Writing your own language?

[Earphone]

Do you think it's actually worth investing the copious amounts of time to create a language that will be scanned over by many readers who won't notice? (Or rather, won't find it special.)

I've been interested in developing one or two fantasy languages for myself to use, but I don't feel like there'd be much use to it, unless you were going to leave easter eggs for readers ambitious enough to translate it. Not much use, because if you're spouting other languages in your story, the reader, and very likely the protagonist, won't have a clue what the speakers are talking about.

I dunno, just a question I've had buzzing around my head for a while.

 

[Steerpike]

Unless you know what you are doing, I don't think it is worth the time. A few choice phrases here and there can add flavor, but unless you have a very good grasp on linguistics (like Tolkien, for example) it seems to me the odds are that the language created won't seem like "real" language. Instead, it will look like the author threw something together without knowing what he was doing.

So I suppose it comes down to whether you have the requisite expertise. If not, then it seems like it could do more harm than good. Again, though, a few words or phrases would work nicely, and you don't have to deal with the issues of developing an entire language in a plausible manner.

 

[Earphone]

That's kinda what I was thinking. But to me, snip-its and phrasing would seem even more out of place and implausible, if there's no structure behind them. I'd sooner hold off a language altogether, than fake it.

 

[Steerpike]

That's kinda what I was thinking. But to me, snip-its and phrasing would seem even more out of place and implausible, if there's no structure behind them. I'd sooner hold off a language altogether, than fake it.

Yeah, I think that is true if you have too many of them. But if you have the odd word here or there (say, another race's word for "magic" or something) then the lack of structure wouldn't be noticeable because you're not trying to over-extend the usage.

No harm in trying to develop the language and see how it comes out (except that it uses a lot of time you could be writing)

 

[Mindfire]

I agree with Steerpike. I tried making my own languages once. What I got was a bunch of lists of disjointed words that didn't feel in any way like a real language. Unless you're a professor of linguistics or otherwise know exactly what you're doing, making a language is a gamble at best and an epic fail at worst. Google Christopher Paolini. There are entire blogs devoted to picking apart his mistakes, linguistic or otherwise.

But to actually answer your question: should you invest time in creating a language? Yes and no. No because of the reasons I previously listed, but yes because an invented language done right can give your world some flavor. But there's a catch: we must never see the language actually spoken/written. If your language appears in written form or being spoken by the characters, then you go right back to that gamble/epic fail dichotomy. BUT! If your language never actually appears, but simply exists in the background, it'll really add depth to your story.

What do I mean by "background"? Many beginner authors use invented languages the wrong way. Rather than using your invented language to construct awkward dialogue or (even worse) stilted poetry or songs to include in your book that will certainly be a scrutiny magnet, instead your invented languages should form the foundation for name creation.

Having a language with set "rules" that all names from a certain culture come from will give your book a feeling of depth and consistency. People know a French name when they hear it. They know a Chinese name when they hear it. They know a Spanish or Italian name when they hear it. This is because languages have "tells" or "giveaways" that result from the "rules" of each language and show up in names derived from that language. Different languages rely on different syllables, letters, and vowel/consonant combos more than others. Using this phenomenon to your advantage will really flesh out your world and make it easier for readers to tell characters of different races/cultures apart.

For an example- The universe of Avatar: the Last Airbender. All the characters speak English (or whatever the viewer's language is) all the time. But their names have subtle trends.

Sokka, Katara, Hama, and Korra are all Water Tribe names and you can tell they're water tribe names. They have a similar "feel" and use similar letter combinations. The most obvious trend is the prevalence of the letters K and A. We never actually see a fictional language for the Water Tribe, but if we did, it would probably include frequent use of those letters. Similarly, look at fire nation names: Zuko, Azula, Ozai, Iroh- the letters Z and O are common.

 

[Caged Maiden]

I'm begging you not to. I once went to a con and a guy was there selling his self-published book... Now I'm not one to knock an artist's art, but his book came with a key and legend so you could translate the language the book was written in...

This is just insane, I'm sorry. I'm as supportive of inventive magic or weird monsters as the next guy, but if I have to use a separate little paper rosetta stone... it has crossed into the realm of craziness to me.

I find the very idea so self-indulgent it's almost insulting to a reader. If a person wants to create a language or an elaborate mythology or a hundred thousand sketches of their characters and world, I would never tell them it's a waste of their time... but to me, having to sift through it would be an absolute waste of my time, and I'd probably put the book down as soon as it felt like I was held captive and forced to watch someone gratify themself.

