teacup
Auror
With all the lesbian sex scenes in the books this might just be right.
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GoT vs. ASoIaF [SPOILER-FEST]
- Thread starter Legendary Sidekick
- Start date
Myth WeaverStarts with Tyrion listening to the battle outside, the "music of slaughter" he calls it. The Iron Born have blocked off the river with a fire ship, trapping the slavers. Tyrion says as a Westerman he knows full well how savage they can be. The slavers are being slaughtered.
Tyrion reflects on his first battle, especially the time before it that he spent with Shae. She's on his mind a lot this chapter. Even though this is his third battle, he is terrified. He thinks about all of his crimes, questioning why he even thinks he deserves to live. Lots of self-loathing going on here. Penny, already in her armor, approaches him and offers to help him don his. Tyrion wants some wine. As he's waxing (morbidly) poetic about his first battle, Penny kisses him all of a sudden. He's left speechless, not wanting to hurt her by making it clear he's not interested.
Eventually he starts talking about all the slaughter going on outside, scaring her. She questions why he makes japes about it all, then she calls him brave. This reminds him of Shae calling him "her giant of Lannister", which makes him (irrationally) think Penny is mocking him. He gets very angry, feeling a momentary impulse to slap her. The memory of killing Shae overwhelms him, and he imagines what he would do to Penny right now if he had a chain, a crossbow or any kind of weapon.....it's a very disturbing moment, which makes one question Tyrion's mental state. I honestly thought he was coming out of his funk, but now I'm not so sure.
The sound of shouts snaps him out of it. The dragons have come. Rhaegal is circling the bay where the naval battle is happening, but not attacking anyone apparently. Viserion is closer, snapping the corpses being thrown by the large trebuchets out of the air and eating them. One of them he sets on fire and drops, landing on some Yunkish horsemen, burning and scattering them. Viserion retreats back to his lair in Meereen, while Rhaegal stays out over the bay. Tyrion smells urine and notices Inkpots has pissed himself.
A Yunkish officer representing [some slaver with a weird name] rides up, demanding the Second Sons go fight the Iron Born that are trying to land on the shore. Inkpots says Brown Ben is off meeting with [some other slaver with a weird name] and they can't do anything until he gets back. The officer rides off, outraged at this disobedience. The Yunkish command structure is a complete mess. They were rotating who was Supreme Commander on a daily basis, and now during the battle several of them are trying to claim that title, each trying to do their own thing.
Jorah walks up and says they are on the wrong side, they should switch before Dany returns. He's absolutely certain she will. He says they should save the hostages, and he swears to tell Dany that the Second Sons were playing the Yunkish the entire time, that they were always on her side. Brown Ben returns with news. Ser Barristan is attacking the trebuchets with his forces, [the slaver with a weird name he met] wants the Second Sons to defend one of them. Everyone in the tent thinks the idea is stupid. Their company is made up of mounted men, they aren't suited to hold a fixed position.
Another messenger, with a depraved image carved on his breastplate that Tyrion admires, representing [a third slaver with a weird name] shows up with different orders. The Unsullied are advancing on a trebuchet now too, Bloodbeard's company and two Ghiscari legions stand against them. The messenger wants the Second Sons to sweep around and attack the Unsullied in the rear. The messenger informs them that the Tattered Prince and his company of Windblown have switched sides...which makes Brown Ben scratch his chin in contemplation.
The messenger recognizes Tyrion as an escaped slave and demands he be turned over. Jorah stabs him through the throat with his long sword in response, sending him sprawling into the cyvasse board. The pieces fly everywhere, a white dragon with veins of Yunkish blood seeped in its grooves lands right at Tyrion's feet. As he picks it up, Brown Ben announces that they have been the Queen's men all along. Tyrion says he wants the dead man's gaudy breastplate, and the chapter ends.
