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What are the most common historical (or other) inaccuracies you see in fantasy?

skip.knox

toujours gai, archie
Moderator
>This is something I will almost definitely get wrong, even when using my master plan of being super vague..
>I have tried to read about it a bit, but then I realise I sort of don't highly understand what I'm reading!

Best thing you can do is to get a beta reader who is a horse person. They will gladly critique you on that point. Like any specialist, they'll get tiresomely pedantic and grimly insistent, but you can agree with everything then quietly use the bits that make sense. I worked with such a person once, and she gave me bits of information that turned out to be quite useful and which I'd likely never have sussed out on my own.
 

skip.knox

toujours gai, archie
Moderator
>An army of a five hundred thousand soldiers is pretty big.
>It's a cool big number, but how much thought has really been put in behind it?

Just for reference, Xerxes invaded Greece with an army of about 500,000. To pull it off, he actually had to sort of "pre-invade", working with local populations to put in supply depots all down the Aegean Coast. One of the reasons why getting through at Thermopylae was so important for him was that such a large army simply cannot sit in one place for very long. They strip the countryside. Armies in enemy territory have to keep moving.

I agree, logistics can really trip me up as a reader.
 

Sheilawisz

Queen of Titania
Moderator
I agree with skip.knox: That Braveheart movie is really a madness, and even though I enjoy the battles and the scenery, I hate the idea that William Wallace could have ever met Isabella of France.

Something that is often portrayed inaccurately in Fantasy is Horse riding. Characters can ride for very long distances and nobody seems to realize that a horse needs rest, food and shelter... Also, in reality not all horses were used for the same tasks: There were travel horses, carriage horses, farm horses, war horses and more, as far as I know.

Military logistics are often not even described in Fantasy settings, like they just raise a huge army and march on their way to the battle or to invade the enemy kingdom!!

In reality, raising and equipping an army is a very complex task, let alone advancing it (carrying enough food and supplies) not to mention the huge financial costs that are involved in a campaign... I think of that every time that I watch Return of the King and also my favorite TV series, Merlin.

Anyway, I think that getting too realistic can ruin the Fantasy atmosphere.
 

SeverinR

Vala
Dialogue is one thing that really turns me off. I can't STAND when non-modern characters say things like "okay", unless it's semi-justified by time travel or something, where they'd have exposure to modern-day people and might have picked up a few habits of speaking. But a peasant woman who's spent her whole life in the eleventh century is not going to say that, ever. It drives me up the wall when my RPing partner does stuff like that, as many of our characters are of the medieval era.
Alrighty then. :) Inconcievable! ;)

You want bows that can fire arrows 700 feet in the air? No problem, just read Game of Thrones. .
;-)
I believe the bows are made of Dragonbones so they aren't being fired by the local hunter. The more incredible items needs to be least available items.

Have reasons why things happen the way they do, even if you don't share them with the reader - this can help you maintain consistency and help avoid the "maybe no one will notice if I fudge this just this once" trap. Because they will notice. I promise.
We have nerds that can identify every mistake in every movie. They will catch it. The writer simply tries to learn the basics and then try to conceal the ones they don't realize with a good story. "Everyone knows the Gold Gilder coin of Elcradan, has the Mother queens left profile not the right, how stupid!"

I agree with skip.knox: That Braveheart movie is really a madness, and even though I enjoy the battles and the scenery, I hate the idea that William Wallace could have ever met Isabella of France.

Something that is often portrayed inaccurately in Fantasy is Horse riding. Characters can ride for very long distances and nobody seems to realize that a horse needs rest, food and shelter... Also, in reality not all horses were used for the same tasks: There were travel horses, carriage horses, farm horses, war horses and more, as far as I know.

Military logistics are often not even described in Fantasy settings, like they just raise a huge army and march on their way to the battle or to invade the enemy kingdom!!

In reality, raising and equipping an army is a very complex task, let alone advancing it (carrying enough food and supplies) not to mention the huge financial costs that are involved in a campaign... I think of that every time that I watch Return of the King and also my favorite TV series, Merlin.

Anyway, I think that getting too realistic can ruin the Fantasy atmosphere.
Every part of making an army must be accounted for. 5000 men, need at 5000 weapons, need at least 5000 uniforms(if they wear one), need 5000 shields(if provided), need at least 5lbs of food=25000 pounds of food/day, 2l water per person=10000liters of water to drink,
Training-military training minimal-3days(know rank and basic movement as a mob) Month-establish minor movements as a team.

When the army eats and drinks it must expel the waste which if they don't move wil become quite a mess, 25000 of waste and 10000liters of urine in a small area per day

That 5000 men army has really overwhelmed even the greatest prepared city in a short time without even raising a sword to it.
Now what if one of them was sick? It would run rampant in the men.
 
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Sheilawisz

Queen of Titania
Moderator
You know what else has a tendency to be very inaccurate in Fantasy worlds??

Swords are often portrayed as a very common weapon. Everyone has a sword, and if you don't have one, getting your own is cheap and easy. It's almost like swords grew out of the ground and you can simply pick one up... Swords are abandoned in every battlefield and nobody cares about them, they are just... part of the world.

