How do you avoid making your characters look like fools?

[srebak]

For the longest time, my mind has had a habit of making characters from TV and movies do things that make them look stupid, naive and/or just plain silly. Sometimes that is because some of the characters actually do do things like that, but most of the time, it's just my mind going wild. Worst of all, when it's the latter, it usually results in making the characters look shallow or mean, or even selfish.

So i have to ask, how do i avoid making characters i write look like fools or jerks?

 

[Feo Takahari]

I'm not sure I understand the problem. Characters should do what's in their natures to do, so when you need something for them to do, think about their natures and have them act accordingly. If you want to have a character do something not in their nature, rewrite the character or create a new one. (If Ranma 1/2 is any indication, there's a market for fantasy about people doing stupid things.)

 

[teacup]

Think the character through very thoroughly. Get inside their head. What do they think, what do they notice, what do they feel? When you have a good understanding of your own character, and put them into a certain situation, how they react should be how that character would react under those circumstances. If they act like a jerk/fool, then that is how the character would act (and there's nothing wrong with that - in fact flaws can make for better, more 3 dimensional characters) or you aren't writing what that particular character would actually do.

If you find all of your characters are being overly foolish or jerks all the time, and you don't want that, then just ask yourself how the character would truly act in that situation. If they would all truly act like jerks/fools and you don't want that, then you'll probably need to change some of the characters in some ways.

To avoid characters being fools/jerks, make them not be fools or jerks - You'll need to look into character traits, like, what makes somebody a jerk, and what traits people you don't consider jerks have. Then try to implement these traits into a character, and try to make it work together and fit.
I haven't done this before, but I suppose working off of somebody you consider to be smart/nice could help with the characters, like try and recognize what makes them not foolish/jerks to you?

I hope I've been of some help and explained myself well.

 

[psychotick]

Hi,

Surely it comes down to who your character is. In my current WIP I have a secondary main character whose a fifteen year old girl whose been decieved by a master criminal into thinking he's her kindly grandfather. For various biographic details - raised in orphanage, mother in nuthouse etc - that's incredibly important to her. And because of that her actions are foolish. As my MC says at one point - she's fifteen and stupid. She's also run away from school and become a bit of a street kid with a bad attitude to authority. So when my MC is a fed that instantly makes her hostile to him, and she does and says jerkish things. Again it's how she is meant to be and also a necessary part of the explanation for various plot elements.

So she does foolish and jerkish things, but that isn't really who she is and I suppose the challenge as a writer is simply to explain her actions / words to the reader so that they become understandable.

Cheers, Greg.

 

[srebak]

The fact of the matter is, seeing and imagining characters doing things that make them look stupid, naive or silly, or selfish, mean or shallow, just leaves a bad taste in my mind and that's a feeling i'd like the avoid.

Even as we speak, i'm having the misfortune of imagining characters in at least three fanfiction ideas i'm working on doing things that make them look stupid or naive, or just shallow jerks.

One character from one story idea is suffering from my mind making her look naive and gullible, even though i would have preferred a tough girl who was smart and could take care of herself

The worst aspect of this problem is that it stems from me wanting my protagonists to sound and act like wise, honorable people (relatively speaking in some scenarios) who believe in the best in people. But the fact that we live in a world that seems to feel that being selfish, cynical and distrustful is a good thing, that hinders my thought process considerably.

 

[teacup]

The fact of the matter is, seeing and imagining characters doing things that make them look stupid, naive or silly, or selfish, mean or shallow, just leaves a bad taste in my mind and that's a feeling i'd like the avoid.

Even as we speak, i'm having the misfortune of imagining characters in at least three fanfiction ideas i'm working on doing things that make them look stupid or naive, or just shallow jerks.

One character from one story idea is suffering from my mind making her look naive and gullible, even though i would have preferred a tough girl who was smart and could take care of herself

The worst aspect of this problem is that it stems from me wanting my protagonists to sound and act like wise, honorable people (relatively speaking in some scenarios) who believe in the best in people. But the fact that we live in a world that seems to feel that being selfish, cynical and distrustful is a good thing, that hinders my thought process considerably.

Just think about what traits people have which you like, and implement them into your characters. If you want a tough and smart character, but instead you're writing one who isn't, just simply think harder on the character, and make her tough and smart. Just figure out what makes tough/smart people, and write it. If you keep writing them ways your don't want, for whatever reason, then it seem you'll just have to try and blank that out, and when you start writing the character doing things that they wouldn't do, stop yourself, and get back on track.

 

[srebak]

Well, the problem still hasn't gone away, i'm still having the problem of imagining my characters (original or a part of fanfiction) saying and doing things that go against their character.

These days, i'm imagining them saying and doing things that make them sound like an "After-School Special" or "Educational message" if you will, and it's kind of corny. The worst part of it is, it stems from me wanting the hero/heroine to say something noble and heroic.

 

[Feo Takahari]

Are there any noble and heroic characters you like? I mean, is there any book or movie where you thought "This character is noble and heroic" and meant it as a good thing?

 

[psychotick]

Hi,

If you want your characters to do noble things then surely they have to be of noble character. But you seem to be saying you want them to do noble things even when that runs against the grain of who they are. The only ways to do this are to force them to do noble things by some sort of plot device which effectively leaves them with the noble choice also being the ignoble choice - so they try to do the wrong thing and it ends up the right thing. Or to give them an ulterior motive such that they get rewarded in some way for doing the right thing.

Alternatively you can rewrite your characters so they are noble, or else allow them to do the wrong things in keeping with who they are.

Cheers, Greg.

 

[wordwalker]

I'd say this comes down to seeing the whole range of options they have-- which is a big part of good, suspenseful plotting anyway. Part of the story is whittling those down, using both plot and character reasons, so the character does what they honestly think they have to do.

