How we Present our Villains

[Androxine Vortex]

Something I was thinking about at work today (when I probably should have been more focused on my work) was how villains appear in films or described in books. My stories tend to be very "epic" and involve the wars of divine or godlike beings. It seems that if there is a bad guy in a story, they always have physical depictions of being evil. Horns, black wings, red eyes, etc. While I don't really have an issue with this, I was starting to question if we are trying to make our villains obviously evil?

I'm not one for superheroes but if there's one series I love most it is X-Men and Magneto is my favorite villain due to his powers and motives for being a villain. Now looking at other super villains (not just from X-Men) like Venom, Scarecrow, Dr Doom, it's pretty obvious that they are evil. If you never heard of Carnage before, just by looking at him you could infer he was bad. But Magneto, while stylish, doesn't have any obvious descriptions showing his evilness.

Voldemort from Harry Potter looks like a snake and I even read in an article that someone brought their child onto the set to see them film the movie and when the little girl saw Voldemort she ran away crying. But he wasn't always like that he was a normal boy who through dabbling in dark magic lost his humanity. I'm not saying that there's no justifiable reason to say why that multi-horned flaming bodied monster is like that, but is it necessary?

In my main story, the main antagonist who is a banished god is titled the lord of shadows, the prince of darkness, the black emperor because of his power over the forbidden and secret black magics. His realm is a vortex of black winds and frozen wastelands of tormented spirits. But his palace is one of bright and shinning light and while the rest of his children are deformed and ugly from centuries of dark magic perverting their forms, I describe him as a being of radiating light, with a smooth and elegant face, wearing clean robes and a beautiful crown of silver through his white hair. I feel like his qualities are what make him terrifying, not just by what he looks like. And again it's not that I don't have a problem with portraying villains are grotesque or anything like that (Think is Lovecraft made his creations in a more pleasant demeanor. The whole appeal of those monsters is their alien physiology)

How do you go about presenting your villains? Are they just normal people? Are they deformed? Are they heathen gods warped by hatred?

 

[Feo Takahari]

I have a history of Lovecraftian villains, but to be honest, they're mostly space-fillers. An embodiment of humanity's self-loathing that makes your eyes bleed if you look at it, or a warped creator goddess that can only manifest in this reality by possessing people who've given up on the world, or a sentient, psychic mass of polluted water that traps its victims in eternal stasis . . . They're not meant as characters in their own right, but merely obstacles to force the protagonists to confront their own issues. My most threatening villains look and act like average people, with all of humanity's flaws and weaknesses. (I once had a wimpy dork with mommy issues, almost unnoticeable for his average appearance, manifest incredible powers and take out two superheroes before someone managed to bring him down.)

 

[buyjupiter]

(I once had a wimpy dork with mommy issues, almost unnoticeable for his average appearance, manifest incredible powers and take out two superheroes before someone managed to bring him down.)

Ok, can I read that one? Because that sounds interesting.

 

[Jabrosky]

I believe the most effective villains are the ones who present themselves as sympathetic when you first meet them. They're the ones who manipulate your sense of morality, or maybe any prejudices you've picked up beforehand, in order to help their agenda. And if you end up dissatisfying their demands, they're the best at making you feel horrible about it. At that moment you realize that even though they claim to represent Heaven's Light, underneath that radiant veneer is Hellfire incarnate.

That said, even villains who don't fake such noble pretenses can still be fun to write if they otherwise come in unorthodox packaging. What if the cruel, oppressive tyrant had the look and demeanor of Thomas Jefferson? What if the warmongering megalomaniac was based on Queen Victoria instead of, say, Adolf Hitler? And what if the violently intolerant zealot took on the guise of Mother Teresa or Richard Dawkins? I take special pleasure in dressing up archetypes in unconventional packaging like that.

 

[Trick]

If you haven't read Abercrombie's The First Law series, don't read the spoiler:

Spoiler: First Law

Bayaz turning out to be the grand villain in so many ways was a great example of a villain who started out sympathetic and respectable. He's in my top five for sure.

