Adapting Mythology

[Jabrosky]

One of my most recent plot bunnies owes its inspiration to the hypothesis put forward by historian Martin Bernal that the Greek goddess Athena evolved from the Egyptian Neith. Since both goddesses patronized warfare and weaving in their respective cultures, and since a few Greek traditions do place Athena's origin somewhere in Africa, I can see why he might make that connection. The idea that sparked in me goes, "What if some Egyptian or other African warrior chick named Neith went to primitive Greece and inspired the legend of Athena?" I do

Obviously most written or cinematic adaptations of mythology end up diverging from their source material in some way, but the question I want to pose here is how much change you would accept in an adaptation. Where do you draw your line? I remember seeing a few people get upset with the Disney retelling of the Heracles myth, what with Hades replacing Hera as the antagonist. I myself felt cheated with the recent Beowulf movie which took out the water monster fight, albeit largely because I thought that would have made the movie much more awesome. At the same time, if I were to pursue my new plot bunny and adapt the Athena myth, I don't want to feel constricted by the limitations imposed by faithfulness to canon.

 

[Lancelot]

In fantasy, you can do whatever you want. I would accept plenty of variance, especially dealing with myth since the figures involved have several different stories to draw from and many characters even have conflicting stories where there is no single correct version.

The difference between adopting a set of stories from a character of myth and a specific story about a character that is only known in that story (Beowulf, assuming that we take the modern version of the single tale, which was originally multiple tales) is that, in the latter you are adapting a story as well.

 

[Lancelot]

As far as tolerance and variation, I would add that it is still tolerated if it is in character. The trick is that you want to stay away from changing a story significantly. If you want such a different story, just don't use that famous character. To do that is dishonest in that you are using the characters fame, but not using the actual character if you write them incorrectly or inconsistently.

Here is where variance is not tolerated as much. Changing a story can make people feel cheated. Adding to the character and activities of a character that has several stories can be well-received as long as the character acts true to form. In the case of Athena, you would keep Neith wise and shrewd in battle, but not make her blood-thirsty and brutal (that would be more like Ares).

 

[Alexandra]

... the question I want to pose here is how much change you would accept in an adaptation. Where do you draw your line?

I'm not sure I understand your question. Are the characters in your story gods or godlike, or do the gods simply form part of the mythology which your characters believe/disbelieve? In The Songs... religion, hence the gods, are important to the peoples of the known world. Gods are blamed when things go bad and celebrated and praised when things go well. Religious figures such as priests and priestesses are generally respected. Religious festivals are used as excuses for extravagant feasting, excessive drinking, and all manor of lascivious behavior so the festivals are generally very popular. Divine wrath is feared by the pious, scoffed at by the sceptical, and ignored by the priesthood. In fact there is very little divine interaction between the Gods (there are two) and the peoples of the Easterlies, the Western Isles, and the Lands of Light. My main protagonist has one divine encounter (or she believed she had) during the first thirty years of her life; or perhaps she may have inhaled too much powdered mushroom.

My pantheon is based loosely on the gods of pagan western and northern Europe. I find the mythologies blend easily, almost seamlessly, allowing me to cherry pick that which I like from each without fussing with them too much. Have I crossed any lines? None that I've drawn, and those lines are the only ones that count.

 

[Jabrosky]

I'm not sure I understand your question. Are the characters in your story gods or godlike, or do the gods simply form part of the mythology which your characters believe/disbelieve?

What I meant to convey is, how much do you think an adaptation of a myth can diverge from the source material before upsetting you.

 

[Steerpike]

What I meant to convey is, how much do you think an adaptation of a myth can diverge from the source material before upsetting you.

I think it all comes down to what you're representing the story as. If you were re-telling Beowulf, and 'advertised' your story as a prose retelling, I wouldn't expect much deviation. But if the book is presented as being based a certain mythology but is its own story and not supposed to be a straightforward re-telling of the myth, then as I reader I'd be happy to see the divergence go as far as the author felt like without it really bothering me. It comes down to what expectation you set up in the reader.

 

[A. E. Lowan]

Well, while we're using Beowulf as an example, we can look at Michael Crichton's Eater's of the Dead. It's a prose retelling, but WILDLY different from the original. However, it stays true to many of the core elements of the story, and is thus accepted as valid.

