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Game Dev Team & Decisions

Discussion in 'Chit Chat' started by Xanados, Jan 7, 2012.

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  1. Xanados

    Xanados Maester

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    After seeking a position in a game development team as a writer, I recently came across one that was working on a slightly stylized RPG spoof.

    In order to see if my writing was suitable for the team, I had to write a short sample to the founder of the company.

    After a few days I began write the sample and came to this conclusion:

    "Hello, Sharsnik. It's Taylor.

    After writing half way into my writing sample, I came to the conclusion that I would like to resign my from my participation in the project. I feel that I am looking for a more mature narrative in which I can freely express myself. I can't work with a story that someone else has already written. I know that the game's lore isn't particularly in-depth, but I am not fond of how basic it actually is.

    My style of writing is quite archaic in nature and I don't think it would suit your project. I don't think I am especially witty either. "

    The story's foundations, already set by another writer, were incredibley basic and quite juvenile.

    My question: Do you think it was wrong to decline the opportunity?
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2012
  2. Johnny Cosmo

    Johnny Cosmo Inkling

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    It doesn't really matter, although it might have been worth finishing the sample to see if the opportunity actually existed.

    I have to ask: why did you go in to such detail with your withdrawal? Could you not have finished the message after the first sentence? Your tone borders on offensive, and seems to make the assumption that you are above the 'opportunity' (especially considering you approached them).
     
  3. Xanados

    Xanados Maester

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    I say what I feel is the truth. It was actually an extremley small team and the leader seemed not to care what happened (he was the only English speaker in the entire team). He was not proffesional in the slightest. I would not be offensive just to be offensive. I'm not stupid. I clearly did NOT say that I was "above the opportunity". I said I did not feel that I was suited for it.

    I see your point, but I was not being offensive.

    Edit: let's see what his reply is first.
    Edit: it was not a paid position, by the way. Now I think you'll understand.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2012
  4. Xanados

    Xanados Maester

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    Let me inform you why I shall not be making a response in those fashions which you assumed: I am not a child. I shall not indulge in your post, clearly intended to provoke me, and I shall not respond in the standard you expect.

    I now wonder why you think the content of that email is immature. I gave perfectly acceptable reasons for my "quitting". In fact, I was polite constantly to the man with whom I spoke. Perhaps you and I have very different views on what is “offensive” or “insulting”.

    I think, perhaps, you should obtain a more acute sense of character judgment. I will absorb any argument thrown my way, I will entertain anyone's ideas, but I shall not be named a child so carelessly. If you have, indeed, been dissecting my posts, then you will understand that I do not tolerate injustice.

    I’m dreadfully sorry that I'm not adhering to your assumptions.

    Thank you.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2012
  5. Johnny Cosmo

    Johnny Cosmo Inkling

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    I didn't say you said you were above it, but that your tone implied it. The point is that you emphasise the triviality of your communication and paint the projects simplicity in a negative light, when no one asked your opinion. It doesn't matter what the reply is, or whether it's a paid position or not. I understand completely; you approached a game development team, and the outcome was unprovoked criticism. And why does his lack of professionalism have to affect your own? I'd also like to point out that you didn't 'quit' anything. To make the assumption that what you did was anything more than a pre-submission withdrawal would be overstating your role in the situation.

    I don't intend to get into a debate over this, but can you not see that conflict seems to follow you around the forums? From our heated discussions in the showcase forums a while back, to your (often uncalled for) random grammar or spelling criticisms (especially considering you are not innocent of these 'offences/mistakes' yourself), to this whole drinking and conflict thread commotion... yet you're adamant that everybody else is acting unjustly, or is otherwise wrong. You're happy to assume you're right (which is made clear in how you present your opinion as fact, and term criticisms to your posts as an injustice), and it makes your posts come off as arrogant.

    Let's assume you are right about everything. Would it be fair for me to offer you some honest feedback on how you approach community participation? I'm sure you'll get along here better if you relax, try not to assume you have a moral high-ground in every debate, and accept that a lot of people have very different opinions on subjective topics. If you can't do this, then ask yourself whether taking part in these forums is really what you want to be doing with your time. There.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2012
    Devor likes this.
  6. mythique890

    mythique890 Sage

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    What is immature about your letter is your need to express your opinion of the project when it was unasked for. If you had included the first sentence and the sentence that made up your second paragraph your letter would have been much more professional. To call someone else's work "basic" and "juvenile" is offensive because it's an insult to the person who wrote it. To say that you "can't work with a story that's already been written" shows that you're not a team player. You're 18. You're looking for a position on a game development team. Until you prove that your writing can make money the only thing anyone is going to hire your for is to work on a story that someone with more experience has already written.
     
  7. Xanados

    Xanados Maester

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    Close the thread now.
     
  8. sashamerideth

    sashamerideth Maester

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    I did some writing for a similar project, unpaid stuff, small team, and not many people that really knew what they were doing. It was one of the worst experiences of my limited career. It did bring out the worst in me, and the others.

