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Sometimes I wonder...

Mad Swede

Auror
...about the fantasy genre. I read a new review of one of my books today, and it opened with the words "This is a fantasy novel which is refreshingly free from the elves, dragons and other things which all too often populate fantasy worlds."

Hmm. Is it the reviewer who hasn't read enough fantasy stories, or are too many of the settings some of us create something of a cliché?
 
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Queshire

Istar
Hey now, different folk have different tastes. If I saw that sort of review then that's instant points off from the book for me.
 

Righmath

Troubadour
I agree with Quesh. If I read that, I'd instantly think the book was not to my liking 🤣. What was the book?
 

Devor

Fiery Keeper of the Hat
Moderator
Yeah, marks off from me, too. It's really pretentious and doesn't suggest the reviewer knows much about the wider genre.

A lot of people (myself included) come into the genre by way of D&D, and there's definitely a wing of the genre that feels like people reliving their campaigns with all the out of place storytelling quirks that come with it. So I get where it's coming from. But that's hardly the whole genre, and there's even some gems there, too.
 
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I probably both read and write in the ‘newer’ genres of fantasy, but I don’t think I’ll ever tire of elves and dragons…

I also think you can have those classic fantasty tropes and still create something that feels fresh.
 

Mad Swede

Auror
I agree with Quesh. If I read that, I'd instantly think the book was not to my liking 🤣. What was the book?
One of mine. I was a little surprised by the comment. Don't get me wrong, I deliberately choose not to focus on that side of the fantasy genre in my stories because I think you can do interesting things in a fantasy setting without having a dragon guarding a treasure horde. But maybe the reviewer has read too much bad fantasy fiction?
 

Mad Swede

Auror
Have you shared any of your work over on here MadSwede?
No, because I'm on contract with a Swedish publisher and one of the contract clauses is that they get first refusal on new stories. So far they haven't refused - which is very flattering...
 

Righmath

Troubadour
One of mine. I was a little surprised by the comment. Don't get me wrong, I deliberately choose not to focus on that side of the fantasy genre in my stories because I think you can do interesting things in a fantasy setting without having a dragon guarding a treasure horde. But maybe the reviewer has read too much bad fantasy fiction?
Perhaps, or maybe he just usually reads fiction, and liked that yours wasn't a high fantasy opera?
 
None published that you would link us to? Or are they in Swedish, I mean that would make sense given that you’re Swedish.
 

pmmg

Myth Weaver
Its a comment from one on the outside, rarely looking in.

So far, no dragons or elves in mine, but I don't promise not to have them.

Who wouldn't want dragons?
 

Mad Swede

Auror
None published that you would link us to? Or are they in Swedish, I mean that would make sense given that you’re Swedish.
They're in Swedish. We're looking for an English language publisher, but because the books aren't straight fantasy (they cross between genres) we're having trouble finding one who'll take the books.
 

Mad Swede

Auror
I wonder if Dwarves would be allowed.
This where it gets interesting. How do you describe a group of people, maybe from a specific area, who are all apparently shorter than average? Are they dwarves or just short people? What about those who are said to have some affinity with nature? Do you as the author focus on the supposed race of these characters, or do you just dump that idea and focus instead on the characters? I've always favoured a focus on the character, because I feel it gives more. But that then means I have to explain things which would otherwise be obvious if I said someone was an elf. Sure, that gives the opportunity for less clear cut explanations and the idea of sagas and folk tales in the setting, and that in itself adds depth. But it can make writing a challenge, because I have to think through so much more before I write.
 

pmmg

Myth Weaver
I have chosen to explain the races. I dont feel it was wasted space, it kind of enhances the discover process the characters (and readers, I hope) experience. But, I can't say as that is the right way.

Just another comment on the above, if the reader who made the comment found it in you, that is not a bad thing. Does not hurt to be in a category of fantasy that does not have elves or dragons. Just speaks to a perception that many have that all fantasy is Tolkien clones. It would be easy to assume that, there are a lot of Tolkien clones.
 

CrystalD

Scribe
I don’t use elves and dwarves and dragons in my fantasy, but I wouldn’t expect it not to popup in other fantasy. They aren’t off the table for my stuff, they just don’t cross my mind when I write. The thing is, they can be an elf or a fae or dwarf, but everyone’s take on their magic systems, and how those fantasy races react and interact with the world are completely different, so I don’t get why someone would be tired of seeing them in the genre when they pop up completely different in most books. It’s not always LOTR elves in every story so I don’t see the big deal.


Fantasy is the most creative genre in my opinion, so being tired of “tropes” in the genre is just weird to me. Read another subgenre of fantasy if you want, but I wouldn’t be surprised if I read epic fantasy and saw those things in the book.
 

ThinkerX

Myth Weaver
Ugh...

Empire series... I do have elves and dwarves, but mostly they're kind of low key. Goblins turn up occasionally. A couple of dragons make brief appearances towards the end of the last book in the series. I do have other extremely strange races appear now and again.

Labyrinth series...some dwarves, but elves barely even get mentioned. Some goblins and hobgoblins...and again, members of other exotic raves.

Exiles series...what I have of it at this point, anyhow...whole different situation. One human character spends most of what will likely be the first book in the series passing through lands where humans are all but unknown. Goblins, hobgoblins, Skrea (bird people). Slith (Lizard folk),Rachasa (cat people), and yes, dwarves and elves. Others settle in an area that is mostly human, but features enclaves and sizable settlements of other races.
 

Demesnedenoir

Myth Weaver
Reviews are strange... I had a reviewer once who didn't seem to know there were multi-POV novels in the fantasy universe and was confused by it. Maybe you shouldn't be reviewing this book, eh?

Of course, it was Peter Dinklage who made a similar comment in an interview before the first season of GoT on HBO, where he said it wasn't typical fantasy with dragons... rrrr, uhhhh, read the script much, Peter? That comment of his seems to have been memory holed and deleted from the internet, heh heh. Best, I'm pretty sure he claimed to have read the book.
 
Hmm. Is it the reviewer who hasn't read enough fantasy stories, or are too many of the settings some of us create something of a cliché?
It's definitely the reviewer who hasn't read enough modern fantasy tales. Most of the popular fantasy novels published in the last decade feature only (or mostly) humans. I can't find too many traditionally published novels featuring elves. There are a few with dragons, mainly because they're more animal than actual characters.
 
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