Embarassing situations

[Karlin]

Two events:

1. We had a guest over for dinner, someone we've known for a year or so. He gave us as a gift a book of his poems. Self published. After he left, I read some. And they were not good. At least not for me. I managed to find one that I could say something interesting about, so next time I see him, it won'tbe totally awkward.

2. I was at a wedding, and happened to sit next to another writer. Got a link, bought her book (kindle version), started reading, and didn't bother finishing it. Ouch. fortunately, she is not in my normal social circles.

Have you ever had this experience?

 

[The Dark One]

As a person who's had a few books published I get asked for advice all the time - which I'm happy to give - but I always draw the line when people ask me to read their stuff and give feedback.

Partly, because I have agreed to read stuff in the past and it was pretty much crap across the board. Me being me, I then told them what I thought and upset a few... sigh. Thing is, you'll never improve if you can't listen to constructive feedback and to not tell them exactly what you thought is letting them down.

The way I fob people (especially first time writers) off these days is to say: "Look, I'm tremendously busy right now on my own projects and don't have time to be distracted. But you really don't want my feedback in any case because I tend to be fairly brutal. I always say what I really think and some people can't handle that."

If they try to assure me that they can definitely handle brutal reality, I then say: "Okay ... try me again in a few months when I might have a bit more time but, without having seen any of your work, I can say with full confidence that it is unlikely to be any good."

They look at me in horror...

"That's no reflection on you," I continue. "It's simply an axiom that it takes a really long time to become a decent writer. You can only truly learn how to write a novel by writing a novel and it'll probably take you at least three attempts before you learn all the fundamentals of plotting, characterisation, world building, pacing etc. You may well have some native talent as a writer but talent is not enough. You need to learn the craft of storytelling and that takes time. Lots of time."

By now they've either flounced off in a flood of tears or simply stopped listening. No-one copping that spiel has ever asked me again.

What I'm basically doing is managing expectations (and saving myself embarrassment and angst).

 

[Karlin]

I understand. Honestly, I'm not doing what i am supposed to do on this forum. Namely, crtique other's writing. Much is difficult to read. Or requires so much feedback that it's a real effort. I'm glad others take the time.

 

[Mad Swede]

As a published author, being asked to read other people's unpublished stories is something I get asked sometimes and I always refuse. In my case it's because I'm dyslexic so I really don't have time to do the reading. Most people are quite happy when I explain. I also don't comment on works by other published authors, as a matter of courtesy.

I do act as a peer reviewer for some academic papers, and that isn't the same as giving feedback to an unpublished writer. For one thing, that sort of reviewing is supposed to be critical, because you're trying to ensure that the paper being reviewed is academically robust and can withstand scrutiny by others. It's especially important when the paper is presenting something new or controversial.

It can be very hard to give criticism to another writer, especially if they've never been published. Writing is often so very personal that giving feedback and hence implicitly (even if unintentionally) questioning or criticising the author and the way they write is all too often taken as an insult or a personal attack. People don't understand (or won't accept) that writing well takes time and a lot of practice, it isn't just a question of getting it down on paper and clicking to publish it on Amazon.

This is why some new writers find it so hard to work with editors, because the editor's job is to pull your work apart and improve it ahead of publication. Having been through it myself I'm well aware of how hard the editing process is, and I'm also aware that it doesn't get any easier as you publish more books simply because your increasing experience also results in higher expectations.

A reluctance to accept criticism can make acting as beta reader hard too, because then you're trying to balance honest criticism whilst not treading on the authors toes too hard. I admire those who are willing to act as beta readers, because I don't have the time (given my dyslexia) and probably wouldn't have the patience to do so.

 

[Genly]

I do act as a peer reviewer for some academic papers, and that isn't the same as giving feedback to an unpublished writer. For one thing, that sort of reviewing is supposed to be critical, because you're trying to ensure that the paper being reviewed is academically robust and can withstand scrutiny by others. It's especially important when the paper is presenting something new or controversial.

Interesting point. I do this as well, and as reviewers we are required to be as critical as we can be without becoming abusive or insulting (or sarcastic, which is sometimes the same thing). This works both ways, as when I submit a scientific paper for publication, I fully expect it to be pulled apart by reviewers so that then I can put it back together when I revise it.

I guess that having gone through this process many times, it might have made me more receptive to constructive criticism, in the sense that I treat it as something normal and not something to get upset about. This has been a useful preparation for trying to publish fiction, where the rejection rate is a lot higher than it is for scientific papers. This is why I always ask beta readers of my work to be as critical as they like, because a publisher certainly will be.

Now having said this, I get what you are saying about being reluctant to give feedback to unpublished writers. It's sometimes hard on both the writer and the reviewer.