research when the topic of religion came up to see If it would be something my story would or should use as I hadn't thought about it yet and after reading about this certain term I remembered this topic and thought it might be useful for you.

On a side note I'm not sure why the site stated doesn't take you to the page as it is copyed and pasted but after clicking link here, click on 'search for henotheism in related articles' then click the very first article in the list. This will take you to the page if your interested in reading up on it.


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## Phin Scardaw

The beautiful thing about fantasy writing is that you can write whatever takes your fancy. 

Monotheism is a very recent thing in human history I believe, and probably an inevitable part of our evolution. It seems natural to me that cultures less developed would have gods big and small, especially for people who live close to the earth and depend on it for survival. As cultures mature and technology develops, it seems natural also for a people to identify with ONE nation, ONE government leader, ONE god. 

I don't think there's any taboo to worry about. Most fantasy stories will either not have any gods because the adventurers are too busy have adventures to pray, and so religion doesn't feature at all in the plot or there are gods and religious rites, but these are added simply to give texture to the invented cultures. 

It's fun to consider having the gods appear in the stories as active characters. I think that would be fun to explore, and I remember liking that aspect of the original DragonLance books. If you only had one god who appears to people, what is its agenda? Why appear to anyone at all? And how does this influence the plot of your story? 

I think the main point I'm making is this: what purpose does any god have in your story? If it is not doing anything, or if your characters are not pious, then why include it?

I have a novel in which my main character interacts with many gods: Anubis, Balder, Odin, Charon, Phaeton, Quetzalcoatl, Tezcatlipoca, and many others. The gods are real characters and its fun to write of them that way. Writing about a singular god would be hard though, because I couldn't imagine how I could relate to an entity that was omnipotent and alone. 

In another novel of mine, the "gods" are very powerful fairies. These Sylphs created the entire universe in which the humans have their adventures. Up until they disappeared, the Sylphs were very present in the different Realms they'd created. They gave humans Songs to sing that would work as spells, tapping into the mana; and the Sylphs also helped the humans build an empire called the Olymphin, during the golden age. These creatures are very advanced and entirely benign, and the story depends on them. 

In my opinion, if it's in your story, then it should be a part of the story. I'm curious to hear more about your progress.


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## Ice Spider

Absolutely it's OK, and I can even think of some series that have done it, like The Kingkiller Chronicle and the Dragon Age series (video games).



Jabrosky said:


> many religious traditions can be more complicated than the Western dichotomy of monotheism and polytheism



This is a good point. Love the examples you mentioned. I would add that even within "classical" monotheism, you have more strict monotheistic religions like Islam, and less strict ones like Catholicism. The Trinity seems kinda polytheistic to me. The way Catholics talked about Mary in the Middle Ages, you'd think she was a Goddess. And the way a lot of Protestants talk about Satan today, you'd almost think he was a god too!

The society in my WIP is henotheistic, fwiw.


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## Steerpike

What I'd like to know is who are the two people who answered 'no,' and why...


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## Mindfire

Steerpike said:


> What I'd like to know is who are the two people who answered 'no,' and why...



I also am curious. lol


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## SeverinR

You can have mono and polytheism in one culture.  
Just because in our worlds history, poly evolved into mono doesn't mean that every world would do it.

Did monotheism become the norm, because of "My gods better then your god" is hard to support if it takes several gods to cover daily life? One god can handle all of the persons needs, rather then several different.


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## shangrila

I'll be honest, I wouldn't like it. Though that comes purely from my own beliefs; the large examples of monotheism are, to me, a scam. But that's a subject for another time.

As far as whether or not it would be valid, of course it would be. It's a fantasy world, _your_ fantasy world, so you can have as many or as little gods as you like. In the world I created, I've got multiple gods, mostly because I feel it leaves it open for tension between them and perhaps a larger, behind the scenes kind of story arc running through my story, but not everybody likes it, nor would multiple gods be needed for something like that (Joe Abercrombie does it with a pair of feuding wizards, for example).

Someone above brought up motivation and I just wanted to give an example. In the Preacher comics, God eventually revealed that he created everyone because he was lonely, and humans in particular because he wanted to be loved. The world is a miserable place and bad things happen specifically so that people will turn to him and love him. Now, maybe that would offend some christians, but personally I just thought that made him so much more...human. Which was cool and a real nice way to end that story.


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## Erica

A lot of the fantasy novels I've read have complex worlds where some nations or cultures are polytheistic and some are monotheistic. Whether any or all of the gods are 'real' in the sense that they interact with the world regularly, whether they are 'real' but absentee landlords or simply social constructs (or whether that's left purposely vague) is sort of up to the writer. Sometimes the monotheistic religions resemble medieval Christianity in structure or belief, but often they do not.