Part of it's plotting: much of any story is defined by what choices don't work (all those flat tires and phone failures), and another part is evolving how people consider or get partway through one approach and then find why it won't work any more. Escalating tension.

But on the character side:

If it's his natural bias, part of that's connecting the reader with that approach already. Harry Potter and his friends always take too long to tell their teachers what they're digging into, but they've already spent half the book using sneak-spells to outmaneuver Slytherin schemes at the Quiddich match and other petty adventures, so keeping secrets seems more natural.

--And of course, throw in a time or two when they try "the sensible approach" and it doesn't work; people don't believe them, the wrong people get blamed, and so on. Or preempt the whole idea of "the logical but out of character choice" by having a sneering Snape-type be the first to suggest it. That way the base has been covered, but by making the reader cheer when the character goes his own way instead. (And later on the cavalry might arrive in time to save part of the day anyway, another nod to common sense.)

If someone's going to be noble and self-sacrificing, he probably knows the less heroic road (and may have taken it in the past), but you show him watching the innocents at stake and knowing that he can't stand to back away now.

If it's pure impulse (the coward flinches away from the door he could have locked, the hero punches the slaver before seeing his options), you might have to convey some of that with the buildup before the full situation is sprung on him, but make the actual choice immediate-- and then show afterward what else he could have done.

Or he might overlook the best choice-- because things happen so deceptively but then so fast that he's stuck with his obvious first choice, instead of the "obvious on second thought" choice.

Really, it's coordinating several perspectives: how the reader (the average one, if there is such a thing) assumes a person will arrange his choices, how the character already wants to weight them, and how the situation has started to limit them. Part of the story's usually making the reader start to be in sync with the character (or at least be aware how how they think and why), and then stacking the situation so those options get harder and harder-- either in the simple heroic sense (dragons/corruption/whatever just keep getting bigger! but we've found a way so far) or setting up a breakdown (how could I be so wrong! is my whole world-view a waste?).

 

[Jabrosky]

For the longest time, my mind has had a habit of making characters from TV and movies do things that make them look stupid, naive and/or just plain silly. Sometimes that is because some of the characters actually do do things like that, but most of the time, it's just my mind going wild. Worst of all, when it's the latter, it usually results in making the characters look shallow or mean, or even selfish.

So i have to ask, how do i avoid making characters i write look like fools or jerks?

What kind of TV and movie characters are these, and what sort of stupid or jerky things do they do in your imagination? Maybe you fixate too much on anti-heroic characters in the media you consume?

I can relate to the experience of writing characters that ended up less likeable than I intended. In my experience, it's easier to fall into this trap when my characters start out either as anti-heroic or pathetic wimps. This is one reason I prefer to write heroes who can kick butt early on. Maybe experiment with the same?

 

[Gurkhal]

Seems like the best advice have already been given, but just run with it. I do totally stupid and silly things all the time and I would figure that many others do so as well. Characters always acting 100% right would make for a damn boring story.

 

[Wormtongue]

Boils down to this. Motivations are everything. If a character has an understandable motivation for being a fool or a jerk, then the reader will not be put off by it. Within reason.

For me it's pretty easy to write fools and jerks believably because I spent so much of my earlier life as a fool and a jerk.

 

[srebak]

For the longest time, the issue in many cases has always been the same: a character does something silly, dumb, or naive and the other characters do the following:

Stare at them with an "Oh Brother" look

Stare at them with a look of shock

Mutter in an "Oh Brother" type of way

or

Face palm themselves


All four have gotten really old really fast.

 

[Gurkhal]

For the longest time, the issue in many cases has always been the same: a character does something silly, dumb, or naive and the other characters do the following:

Stare at them with an "Oh Brother" look

Stare at them with a look of shock

Mutter in an "Oh Brother" type of way

or

Face palm themselves


All four have gotten really old really fast.

You can always have a character punch the jerk in the face. That would both be unexpected and also give more drama and conflict to the story.

 

[hots_towel]

the way I get over this is as simple as rereading, or having someone proof read for you.

I pretty much have the same problem. i dont realize my characters have done something stupid until i have someone look it over and ask "why didnt they just do that?" or "why would this character even do that?" im completely oblivious to what my character has done until someone reads it over.

the phrase "the labyrinth is easier solved from the sky than from within." seems pretty fitting to this situation

 

[Terry Greer]

you have to understand the character's intention. Describe their thought processes and WHY they decide to do something. What is the thought that drives them to their actions and why do they dismiss a different action?

If you can convey their reasons for their actions you can make your character's do the dumbest things (as looked at from outside) - providing it made sense to them at the time. This could be because of:

Prejudice - a previous 'correct' action went wrong so they automatically think the correct action is wrong.
Incomplete/Inaccurate knowledge - the information the character has is flawed in some way - maybe they're missing some vital piece, or they don't trust who gave them it.
Wishful thinking - they would prefer a different action (possibly subconciously)- so ignore the facts.
Erroneous logic - their logic is flawed but they can't see it - but the reader can.

If their reasoning is clear to the reader (and makes sense) then the reader won't feel them fools.

 

[srebak]

Seriously, whenever i don't want my stories to have naivete, embarrassment, cynicism, inexperience or just plain stupidity, it feels like my mind is trying to force them into the story.

 

[Terry Greer]

Even the cleverest people have their naive weakspots - I know of no one who is universally wise and knowledgable. It's therefore permissible for any intelligent character to make the wrong decision without them looking a fool - indeed it can make vastly intelligent characters suddenly mire human an vulnerable..

 

[srebak]

Seriously, all of the things that i don't want said or done in my stories are just plaguing my imagination. Almost as if my mind wants me to put them in.