 

[Terry Greer]

The main thing is that villains aren't villains in their own eyes.
They have full justification - and the reader should be able to see that self justification - and the reasoning behind what they do.

If that justification is really weak - then they are terrible pantomime villains.
The more compelling reasons and justifications for their villainy - the better the villain.

Great evil can be done with good intent.

 

[Penpilot]

I'm not one for superheroes but if there's one series I love most it is X-Men and Magneto is my favorite villain due to his powers and motives for being a villain. Now looking at other super villains (not just from X-Men) like Venom, Scarecrow, Dr Doom, it's pretty obvious that they are evil. If you never heard of Carnage before, just by looking at him you could infer he was bad. But Magneto, while stylish, doesn't have any obvious descriptions showing his evilness.

FYI

Magneto wasn't always so complicated. Originally, he was just your typical villain. His look hasn't changed all that much from his first appearance. On of the major differences is in his helmet. The older version has very prominent devil-like horns. In the newer depictions of Magneto, the horns tend to be smaller but are definitely still there.

As for Venom, he's made the transition from villain to anti-hero. The Eddie Brock version retained his villainous look, evil smile and all. The Flash Thompson version is named Agent Venom and his costume looks a lot like WW2 Movie Captain America's except all black and with the white spider.

Dr Doom, if you remove his cape, his armor to me looks a lot like the Ironman Mk1 armor.

How do you go about presenting your villains? Are they just normal people? Are they deformed? Are they heathen gods warped by hatred?

It depends on what type of story, what type of villain, and how you want to portray them. So it can run the spectrum. You can have the villain that looks too pure, all dressed in white and all proper. Or you can have the raggedy hero.

I think a lot of writers like to play the polar opposites card. If the hero looks good then the villain looks bad. The hero has black hair the villain blonde.

For me, more of the villainous feel comes from attitude and actions rather than physical appearance. I tend to write sympathetic villains where their motivations are understandable and given the right circumstances anyone could become them. They don't take any pleasure in the evil they do. They just think it's required to achieve their goals.

Though, I think one day I'm just going to try a plain black as coal villain who was just born bad.

 

[CupofJoe]

The main thing is that villains aren't villains in their own eyes.
They have full justification - and the reader should be able to see that self justification - and the reasoning behind what they do.
If that justification is really weak - then they are terrible pantomime villains.
The more compelling reasons and justifications for their villainy - the better the villain.
Great evil can be done with good intent.

I agree with TG.
Bad/Evil vs Good/Virtuous differences are often only in the eye of the beholders.
Even those we would consider insane usually make sense to themselves and others if you can get to their PoV.
My current Bad Guy is trying to improve humanity... They think they can see a better way to live, a new path for all humanity... if only they can burn down what is here and build anew... They may even be right...

 

[Tom]

I don't really have a typical way I present villains. Well, actually that's not true--most of the time, they've been driven to evil by extreme mental or emotional trauma. The idea that an ordinary person, twisted by pain and rage, can become a horrifying evil kind of fascinates me.

Most of my villains are sympathetic. I try never to look at them through a black-and-white lens--instead, I think like they would think, and figure out how they would justify doing what they do. The hero shouldn't be able to just look at the villain and say, "Yep, you're evil." Even villains are complex human beings, and I think they should be presented as such.

That said, I have had a few non-human villains. I see them as a sort of placeholder--they're there just to overshadow the real villain, who is usually human. Using Big Bads has great potential (and it's sorta fun), but that's not how I roll.

 

[knight1298]

im abit of everything of God like all the way down to just ****ed up in the head.
example to have a villain that works in the background pushing pulling events to his/her desires leaving the hero's to a darker ending.
or having a god like being who is top of the command with a army of minions for a classic legendary hero rpg thing to defeat the demon king but have realism and not a happy ending.
cant forget about the psychopaths who just want to torcher you without reason just to rip your mind and soul to pieces

 

[Chessie]

How do you go about presenting your villains? Are they just normal people? Are they deformed? Are they heathen gods warped by hatred?

