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Cool characters, no plot worth squat

Jabrosky

Banned
Have you ever designed characters you thought were really awesome and had a lot of potential, only to end up stumped on how to bring them to life in a story? This problem has been the bane of my career as a budding fantasy writer. I come up with character concepts that I love dearly and draw them down, but when the time comes to actually write a story around these characters, for some reason I have a hard time finding a satisfactory plot for them to act in. I mean, I know I have to give my characters some form of conflict, but there are so many things I can throw at them that I don't know which ones to single out for my plot. I think I suffer from an excess of ideas, which may additionally explain why I'm constantly changing their names and details of their back-stories.

That said, my characters do tend to fall into a small number of basic archetypes. My favorites are tribal warrior chicks who hunt prehistoric monsters and headstrong queens of ancient civilizations. I really want to do something with my babies, but my failure to do so thus far has caused me frustration to no end.
 

Jeff Xilon

Minstrel
Do you ever try discovery writing with your characters? I mean instead of worrying about a plot just write about them. Pick a day of their lives and write about what happens just that day. Put two characters together and let them have a conversation. Play "What if?" with them and write out flash fiction length scenes or stories for them. If you're suffering from an excess of ideas maybe you could set rules and goals for yourself. Like - I will write 20,000 words for THIS character with THIS idea. Write three novellas like that and then pick the one that you most hated letting go of to write the others and turn that into the story of whatever size you want to write.

I've heard a lot of author interviews where they say they hate the question "where do you get your ideas" because the real problem isn't getting ideas is figuring out which ideas are the best ones to actually jump into and write, so I think your problem is probably a fairly common one.
 
You might want to do more research into what people say a plot is made up of. Study the Hero's Journey, analyze some of your favorite tales, or look at the better book and blog analyses out there (yes, I'd recommend my own), until you have a more comfortable sense of what the main pieces are for you. Some writers believe that (or just get inspired when) it's all about finding a hidden weakness the MC has never had to confront before, others that it's making as much of the world as possible risk turning against the MC, and so on. The more you find your own understanding of what a plot is, the easier it is to pick one.

It might also be that you love your characters too much. It's easy to think of well-rounded characters who've already learned most of what they need to know in life, and put them in settings that challenge them but don't really threaten them-- or to see a number of promising ways to hurt them but not follow through very far. But good drama usually means taking characters or the world around them and tearing large parts of them apart, and raising real doubts over how well they can be put back together again (summarized as "spare them nothing"). In fact, a lot of us joke about how cruel we are to our characters, but we also talk about how we savor other stories that put an MC through hell.

(That's not the only approach; a plot can also be more positive, someone mostly trying to improve or gain something rather than survive it, as long as you do justice to the difficulties of each step forward. Or there's the Day In The Life moment, where even a small gain or loss is enough if you make the reader care about it.)

One rule of thumb I like is to pick a complex challenge and think of the biggest variety of actions an MC would need to take to get through it all: many different kinds of fighting, negotiation and other ways to deal with different characters, and many more. If the MC has to dabble in all the kinds of skills, decisions, and so on I think the subject might really call for --especially the ones outside her comfort zone-- I think I've done my job.
 

Jabrosky

Banned
It might also be that you love your characters too much. It's easy to think of well-rounded characters who've already learned most of what they need to know in life, and put them in settings that challenge them but don't really threaten them-- or to see a number of promising ways to hurt them but not follow through very far. But good drama usually means taking characters or the world around them and tearing large parts of them apart, and raising real doubts over how well they can be put back together again (summarized as "spare them nothing"). In fact, a lot of us joke about how cruel we are to our characters, but we also talk about how we savor other stories that put an MC through hell.
That possibility occurred to me too. It does seem that the characters that appear the most inspirational at first end up as the most difficult to make interesting from a dramatic perspective. Come to think of it, most of the stories I have finished featured protagonists towards whom I felt not so attached. Maybe I should work with those instead.
 

TWErvin2

Auror
I tend to create the world or the conflict first, then create the characters.

In any case, if it's going no where, maybe you need to simply scrap/shelf the tribal warrior chicks/ancient queens and focus on something/someone else as the protagonists/focus characters.
 

Steerpike

Felis amatus
Moderator
Loving your characters is OK by me.

What do they want more than anything in the world? Figure out what those things are, and then throw every roadblock at them you can think of. That should at least give a start on some ideas :)
 

Nameback

Troubadour
Loving your characters is OK by me.

What do they want more than anything in the world? Figure out what those things are, and then throw every roadblock at them you can think of. That should at least give a start on some ideas :)

This right here.