The question you'd want to ask yourself is why you are doing it. If you are trying to create an authentic feel or ambiance with native languages, well then be very selective about how you use it and in what ratio (not to mention how you are going to let a reader know what is being said). If it is because you want to, I would respectfully remind you that readers are intelligent people who are discerning enough to know when an author is being self-indulgent. If they are giving you their money, your job is to entertain them.

That being said, if you are inclined to create a language for yourself and your own enjoyment, I say do it. I sketch my characters and would never consider including those drawings in my novels. The wonderful thing about being an artist is that your creativity can take many forms and each one can bring you joy.

 

[Queshire]

Personally I wouldn't simply because the effort involved doesn't appeal to me. I think the question is, do you really want to do it, or is it just make work so you can justify putting off your writing?

 

[Devor]

If you're a linguist, and you want to make a language as a secondary hobby, and then want to put a little of it in your writing for flavor, then okay.

Anyone else, just no.

 

[Christopher Wright]

... no, that would be pure folly for me. I don't really understand all the rules for the one language I actually speak. Trying to create a new one? That way lies madness...

 

[Ghost]

The general consensus on different forums I've been on seems to be: don't do it unless you're Tolkien. To me, it's like saying you shouldn't build cultures unless you've majored in anthropology and sociology or you shouldn't describe buildings unless you've studied the history of architecture. You need to do the research, but I don't think it's necessary to be an expert to explore a certain subject.

That said, constructed languages shouldn't intrude on the reader's experience. It annoys me as a reader when the narrator's descriptions are peppered with foreign phrases. It could be a conlang, French, Latin, whatever--I don't care to see it all over the novel.

Naming languages give you better returns. You get some of the flavor without the investment of weeks, months or years. Trying to create a language can take away from writing time, but so can drawing character sketches or creating family trees. You've got to decide whether it suits your purposes and if the conlang adds to your lore or drowns it in minutiae.

I think everyone has their pet projects in their fantasy worlds: clothing, military/fighting, art, zoology, religion, magic systems, government, etc. While I don't think you should focus on the side project to the exclusion of everything else, I think it's fine to emphasize it when it fits the story. Just beware of shoehorning it into the narrative to show off your creations (ie putting conlang poetry or dialog into the novel). Personally, I don't think "easter eggs for readers ambitious enough to translate it" is a good reason to create a language.

We've got a conlanging group, but it's kind of dead. :skull:

 

[Earphone]

Well, in truth the idea of creating a new language (for me) would simply be for fun, and also (as others mentioned) naming convention. I'm big into creating fantasy names, and I'm super super big into making my own fantasy races. I want languages/cultures there to set them apart from the rest of the world; to make them unique. I wouldn't want to have it to thrust down others' throats, (as that's a big pet peeve of mine) but merely for the knowledge that it's there. (And yes, it is hindering my writing... Not that I'm working on the languages either.)

Thanks a lot for the words so far guys, it's always great to converse with other writers.

 

[Ophiucha]

I took two years of linguistics courses and at least a year of five foreign languages and I still find conlangs to be rather daunting. I barely even suck up the will to come up with naming conventions for all the cultures of my world. I suppose that is ultimately my problem... I have three or four novels in various stages of production, and no less than eight theoretical languages in one of them. If I created a language for all of them, I'd be dead before I finished Chapter One of any of 'em.

But... I mean, I love linguistics. I find language to be interesting and language creation is fun. And, really, I don't think conlanging is necessarily any more of a waste of time as any other aspect of worldbuilding. There are people who spend six years developing a world's theology, which I'm sure is great for them and their religious studies degrees and religious characters, but here I am writing predominantly atheist characters and I barely give it more than a week's thought. If you think making a language sounds fun, there's no reason not to do it. Just don't let it get in the way of your other hobbies... like writing, for instance.

 

[Joshua Allen Mercier]

Hello Earphone,

Honestly, I say ignore the numerous replies in the negative realm of things and go for it. But be cautious, educated, and tactical. Knowing how to incorporate a language into your writing is an art, and can be a failure if done wrong, but doing it with poise and a bit of stealth usually lends itself to a time-treasured masterpiece like the works of Tolkien or Herbert.

I am currently running a World-Building Series of posts on my blog, with a great number of them dealing with Language Construction.

Best,

Joshua A. Mercier

 

[Hans]

I like to have some minor characters having a consistent accent, or using short phrases in their native language. For that I have to know the basic structures (word building rules, basic grammar and so on) of that language.
But writing longer texts in an invented language? I cant even do that in English and have been trying to learn that language for over a quarter century now.
Inventing languages is fun. But if you need a language for a single story don't overdo it. It is a lot of work to make a good language. (Simple to invent some words. Harder when they should sound like one consistent language. Real work when you start thinking about word families and derivations.)

