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Mothers

Trick

Auror
My MC has a special attachment to his mother. This has become an issue for me because I grew up without one. She passed away when I was very young and I have no memory of her. My MC loses his father at seven and as such grows even closer to his 'Mama.' So far I have used my wife as an example of a good mother for the character but I can't get the child's point of view right. His mother is strong and beautiful, loving and kind but very likely flat... I don't want her to be a cardboard cutout, I want a real woman with a huge influence on my MC's life.

Can anyone give me a little perspective on this? I'm looking for emotions felt towards moms from their children. Even bad ones as my MC has a bit of a dark heart. Describe the feeling of dissappointing the mother you love, or of making her proud. Anything would help...
 
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Spider

Sage
The thing I appreciate most from my mom is how she listens to what I have to say. As the youngest in my family, I often felt like I was not taken seriously and sometimes misunderstood. To have a mom who was simply there to hear me out and reason with me meant a lot to me. On the other hand, I feel like she worries too much about me, and that sometimes gets on my nerves. One time when the family went camping, I fell and bloodied my knee. My mom was so concerned that she looked worse than I did. :p

I'm not sure what kind of a person your MC is, and whether or not he gets into a lot of danger. I think you could even establish his mother as an obstacle trying to get in the way of his goals, as she might try to prevent him from doing anything dangerous. Ultimately, his mother is a person he can rely on and confide in.
 

Trick

Auror
He definitely gets into a lot of danger but keeps it secret from his mother whenever possible. I like the idea of her being overworried and of it irritating him. At the start my MC is only a child (7-9 in the first several chapters) and he works a full-time, dangerous job that worries her but his secrets are far more deadly. (yes, it's a poor society with child labor.)

He's not the type to "run to mommy" but he is just a kid so I can easily put him in a situation where he needs her.

(Youngest here also!)
 

Penpilot

Staff
Article Team
I think you might be looking at this from the wrong angle. Don't think of the Mother as a mother. Think of her as a person first, with all her flaws and goodness, who happens to be a mother. Mother is only one dimension of who she is, so only thinking of her that way means you only tap into that one dimension.

As for emotions felt toward the Mother, try taking from your own experiences and extrapolate from that. Think about disappointing your wife. How would you feel? OR how about your Father (Hopefully you didn't lose him too), how would you feel if you disappointed him? Take from that and imagine it's your mother instead.
 

Trick

Auror
I think you might be looking at this from the wrong angle. Don't think of the Mother as a mother. Think of her as a person first, with all her flaws and goodness, who happens to be a mother. Mother is only one dimension of who she is, so only thinking of her that way means you only tap into that one dimension.

As for emotions felt toward the Mother, try taking from your own experiences and extrapolate from that. Think about disappointing your wife. How would you feel? OR how about your Father (Hopefully you didn't lose him too), how would you feel if you disappointed him? Take from that and imagine it's your mother instead.

My WIP is in FP and the mother is viewed through his eyes and described with his words so parts of her personality will go unnoticed by a child but I agree that I should establish who she is while standing alone to breath more life into her.

No, fortunately my father is alive and healthy. However, he is a hard man. Not the nurturing sort at all, though he loves me and my siblings, I cannot imagine my feelings towards him being at all similar as to my mother. From what my siblings say, my parents were polar opposites. It worked for them. She was soft hearted, warm and caring. He is logical, cold and providing.
 

Mara Edgerton

Troubadour
I think you might be looking at this from the wrong angle. Don't think of the Mother as a mother. Think of her as a person first, with all her flaws and goodness, who happens to be a mother. Mother is only one dimension of who she is, so only thinking of her that way means you only tap into that one dimension.

Well put! I agree: create this woman as a character first, with her own goals, talents, likes, dislikes, strong points and shortcomings. From there, you can figure out what her strengths and weaknesses are as a mother. For example, she may be fiercely independent, and somewhat at a loss as to how to help her clingy son achieve the same sense of self-reliance. Or she may be over-protective of her son after losing her husband (or the father of her child, at any event).

Good luck!
 

Scribble

Archmage
There are many different kinds of mother-child relationships, so this is a generalization, with plenty of exceptions...

When one is young, people often look to the mother as the one source of all security and love. Any separation from the mother is filled with anxiety, and any reunion with the mother is the greatest joy. As the youth grows, the relationship will change slightly, but up to adolescence the emotions tend to override reason. Mom is all.

Disappointing the mother at this phase would likely be a fear of mother's displeasure, of being separated from the love of the mother.

