"A Big Picture Ripe With Possibilities"

[_Michael_]

Was reading the 2012 edition of the Kobold Guide to World Building the other day, and I came across a quote from Chris Pramas as he was discussing Gary Gygax (Kenosha Alumni! Woo!) and his approach in how the Greyhawk world was designed.

"Gary did not want his players learning too much about its secrets, so he made some major changes (like creating a brand new map) and made up a bunch of new material. What he provided in the folio (and the later 1983 boxed set) was a big picture that was ripe with possibilities...The nations are painted in broad strokes. The boxed set includes a section on the gods and cosmology. And there is history there. Gary describes the migrations of peoples, ancient wars, and apocalyptic events to set the stage for the modern Greyhawk. There is also plenty of mystery in the setting as described, to leave room for further development or just to give GMs ideas for adventures."

I love that last line. "...to leave room for further development or just to give GMs ideas for adventures."

I cannot stress how amazing that line was because as soon as I read it, I was like, "Hey! That's what I'm trying to build!" Literally a framework for an idea generator that others can use to easily flesh out new stories and adventures and locations and creatures. For me, the framework is a reassuring ruleset that I can work within to maximize creativity. Even as I lay out maps, I'm already thinking of such things as "...the migrations of peoples, ancient wars, and apocalyptic events to set the stage." I can see all the connections lighting up as I lay things out.

My ultimate goal, of course, is a world system that I can invite others to use who will take my ideas and expand on them further. I get some game worlds are designed for specific purposes. Novelists design reams of background lore that never get put into their finished books as a way to flesh out their story. GMs design adventures to run their characters through without reallly concerning themselves about lore and history they may never use--it's nice to have, but not necessary. Gary Gygax designed his world piecemeal, with only small portions revealed at a time, but left vague enough to allow GMs to create their own supplemental material within the framework of established lore.

However, for those who have the time, the outside-in method of world building is, to me, the most rewarding as it allows one to create the whole in vague fashion, leaving just enough conflict and mystery to fire the imagination and give the reader enough material to put their own ideas in. Does anyone else design like this anymore? I sometimes feel like I'm the only one shouting into an empty echo chamber because everything these days is high magic, over-the-top fantasy in which everyone is a half-dragon paladin that starts with a vorpal sword and a fully-formed knowledge of every possible danger in existence. The Greyhawks are no longer around--worlds in which magic takes a back seat to actual fantasy and plot development, where things are solved not with ridiculous magical deus ex machina, but actual logic and cleverness.

Curious to hear what others have experienced when attempting to design such an idea generator in the form of a fantasy world. Is there a way to successfully market such a thing? I get that it's already geared towards modular releases by nature of its creation, but profit isn't the concern, and I'd release it all in a giant almanac if I could. If I have my way, my setting will be a thousand-page tome with dozens of fold out maps and ten thousand plot hooks.

 

[Devor]

I sometimes feel like I'm the only one shouting into an empty echo chamber because everything these days is high magic, over-the-top fantasy in which everyone is a half-dragon paladin that starts with a vorpal sword and a fully-formed knowledge of every possible danger in existence. The Greyhawks are no longer around--worlds in which magic takes a back seat to actual fantasy and plot development, where things are solved not with ridiculous magical deus ex machina, but actual logic and cleverness.

So, I thought I understood the OP except for this part. I would think you can create a backdrop world for a high magic setting just as easily as a low magic setting.

A few of us had this idea for an RP forum game setting where a "typical" fantasy world suddenly had a massive continent being gradually teleported into the middle of its ocean, coming in from another world. The idea was to have different contributors write about different colonies that people were setting up on the incoming continent, with people from the old setting mixing with people already there on the continent, and then force those colonies to occasionally react to the next thing that comes through on the continent, whether it was a dessert full of monsters or the capitol of an empire. Then, of course, there's the mystery of why the continent was coming in at all, as well as bits and pieces of the turmoil that's still happening on the other side. Lots of room for intrigue, drama, surprise, and stories of all kinds. People who've come through early on, waiting for the next town to emerge where their family lives, only to find... well, that story happens. Or one of the colonies is kind of brutal to the people of the continent, only to find those people have an army in an unassailable fortress come through next.

But, to get back to the point.... it's not enough to write a setting's encyclopedia. If you want people to contribute big and cool ideas based in your world, it's not a worldbuilding challenge. It's a design one. And a community challenge. You have to create the mechanisms which invite people to build on it with their own ideas. Although we didn't manage to follow through, in our example, the mechanism was supposed to be the ongoing events as new features emerged on the continent, pushing contributors to update their colonies in response, while also providing new features that could attract new contributors.

Was any of that helpful to you?

 

[_Michael_]

I think I have that sort of thing in my game...maybe? Basically in mine, I have this forgotten past that was once high-technology and magic, but there's bits and pieces of history and lore to be found all over. There's also the ever-present threat of the return of the Protea (the magical clockwork machines that turn on their creators--on the sister planet--and send down occasional seed ships) to present an existential threat that offers a whimsical bit of technology that can be incorporated into a party's make-up, if they can wrest it free. The main driving force for encouraging discovery is the High Council and the Arcanum which will pay bounties on discoveries, as well as be a check on overly ambitious mages who think to use such old world artifacts to lay waste to entire kingdoms, especially by trying to re-engineer old Protean devices.

In between all that is supposed to be this vast land that is dotted with old ruins and curious geography, only vaguely filled in with small details. On top of which (or inside of) is Orphalis, a hollow-earth setting I'm going to pattern after Edgar Rice Burroughs' Pellucidar, that already has a few creatures coming up through the Evergloom to inhabit the lower subterranean areas. The main focus, however, is on the surface and the intersection of magic and technology that is offered by finding old world devices. I was inspired a bit by the old Dragon magazines that featured the machine mages as found in #258 and #270. lol Thought it was a great premise.

