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Going to vs. Gonna, Etc.

Philip Overby

Staff
Article Team
Short question: what do others think of using written speech vs. the way it sounds in stories? Do you find it distracting or do you not mind?

Something like:

"I'm going to smash your face in," the orc growled.

vs.

"I'm gonna smash yer face in," the orc growled.

I've seen this used to good effect where it doesn't bother me to much, but I've seen it overused to the point of being difficult to read.

Thoughts?
 

MadMadys

Troubadour
I'm all for it in dialogue.

It gives things more flavor to proceedings and is a bit more realistic. Books where everyone speaks in proper English and in complete sentences are a tad robotic, for my tastes. In descriptions, though, I tend to keep to more standard grammar whenever applicable.
 

BWFoster78

Myth Weaver
I usually hate dialect, but sometimes it works great. "The Help" is one example where it is used particularly well. The way the characters speak helps immerse you in the story.

Unfortunately, I have no idea how to make it work on a grand scale.

I think something like "gonna," when used in moderation, is fine. I'd advise to write the story with it, but be on the lookout for beta reader comments. If any complain that its annoying, you'll need to consider revision.
 

Philip Overby

Staff
Article Team
I don't normally use it, that's why I've mostly avoided it from fear of doing it badly. But I think it could possibly add to some characters I'm thinking for an upcoming short story.

Being that I'm originally from Mississippi, seeing Southern speech patterns always used in dialect is a little weird. I don't think I talk like that, but maybe I do? I mean, I don't even say "ya'll" anymore. I guess living in Japan did that to me to an extent. :)
 

Devor

Fiery Keeper of the Hat
Moderator
I don't know. I used to do it a lot, but I've largely taken it out of my writing.

People associate speech patterns with intelligence, so the moment you begin using a heavy dialect, readers downgrade the intelligence of your characters. In that sense, in my medieval settings, I realized I was using it as a cheap way to characterize someone's rank in society. Once I stopped, it forced me to do a better job with my characterization.

I remember reading Huck Finn, and I remember a note at the beginning about the research that went into getting the dialect right. I respect that kind of research a lot, as well as the way that it's used consistently throughout the story. And there are stories which I would like to write which may require a sliver of that kind of universal dialect.

But for the most part, I've decided to no longer use it as a gimmick for my writing. I do think that kind of usage has a place in some stories, so I don't mean to judge other writers. But for me, I needed to move on.
 
Nothing wrong with having a character speak in a characteristic way. Like you say, Phil, it becomes a problem if you overdo it, but that's true for a lot of things. I see no reason to never do it at all.
 

Ralavik

Acolyte
I see it as a way to provide more character to your... characters. It follows along the lines of "show, don't tell." I say use it, as long as it doesn't become overbearing.
 

keiani

Dreamer
I'm in the "use with moderation" camp. Too much phonetic spelling is distracting and a turn-off, but a little bit can add a subtle flavor to a character's speech. You might have the orc say "I'm gonna smash your face in," using the "gonna" but not the "yer."

An occasional "y'all" can go a long way - we can read quickly and comfortably while inferring that the character speaks in a typically Southern manner.
 

AWrighton

Acolyte
Creatively speaking, there should be a reason behind phonetic spelling/shortcuts and only then is it truly justified.

Another thing to remember, of course, is that if you're going to go with a certain dialect/phonetic spelling it needs to be consistent throughout and not so altered that it becomes no longer understandable/readable.

Gonna is the colloquial version of going to - and is often used by those of lesser education who don't really know better than using the full form of the words going to and defer to the shorter, quicker, colloquial gonna. This might very well make perfect sense for an Orc - as long as the Orc race doesn't have a university of some sorts or aren't very upper-crust/high brow.
 
Gonna is the colloquial version of going to - and is often used by those of lesser education who don't really know better than using the full form of the words going to and defer to the shorter, quicker, colloquial gonna. This might very well make perfect sense for an Orc - as long as the Orc race doesn't have a university of some sorts or aren't very upper-crust/high brow.

Erm... Assuming I read your post right, I'm going to disagree here. People don't say "gonna" because they lack a university education and don't understand how language works; they do it because when you say "I am going to" in a quick, conversational tone, it actually comes out as: "I'm gonna." It's just how normal people sound when they speak - very few bother to articulate each word properly if they can get the message across with colloquials instead.
 

AWrighton

Acolyte
Erm... Assuming I read your post right, I'm going to disagree here. People don't say "gonna" because they lack a university education and don't understand how language works; they do it because when you say "I am going to" in a quick, conversational tone, it actually comes out as: "I'm gonna." It's just how normal people sound when they speak - very few bother to articulate each word properly if they can get the message across with colloquials instead.