In the adolescent phase, there are conflicting emotions regarding the mother. As the youth grows intellectually, they come to live with a kind of cognitive dissonance, where the authority of parents clashes with the belief that not all their ideas and rules are sound. They have the emotion of attachment and fear of their authority, but at the same time, feel they are restricted from being able to act in their best interests. This can manifest as resentment or rebellion.

Disappointment at this phase will be in part shame, but also in part a fear of retribution, punishment, loss of freedom.

In the young adult stage of life, there comes an awareness that the mother is an imperfect person, just as the child, with doubts and prone to make mistakes. This can be a difficult time, the coming of age. There is a feeling of freedom from maternal domination, and possibly also a feeling of guilt at the rejection of their authority. Life can appear very daunting, yet exciting at that point, with many possibilities but with little understanding of them. The guidance of the mother may be rejected, as mothers tend to fear always for the safety, and may urge only the safest paths to take.

Disappointment at this phase will involve shame, but more empathetic understanding of the parent. At this age, the child is better at putting themselves in the place of the parent, but will likely be overcome by their own emotions.

The young adult stage of the relationship may last in fact for a very long time. Many grown people act as adults in every aspect of their lives, except when it come to their parents. They may still put the responsibility of their life situation on the mother.

In the adult stage of life, there can be a different relationship reached where you become equals in the relationship, when the child sees the mother as a person with flaws, and themselves as a similar person with flaws. If the mother can step back from authority, this opens the door to equal friendship. If the mother persists in authority, the adult child may see the relationship as a slight patronage.

Speaking of disappointment at this phase, if they both feel they are equals, disappointment will be ideally reciprocally empathetic. Each the mother and child can understand the feelings of the other, bringing more understanding. You would deal with disappointment the way you would with a friend. You may feel shame, you may feel sad to have let them down. If the mother clings to the authority position, the child may feel they need to "manage" the expectations of the mother, as they are not meeting the issue head on with understanding, but perhaps holding to a "what is proper for their child" attitude.

There is growth on the part of the child to consider, but there is also growth on the part of the parent. The child matures in the relationship when they see the parent as an adult, with flaws, etc... but the parent also matures in the relationship when they see the child as an adult, with flaws, etc... That growth will affect the adult relationship equally.
 

Trick

Auror
I agree with what folks are saying. I have plenty of women in my life to draw from as examples for a strong character in my book but that is not my issue. My issue is that the book is in FP. I need examples of how a 7-9 year old feels about their mom, in a good relationship but flawed as all are. I have never felt those emotions. That's what I'm trying to describe, not the mother as a person. To him, she is Mama, no more no less. When he gets older he will see how much more than that she really is. She is her own person with a unique personality, strengths and weaknesses... but right now he's a child and cannot see the big picture.

(ninja'd by scribble so I must add) Thank you scribble, your post is more what I'm looking for.
 

Scribble

Archmage
Thank you scribble, your post is more what I'm looking for.

Most welcome! I've got 41 years of experience being the child of a mother, and 21 years of experience being the father of children who have a mother. My mother has a mother, so does my wife, and all my cousins and friends do. If I learned anything from all these mothers and their children, I am glad to make it useful to your writing!
 

Trick

Auror
Yes, it was helpful and I am happy to have gained the rewards from your experiences.

A new thought, anyone here raised by a single mother? That experience would be particularly useful.
 

Jamber

Sage
Hi Trick, generalisations are all very well, but if you want to write a character who stands out (even if she's not a main one), you'll still need to vary the psychology.

Scribble's 'When one is young' account doesn't match a lot in my upbringing. That's not to say my upbringing is anything to work from. Still, 'mom is all' really is a blandism. Why not sneak a peek into Freud? I know he's old hat, but at least he puts conflict in really early, e.g. the baby resents the mother not being there on cue, so he withholds poo so as to punish her for not being with him constantly (or something like that). Even from the get-go it's a fraught relationship. Giving a baby one's time and milk doesn't always come naturally and isn't always in itself satisfying or enriching (even a bit of trouble lactating can change the relationship). Meanwhile there are as many types of mother as there are types of father: some cold and remote; some irresponsible; some giving; some selfish; some grandmotherly (remote but kind); some tender and light; some dark; some full of anger and resentment; some distracted; some ethereal; some wistful; some deliriously joyful; some smoking a pipe. Which type of mother suits the psychology you want in the child? Which one is most meaningful to your story?

Ah, just read your single mother post -- yes, that's very interesting. There the gamut goes from drowning children in a pond to absolute and utter devotion. Which style of mother would shape (or help shape) the main character as you want him to be?