I don't have this problem, because usually the plot/world comes to me first and then the characters to carry out that plot. But what Steerpike said is basically the heart of any story. Your protagonist wants or needs something, and is thwarted again and again until they finally achieve their goal (comedy) or fail permanently (tragedy).
 

Jabrosky

Banned
Loving your characters is OK by me.

What do they want more than anything in the world? Figure out what those things are, and then throw every roadblock at them you can think of. That should at least give a start on some ideas :)
Thank you so much. To be honest, for all the love I tend to show my characters, I tend not to think about their motivations or other internal psychology as much as I do their visual design or fighting abilities. Maybe that's been my problem all along.
 

Kevlar

Troubadour
Thank you so much. To be honest, for all the love I tend to show my characters, I tend not to think about their motivations or other internal psychology as much as I do their visual design or fighting abilities. Maybe that's been my problem all along.

The internal design of your character is paramount, and should always take precedent over the aesthetics. Characters don't need to be pretty or good at fighting for us to love them (in a book at least, I'm sure Hollywood will tell you you need at least one of those). What we love about characters is what drives them, what makes them who they are. Their motivations: this character wants to dole out unbiased justice, this one unbridled vengeance. This character fights for love, that one fights from a dark and terrible hatred. This character has no motivation but survival and his hand has been forced. That one? We're not quite sure. He's shrouded in mystery but just observing him it's obvious he fights for a cause. I wonder what it is...?

This character on the other hand wears a lot of jewelry, has a runic blade, absolutely no apparent reason for doing anything he does, and the depth of a saucer. He may be fun to read about, but we don't care about anything beyond the fact that he's good in a fight and sounds fancy.

Would you rather read a book about the former characters or the latter?
 

A. E. Lowan

Forum Mom
Leadership
To misquote Vonnegut, "Each character must want something, even of it is just a drink of water."

What do your warrior queens want? What so they hold most dear? Figure it out, and then take it away from them, and then keep throwing up roadblocks to keep them from getting them back. Voila, you have a beginning of a plot.
 

Jabrosky

Banned
I'm feeling a lot more confident in my writing abilities right now. I find that in addition to considering the motivation factor brought up more than once in this thread, it's useful for me to have a loose outline (or plot skeleton as my Creative Writing teacher would call it) of the plot to guide me. Thanks everyone!
 
Sometimes you just need a kick up the noggin and start writing. It doesn't always have to be about the wants of the MC. Sometimes you can create a bigger picture and put the wants of the MC between that. Sometimes you can create a halt in their lifestyle that they must deal with. The list is endless...

Lots of ways you can go about it, there are different methods to get the plot moving. Snowflake, Three Act, etc. Or plain old discovery writing. Just go with the flow. Keep writing, and see where the wind takes you.
 

Jabrosky

Banned
Sometimes you just need a kick up the noggin and start writing. It doesn't always have to be about the wants of the MC. Sometimes you can create a bigger picture and put the wants of the MC between that. Sometimes you can create a halt in their lifestyle that they must deal with. The list is endless...

Lots of ways you can go about it, there are different methods to get the plot moving. Snowflake, Three Act, etc. Or plain old discovery writing. Just go with the flow. Keep writing, and see where the wind takes you.
How exactly does this discovery writing you describe work? Do you simply type away any random thing, or do you start off with an idea of what you want to happen in the scene?
 
Well, I'm not the true discovery writer. I do my own thing. But I do plan ahead a little, and then write, and then ideas strike me, so I write them, and this planning keeps on coming. But I did keep a plot skeleton, as someone said. So I cheated somewhat. But the theory is sound. Some people type away from the start with just a character in mind and some people plan a little ahead to know the initial direction they're going.

I suppose it's a little more beneficial to know a little further ahead so you know what you're up against, but that's me.

Try it out. It could help you, and if it doesn't, there are other methods you can employ. I hope it does.
(Correct me if I'm wrong up there, by the way.)
 
One method might be, since you have so many polished and capable characters already, to write about a protege for one of them. Take what your senior character has mastered and make the MC argue with her over every point, while events work out to show who's got it right (at which times).
 

Sinitar

Minstrel
Hmm... I think you are being too hard on yourself or overthinking this. Good characters is what most readers are looking for. With a good voice, witty dialogues and spot on scenes that convey the mood you set, you can have a great story.

If characters are your strong point, here's what I suggest: Adapt the story arcs to the individual personalities of your characters. Analyze their strength and weaknesses and come up with obstacles that take them by surprise. You can also single out their internal conflict and put them into situations where they are forced to take decisions that they have not prepared for. These are just examples, and I'm sure you can come up with so much more.

For a headstrong queen, for example, you can always have an alliance that requires her to marry an equally headstrong leader who she will barely get along with. The compromises she will have to make will just serve to make her shine even brighter.
 
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