Tyrion reflects on his first battle, especially the time before it that he spent with Shae. She's on his mind a lot this chapter. Even though this is his third battle, he is terrified. He thinks about all of his crimes, questioning why he even thinks he deserves to live. Lots of self-loathing going on here. Penny, already in her armor, approaches him and offers to help him don his. Tyrion wants some wine. As he's waxing (morbidly) poetic about his first battle, Penny kisses him all of a sudden. He's left speechless, not wanting to hurt her by making it clear he's not interested.
Eventually he starts talking about all the slaughter going on outside, scaring her. She questions why he makes japes about it all, then she calls him brave. This reminds him of Shae calling him "her giant of Lannister", which makes him (irrationally) think Penny is mocking him. He gets very angry, feeling a momentary impulse to slap her. The memory of killing Shae overwhelms him, and he imagines what he would do to Penny right now if he had a chain, a crossbow or any kind of weapon.....it's a very disturbing moment, which makes one question Tyrion's mental state. I honestly thought he was coming out of his funk, but now I'm not so sure.
The sound of shouts snaps him out of it. The dragons have come. Rhaegal is circling the bay where the naval battle is happening, but not attacking anyone apparently. Viserion is closer, snapping the corpses being thrown by the large trebuchets out of the air and eating them. One of them he sets on fire and drops, landing on some Yunkish horsemen, burning and scattering them. Viserion retreats back to his lair in Meereen, while Rhaegal stays out over the bay. Tyrion smells urine and notices Inkpots has pissed himself.
A Yunkish officer representing [some slaver with a weird name] rides up, demanding the Second Sons go fight the Iron Born that are trying to land on the shore. Inkpots says Brown Ben is off meeting with [some other slaver with a weird name] and they can't do anything until he gets back. The officer rides off, outraged at this disobedience. The Yunkish command structure is a complete mess. They were rotating who was Supreme Commander on a daily basis, and now during the battle several of them are trying to claim that title, each trying to do their own thing.
Jorah walks up and says they are on the wrong side, they should switch before Dany returns. He's absolutely certain she will. He says they should save the hostages, and he swears to tell Dany that the Second Sons were playing the Yunkish the entire time, that they were always on her side. Brown Ben returns with news. Ser Barristan is attacking the trebuchets with his forces, [the slaver with a weird name he met] wants the Second Sons to defend one of them. Everyone in the tent thinks the idea is stupid. Their company is made up of mounted men, they aren't suited to hold a fixed position.
Another messenger, with a depraved image carved on his breastplate that Tyrion admires, representing [a third slaver with a weird name] shows up with different orders. The Unsullied are advancing on a trebuchet now too, Bloodbeard's company and two Ghiscari legions stand against them. The messenger wants the Second Sons to sweep around and attack the Unsullied in the rear. The messenger informs them that the Tattered Prince and his company of Windblown have switched sides...which makes Brown Ben scratch his chin in contemplation.
The messenger recognizes Tyrion as an escaped slave and demands he be turned over. Jorah stabs him through the throat with his long sword in response, sending him sprawling into the cyvasse board. The pieces fly everywhere, a white dragon with veins of Yunkish blood seeped in its grooves lands right at Tyrion's feet. As he picks it up, Brown Ben announces that they have been the Queen's men all along. Tyrion says he wants the dead man's gaudy breastplate, and the chapter ends.
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Snowpoint
Sage
Podrick attempting to ride a horse was the best part of the episode. The Brienne and Bran sections of the books go one forever and I think the show is doing as much as it can to make those threads more interesting.
- Thread starter
- #44
Yeah, I can see why they made that change for the screen. It looks like there is a HUGE change regarding the Theon/Asha reunion, unless I misread the preview.
I have a feeling the season will cover the Brienne plot from book 4 (but not her "cameo" in 5) and the Theon plot from book 5. My guess is that the other major characters won't progress past book 3 with the possible exception of Arya. (It may be my faulty memory, but it seems she's spending more time with the Hound than in the book. That, or the order of events has been shuffled.)
Pod is a good comic relief character. I hope he doesn't die. (Speculation regarding his fate is mixed. I let someone borrow book 4, so I can't reread to see his fate is a clear "yep, he's dead." I assumed Brienne said her "word" to save him, not just herself. Of course, I'm also assuming/hoping she's not a younger, bigger Lady Stoneheart.)