In reality, swords were very, very expensive things. It took a long time (and the expertise of many people) to make a single sword, so they were often owned only by the wealthy.

The common soldiers would be equipped with other weapons, but in Fantasy, we find the finest swords everywhere.
 

Trick

Auror
As a reader I say: If you're writing in our world, be accurate. As accurate as possible. Don't tell me that New York city has always been called by that name or that it's the Capitol of New York State. Regardless of the period, get the basics right. If someone in armor rides around all day in a battle, make them and the horse tired, very tired. But at the same time, if, historically, leather clothes were expensive at a certain time and your MC has leather pants but is poor, don't spend a page explaining where they came from. I don't care. Just make them cloth or don't tell me they're leather if you're worried over it.

But, when something is your creation, the whole world or just fantastical parts of it, be consistent. If your MC can jump ten feet in the air, I better find out why and why others can't/can too. If something is common in your world that doesn't exist/is rare in the real world, make that obvious; only once though... I don't need to be told four times that all horses have wings. But if a horse suddenly appears with no wings, I want to know why.
 

C Hollis

Troubadour
You know what else has a tendency to be very inaccurate in Fantasy worlds??

Swords are often portrayed as a very common weapon. Everyone has a sword, and if you don't have one, getting your own is cheap and easy. It's almost like swords grew out of the ground and you can simply pick one up... Swords are abandoned in every battlefield and nobody cares about them, they are just... part of the world.

In reality, swords were very, very expensive things. It took a long time (and the expertise of many people) to make a single sword, so they were often owned only by the wealthy.

The common soldiers would be equipped with other weapons, but in Fantasy, we find the finest swords everywhere.

I don't mean to sound like a toad, but I do find it interesting that some points brought up in this thread are based on our personal perceptions of historical accuracies. Some things I thought were inaccurate turned out to be true upon further research.

The Statute of Winchester (1285) stated that every man between the ages of 15 and 60 must have arms of some sort, for the purpose of keeping the peace.

So, I'm thinking, okay farmer Gustav has his pitchfork. However, I found this little trinket from Ian Mortimer:
The swords which peasants use are cheap-you can buy a blade in some places for as little as 6d-but if you are sensible you will wear a weapon that looks as if its owner knows how to use it. A serviceable blade with a leather-bound hilt can be bought for as 1s to 2s; a good scabbard and belt will be 1s more.

I would have to do some digging to see how long it would take for, what we refer to as, a peasant to drum up a single penny, but I found this quite interesting.
 

Sheilawisz

Queen of Titania
Moderator
@C Hollis: Peasant swords would be Falchions, a type of machete-like tool used commonly to work in the fields. Those cheap blades could be used for battle, but they were inferior in quality and durability to the style of swords that we have in our stories.

The beautiful, shiny double-edged swords that we see in Fantasy were very expensive in Medieval times. There were also high quality and expensive Falchions that were used by wealthy people and even by Knights, but the truth is that the best swords were simply out of the reach of most people.

Swords would never be abandoned in a battlefield like we see in Fantasy, they were too valuable. Armor also was very pricey, but in Fantasy they can equip entire armies with it =)
 

skip.knox

toujours gai, archie
Moderator
C Hollis, I have additional information on that. I was recently in Oslo where they have (surprise!) a Viking museum -- er, well, a wing of it devoted to Vikings. On display is a whole bunch of stuff from Viking graves. I was shocked by the swords. They were really pieces of crap. It looked like someone just took cheap metal and put an edge on it. They were bent--I mean bent like a bicycle fender bent, and not much sturdier. They were all knicked up as well. They looked like they would be good for one battle, maybe too. All I can figure is that the metal was so pliable, after the battle you took out a hammer, pounded the sword straight again, and tried to put an edge back on it.

It certainly was a far cry from what I imagined a Viking sword would look like.
 

Trick

Auror
It certainly was a far cry from what I imagined a Viking sword would look like.

There is a documentary on Viking swords on Netflix and elsewhere I'm sure. You may find it interesting. Apparently they've discovered that certain sword making processes were actually discovered further back in history than originally believed. Although, the swords you saw were probably not the best of the best. One swordmaker in particular made these amazing swords. Definitely worth watching.
 

C Hollis

Troubadour
...
I apologize, I didn't realize you were talking only of fancy swords. No, fancy swords were not available to everyone, I agree.

Falchions in their basic form were a common sword for the ones we now call peasants, but more elaborate falchions were also used by other classes.
 

C Hollis

Troubadour
I suppose my main point in the original post was the fact that what readers see as inaccuracies are not always the case. There have been a couple of times in this thread where we see this.

I deal with a fantasy world that I created, so there are no inaccuracies. However, I do make an effort to mirror some of the "expected" genre staples, and real world situations. My armies take forever and three days to cross the street, my mercenaries are typically armed with basic blades and bare bones armor, and my characters still have to sleep from time to time, but I'm not going to sweat it if a reader, or group of readers, find the crenelations on my castle walls do not fit their prescribed time period.

Probably because, as a reader, the only thing that really takes me out of book is what I perceive as modern sayings, which admittedly, my perception could be well skewed (see first two sentences). Somebody can "fly off the handle", that's fine, bu I'd better not hear about a character "jumping the shark" (actual line in a book I read last week).
 
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