Androxine, I spend plenty of my time at work researching writing articles on Google, making notes about my stories, and thinking endlessly about them. It gets me through the work day, so I totes sympathize.

About my villains: they tend to be your average person with strong convictions that run against the main character's desires and boundaries. I've never written about a truly wicked villain. They have all had redeeming qualities because that's what I find most interesting in bad guys--will they ever realize they are wrong?

I think it's important to keep in mind that villains are also people with desires and ethics. Have any of you heard of John Truby? I've been reading his book The Anatomy Of Story: 22 Steps To Becoming A Master Storyteller. In it, he goes over a chapter about creating antagonists that I haven't seen anywhere else. He makes the point that, on the surface, it seems that the main character and the opponent want something different. But underneath that layer, the antagonist and protagonist actually want (and are fighting over) the same thing. He gave some examples that made perfect sense.

He also goes over what he calls the "double reversal" in where the villain and the opponent learn something in the climax. And they learn that from each other. He says not all stories have this component, but that deep ones do. An interesting concept I had never thought about before.

So that's been my newest revelation as of late, but I have always been interested in the average person turning a bad guy. They aren't always in the blatant wrong either (my bad guys). Although it's much funner when they are that way.

 

[WooHooMan]

I think I'm kind of mixed when it comes to villains. Really I think certain villains only work in certain stories. You can't fit a round villain in a square story, you know what I mean.
Generally, the only villains I hate are the ones who are pure evil but try to pretend like they're very deep. Like they try to give speeches about human nature or moral relativity or whatever while doing unquestionably bad things. Pretentious villains are the absolute worse.

I've noticed, in my stories, I tend to set-up a character as "the lord of darkness, pure-evil coldly-charismatic baby-eating sociopath big villain of everything" but then he ends-up being a total chump who gets his crap kicked-in early on. Then the more effective antagonists tend to be a "hero in another story" type.

In my current fantasy story, for example, the villainous "dark lord" gets arrested and executed within the first chapter, the evil gods are unceremoniously killed in the backstory, and the main antagonists are an amiable social activist and the "chosen one who will defeat a great evil".

A lot of the time, the villains (be they major or minor, monstrous or sympathetic) will be weak in one area and strong in another. Like physically weak but very resourceful or stupid but strong. Or stupid, weak and short-sighted but extremely lucky. I love it when people underestimate a character but then they turn-out to be very dangerous.

 

[X Equestris]

In my current work in progress, the villain is a well-intentioned extremist who has no problem doing whatever it takes to protect his country. Even if that means abducting a young mage child with unique powers and using him as a conduit to summon and bind an army of demons. The plan being to use this army to help his homeland win a desperate, two front war. He won't win, of course, but I think giving your antagonists understandable goals but horrible methods is quite effective.

 

[Mythopoet]

I start out by never calling any of my characters the "villain". In my opinion, it's a word only useful for comic books and melodrama since, by definition, it means someone who is malicious and evil. It conjures up images of sallow men in black capes with twisty mustaches or "supervillains" dedicated to nothing more than crime and mayhem. Authors, in my opinion, should strike the word from their vocabulary. I did so years ago when I realized what a negative term it was. Now I work in terms of protagonist and antagonist.

Antagonist is a much more useful word. Its original meaning was simply "second actor" from way back in the days of Greek drama when you could actually put on a play with only one actor and the introduction of an antagonist meant the introduction of conflict in a new way. Conflict requires two opposing forces. Two actors could be pitted against each other. Hence our modern definitions of the "protagonist" being the main character and the "antagonist" being the one who opposes the protagonist. I like these words because they do not carry any baggage with them. A protagonist can be anyone or anything, good or bad. And an antagonist can be anyone or anything, good or bad. The main point is that they are in conflict over something.