I have a feeling the season will cover the Brienne plot from book 4 (but not her "cameo" in 5) and the Theon plot from book 5. My guess is that the other major characters won't progress past book 3 with the possible exception of Arya. (It may be my faulty memory, but it seems she's spending more time with the Hound than in the book. That, or the order of events has been shuffled.)
Pod is a good comic relief character. I hope he doesn't die. (Speculation regarding his fate is mixed. I let someone borrow book 4, so I can't reread to see his fate is a clear "yep, he's dead." I assumed Brienne said her "word" to save him, not just herself. Of course, I'm also assuming/hoping she's not a younger, bigger Lady Stoneheart.)
An interview of GRRM where he discusses reader & viewer reactions to depictions sexual violence.
I thought some may find it interesting considering our forum discussion of the Cersei-Jaime funeral scene.
http://www.theguardian.com/books/2014/may/06/george-rr-martin-game-of-thrones-sexual-violence
I thought some may find it interesting considering our forum discussion of the Cersei-Jaime funeral scene.
http://www.theguardian.com/books/2014/may/06/george-rr-martin-game-of-thrones-sexual-violence
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kayd_mon
Sage
So it appears that I have returned to the spoiler thread. So much for resolve, lol.
How great was Peter Dinklage's performance in the trial scene? He's a great actor, but last night he really shone.
How great was Peter Dinklage's performance in the trial scene? He's a great actor, but last night he really shone.
SeverinR
Vala
That was a great scene, I think it might be award winning.(another one)
[I did find the complete episode, the first of the season. I have seen bits and pieces of several episodes]
The frustration, the betrayal, the anger, the hurt, the rage shown in that one scene.
One question, was Shay's betrayal a suprise or was it lead up to in scenes that I haven't seen yet?
(I believe like Pod, he demanded she make a clean break of him. It didn't lessen the pain when she did it, nor could it, since her life depends on them believing her story, or else she is a co-conspirator. She would not sell out Sansa and Tyrion like she did if she was not told too.)
[I did find the complete episode, the first of the season. I have seen bits and pieces of several episodes]
The frustration, the betrayal, the anger, the hurt, the rage shown in that one scene.
One question, was Shay's betrayal a suprise or was it lead up to in scenes that I haven't seen yet?
(I believe like Pod, he demanded she make a clean break of him. It didn't lessen the pain when she did it, nor could it, since her life depends on them believing her story, or else she is a co-conspirator. She would not sell out Sansa and Tyrion like she did if she was not told too.)
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- Thread starter
- #48
I found it surprising in the book. And, yes, there's more to it which was hinted at in the dialogue. (But if you haven't read the book, you'll find out what the "more to it" is in a few weeks.)
kayd_mon
Sage
With each day that passes, and with each episode that airs, the fear that the show will start spoiling the books grows larger. Makes me sad! In my dreams, GRRM has already finished both Winds of Winter and A Dream of Spring, and we'll get them both in early '15.
- Thread starter
- #50
Well, this season does end where book 3 ends. (I mean, it has to!) I think of book 4 and 5 stuff, they just started Brienne's journey and the same goes for Theon's plot.
I could see having the worry that Theon/Brienne would advance into book 6 territory sooner than later.
Honestly, they make up so much stuff on the show, I wonder if they air Winds of Winter scenes before I read the book I'll being saying things like: "Strong Belwas? But... Dario did that!" (I mean when I read it later.)
Speaking of... does TV Dario have sex with Dany every night until the wedding, then the night after, pig out on chocolate locusts?
I think the pit fights will be harder to watch than Oberon's death, particularly the topless woman being disemboweled by the boar! I had to reread that part. I was so distracted by the horrible death, that I put aside my suspicions that Belwas was pigging out on poisoned snacks. I guess it made sense that the characters didn't pick up on that. I DID, but when he was puking, I was just thinking about that poor woman's thwarted futile attempt to hobble out of the arena and the painful death. That was the part that confirmed my suspicion that Belwas was about to die (I'm happy to be wrong about the death part!), but I was focused on the pit like the rest of the audience. (Um... I mean the fictional audience. I wasn't really sitting with them, was I?)