Sorry if this all sounds too much like throwing the question back in your face -- mothers are great, but every era seems to find a new way to strain the mother-child relationship (my mother was a 1950s version, not terribly happy with the insular suburban ideal, and eventually inclined to escape it). Single motherhood adds strain; everything becomes a bit more dire. However some of my friends who raised children alone have produced some of the happiest and best-adjusted children I know. Others have raised absolute terrors. Look at the psychology of your main character (if he has one) and you'll have your mother.

Jennie
 

Trick

Auror
Which style of mother would shape (or help shape) the main character as you want him to be?

Actually, I almost want him to develop into a thief and assassin despite the fact that his mother is loving and good. I know those are generalities but I want his exterior esperiences to be the cause of his flaws and not his mother. Basically, I want her to try her damndest to raise a good son and fail anyway.
 

Jamber

Sage
His mother is strong and beautiful, loving and kind but very likely flat... I don't want her to be a cardboard cutout, I want a real woman with a huge influence on my MC's life.

Actually, I almost want him to develop into a thief and assassin despite the fact that his mother is loving and good. I know those are generalities but I want his exterior esperiences to be the cause of his flaws and not his mother.

So is the mother the moral guardian who haunts his misdeeds? Does she represent guilt? The idea of who he should have been?
You could make the mother's character more real simply by working with the idea of guilt in backstory -- a moment when he disappoints her or when he first associates his perfect mother with unpleasant feelings of guilt. (Is she a passive-aggressive, a hoarder of disappointments? Does she turn remote and cold when he doesn't live up to expectations? Or does she forgive and forget instantly? Is she a bit of a doormat?) Using guilt early on can create inner conflict you can use later, when he goes against her influence more consciously.

Then again, if the mother isn't really part of his characterisation (if she hasn't been a 'huge influence'), then the initial question was a bit astray. It's your story; you decide.

cheers
Jennie
 

Scribble

Archmage
Yes, it was helpful and I am happy to have gained the rewards from your experiences.

A new thought, anyone here raised by a single mother? That experience would be particularly useful.

I was. She worked at the bank, and in those days the salary for a bank teller was abysmal. She managed to buy a townhouse in a decent neighborhood after we lived at my grandparent's house for a year, then shared an apartment with my two aunts.

She was not a disciplinarian. She was a talkinarian. She talked to us about morals, about empathy, about respecting other people, endlessly. If I did something wrong, she would start talking to me, and she would talk until she got past all my defenses, until I had to be utterly honest and understand every detail about the situation.

Counter to this, she wasn't around in the afternoons. We got into a bit of mischief. Not terrible when we were in our young teens, but enough. Dad was financially supportive, we had what we needed: clothes, school, etc... but I think he got off easy with the alimony. I think she didn't really want his money, and took a bare minimum.

She had a hard time trying to develop relationships while working full time and managing us two boys. There was one fellow who really loved her, but he was too young. He couldn't adapt to the responsibilities. I liked him, but he was a kid in many ways. There were a few others, but they didn't last. She's a highly intelligent, lovely woman, with deep values and moral fiber. She needed someone her equal.

That came later. She married a fine fellow, I have a great respect for him.

When I was 15, I started going off the rails. I was wild, I was getting involved with an older crowd. I was getting into staying out late, then drinking, then drugs, then staying out all night, then getting arrested. She was not equipped to handle it. She couldn't control me, and she was having health problems that she DIDN'T even tell me about. She was carrying the whole thing, and at a certain point, I went to live with Dad. They thought he could reel me in.

I went even wilder, and that gave her a lot of anguish, and I feel bad about it today, but when I was young, I couldn't see the forest for the trees.

Now, today, we have a wonderful relationship, reforged through her grandchildren. We talk frequently, and my children adore her.

We can talk about those times. See, my kids will never get the chance to fool me. She was smart, but totally naive about how teenagers can get into trouble. She didn't know I was in trouble until I was deep in it. It happened over a few months that I transformed, and I was going through such a hard identity change that I didn't even know myself. She blamed herself for much of my troubles, just as I would, if something happened with my children.

We've been able to talk through all that. I don't blame her, or anyone for anything. It was iffy for a while. I turned out well, I have a pretty good career, a house, etc... It could be worse!

I always had a feeling of worth inside, that whatever I was doing was a temporary experiment. I was immune from destruction or ultimate failure because she always poured into me a sense that I was special, that I had gifts, that I would find my way. I like to think that all the trouble I went through gave me a perspective that other people often never get, and what saved me from self-destruction was the gifts she gave to me, my self-esteem.
 