And of course, it's important to remember that to be in conflict over something, one person doesn't have to be "bad" and the other "good". Fantasy, and epic fantasy in particular, tends to fall into a rut where the "villain" wants to accomplish something "bad" and the "hero" must stop the villain. But there are any number of ways that two people can be in conflict without representing moral extremes. Two people might both want to accomplish something, but go about it in two conflicting ways. That "something" could be good or bad or neither. Two people might both wants to stop something from happening and go about it in two conflicting ways. And again the "something" can be good, bad or neither. Two people might both be dealing with some sort of external problem or change, and go about it in two conflicting ways. The conflict can happen any number of ways, and neither protagonist or antagonist have to be "good" or "bad".

The important thing is to never begin with any assumptions.

 

[Giya Kusezu]

Oooh, I do love a good villain discussion!

I like to have a variety of characteristics with villains, in general. I think that sometimes the reason villains or bad guys get written as so hideous or scary-looking is because the writed wants you to automatically hate them and understand that they are bad without question. I don't really have a problem with that, but I've learned through personal experience that some of the worst characters/people you can run across look and act totally normal on the surface while harboring a well of pure evil under the skin.

I do have one or two villains that fall under the visual category - one is a highly powerful non-human that is pure black with red eyes and glows red. Yeah, pretty cliche, right? But then I have others that don't look especially terrifying at first glance and only really come across as evil once you begin to see their actions and the way they tick.

I have one villain in a future project that truly believes he is bettering the world by forcing everyone to comply with his spiritual beliefs. Another I've worked with is just a two-faced vagabond who will knock down anyone, friend or foe, to get what she wants. Another is a manipulator who preys on the fears of people he interacts with in order to control and subjugate them.

I think villains can be pretty colorful, and they're definitely fun to write. I tend toward villainous characters that act predatory in some way or seek control of others for the wrong reasons, just because those traits drive me nuts *shrug*

 

[Alex_Darkling]

I really like the way the OP presents their villain, I think sometimes the less typically evil a villain looks the creepier and more menacing it makes them. In real life evil and twisted people don't stand out from the crowd a great deal, that to me is what makes them truly scary.

My man villains are toned down, they wear darker clothing and a slightly more menacing look but I've tried to keep it as subtle as possible but still entertaining. I'm not going for a high fantasy style so they would stand out too much if I were to make them obviously evil from just looking at them.

What I have done on the other end of that spectrum is create a kind of "shadow realm" which works like a parallel universe where all my characters have a twisted and dark version of themselves, these doppelgangers do look evil, rotting flesh, blood stained clothing, deep black eyes, twisted demonic voices, the whole works.

 

[Addison]

My best reference for villains if "Criminal Minds".

Every episode shows both sides of the investigation, giving us a full view and understanding of the villain. We are there as they discover the reasons and circumstances that made the villain/un-sub and we see them at the present time in their present life facing the triggers which sent them on their current spree of murder, rape, arson etc.

Also I'd like to remind everyone, or for those who haven't seen the show-tell, a key rule of evil from "Once Upon a Time". Evil isn't born, it's made. Look at all the villains from OUAT, Regina was a happy, smiling lady with a bit of a tomboy streak in love with Daniel. Then her mother - Who I still think knew about Regina and Daniel before Snow White even met Regina- crushed Daniel's heart and sent Regina down the dark path. Rumpelstiltskin was a spinner and veteran who took the power of the Dark One to save his son, only to lose his son and spend the next centuries doing evil and manipulation to reunite with his son.

While on the subject of what makes a villain I'll say it, the same goes for heroes. No one is born a hero, they become heroes by facing challenges and making the right choices despite the temptations, urges and knowing that the other way will probably do the task faster and more effectively than the good choice. Seriously, how many chances did Charming have to kill King George before the first curse? Snow could have killed Regina the second after Regina tried and failed to kill her that time before the first curse. But they didn't, and that's how and why they're heroes.