 

[Demesnedenoir]

My world is too big to be 100% fleshed out, so it is broad-brushed in various regions. I know a lot, but it's not canon until I publish it.

 

[_Michael_]

We always seem to generate way more than we need unless you have one of those bards who wants to know all the salient details about some obscure kingdom.

My idea was to write it all out as a sort of almanac published by the Arcanum for those who can read to benefit from it, in what is basically just an information-dense idea generator. That's why I love that line. A big picture ripe with possibilities.

How do you go about it, though? Do you do the maps first? Or the information? I prefer the maps first since I can get an idea of where kingdoms would most likely end up by looking at the geography.

 

[Demesnedenoir]

General ideas and concepts, the broad strokes of what I needed the world to be, then map, then fill in.

 

[ThinkerX]

My world(s) have entire regions - major countries thousands of miles across with hundreds or even thousands of years of history that barely rate a mention in the main novels. Some of them are explored a bit in shorter stories, but there are plenty of 'blank spots.'

I took a similar approach to the protracted Traag War that shaped the primary nation. Most epic fantasy war tales focus on the exploits of a few major characters, with the rest seemingly there to die in droves. My heroes were present - but they had only hazy ideas of what was happening, even during battle - their world was reduced to their immediate surroundings. And I have many minor characters with war stories of their own.

 

[_Michael_]

Have you been tempted to fill in more details to generate new stories?

 

[ThinkerX]

Have you been tempted to fill in more details to generate new stories?

Sometimes.

Mostly, though, I take the bits and pieces I do know about a given area and fill in the blanks with short stories. I put myself in the shoes of someone who was present at or played a role in a key event in that part of the world. Because ultimately. it is about the people.

 

[_Michael_]

Do you leave plot hooks and interesting places for later exploration? I tend to drop in interesting places with a note and then abandon them until later on, especially when I'm designing major regions. Have you ever thought about releasing an atlas like what was done with other series of books, like Wheel of Time or the Thomas Covenant Chronicles, just so your readers can enjoy some background?

I think the Tales From Mos Eisley and Tales From Jabba's Palace books spoiled me--I love background detail and characters because it becomes more a situation where I watch the movies again and I'm like, "Wait, I know that guy!" Same thing going on in world building where I establish this pool of potentials I can draw from, and it's surprising to recall old details I can roll in, without breaking the canon. I get that same energy. As I design, I see connections to other bits I've already established, and it's like even more connections and possibilities open up. It keeps growing.

 

[ThinkerX]

Do you leave plot hooks and interesting places for later exploration? I tend to drop in interesting places with a note and then abandon them until later on, especially when I'm designing major regions. Have you ever thought about releasing an atlas like what was done with other series of books, like Wheel of Time or the Thomas Covenant Chronicles, just so your readers can enjoy some background?

I think the Tales From Mos Eisley and Tales From Jabba's Palace books spoiled me--I love background detail and characters because it becomes more of a situation where I watch the movies again and I'm like, "Wait, I know that guy!" The same thing goes on in world-building where I establish this pool of potentials I can draw from, and it's surprising to recall old details I can roll in, without breaking the canon. I get that same energy. As I design, I see connections to other bits I've already established, and it's like even more connections and possibilities open up. It keeps growing.

Yes, those are all through the published and unpublished stories alike.

The Agba Empire, once a puppet state of the utterly alien Old Races before their implosion, is mentioned repeatedly throughout the 'Empire' series (and there is an unpublished tale or two set in that now-fallen realm. Celthania, once a vassal/ally of Agba gets repeated mentions. Likewise, the quasi-oriental realm of Chou is mentioned several times (and there is a flashback sequence of sorts set in that nation's past) - but that is about it.

Celthania gets briefly visited in 'Labyrinth' (which I hope to publish this year) and is the setting for an unpublished short story or two. Characters from that sophisticated and treacherous realm visit other parts of the world - and beyond.

Speaking of beyond...I currently have tales of varying lengths set in three other worlds.


'Dagon's World' is a barely habitable rock at the edge of the galaxy, dominated by a huge plateau with a toxic atmosphere. Breathable air and water are found at the bottom of huge craters two-plus miles deep - but even then, it is on the thin side. The largest of these craters is the Alar Basin, dominated by a pair of monster-infested lakes. Ruling over this realm is Dagon the Devourer, a Lovecraftian abomination, presiding over the ancient alien city of Carcosa through his puppet, the King in Yellow. About half of 'Empire: Spiral' is set in this world and it gets mentioned elsewhere.

Aquas or the 'Refuge World' is covered by a world-spanning ocean. There are a couple of 'normal' continents and a few big archipelagoes, but the main landmass is the Strand, a ribbon of land that wraps completely around the planet on a rough NE/SW axis. It is 24,000+ miles long but is mostly only a few dozen miles wide. All manner of races, nations, city-states, tribes, and outposts are found on the Strand. Especially noteworthy are the Pilgrim Shrines, set roughly a thousand miles apart, each a nexus of mystic power. That world gets partly explored in 'Exile's Pilgrimage' slated for release sometime this year.

Then there is the 'Eldritch World,' a tilted and tidally locked planet that still retains a 30-hour rotation period. The further north you go, the longer the day and the hotter it gets. Go too far south and the daylight vanishes completely at the fringes of a dark, frozen wasteland. Right now, there are only a few unpublished short stories set on this world.