Fantasy races and bigotry

[Neunzehn]

I don't read science fiction very often but that seems like a unique idea. As long as it doesn't look too much like a historical event from real life (think the black dwarfs), it won't be obnoxious, just interesting.

Edit: In my opinion.

 

[sashamerideth]

I don't read science fiction very often but that seems like a unique idea. As long as it doesn't look too much like a historical event from real life (think the black dwarfs), it won't be obnoxious, just interesting.

Edit: In my opinion.

I am trying to figure out how to write bigotry, I am a pretty tolerant person and don't know how to think that way... it is kinda tough for me.

 

[Fnord]

I am trying to figure out how to write bigotry, I am a pretty tolerant person and don't know how to think that way... it is kinda tough for me.

I guess a little immersion could probably help with that. Obvious examples would be books or movies that feature it pretty prominently and we have a pretty strong history of it in the U.S. Uncle Tom's Cabin by Harriet Beecher Stowe and Things Fall Apart by Chinua Achebe can put you in the minds of people who perform seemingly senseless acts behind the perception of thinking they are actually doing the right thing because of the belief that one race or group is inherently inferior to another. Movies like "Rosewood", "I Time to Kill", "Higher Learning" and "Mississippi Burning" are all movies that explore the topic of bigotry and race. Sometimes getting into the minds of people who hold those beliefs, while unpleasant, can illuminate their motivations.

These are all obviously extreme examples and if your particular use for bigotry in fantasy writing isn't quite so extreme, these might seem like overkill, but I still think they can be useful in giving insight behind the motivations.

 

[sashamerideth]

Thanks for that, will get them out of the library and read through them.

 

[JBryden88]

IMO, fantasy, where you have many races, or many cultures, is not complete without bigotry. Same with Sci-Fi. The point of a story is to connect you with the world, and unfortunately, it's a very real element in our world. Thus, unfortunately, bigotry is one of many ways to connect you to a fantasy world.

IMO, it doesn't just have to be for stupid reasons like "your skin is dark" like we have. It can be for various reasons.

Perfect example: in my world, there's a mysterious people who are divided into five tribes that each represent a totem animal. The Bear and Wolf tribes HATE each other, will discriminate against each other, and will kill each other, based on their totem alone.

Or on the mostly human side. One group of humans, the Lochinions, hate the big Broan Empire, because the Empire is arrogant, and at one time conquered them until most unconquered nations surrounded them and forced them out. So they have a hatred based on past wrongs. Which descends into outright pettiness between individuals.

There's all sorts of reasons why characters might end up as bigoted individuals.

 

[Fnord]

IMO, it doesn't just have to be for stupid reasons like "your skin is dark" like we have. It can be for various reasons.

I think this is super important. When you really think about it, "skin color discrimination" is really just an easy way out in our world anyway. Even if everyone in the world was the same color, we definitely have plenty of other instances where discrimination and prejudices against groups of people based on some characteristic hold sway. And history backs that up; skin color is just an easy form of differentiation. We've discriminated against people in our world based on things like Irish or Italian ancestry, tribal allegiances (such as in Rwanda, for example), social class, and certainly religious differences. Though I used the American history of racial bigotry because it's something we still see everyday, there are plenty of other things we hate and kill each other over. In your world it could be beards and pointy ears. Or eye or hair color. Or even otherwise ridiculous taboos based on long forgotten feuds or customs. Don't forget, even left-handedness was considered "sinister" (the origin of the term) in the not-so-distant past.

 

[Waltershores]

In my current venture the antagonist was created from racial inequality and holds quite the grudge. I find racism quite interesting in the real world, so why not touch on it in the fantasy world.

 

[Hans]

As I've said somewhere else, I am more a worldbuilder than a writer. And of course I have racism in my world. Folks which doesn't travel much and thus doesn't see much different builds up strange stories about the unknown. Moreso if this unknown looks different or has strange habits or speaks funny. Sometimes propaganda plays into this when there is a war or any reason to build up a "us versus them" attitude. A nice story could have one or more characters with strong prejudices and see these broken.

For the topic of slavery on earth, it is not completely right to say it was free of the race or other "we group" issues. Different eras of the roman empire did not allow for romans to become slaves.
Traders in the sumerian city states were sometimes obligated by law, when they come upon a slave born in their hometown to buy him into freedom. Different city laws granted support if the trader could not afford that.
Slavery in europe ended shortly before medieval times because a christian was not allowd to own christian slaves. So a medieval setting with slavery is not possible because all former slaves had converted by that time. Villeinage or serfdom is not the same as slavery.

 

[kolchak]

This is almost exclusively what I use fantasy environments for. I have a lot of opinions on race and race relations, and I find it a lot easier (and a lot more satisfying) to explore them removed from our world. It makes it a little easier for people to accept certain truths that they are conditioned to otherwise immediately reject: western civilization being a negative aggressor, for one. Dress up European culture as elves or dwarves and suddenly nobody is making excuses for when they wipe out entire continents of people to set up their cities.

