Writing the Ideal...Barbarian

[Philip Overby]

I'd like to posit these ideas every so often to maybe get other writers discussing what it takes to write your ideal version of a character type.

Barbarian-usually brutish, has little use for magic, may be from an "uncivilized" culture, good at killing things

My ideal barbarian:

1. I think Conan is one of the perfect examples of a good barbarian character and perhaps is why this type has been used so often in fantasy literature. He's the sort of "noble savage," a man who does what he must to get what he wants. Barbarians throughout history have often acted this way. I also enjoy Fritz Lieber's Fafrd character. He has an honor about him I find really interesting.

2. Is from a culture than may not be too atypical of fantasy. Often barbarians tend to be from some sort of "frozen north" or are of a Mongol horde type. My ideal barbarians would have a strong culture that they would see as superior to others. They would use intimidation over brute force. Perhaps they would have favor with some gods and would use it to terrify other people.

3. Would probably have a big a** sword. Or an obsidian club. Or a hammer made of bones. Something scary and cool. Maybe he/she would ride a giant undead jaguar or something equally horrifying.

So I have a couple of questions:

1. How would you write your ideal barbarian character?

2. What writer/writers do you think have done the barbarian character well?

3. Would you make a barbarian character a main character in your story/novel? Why or why not?

 

[Ankari]

1. Karsa Orlang. Steven Erikson's Karsa Orlang isn't a noble savage. He's a barbaric force who seeks to sever any and all chains others would wrap around his neck. He is the pure form of what we think a barbarian is, someone who wants to live outside the confines of civilization, someone who wants to be free.

2. Robert Howard's Conan was done well. But Steven Erikson's Karsa Orlang is my favorite.

3. Yes, but with hesitation. I don't want people to think that I put a different name on Conan, or tried to emulate Steven Erikson. It's hard to seek originality, but that's a good excuse if every variation of an idea has been used. The barbarian isn't. I would try to find that unique element before I decide to write a barbarian.

 

[skip.knox]

Barbarian heroes tend to be one-dimensional and they tend to provide a certain commentary on civilization. Neither of these is necessarily bad. They can serve a very important role in a story. They are rarely strong enough to carry a full novel (Fafhrd is a barbarian, but he needs the Mouser to carry the story). IMO, the barbarian hero works best either in a short story or as a supporting character.

I suppose it would be possible and interesting to create a more fleshed-out barbarian hero, but I also think that this sort of Neo-Romantic commentary on the evils of civilization doesn't carry the same resonance it once did.

My favorite barbarian of recent years has to be Khal Drogo. That character had a bit of depth (a surprising tenderness) and was certainly not a commentary on civilized society. He was there to be a natural force in command of large armies, so a more important character could succeed to them (both his strength and his armies). That was some of GRRM's better work there.

 

[Weaver]

The example I'd use of an "ideal barbarian"? Icefalcon from Barbara Hambly's Darwath novels. He's not brutish, although he would appear that way to some people because he doesn't care about all the (as he sees it) foolishness of the soft "civilized people" who live in the southern lands. His people live in a harsh environment, and they have adapted to survive there. Icefalcon himself "has no use for magic," but he has friends who are mages. And yes, he's good at killing things, but I don't see that as a particularly "barbarian" trait any more than it's a trait of any other culture.

I like Icefalcon because he doesn't fit the same mold of "barbarian" as so many characters from older sword-and-sorcery fiction. (Did you know that there was a Swordsmen and Sorcerers' Guild of America for a while?) Not that I have anything against archetypes or tropes (don't make me go on that tirade again), but some of those characters were so... flat. And unbelievable, even within the context of their own settings. Blood and thunder/thud and blunder, there's nothing else to such characters, no depth beyond 'oh, he's got lots of secret personal reasons for being all about the smashing and killing and ocasionally making out with evil sorceresses.' Except all too often the 'secret personal reasons' are just like every other stock barbarian's: he got exiled from his tribe, or they were killed by the Evil Whatever, and now he's set on revenge. And he doesn't really care that his people are gone, because he was always such a loner anyway; it's simply that seeking revenge is What One Does in such situations. He didn't actually love his dead wife; it's just that she was His Woman, and he's going to kill the Evil Whatever that stole her from him. Usually the most philosophy he ever has is "What doesn't kill me makes me stronger. The best things in life are making my enemies unhappy, like Ghengis Khan said. I like to kill stuff 'cause it makes me feel manly." After thinking that much, he has to go drink a lot of mead because his brain hurts.

This is the stereotype, and it has been done far too often. Something new, something more complex, something that didn't automatically equate a low-tech culture with dirt and brutishness and ignorance and outright disdain for learning... would be good.


If you want to get technical, a barabarian is someone with a beard. That's where the word comes form, y'know: the Romans thought those guys with facial hair were so uncivilized. (They also thought that wearing trousers was a bit uncouth, so take their opinions with a grain of salt.) By the original definition, my twin is a barbarian and I am not. My twin is "good at killing things," but I wouldn't call him uncivilized, uneducated, or even 'having no use for magic.' (He gave a really good speech once to a bunch of anthropology students about how modern medicine isn't any different from belief in magic and miracles.)

