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Sex!

Thoras

Minstrel
That got your attention, now didn't it?

Now I'm not sure if this is the right place, but I couldn't tell where else it would belong. I know this is a fantasy forum, but on occasions - I'm sure your characters hook up.

Anyway to the point, the story I'm working on right now will eventually lead to a sex scene between two characters, but I'm not entirely sure if I should simplify it by going like "...aaand then they hooked up." <cut chapter>, or if I should actually show the act.

The thing is, it is a fantasy book, not an erotica - but on the other hand, it is also an adult fantasy. I want the book to feel real and not sugarcoat it either, so I guess some might appreciate it - a book that would include all parts of life. And at the same time, the thought of actually describing the act in detail kind of make me feel like a pervert, because I actually think I could make it pretty authentic. So I'm thinking "what if this would be published and friends and family actually read it". :eek: That'd be awkward.

So I'm looking for advice on how you would deal with this in your writing, thanks in advance!

//Thoras
 

CupofJoe

Myth Weaver
Two questions to ask... [and we don't need to know the answer to either of them :whistle:]
Do you want to write a sex scene?
Do you think you can write one well?
I tend to go for the "fade-to-black... Next morning" approach.
Unless you have an Orc having sex with Fire elemental [as an example] then most people are going to be able to fill in that x and y happened an their pictures will be WAY better than any words...
Now if it is important to your characters development that something happened in a certain way... then that's a different problem.
A friend wrote a story about someone who was a war crimes survivor and had the most brutal types of sex to punish themselves for surviving. It was true to the character [as far as I could tell] but it didn't make for an easy or pleasant read.
 

Thoras

Minstrel
Two questions to ask... [and we don't need to know the answer to either of them :whistle:]
Do you want to write a sex scene?
Do you think you can write one well?
I tend to go for the "fade-to-black... Next morning" approach.
Unless you have an Orc having sex with Fire elemental [as an example] then most people are going to be able to fill in that x and y happened an their pictures will be WAY better than any words...
Now if it is important to your characters development that something happened in a certain way... then that's a different problem.
A friend wrote a story about someone who was a war crimes survivor and had the most brutal types of sex to punish themselves for surviving. It was true to the character [as far as I could tell] but it didn't make for an easy or pleasant read.

Well the first question I think I would say no, the second one I'd say yes - but of course that is for others to judge.
Haha well there are no orcs nor fire elementals involved, they're both "pretty much" human.
Oh, yeah I'm sure that wouldn't be pleasant, however I'm not considering something to freaky haha. But yeah, the "fade-to-black" do feel as the best option at the moment. I'm mostly curious to know what people would appreciate most as the reader. :whistle:

Thanks!
 
Basically, the biggest questions to ask yourself are whether the sex scene is important to the story and how important it is to the story.

I've read a lot of fantasy m/m romance stories, and at least one sex scene with at least moderate detail is important to that subgenre. The relationship between the two characters is key to the story as a whole, and the sex scene can be used to show a lot about each character and how they interact. A lot of those romances will have more than one sex scene, and those scenes will be rather explicit, although there are different approaches in the subgenre and not all will have many explicit scenes. (Some trend more toward the fantasy plot throughline than toward being almost entirely only about the relationship.)

So...even in something that isn't largely a type of romance tale, a detailed sex scene can still be important to the story. Or not. Much of the time for typical fantasy fare, it's simply not important to the tale. But it could be. What are you wanting to show by including the sex scene? How two characters interact? How their interaction will play a major role in the tale as a whole? How two species come to interact in such an intimate way? How various ecologies/species function? Etc. You might have any number of reasons for including an extended scene and for how you write that scene. However, I don't think that "to make it more realistic" or "to show that all the common things in our world are common in that world" are great reasons for including such scenes. Some other purpose would be necessary to justify spending a lot of time and detail on the sex—in my opinion.


BTW, regardless of your purposes for including the scene, the scene should probably be about more than mere sex. Unless of course alien sex or even violent encounters of a sexual nature, or some similar things, are the point.
 
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Vvashjr

Minstrel
I detail my sex scenes because its integral to the development of a character, and also the catalyst of the start of a relationship with another main. I see it as no different from those romance novels out there.

Personally I don't think there are hard and fast rules about it. Even among interspecies, if you can work around the biology of it, I say go for it. I would be interested to read of how this race makes it with another(eg a centaur and a dwarf etc)
 

Thoras

Minstrel
Basically, the biggest questions to ask yourself are whether the sex scene is important to the story and how important it is to the story.

I've read a lot of fantasy m/m romance stories, and at least one sex scene with at least moderate detail is important to that subgenre. The relationship between the two characters is key to the story as a whole, and the sex scene can be used to show a lot about each character and how they interact. A lot of those romances will have more than one sex scene, and those scenes will be rather explicit, although there are different approaches in the subgenre and not all will have many explicit scenes. (Some trend more toward the fantasy plot throughline than toward being almost entirely only about the relationship.)