 

[Derin]

I don't deliberately focus on racism, but it tends to crop up in any setting. In my current world, for instance, the country in which the story is set is on land that used to belong to dwarves before humans conquered it. Humans took alol the farmland but couldn't match dwarves in the mountains; now, the relations between the mountain-dwelling dwarves and flatland humans are very, very tense. Any wandering on the other's land would probably find themself lynched. But none of this was deliberate, or intended to be a parallel for anything on Earth. It's just how people are.

 

[Smaug]

in a medieval setting, I'd say NOT having any kind of racial bigotry is almost guaranteed to be bad storytelling.

I would agree with this: many authors use racism as a way to signpost an 'evil' character, but a simplistic view of racism in your fantasy world could make it difficult to create a sense of realism.

Also, in the real world, prejudice is often hard to detect and can be built into some people's ideas of national identity. Far-right parties here in England use this to mask extreme views on race.

For example, the Imperium of Man in the Warhammer 40K universe is not one of the 'evil' factions, but it is fanatically racist against aliens and mutants. I enjoy it when authors don't give us an easy ride, and build flaws into 'hero' characters. As a product of their own cultures, should we blame them for holding potentially racist views? Where do we draw the line, after which we can no longer sympathise with them? It helps get away from the classic but unrealistic Paragon-type heroes.

My current project is based around Ancient Greece, where even the most democratic and free city states owned slaves. But to remove slaves all together would damage the Classical flavour I'm trying to create (and also a potentially interesting question to explore in the book)

 

[Amanita]

I've wanted to write an answer to this for a long time, now might be the time to do so.
Does a realistic fantasy world have to have racism?
If this is supposed to mean problems similar to those that existed between whites and blacks in the USA, my answer is no. There is no need to import people from another part of the worlds as slaves and there is no need to have them need to deal with the consequences of this in later times.
And I also don't understand people claiming that in a fantasy world with people of different skin colour these have to interact exactly the same way they do in our own world or the author is "colour-blind" or anything of the sort. (I've heard this argument, though not here.)
If the question is supposed to mean different groups of people or nations hating each other, the answer is yes. It's very likely, that something like this exists somewhere in every fantasy world and if it doesn't, there should be a good reason for it. These can be countries who've been enemies for ages, different religious groups, different magical groups or indeed the arrogance of a technologically more higher developed nation against others that aren't, a tribe of people that only considers tribe members human and not others and so on.
They're can be extreme power differences that result in slavery, which results in a lot of baggage for various groups involved as well of course.

In my own story, there are lot's of different kinds. Many people in my most powerful nation, Arunien, believe that it's their duty to teach the rest of the world how to run a state and how to use magic in a civilised way and they think that everyone should adopt their ways.
And clash with the Sarilians who think completely differently about those issues. The Sarilians are racist in the way that keeping their blood pure is very important to them and many of them feel extreme racism against their neighbours, the Elonians. There's actually been a genocidal war against an Elonian minority within their country about twenty years before the story starts. It was stopped by the Arunians, some of whom believe that the Sarilians will never reach a civilsed state and need to be ruled by others or even exterminated.

There's more but I don't want to ramble away.
Another interesting aspect of fantasy racism is the fact, that Orcs (or similar beings) often serve to avoid the "racism trap" during war. In wars, people often believe that the other side consists only of cruel, inhuman monsters who can be killed without a second thought. Orcs actually are such cruel inhuman monsters and can be killed without regret.
Tolkien actually has a relatively strict racial hierarchy where everyone is supposed to stay in their place and do their part there.

 

[Donny Bruso]

...Many people in my most powerful nation, Arunien, believe that it's their duty to teach the rest of the world how to run a state...they think that everyone should adopt their ways.

Sounds like the United States, lol.

But you make a good point. Dislike of a people doesn't have to be based on a person's skin color or accent or nose type. It can simply be that you hate their country's attitude towards well... everything. Human nature is that we want someone to blame, so we blame the people of the country who, realistically, have little to no control over what their government decides to inflict on the rest of the world.

 

[SeverinR]

Racism is a common theme in real life and can be used in fantasy.

I started a book with a half elf woman, that gets caught in a siege by orcs, in a town full of various human bigots.
All town occupants prefer to live with humans, and some are openly hostile to other races.

Orcs-elves have a traditional hatred between each other, so if the townspeople cast her out she will die a terrible death, and for some in this town, that is not a problem.

(I haven't worked on that story for a while, I have alot....alot of stories in the works. 12- 15 in various stages.)

Racism is the basic emotion of "us" vs "them", "we" are better then "them", "we" would be great if "we" didn't have "them" around us.