I could see having the worry that Theon/Brienne would advance into book 6 territory sooner than later.
Honestly, they make up so much stuff on the show, I wonder if they air Winds of Winter scenes before I read the book I'll being saying things like: "Strong Belwas? But... Dario did that!" (I mean when I read it later.)
Speaking of... does TV Dario have sex with Dany every night until the wedding, then the night after, pig out on chocolate locusts?
I think the pit fights will be harder to watch than Oberon's death, particularly the topless woman being disemboweled by the boar! I had to reread that part. I was so distracted by the horrible death, that I put aside my suspicions that Belwas was pigging out on poisoned snacks. I guess it made sense that the characters didn't pick up on that. I DID, but when he was puking, I was just thinking about that poor woman's thwarted futile attempt to hobble out of the arena and the painful death. That was the part that confirmed my suspicion that Belwas was about to die (I'm happy to be wrong about the death part!), but I was focused on the pit like the rest of the audience. (Um... I mean the fictional audience. I wasn't really sitting with them, was I?)
SeverinR
Vala
How cool would it be to be actually sitting in the audience for a filming?
Just watched the battle between Mountain and the Viper.
I believe both men died. I guess the acting king gets to decide what that means.
I guess Viper died first.
I only read the description before, I wondered how the Mountain got the upper hand.
Never play with your conquest. Never get over confident.
He got the confession but he didn't get the part saying Tywin ordered it. But it cost him the ultimate.
I wonder how long the actor had to practice with the polearm to look that comfortable with it.
Just watched the battle between Mountain and the Viper.
I believe both men died. I guess the acting king gets to decide what that means.
I guess Viper died first.
I only read the description before, I wondered how the Mountain got the upper hand.
Never play with your conquest. Never get over confident.
He got the confession but he didn't get the part saying Tywin ordered it. But it cost him the ultimate.
I wonder how long the actor had to practice with the polearm to look that comfortable with it.
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- Thread starter
- #52
The Mountain isn't dead, but the Viper's spear was poisoned, so Oberon did succeed in avenging his sister and her children. I think the show didn't reveal that the spear was poisoned (yet).
Gryphos
Auror
Actually, if you watch closely there is a shot of Oberyn's squire wiping a cloth on his spear before the fight.
- Thread starter
- #54
It was subtle... but if you didn't read the book, did you know the Red Viper used poison spears? (I suppose you could guess that if you referred to him as "Red Viper" instead of "Prince Oberon.")
By the way, this is the spoiler-fest thread! If you didn't read the book, you might not want to dig too deeply in here.
By the way, this is the spoiler-fest thread! If you didn't read the book, you might not want to dig too deeply in here.
Pay-off in two weeks.
In the show as well as the books, his extensive knowledge of poisons is mentioned.
SeverinR
Vala
He did change weapons. His squire did toss him one.
The wounds looked to strike deep vital targets. He also would never walk right again. Viper cut his tendon or maybe the whole calf muscle. I don't think the mountain would play dead in a fight.
Dang it Hodor gets the babes.
My favorite Harpys with Hodor. (Harp twins)
"Hodor...Hooodor!"
I just saw an cologne ad(fake I believe) Odor by Hodor.
http://www.daylol.com/odor-by-hodor
The wounds looked to strike deep vital targets. He also would never walk right again. Viper cut his tendon or maybe the whole calf muscle. I don't think the mountain would play dead in a fight.
Dang it Hodor gets the babes.
My favorite Harpys with Hodor. (Harp twins)
"Hodor...Hooodor!"
I just saw an cologne ad(fake I believe) Odor by Hodor.
http://www.daylol.com/odor-by-hodor
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kayd_mon
Sage
There's also the fact that anything that Littlfinger or Sansa does from here on out is either a book spoiler or a deviation.
teacup
Auror
Correct me if I'm wrong about anything on this, it's been a while since I read the books.