    What you said was unprofessional, but the whole situation was unprofessional. Please try to be more professional with us.
     
  9. Legendary Sidekick

    Legendary Sidekick The HAM'ster Moderator

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    It was wrong for these reasons:

    1 - You burned a bridge saying "not fond of"/"looking for a more mature narrative." Maybe that won't matter. Most indie dev teams only go so far. But as someone who's met the Harmonix guys before they made Guitar Hero or Rock Band and witnessed eye-rolling skeptics who saw them as scruffy-chinned music enthusiasts letting their passion for something unheard of cloud their judgment, well... let's just say it's best not to burn any bridges.

    2 - You came off as a quitter the moment you said that you stopped "writing half way into [your] writing sample!" Since that's the first thing you said, they may have stopped reading at that point. Do you think they feel bad that you're bowing out? If you're writing is so great, show it off.

    Confession: I turned down a game writer gig for a team that, at the time, was voted most likely to succeed on GameDev.Net. It really wasn't the kind of game I wanted to write for (too serious), but I kept that to myself and only said something similar to your comment in your last paragraph--that my writing style isn't a good fit. (Your last paragraph is fine, by the way, except for the I'm-not-witty part. Never admit this!) But believe me, it felt good to be wanted--and he approached me. I probably should have gone for it!

    3 - You're eighteen, so what do you mean you "can't work with a story that someone else has already written?" I'm more than twice your age, and I don't expect to be lead writer with creative control. No MFA + no industry experience + no five-figure book sales = get down on my knees and lick dog doodles off their shoes if hired as a co-writer. (Well... for a non-paying gig, I'd insist to use a sponge.)


    Most likely scenario: Being satirists, the dev team will have a laugh over what you wrote then forget you exist. If they're thick-skinned, they'll write you off as one who their satire is making fun of and will genuinely not be offended by you. If thin-skinned, they'll throw a hissy fit and fail the video game business (which is "inherently evil" in the words of a rocket-scientist friend who was in the game industry for 16+ years).
     
  10. Xanados

    Xanados Maester

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    Close the thread.
     
  11. Devor

    Devor Fiery Keeper of the Hat Moderator

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    You should probably send a PM to a mod if you really want this thread closed.
     
  12. sashamerideth

    sashamerideth Maester

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    Xanados is just upset he embarrassed himself in front of his peers. I forgive him, this time.
     
  13. Devor

    Devor Fiery Keeper of the Hat Moderator

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    I really think you should drop the "tough guy" facade already and stop being so defensive when people hold you accountable for your attitude. It's okay to make mistakes if you make up for them.
     
  14. Xanados

    Xanados Maester

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    Trivial.
    No, that is not the case.
    Close the thread.
     
  15. Xanados

    Xanados Maester

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    "Tough guy", interesting assumption.
     
  16. Devor

    Devor Fiery Keeper of the Hat Moderator

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    What would you call it when someone pretends to be unemotional and superior while hiding from criticism and refusing to admit to any mistakes?
     
  17. Johnny Cosmo

    Johnny Cosmo Inkling

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    Yeah, I forgot to point out that expecting to join a team as a lead writer as an inexperienced 18 year old is ridiculous.

    I get the feeling that any self-criticism from the e-mail was actually an attempt to try and balance out his insults, and written without any real basis. I'm not saying Xanados is witty or not, just that I don't think that was the reason he said he wasn't.

    Why? Moderators decide which threads need to be closed, not us users. I'm fairly certain that this is a vastly more civilised discussion than that drinking thread argument ever was. And let's not forget that you were essentially presenting your e-mail for us to judge; otherwise, you needn't have quoted the e-mail at all, and opting to just ask your question would have been a better idea.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2012
  18. Xanados

    Xanados Maester

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    1: There was only one English speaker in the team, which I found out a few days after talking to the guy. The other 2 were Japanese and could barley speak a word of English. I did not once say I wanted to be a lead writer.
    2: The writing required that the writer be witty. I am not.
    3: I have no idea why I presented this to you people. I realise now that I essentially posted something that, either way, would've been negative toward me.
     
  19. Devor

    Devor Fiery Keeper of the Hat Moderator

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    Would you, Xanados, at least apologize for being unclear and for giving the wrong impression? People are responding directly to your own statements, Xanados.
     
  20. Johnny Cosmo

    Johnny Cosmo Inkling

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    Why are you so persistent in dismissing other people's arguments as assumptions? Can you not see how it displays your inability to handle criticism? Honestly, just read back on some of your posts. It just sounds like you're trying to cool, detached, and opinionated... but you come of as arrogant and pretentious.

    Don't take that as an insult, because I'm sure it's just some automatic defence mechanism that's kicking in, but I think you need to stop trying so hard and just stop acting up. This is why people have called you childish, because you seem to be acting up like a child.

    And I'll admit it now, this discussion is descending into drivel. I think your passive-aggressive remarks are to blame, but it doesn't really matter. If it gets out of hand, then I guess it ought to be locked.
     
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