So...even in something that isn't largely a type of romance tale, a detailed sex scene can still be important to the story. Or not. Much of the time for typical fantasy fare, it's simply not important to the tale. But it could be. What are you wanting to show by including the sex scene? How two characters interact? How their interaction will play a major role in the tale as a whole? How two species come to interact in such an intimate way? How various ecologies/species function? Etc. You might have any number of reasons for including an extended scene and for how you write that scene. However, I don't think that "to make it more realistic" or "to show that all the common things in our world are common in that world" are great reasons for including such scenes. Some other purpose would be necessary to justify spending a lot of time and detail on the sex—in my opinion.


BTW, regardless of your purposes for including the scene, the scene should probably be about more than mere sex. Unless of course alien sex or even violent encounters of a sexual nature, or some similar things, are the point.

All right, you do make some excellent points. They come from very different cultures, and one of them are sort of a mutation or evolution of the human, therefore they are mostly the same biologically - but their culture and view on relationships vary a lot. You gave me some points to consider, as it could tell a lot about their cultural difference. Thanks!

I detail my sex scenes because its integral to the development of a character, and also the catalyst of the start of a relationship with another main. I see it as no different from those romance novels out there.

Personally I don't think there are hard and fast rules about it. Even among interspecies, if you can work around the biology of it, I say go for it. I would be interested to read of how this race makes it with another(eg a centaur and a dwarf etc)

Haha you made me laugh out loud mate, I'm not sure I would use the word "interested" to describe how I would feel about the thought of a centaur mating with a dwarf... not sure which would be worse to be honest, if the centaur being male or female... :eek:

Thanks!
 

Vvashjr

Minstrel
Haha you made me laugh out loud mate, I'm not sure I would use the word "interested" to describe how I would feel about the thought of a centaur mating with a dwarf... not sure which would be worse to be honest, if the centaur being male or female... :eek:

Thanks!
Hhahahahah personally I am always intrigued when it comes to inter-racial relationships, especially more so if neither is human, or at least one of them is not of conventional humanoid shape. No I assure you Im not a perv lol but I think its wonderful to stretch the mind or imagination or at the very least try to use science to explain in terms of fantasy. I just had an animated discussion with a close friend on the dynamics of mermaid/man reproduction with a human, and it was interesting to dissect the nuances of it
 

Thoras

Minstrel
Hhahahahah personally I am always intrigued when it comes to inter-racial relationships, especially more so if neither is human, or at least one of them is not of conventional humanoid shape. No I assure you Im not a perv lol but I think its wonderful to stretch the mind or imagination or at the very least try to use science to explain in terms of fantasy. I just had an animated discussion with a close friend on the dynamics of mermaid/man reproduction with a human, and it was interesting to dissect the nuances of it

Haha! Not judging anyone, I didn't think you were a perv, I just had a hard time pitching it as something "beautiful" hahaha :ROFLMAO:
But yeah, I'm sure there are things along those lines that would be interesting, I suppose my mind isn't fully as developed within fantastical acts of mating :LOL: Ah... the classical mermaid-and-man-question, that is something I have explored to some extent in my mind, probably like most others. Always seems to come to the same conclusion however... :whistle:
 

Vvashjr

Minstrel
Haha! Not judging anyone, I didn't think you were a perv, I just had a hard time pitching it as something "beautiful" hahaha :ROFLMAO:
But yeah, I'm sure there are things along those lines that would be interesting, I suppose my mind isn't fully as developed within fantastical acts of mating :LOL: Ah... the classical mermaid-and-man-question, that is something I have explored to some extent in my mind, probably like most others. Always seems to come to the same conclusion however... :whistle:

Our conclusion on that is hardly romantic. LOL basically you have to do as fishes do. Spawn in water and fertilise in the water!
 

Chessie2

Staff
Article Team
It depends on the tone of your novel. If it's already gritty, show it. If it's clean and tame, fade to black. Think of the audience you are writing for and how they would respond.

There are strong sex scenes in my elven romance because of the story's tone, but my historical romances are split: my clean and wholesome series has bases 1 and 2 leading up to the act, which I hardly decribe and then fade to black. My sweet historical romances are not wholesome. They have strong adult themes and the sex is more poetic, if you will. I wrote the prose to be delectable according to the theme of the books and the series in general.

So, it depends on many factors. And hey, if you need help PM me. I write sex scenes a lot, lol.
 

Insolent Lad

Maester
They say to write what you know so I avoid sex scenes. Seriously, every time I start a new project I think 'Oh, I'll go more explicit in this one' but I can't seem to find a reason to when I get there. It doesn't seem to reveal much of anything—the lead up, the pillow talk after, seems to do way more for characterization.
 