And monotheistic doesn't have to be a carbon copy of Christianity or any other existing monotheistic religion. I would be careful of making a story which seems blatantly anti atheist or anti religious, simply because that can turn off some readers who might otherwise like your story, but then, it might be a matter of how people take it and who your target audience really is. My world has a monotheistic theocracy where the god has different aspects which have subsumed earlier pagan dieties. The god is real and benevolent, for the most part, but an absentee landlord as well. 

The evil done in the god's name is due to human ambition and misconceptions...not because the religion is inherently bad. There are other cultures in my world who follow different religions, some pagan, as well. Again, the gods exist in some way, but their worshipers only ascertain the 'truth' about their religion through a glass, darkly, so to speak.

So in my world, there is no one true religion...religions are human constructs seeking to understand what is real about the divine.

I think there are ways you can make people not following the 'one true' religion seem plausible, though. Lots of people on Earth believe that there is only one 'true' god or religion (theirs) and that most other people are mistaken, stubborn or foolish for not seeing the truth as it has been revealed to them. And there have been plenty of beliefs where the 'truth' is only revealed to a select group of people and those people are not even interested in 'converting' anyone else (though evangelical religions do have a historical advantage in terms of growth potential).

The only issue I'd really have is with their only being 4 religions in the world (whether or not any of them are 'true' or not). Since when has there ever been so few religions at any time in human history on Earth? So if you want to make it plausible, you may have to work that into your world's history somehow.


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## Rikilamaro

Steerpike said:


> What I'd like to know is who are the two people who answered 'no,' and why...



I am also curious about that. Just because I'd like to know their reasoning.


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## Ankari

Monotheism, I think, is always the black sheep of fantasy.  I can't think of one series that truly worships one god.  The only series I recall that has a monotheistic religion in it that _does not_ recognize other religions are acceptable is ASOIAF which uses the Bright Lord.  

I think that, for some reason, fantasy authors are afraid to broach the subject because they think it hits too close to home in our world.  I think that monotheism is a strong tool that can be used in fantasy, after all most of our childhood fantasies derive from the cliche Knight in Shining Armor, stalwart of faith and full of courage.e.

As someone said, try to avoid copying real world monotheistic faiths and you should be fine.


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## Mindfire

Ankari said:


> Monotheism, I think, is always the black sheep of fantasy.  I can't think of one series that truly worships one god.  The only series I recall that has a monotheistic religion in it that _does not_ recognize other religions are acceptable is ASOIAF which uses the Bright Lord.



What about The Chronicles of Narnia? We never actually see people worship Aslan _per ce_, but they might as well. And while the Calormenes do have a religion of their own, their god Tash is shown to be a terrible demon who requires human sacrifice, so their religion wouldn't be considered "acceptable".


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## Steerpike

Ankari said:


> Monotheism, I think, is always the black sheep of fantasy.  I can't think of one series that truly worships one god.  The only series I recall that has a monotheistic religion in it that _does not_ recognize other religions are acceptable is ASOIAF which uses the Bright Lord.
> 
> I think that, for some reason, fantasy authors are afraid to broach the subject because they think it hits too close to home in our world.  I think that monotheism is a strong tool that can be used in fantasy, after all most of our childhood fantasies derive from the cliche Knight in Shining Armor, stalwart of faith and full of courage.e.
> 
> As someone said, try to avoid copying real world monotheistic faiths and you should be fine.



I think there is some truth to this, but I find it interesting that, in answer to the poll, at least two writers said it "has no place" in Fantasy. Think about that. You've basically got two writers telling other writers that they don't think it can be done in a _Fantasy_ world, of all things. It is absurd, when you think about it.


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## Mindfire

Steerpike said:


> I think there is some truth to this, but I find it interesting that, in answer to the poll, at least two writers said it "has no place" in Fantasy. Think about that. You've basically got two writers telling other writers that they don't think it can be done in a _Fantasy_ world, of all things. It is absurd, when you think about it.



Lol you do have a point there.

Btw, to clarify matters, I don't "copy" real-world monotheism at all really, but the monotheism in my book could be considered Abrahamic "in spirit" even though it doesn't really have any practices or doctrines in common with Judeo-Christianity other than basic moral principles. But really, it wouldn't make sense to transplant Judeo-Christianity into a world where the historical events that shaped those traditions did not occur. The monotheism in my books is more of a what-if kind of deal. Theology isn't the main focus, but it does inform the decisions that the characters make.


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## Ankari

Mindfire said:


> What about The Chronicles of Narnia? We never actually see people worship Aslan _per ce_, but they might as well. And while the Calormenes do have a religion of their own, their god Tash is shown to be a terrible demon who requires human sacrifice, so their religion wouldn't be considered "acceptable".