You did misinterpret. As I mentioned, gonna is a colloquialism. I was talking about when someone specifically & purposefully says gonna because that is all the know as opposed to sounding like they say gonna, which is what you are speaking about.

Lack of articulation is, again, only necessary in fiction if it delivers a message about a character.
 

Caged Maiden

Staff
Article Team
This is really interesting to me because I've been accused of having my stable hands sound like my nobles. :) Haha I am not sure how to distinguish besides things like "gonna", "ain't", etc. If anyone's got some better ideas for how I can differentiate the voices of my characters without resorting to poor grammar, please help!!! Haha. The thing I find hard to get over is that in every century, there were undeniable differences to how the upper class and lower class spoke. It's even evident in historical written documents. How then do we as writers accomplish this without sounding "annoying"?
 

Rob P

Minstrel
I've read it is perfectly possible to imply dialect with word choice, cadence and grammar which will give the dialogue a particular rhythm. When read aloud it gives and sounds like dialect without any gimmicky mis-spellings etc.

For example:

This is correct (English?)
That is correct (German?)
Is correct, yes? (Russian?)
It be right. (Old Country English?)

Sorry for my meagre attempts

To use it widely in a story would I feel take real confidence and need a good ear for how people speak.
 

Penpilot

Staff
Article Team
I think it's fine as long as you don't let it get away from you. The novel I'm working on now, I use a few of these things with my characters, specifically words like gotta, figgin', ain't. If clarity is ever in doubt I use correct spellings.

As for what doing this says about a character's intelligence and education. It depends. It's just one trait among many a 3D character has. If the character is unintelligent and uneducated it will reinforce that. If a character is smart then it's a small contradiction and real people tend to have lots of those.

Using myself as an example, at certain times, I speak using "words" like gotta, gonna, ain't, etc., and although I've been called a dumb@ss and stupid, I'd like to think in reality I'm neither. I've got a CompSci degree. I know someone who's a MIT grad student in physics and they pronounce "Garage" as Gair-age.

To me, it's like anything in writing, use it if you think it's right for your character and your story, otherwise don't.
 

Devor

Fiery Keeper of the Hat
Moderator
You did misinterpret. As I mentioned, gonna is a colloquialism. I was talking about when someone specifically & purposefully says gonna because that is all the know as opposed to sounding like they say gonna, which is what you are speaking about.

I think that many people with a dialect are proud of it and use it because they want to, not because they don't know any better.
 
I'll give my usual giant "DO NOT"--DO NOT write one character's speech phonetically, but another character's speech formally, in cases where they both pronounce words the same way. (The traditional offender to mention here is Gone With the Wind, which renders slaves' accents phonetically and slavers' speech formally, even though the two have much the same accents.)

With that out of the way, go nuts. "Gonna" versus "going to", "y'all" versus "you", or even (as in my father's accent) "vinella" instead of "vanilla" are all legitimate ways of representing speech.
 
The most common opinion here is that, most of the time, you write the words but not the pronounciation; try to convey tone through which words they meant to say (including flawed grammar) rather than most of the sounds. Rob nailed it:

I've read it is perfectly possible to imply dialect with word choice, cadence and grammar which will give the dialogue a particular rhythm. When read aloud it gives and sounds like dialect without any gimmicky mis-spellings etc.

For example:

This is correct (English?)
That is correct (German?)
Is correct, yes? (Russian?)
It be right. (Old Country English?)

The theory is that these look less awkward than spelling out sounds, so the latter's best used sparingly. (I can see a walk-in character getting it to make him look odd, or a "y'all" for a character who made a point of saying that, but I agree don't draw a Gone With The Wind line where one class of people is perfectly one type and the other's heavily the other.)

It's still a judgment call, but it is good to keep in mind how fast things like this can wear thin. But Penpilot's right, it's still part of a larger picture.
 

Addison

Auror
What words and grammar a writer chooses is up to them and the story they tell. It creates their tone and voice and narrator. If it's large, formal vocabulary then it would be "Going to", if it's more modern, with average or teenage vocabulary, then "gonna" is good.
 

PaulineMRoss

Inkling
On the distinction between classes: one way to do that is to write the nobles' speech out in full (it is, do not, let us) while the stablehands talk more colloquially (it's, don't, let's). Readers will barely notice it, but the distinction is there. And there's always swearing - yokels swear more colourfully, I would think.
 
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