Trick

Auror
That is eactly the kind of thing I'm looking for! Yes, the influence she has on him exhibits itself as guilt until he finally faces his demons. He doesn't blame her but he blames many others when he is young along with himself. He progresses from minor thief to assassin and criminal and his first act of major thievery sets off a domino effect that he thinks of as the cause of her death. She loves him but is, as you put it, not equipped to handle it. She is naive but worries over him constantly. This serves to drive a wedge between them before her death which, as an adult who has grown more than vertically, he later regrets. I'm planning on her memory making him a better man but his ever present regrets keeps him angry and he still smolders inside, though the teenage angst and temper flares subside.
 

Trick

Auror
Now, today, we have a wonderful relationship, reforged through her grandchildren. We talk frequently, and my children adore her.

Not to bring up anything painful, but how do you think you would feel if you never got the chance to get back that relationship?
 

Scribble

Archmage
Not to bring up anything painful, but how do you think you would feel if you never got the chance to get back that relationship?

There would be an empty space that could not be filled by anything. There would be things in myself I would have a hard time to reconcile. Growing up, you have a child's awareness of the world. Your impression of certain events will be limited by your perspective, things that may affect your life. When you reconcile with the parent, things come full circle, and you can view those old events with new eyes. You may hold onto old emotions, old ideas, and with those new eyes, you see yourself differently. You can let go of old anger. People who keep their old emotions close in their minds, always replaying them, they are not able to get to that clarity. You may feel more connection to those feelings and have no concept of the peace you could have. That is how many people get stuck.
 

Caged Maiden

Staff
Article Team
I'm the mother of a 7-year-old. I can say that, as my oldest, he's very independent. He sees me as the obstacle most of the time, the thing standing in the way of what he wants to really do. I'm the one who makes him pick up messes he swears he didn't make in his room (we also have a five, three, and almost two-year-old). He gets very frustrated and takes it out on me and the other kids. I'm the law. My husband is gone all day and I'm the one raising my children. I am the enemy... But I don't have that problem with my five-year-old. He's completely different personality. He negotiates, asks me politely for things, and is all-around an easier personality for me to work with. I never have to yell at him or punish him. I just ask, talk to him about how his behavior makes me feel, and ask him to stop doing whatever is upsetting me. My oldest, I've gotten into knock-down drag-outs with. Literally. He stresses me out so bad sometimes I would lock my bedroom door and let him pound on it, trying to keep his fight going.

So yeah, kids have different personalities and it starts to show young (about age 3). My first son has been hellish since three. My second, an angel. My daughter (currently three) responds to one-on-one face time very well, but left to her own devices, I find she gets herself into trouble and then gets mad at me when I have to punish her (by making her clean up a room she trashed or denying her snacks after she steals and eats a while box of cookies from the cupboard). My own mother was very calm. She almost never yelled and I never remember fighting with her. Me and my brother were calm, happy kids. My mom played with us occasionally, but for the most part, she stayed home doing god knows what, because me and my brother were often playing in our own rooms or out riding bikes or playing video games. Honestly, at age 7-9, kids don't really want to hang out with their parents. Now, of course, circumstances alter those perceptions. If my family were more traditional, we might have very different views. If we all got together for Sunday supper, I might be asked to cook with my mom and learn our traditions or whatever, and I'd have fond memories of that (or resentment). If my parents traveled and left us in the care of Grandma or a nanny for long times, I'd have feelings about that. Each situation influences how kids relate to their parents, and their personalities do too. Hope I've helped a little.
 
My MC has a special attachment to his mother. This has become an issue for me because I grew up without one. She passed away when I was very young and I have no memory of her. My MC loses his father at seven and as such grows even closer to his 'Mama.' So far I have used my wife as an example of a good mother for the character but I can't get the child's point of view right. His mother is strong and beautiful, loving and kind but very likely flat... I don't want her to be a cardboard cutout, I want a real woman with a huge influence on my MC's life.

Can anyone give me a little perspective on this? I'm looking for emotions felt towards moms from their children. Even bad ones as my MC has a bit of a dark heart. Describe the feeling of dissappointing the mother you love, or of making her proud. Anything would help...

At the risk of revealing more about myself than any of you want to know...this point reminds me of something that happens for the main character in my first book published in the mainstream. At the age of 40, he becomes a father for the first time.

My wife and I have been through 10 miscarriages.

Amazing what comes out in your literature without you quite realising sometimes.
 

Trick

Auror
Amazing what comes out in your literature without you quite realising sometimes.

I totally agree. Even at fifteen I was writing about characters missing a parent or even both. I guess it's hard to know what anything else would feel like. If you haven't lived it, it may not come naturally. Only now that I try to branch out and get perspectives from the experiences of others I see that the undertones in my work are distinctly revealing about myself. As a man with muted emotions, I was surprised to see how much feeling I put into my fantasy creations.
 
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