My usage of "acceptable" is to mean _recognized_ and not _normal_.  What I meant to say by that sentence is that a lot of fantasy writers have their characters worshiping one deity solely, even though they recognize the existence of others.  So a character who worships the God of War solely but recognizes the existence of other deities is not monotheistic.  

By the way, I remembered another author that uses monotheism _very_ well.  R Scott Bakker with this series *Prince of Nothing* and *The Aspect-Emperor*.


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## Devor

Steerpike said:


> I think there is some truth to this, but I find it interesting that, in answer to the poll, at least two writers said it "has no place" in Fantasy. Think about that. You've basically got two writers telling other writers that they don't think it can be done in a _Fantasy_ world, of all things. It is absurd, when you think about it.



I'm a little surprised nobody's said anything, but I'm one of the two who voted "no" in the poll and I posted about it pretty much right away.  It's on page two and opens with "I voted 'no,' but I don't really mean it."

I was mostly reacting to a number of threads with poor details of a religion that is "essentially" a real-world religion, followed by a terribly ignorant, lopsided or shallow portrayal of said group.  But honestly, if the question simply asked "Does religion have a place in fantasy writing?" I'm not sure my answer would be much different.  The number of D&D-style religions saddens me.  The culturally-wrong portrayals of Greek, Norse and other religions makes me wonder at our inability to capture a historical mindset.

I think handling religion poorly is a good way to get your manuscripts in the garbage bin, and that most writers would do better to leave it aside until they've developed better skills at handling the subject.  As I said earlier, if I had to set a rule, the rule would be "No, skip it," because I think, on average, you're more likely to have it harm your work than improve it.  But I think rules are meant to be broken once you know what you're doing.

I'm aware that's not really what the question was asking.  I figured it was better for the discussion to take the question less literally.


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## Phin Scardaw

Devor said:


> But honestly, if the question simply asked "Does religion have a place in fantasy writing?" I'm not sure my answer would be much different.  The number of D&D-style religions saddens me.  The culturally-wrong portrayals of Greek, Norse and other religions makes me wonder at our inability to capture a historical mindset.
> 
> I think handling religion poorly is a good way to get your manuscripts in the garbage bin, and that most writers would do better to leave it aside until they've developed better skills at handling the subject.  As I said earlier, if I had to set a rule, the rule would be "No, skip it," because I think, on average, you're more likely to have it harm your work than improve it.  But I think rules are meant to be broken once you know what you're doing.



Probably most Fantasy does not need to include religion because the heroes in the stories are on the path to becoming godly. They interact with races immortal and wise as angels, and are forced to combat demons and monsters. They have not much need of mythos, because they exist within the sphere of the mythological. 

A series like Game of Thrones, however, seems to use gods and religion very well as those other Fantasy elements are not very apparent and are greatly subdued. Here we have a story based on very flawed human characters - and they are shown to have religious compulsions, a need to worship and idolize. 

I would say that Religion in general is one of those darker areas of human nature, like Sexuality, whose inner regions are unlit and unexplored, and whose depths are not easily plumbed. It can be done, and done well - but like a sloppily-written sex scene, such elements can really hurt a story, it's true. A good writer sees what it means to be human and reports back from the deeps of the psyche using prose and story to relate the Truths found there.


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## Jabrosky

I have a monotheistic culture in a story I've started this evening, but since it's largely based off ancient Israel (albeit with a medieval Islamic/"Arabian Nights" visual aesthetic), a form of monotheism analogous to Judaism is the logical choice for it.


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## Mindfire

Jabrosky said:


> I have a monotheistic culture in a story I've started this evening, but since it's largely based off ancient Israel (albeit with a medieval Islamic/"Arabian Nights" visual aesthetic), a form of monotheism analogous to Judaism is the logical choice for it.



Do you have a David figure? If you have a culture based on ancient Israel, you MUST have a David figure. It's kind of a given.


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## Jabrosky

Mindfire said:


> Do you have a David figure? If you have a culture based on ancient Israel, you MUST have a David figure. It's kind of a given.



My male main character is a prince, making him royalty like David, but he's more inspired by the Prince of Persia than David per se.


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## Mindfire

Jabrosky said:


> My male main character is a prince, making him royalty like David, but he's more inspired by the Prince of Persia than David per se.



David and the Prince of Persia had some things in common. Sort of. A little. Well, not much. But it's strangely easy to imagine David as a Prince of Persia type.


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## SeverinR

Steerpike said:


> I think there is some truth to this, but I find it interesting that, in answer to the poll, at least two writers said it "has no place" in Fantasy. Think about that. You've basically got two writers telling other writers that they don't think it can be done in a _Fantasy_ world, of all things. It is absurd, when you think about it.


I believe it is their opinion, not saying it can't be done, the op did ask.  IMHO anything a writer can make believeable can be done.  In the world of fantasy, why set limits?