I would say that as long as you are keeping true to the spirit of the story/myth, then you're good to go. And this spirit can be pretty loosely interpreted. In trying to solve an internal debate recently, I went looking for Persephone's father. Turns out that both her and Demeter's entire mythologies vary greatly from time period to time period and region to region, and that even the identity of her father changes as the myth itself evolved. Early on, Poseidon is credited with being her father, and then later Zeus gets to claim the honors. Stories change as culture changes.

Also, I was among those who had no issues with the Disney Hercules. For starters, his name was Heracles. Hercules is just an adaptation of the original. And of course they were going to change some of the details about his parentage - he was conceived by rape-by-deception. Yeah, so not going in a movie targeted to young people. I thought the adaptation was funny, and while varying wildly from the original myths (for example Hercules doesn't murder his wife and children), it stayed true to a lot of the flavor of the original myths.

 

[Jabrosky]

For the record, I like the Disney adaptation a lot too. Mythology revises itself all the time anyway as I have found from my research.

 

[Alexandra]

What I meant to convey is, how much do you think an adaptation of a myth can diverge from the source material before upsetting you.

As much as you, as author and storyteller, can pull off without losing what it was that attracted you to the myth in the first place, eg. American Gods by Neil Gaiman.

 

[Jabrosky]

As much as you, as author and storyteller, can pull off without losing what it was that attracted you to the myth in the first place, eg. American Gods by Neil Gaiman.

To tell you the truth, I'm not so much interested in the original Athena myth so much as the hypothesis of her derivation from Egyptian (or other African) religion. I have a strange obsession with the idea that African cultures might have influenced Western civilization to a greater extent than most people appreciate.

 

[A. E. Lowan]

To tell you the truth, I'm not so much interested in the original Athena myth so much as the hypothesis of her derivation from Egyptian (or other African) religion. I have a strange obsession with the idea that African cultures might have influenced Western civilization to a greater extent than most people appreciate.

I wouldn't call it strange. Many African cultures are much older than those in the Middle East, and we know based on genetics (the Genographic Project, in particular) that humans originated from Africa, moved out, some moved back, creating a flow of humanity and ideas and mythologies that travelled far and wide. It's not my area of expertise (I studied 13th century English nationalism in literature in grad school), but I would say you're probably right on the money with your idea. Go forth and research, young man!

 

[Alexandra]

I agree with aelowan in that there is nothing strange about your obsession. Until recently the importance of the African influence on western European and North American culture has been downplayed, I suspect purposefully but that's another story/debate. "Go forth and research", indeed.

 

[Jabrosky]

Thanks for the encouragement, you both.

Among other sources, I might check out Martin Bernal's Black Athena series if my university's library has it. I do take some of his claims with a pinch of salt, but if nothing else his arguments might inspire some "what if" scenarios for fiction.

 

[A. E. Lowan]

If they don't have it on-site, I bet your university takes part in inter-library loan. My university did, and I needed some pretty unusual books when I was doing my research - they came from everywhere! It was pretty awesome.

Also, my college mentor taught me a great trick. If you find a good book on your topic, check out it's bibliography. There will be TONS of additional source material for you to mine there.

 

[rhd]

What I meant to convey is, how much do you think an adaptation of a myth can diverge from the source material before upsetting you.

Have you by any chance heard of Shiva3000? I picked it up out of curiosity and as I was reading it wondered why it wasnt banned, but it pulled me right in, it was brilliant and thankfully there's no price on Jensen's head because it didn't really get around here. I know what it's based on what is called Hindu 'mythology' but it's a strong part of an ancient, existing religion, and it could easily risk insulting a large group of people who take their gods very seriously, so by comparison, about the smaller group you're worried perhaps might to disagree, have a sincere disclaimer that you don't mean to insult them, plus you have a very believable concept of migration/travel to back it up. Also, meanwhile, check out the controversy behind this Indian author's work, about the origins of Shiva, basically he suggests that gods were human once. He's safe though no one's thrown a rock at his head, like they did to Taslima Nasreen when she was here.

So really, I don't think you should hold back at all, even in your mind because stressing out about it might hamper your flow. Religions break and form opposing sects and myths adapt, change and pass through many interpretations. It just happens, don't worry about all that stuff. I louuurve the idea of your Athena.