In the books, when Littlefinger kills Lysa, he blamed it on a singer who was there at the time, and got away with it, and is now Lord of the Vale. In the show the singer isn't there, and it looked like Littlefinger would have been found guilty of murdering her if Sansa hadn't helped him out.
Though this made Sansa very interesting, it made Littlefinger seem unprepared, to me, and not quite as clever as I thought. In the books he got away with it because of his own lies and blaming the singer. In the show it was like he was going to lose, until Sansa stepped in.
What are peoples thoughts on this?
(Like I said I could be wrong. I can't remember how easily he got away with it in the books. Maybe he's still under suspicion? I don't remember Sansa helping...but again that might just be my memory.)
In the books, when Littlefinger kills Lysa, he blamed it on a singer who was there at the time, and got away with it, and is now Lord of the Vale. In the show the singer isn't there, and it looked like Littlefinger would have been found guilty of murdering her if Sansa hadn't helped him out.
Though this made Sansa very interesting, it made Littlefinger seem unprepared, to me, and not quite as clever as I thought. In the books he got away with it because of his own lies and blaming the singer. In the show it was like he was going to lose, until Sansa stepped in.
What are peoples thoughts on this?
(Like I said I could be wrong. I can't remember how easily he got away with it in the books. Maybe he's still under suspicion? I don't remember Sansa helping...but again that might just be my memory.)
Sir Kieran
Scribe
I believe he had much more control in the books. He blamed Lysa's death on Marillion, immediately inherited the title of Lord of the Vale, and then told the other lords that he would be out within a year. I just reread the scene and outlined some of his plans:
(1) He expects Robert(Robin) to die soon. "Our poor brave Sweetrobin is such a sickly boy, it is only a matter of time" (896).
(2) Sansa will win the affections of Harold Hardyng (Harry the Heir), son of Lady Waynwood. "The dwarf wed Ned Stark's daughter, not mine. be that as it may. This is only a betrothal. The marriage must needs wait until Cersei is done and Sansa's safely widowed. And you will meet the boy and win his approval. Lady Waynwood will not make him marry against his will, she was quite firm on that [. . . .] Harry can be a beguiling one, no doubt. Soft sandy hair, deep blue eyes, and dimples when he smiles. And very gallant, I am told [. . . .] Bastard-born or no, sweetling, when this match is announced you will be the envy of every highborn maiden in the Vale, and a few from the Riverlands and the Reach as well" (893-894).
(3) Harry the Heir is called so because he is Robert's heir (through numerous deaths in the Vale houses). Littlefinger concludes the final Alayne chapter with the following speech:
"When Robert dies, Harry the Heir becomes Lord Harrold, Defender of the Vale and Lord of the Eyrie. Jon Arryn's bannermen will never love me, nor our silly, shaking Robert, but they will love their Young Falcon . . . and when they come together for his wedding, and you come out with your long auburn hair, clad in a maiden's cloak of white and grey with a direwolf emblazoned on the back . . . why, every knight in the Vale will pledge his sword to win back your birthright. So those are your gifts from me, my sweet Sansa . . . Harry, the Eyrie, and Winterfell. That's worth another kiss now, don't you think?" (896)
When I first read this scene, I had to put the book down in amazement of Littlefinger's elaborate plan and his extensive knowledge of the Vale houses; he certainly did his research. I certainly believe that he is playing for his own selfish reasons; my only hope is that he means to genuinely help Sansa along the way, and will not ruin her in the process. What the showrunners seem to be hinting at, in some interviews, is that Sansa is growing intelligent and could possibly play Littlefinger at his own game, if it ever comes to that.
For now, I think Littlefinger's plan sounds just fine.
teacup
Auror
Oooh great, thank you. Very interesting.
I'm a little disappointed in Littlefinger for killing Lysa in the show with no good way out of it, and it didn't look like he was planning on Sansa to help him out there. But I can forgive it, because it's certainly made Sansa a much more interesting character.
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