Back on the subject of villains, they require just as much work as your heroes. Not just their physical description and what they do at the time of the story. But how they got where and how they are. We know Voldemort's back story, Hannibal Lecter's, Darth Vader, Sauruman. Everyone got where and how they are by their past, what is your villain's past? Is he looking to destroy the world because the world, in their eyes, has gotten worse than the nightmare it was when they were kids? Are they looking to overthrow or take control of the government because the government let him/her down too many times in the past?

Villains are just as important to a story as Heroes, thus they deserve and need the same hard work.

 

[willsonjohn90]

Something I was thinking about at work today (when I probably should have been more focused on my work) was how villains appear in films or described in books. My stories tend to be very "epic" and involve the wars of divine or godlike beings. It seems that if there is a bad guy in a story, they always have physical depictions of being evil. Horns, black wings, red eyes, etc. While I don't really have an issue with this, I was starting to question if we are trying to make our villains obviously evil?

I'm not one for superheroes but if there's one series I love most it is X-Men and Magneto is my favorite villain due to his powers and motives for being a villain. Now looking at other super villains (not just from X-Men) like Venom, Scarecrow, Dr Doom, it's pretty obvious that they are evil. If you never heard of Carnage before, just by looking at him you could infer he was bad. But Magneto, while stylish, doesn't have any obvious descriptions showing his evilness.

Voldemort from Harry Potter looks like a snake and I even read in an article that someone brought their child onto the set to see them film the movie and when the little girl saw Voldemort she ran away crying. But he wasn't always like that he was a normal boy who through dabbling in dark magic lost his humanity. I'm not saying that there's no justifiable reason to say why that multi-horned flaming bodied monster is like that, but is it necessary?

In my main story, the main antagonist who is a banished god is titled the lord of shadows, the prince of darkness, the black emperor because of his power over the forbidden and secret black magics. His realm is a vortex of black winds and frozen wastelands of tormented spirits. But his palace is one of bright and shinning light and while the rest of his children are deformed and ugly from centuries of dark magic perverting their forms, I describe him as a being of radiating light, with a smooth and elegant face, wearing clean robes and a beautiful crown of silver through his white hair. I feel like his qualities are what make him terrifying, not just by what he looks like. And again it's not that I don't have a problem with portraying villains are grotesque or anything like that (Think is Lovecraft made his creations in a more pleasant demeanor. The whole appeal of those monsters is their alien physiology)

How do you go about presenting your villains? Are they just normal people? Are they deformed? Are they heathen gods warped by hatred?

I think in sci-fi fiction movies and Books it looks good to see villains with some kind of imaginary deformity or something which looks evil but in realistic movies we see them as normal people with bad intentions or some become villain in movies because something bad happened to them. So there is no perfect answer for your question it depends if I am writing a sci-fi book or script for such kind of movie I will use some kind of imaginary characters which are showcased as villains and if I am writing on real life then definitely they need to look realistic. So it depends on the genre of the book or movie for me.

 

[ScipioSmith]

The way I write means that the personalities of the characters tend to develop as I go along, becoming much clearer to me by the end than they were at the start, but their physical appearances remain consistent. This means that my villains, who tend to be conceived as cackling psychopaths but who then develop in more interesting ways, tend to be stuck with external markers of the evilness that they no longer possess. So I have an elven warlord who wears all black armour with a blood-red cape, because when I came up with her she was basically an elven nazi. Now she's one of the most selfless and altruistic characters in the story, but she still wears black armour with a blood red cape.

 

[psychotick]

Hi,

My villains run the gamut. My imagination has room for those who really do have noble purposes however misguided, and those who simply do what they do for self involved reasons. Usually I try to explain what those reasons are so they don't look to one dimensional. But sometimes as a reader and a writer I simply don't want to "understand the villain." I just want him dead!

One of my favourites was from The Godlost Land which I put out last year. Terellion was pure self interest. I gave reasons for why he became as he did, but in the end I didn't want him to have any redeeming characteristics. The story worked better if he was simply a full tilt arsehole. And it meant I could kill him in a particularly nasty way and not feel bad about it!

Cheers, Greg.