Also it really annoys the readers when you have a mayor character speaking an accent.

 

[Anders Ämting]

Do you think it's actually worth investing the copious amounts of time to create a language that will be scanned over by many readers who won't notice? (Or rather, won't find it special.)

I've been interested in developing one or two fantasy languages for myself to use, but I don't feel like there'd be much use to it, unless you were going to leave easter eggs for readers ambitious enough to translate it. Not much use, because if you're spouting other languages in your story, the reader, and very likely the protagonist, won't have a clue what the speakers are talking about.

I dunno, just a question I've had buzzing around my head for a while.

I don't think it's necessary to invent an entire new language, but if your story features a fictional language, I do think keeping it consistant is important. You'll want to keep track of all the words you use and have a basic idea of the grammar, your subjects and objects and verbs, how the words relate to each other and the general sound of the language. Not everyone is going to notice that but for those who do, the language will feel realistic.

On the other hand, if you just make something up at random and don't pay any mind to the structure, those same people will notice that and lose their suspesion of disbelief.

 

[studentofrhythm]

The general consensus on different forums I've been on seems to be: don't do it unless you're Tolkien. To me, it's like saying you shouldn't build cultures unless you've majored in anthropology and sociology or you shouldn't describe buildings unless you've studied the history of architecture. You need to do the research, but I don't think it's necessary to be an expert to explore a certain subject.

Hear, hear! (Or, "see, see!"?) But it's true, you do need to learn enough to pull things off convincingly. I started making short naming languages about six years ago, and from the start it proved to demand more attention than I imagined. For starters: are these roots or stems? What's the order of sticking them together? If you do a quick and easy naming language, you're likely to go along with the grammar rules in your native language in how you put the names together. That's fine if all you want is a system of names that doesn't look cliched.

It's true that working on conlangs can take you away from actually writing your novel, but I have found it necessary to refine a lot of grammar rules in order to give my character names the detail and sense that will satisfy me. I figure that if a guy like M.A.R. Barker can attract a loyal readership, there ought to be plenty of folks out there who will in fact greet a novel full of conlang stuff with delight.

 

[shangrila]

Writing a book in an entirely made up language would be stupid, but if you're just using it for naming and the odd word then I think it's fine.

 

[Caliburn]

Yeah like Ophiucha said: if its something you get a kick out and the time factor doesn't worry you, then I would definitely consider it.

Aside from verisimilitude, I think one of the big benefits that comes from developing your own language is that it allows you to easily come up with unique names and terminology with a consistent stylistic tone. Most importantly, the words have a decipherable meaning (since you can include a language guide), which some people get a real kick out of. If you are like me and simply need to have your names to mean something as well as sound the part, then you might appreciate that.

An option I am considering at the moment is devising a language to replace the common tongue in my setting. This wouldn't mean that the stories are written in the language, of course, but simply that all important nouns (such as city names, races, characters etc) are expressed in that language. Less common languages would exist, but would be limited to occasional words and phrases.

Of course, it takes a LOT of effort to make up a completely original language. Another option is to find an obsolete or obscure world language and either use it as it or edit it. Basically, if it isn't one of the more common languages spoken today, it will sound exotic to people, which is all I am after personally

 

[studentofrhythm]

When I started work on my setting in earnest 10 years ago, I took real languages and tweaked them a bit. I speak Spanish and used to speak Russian, so it wasn't hard to put together some slightly off Romance and Slavic variants of names or even short phrases (there should still be Yahoo groups devoted to Romance and Slavic conlangs). Even if you only speak English, you can have lots of fun with other Germanic languages. I was putting a Gothic lexicon through some systematic sound changes and came up with something that looked pretty nifty.

But as the song "Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious" warns: "better use it carefully or it can change your life."

I wonder how many conlangers successfully offer their services to authors? I'd do it, if someone wanted to pay me.

 

[Caliburn]

Thanks for the tip! I barely know anything about conlanging, so I plan on starting with an existing language myself. I'm hoping I can just get it to a point where I am happy enough with it, which is difficult because you can always go "what if I did it like this instead? Ah, this one's way better. I guess I'll just scrap the old system and start over..."
Knowing when to stop can seem impossible to me sometimes!

Maybe conlangers could be to world-builders like colourists are to comic book artists? That would be neat.
Often when I think of writing I just think "writer" and don't imagine any other roles or specialisations within that discipline.

I for one, would love to hire a professional name-smith. I spend a hugely disproportionate amount of time trying to come up with interesting names/nouns/terms. I still enjoy it, but it doesn't come anywhere near as easily as, say, story concepts.
In fact, most of my research work at the moment has been devoted to name creation.