To answer your third question, I don't think I'd ever write a story with a fantasy-barbarian protagonist. The reason is simple: I'm not interested.

I second Ankari's opinion: find a unique element, instead of trying to emulate how "barbarians" have been written in the past.

 

[Steerpike]

I agree with Ankari regarding Karsa Orlong. He can sustain a novel himself (so can Conan, of course). Fafhrd and the Mouser are good examples of characters that work best together, though if I'm not mistaken there are stories of the two of them before they met in Lankhmar, where each has to carry a story on his own.

 

[skip.knox]

>If you want to get technical, a barabarian is someone with a beard. That's where the word comes form, y'know: the Romans thought those guys with facial hair were so uncivilized.


That's a natural inference, since "Barbarossa" means "red beard", but it's not correct. The root there is Latin, but the root for "barbarian" is Greek. It's onomatopoetic. My Greek history teacher said it evoked the bleating of sheep, but I've not been able to confirm that one. Basically, it was a babbling sound. The Greeks felt that everyone who did not speak Greek was babbling. The Greeks were not big on diversity.

 

[Weaver]

That's a natural inference, since "Barbarossa" means "red beard", but it's not correct. The root there is Latin, but the root for "barbarian" is Greek. It's onomatopoetic. My Greek history teacher said it evoked the bleating of sheep, but I've not been able to confirm that one. Basically, it was a babbling sound. The Greeks felt that everyone who did not speak Greek was babbling. The Greeks were not big on diversity.

And yeah, since the Romans borrowed nothing of Greek language, the word can't be related to Latin. *shakes head* I think the rest of the post may have been more relevant than an intended-as-humorous aside about linguistics, but what do I know?

 

[Feo Takahari]

I tend not to approach this type as the "barbarian", but rather as the "tribe member"--focused not on what they lack (high tech), but what they have (strong kinship bonds, emphasis on hunting, typically either animistic or totemistic religion.) I also tend not to use two elements that I've seen other people use: patriarchy (which is certainly possible, but not necessary) and opposition to magic (which doesn't make much sense to me--it seems more likely they'd have their own rituals to draw on the "power of the spirits.")

(I'll use male pronouns for brevity, but this applies just as well to female tribe members.)

To me, the central trait of the tribe member is loyalty to other members of his tribe. He may be ambivalent or hostile towards those outside the tribe, but he will help and protect the tribe as a whole, and unless they seriously piss him off, he'll help and protect the individual tribe members. (We can model this type today as the gang member--for instance, CJ in Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas demonstrates this perfectly, caring deeply for the rest of the gang while being willing to kill anyone who's not a part of it.)

The tribe member has been raised from birth in the tribe's belief system, and assuming the tribe lacks any form of the scientific method, he's probably acquired quite a few superstitions. He may thank the animals he's killed, never hunt or gather near where the dead are disposed of, or believe in a complicated myth that explains why moss grows on the north side of trees. However, this doesn't necessarily make him stupid, and his beliefs will often demonstrate a skewed understanding of something other cultures also know.

Tribe members can easily become hidebound by tradition. This isn't universal (see: the Plains Indians), but it's a common outcome of living the same way for generations on end. This leaves them vulnerable to unexpected threats, creating the need for a protagonist to deal with the problem.

 

[ThinkerX]

1. How would you write your ideal barbarian character?

I have some quasi barbarian type characters appearing towards the end of 'Labyrinth'. They don't fit the Conan, Fafhrd, or (from what I understand) Karso Orlang type.

2. What writer/writers do you think have done the barbarian character well?

If you mean the classic sword swinger, then Howard and Leiber. There are other types of barbarians, though.

3. Would you make a barbarian character a main character in your story/novel? Why or why not?

Much of the southern hemisphere of my world is plains country, roamed by a hundred or more nomadic tribes. I might feature a few of them in upcoming works, though I've nothing definite in mind. Perhaps a 'barbarian invasion of the civilized lands' type thing, as thats happened more than once in my worlds time line. Hmmm...maybe the fall of the Agban Empire...

 

[saellys]

1. How would you write your ideal barbarian character?

2. What writer/writers do you think have done the barbarian character well?

3. Would you make a barbarian character a main character in your story/novel? Why or why not?

1. The Stone Front has a whole culture of semi-assimilated barbarians. One of them is a central protagonist. While her culture is widely accepted as part of the kingdom, they still have a reputation for brutishness and the "civilized" nation-states tend to turn up their noses at them. The friction between these societies creates problems on the macro political level and the individual level for our protagonist. In the portrayals of barbarians I've enjoyed most, it's this culture clash that stuck with me afterward.

2. Richard K Morgan's Egar Dragonsbane and R. Scott Bakker's Cnaiur Urs-Skiotha are... basically the same character, but I enjoyed them both a lot.

3. Absolutely! Like I said, we're totally doing that in The Stone Front and it's hella fun. Throwing someone with different standards into the very staid classically medieval culture of the kingdom at large is a good way to add drama and conflict, and explore the prejudices of all the other characters. Plus our barbarian is just a really great character and I think she'll be a reader favorite.