Devor said:


> I'm a little surprised nobody's said anything, but I'm one of the two who voted "no" in the poll and I posted about it pretty much right away.  It's on page two and opens with "I voted 'no,' but I don't really mean it."
> 
> I was mostly reacting to a number of threads with poor details of a religion that is "essentially" a real-world religion, followed by a terribly ignorant, lopsided or shallow portrayal of said group.  But honestly, if the question simply asked "Does religion have a place in fantasy writing?" I'm not sure my answer would be much different.  The number of D&D-style religions saddens me.  The culturally-wrong portrayals of Greek, Norse and other religions makes me wonder at our inability to capture a historical mindset.
> 
> I think handling religion poorly is a good way to get your manuscripts in the garbage bin, and that most writers would do better to leave it aside until they've developed better skills at handling the subject.  As I said earlier, if I had to set a rule, the rule would be "No, skip it," because I think, on average, you're more likely to have it harm your work than improve it.  But I think rules are meant to be broken once you know what you're doing.
> 
> I'm aware that's not really what the question was asking.  I figured it was better for the discussion to take the question less literally.



I try to stay away from real world religions, because to honor a religion, even an ancient religion, you have to study it fairly well. And there are some followers of old gods that will complain about inaccuracies.

So far I have created only the Elven gods, and I think I mentioned a Mythic God, but nothing specific. Human people worship human gods, so I mentioned it. I could create my own human gods, or even god, but we have so many to chose from already...


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## Christopher Wright

For a specific example, Katherine Kurtz' Deryni novels aren't just Monotheistic, they're also pretty Catholic, and the Catholicism[1] plays heavily in the politics at hand (when countries are denied access to the sacraments by the head of the church, an the role the church plays both in the persecution and protection of the Deryni race).

--------
[1]I'm not sure the Church as portrayed in the books really is the Catholic Church -- it's been a while since I've read them and I don't remember if a Pope is ever mentioned -- but it's definitely modeled after it.


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## Erica

SeverinR said:


> You can have mono and polytheism in one culture.
> Just because in our worlds history, poly evolved into mono doesn't mean that every world would do it.



Polytheistic cultures and religions exist still today, and they dominate in some countries, including one of the most populous countries on Earth. Some are very old and some are new or are reinterpretations of older religions that died out or were assimilated. The ways in which people from different cultures have incorporated religion into their collective and personal lives is endlessly fascinating and certainly fun to explore in fantasy worlds.


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## undertheshepherd7

It's really up to you what you want in your world!  I think monotheism works very well in a fantasy world.  It creates a much more powerful, personal god that actually makes a great character.  The god would always be present and referred to.  And actually, in my world, I have only one god, but he made these prodigies that usurped him and his power.  A monotheistic pantheon works really well and I hope to see it more often!


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## Konstanz

People who think monotheism has no place in fantasy need to evaluate their opinion again I think. Dragon Age has a monotheistic religion (the Maker) and it works really well. Monotheistic religions are in general a lot less tolerant and a lot more aggressive since they clearly dictate there is only one god. Polytheistic religions often don't specify the exact amount of gods and even if they do, if there are 10 gods, why can't there be an 11th that is overlooked? 

I think monotheism makes for a lot more interesting religions if you want to write dark fantasy...


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## Anders Ã„mting

Konstanz said:


> Monotheistic religions are in general a lot less tolerant and a lot more aggressive since they clearly dictate there is only one god.



Well, they are more aggressive in the sense that they are far more prone to evangelism. Which makes sense: If you have a polytheistic faith, there's no reason to be concerned if someone else worships a different set of gods; each to his own. But if you are monotheistic, everyone else are worshipping false idols out of ignorance and you have a duty to enlighten them.

I think calling monotheistic religions less tolerant is a bit of a generalization, though - they're not naturaly oppressive or anything. Just as an example, Muhammad himself declared religious freedom for Muslims, Jews and Pagans so if you lived in a medieval Muslim caliphate you were allowed to pray to whoever the heck you wanted as long as you behaved and payed your taxes. 



> Polytheistic religions often don't specify the exact amount of gods and even if they do, if there are 10 gods, why can't there be an 11th that is overlooked?



There's a hilarious scene in Frans G Bengtsson's _The Long Ships_ where a bunch of vikings end up in Al-Andalus and start working for as bodyguards for Al-Mansur. They are treated very well but the catch was that they'd have to pray to Allah.

The vikings discussed this and decided that their own gods probably found the climate in Spain far too hot anyway, so they reasoned that they may as well pray to this Allah guy while they were there and go back to their old gods when they made it home to Scandinavia. 

(Which, of course, is exactly what they do, except for the main character who converts to Christianity because his mother insisted on it.)


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