I've included sex scenes in my WIP. I agree with Chessie2 that it depends on the story as to how explicit you get. Matching the tone of the rest of the story I think is key. Otherwise your sex scene will stand out like a proverbial sore thumb. For my WIP, my rule has been to not get any more explicit than necessary to get the point across that needs to be made by including the sex scene. If it's just to say that a couple had sex, then the fade-to-black is all that's necessary. If something happens during the sex act that is needed to build character or further the plot or serve some other story purpose, then I focus on that part, and gloss over other details. I know some people prefer not to read about the sex act in their fantasy, but if you're writing adult fantasy, I think a lot of those readers will tolerate it, if it's not gratuitous.
 

Thoras

Minstrel
It depends on the tone of your novel. If it's already gritty, show it. If it's clean and tame, fade to black. Think of the audience you are writing for and how they would respond.

There are strong sex scenes in my elven romance because of the story's tone, but my historical romances are split: my clean and wholesome series has bases 1 and 2 leading up to the act, which I hardly decribe and then fade to black. My sweet historical romances are not wholesome. They have strong adult themes and the sex is more poetic, if you will. I wrote the prose to be delectable according to the theme of the books and the series in general.

So, it depends on many factors. And hey, if you need help PM me. I write sex scenes a lot, lol.

This was kind of the view I had at first, as the story is intended to be gritty, raw and 'real', therefore I thought I should show it. It's hardly clean and tame ;)

Ah thanks! I might do that! I'll be starting a new job tomorrow (besides my full time studies) so it's not likely I'll be getting much done in the coming weeks though, but if I'll ever get stuck in a dirty sex-pile, I'll absolutely PM you :D Thanks!

They say to write what you know so I avoid sex scenes. Seriously, every time I start a new project I think 'Oh, I'll go more explicit in this one' but I can't seem to find a reason to when I get there. It doesn't seem to reveal much of anything—the lead up, the pillow talk after, seems to do way more for characterization.

Yeah that's probably true, like others said earlier - if it doesn't add to the plot it's probably pointless. However "write what you know" may be true, but you can always research what you don't know. I mean, I don't know how it is to be a 25 year old woman, but I can imagine it, and research the blank spots if necessary :) Thanks!
 
I think two important guidelines apply here:

1. Leave in only what the story needs
and
2. Skip what the reader will skip anyway.

I'm not a guideliney person, but these guidelines are some i like. They help to curb some of my bad habits of pointlessly rambling.

"It's a part of life" or "It's something that people do a lot" isn't really a reason for something. We skip things like that all the time because they're not important to the story. For example, even if the hero took a long, refreshing crap prior to going out to fight the villain, we don't need the details.

That's not to say that a sex scene can't be important. Unlike the hero taking a dump, such a scene is an interaction between two characters that is likely to transform or add to their relationship. I think that's pretty important to show.

That said, I think the emotions involved and the events leading up and afterward are likely to be more revealing of character and the transformation in their relationship than the act itself. Personally, I don't want to read about body parts; I want to read about character's feelings, vulnerabilities, both the closeness and the distance between them.
 

Chessie2

Staff
Article Team
I actually disagree with the concept of "only if it's important to the story." The tone and vibe of the novel is really what matters:

-if your readers are already immersed in a gritty tale, this means they are more open to reading detailed love scenes (less room for being offended).
-love scenes by their very nature are designed to show character growth and vulnerability. It binds characters, brings them closer emotionally. Meaning, it's a positive way of developing strengths etc.
 
I actually disagree with the concept of "only if it's important to the story." The tone and vibe of the novel is really what matters:

-if your readers are already immersed in a gritty tale, this means they are more open to reading detailed love scenes (less room for being offended).
-love scenes by their very nature are designed to show character growth and vulnerability. It binds characters, brings them closer emotionally. Meaning, it's a positive way of developing strengths etc.

I kinda think that falls under "important to the story".
 

Ban

Troglodytic Trouvère
Article Team
Write it, see if it is any good and use it if it is. If it's not good, you've at least gained some experience in writing scenes like this.
 

Heliotrope

Staff
Article Team
I actually disagree with the concept of "only if it's important to the story." The tone and vibe of the novel is really what matters:

-if your readers are already immersed in a gritty tale, this means they are more open to reading detailed love scenes (less room for being offended).
-love scenes by their very nature are designed to show character growth and vulnerability. It binds characters, brings them closer emotionally. Meaning, it's a positive way of developing strengths etc.

Yeah, I agree with Chessie on this. At first I was in the "what does it serve the plot" camp.... which I think is mostly right to consider... but then I love GOT and Outlander as much as anyone and a lot of those scenes would be considered "gratuitous" or in some cases down right pornographic... but hey... it makes for good reading and viewing and serves the tone of the novel.
 
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