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Dissatisfaction in my work

TheokinsJ

Troubadour
I've read a lot of advice above saying, "Just finish your work."

I'm inferring that this admonition is meant to be heeded regardless of circumstances, and I'm not sure I agree.

To the OP:

Where are you in your writing career? Are you good enough to know that what you're producing is or isn't complete crap?

At some point, your focus needs to be on finishing new material. Until you get to a stage where you can produce good material, finishing, imo, isn't any better than not finishing.

I've long advocated that:

1. Write something
2. Get feedback
3. Revise based on that feedback
4. Go back to step 2

is the path to improvement.

Basically, to me, your initial post didn't provide enough information to answer the question. Do you need to focus on finishing or on improvement?

In terms of my writing skill, I believe my writing is pretty good, it's not perfect- no one's is, but it's not so much my writing that I want to focus on, it's more on finishing and actually making progress with the story, rather than editing whilst writing.
 
Well, there we go.

We've had the same argument in way too many threads now, in my opinion. In the end, it's what the writer wants that matters.

Saying that, I'll sneak in my opinion.
Your writing is going to improve as you write, as T Allen Smith said, and if the improvement is reflected in the later part of the story rather than just after revising an isolated part of the novel that you haven't been able to progress past.

For a young and new writer, I'd say that finishing the work is the desired goal. Our writing may suck, but it isn't going to get all that much better if we shred and rip apart one scene that we wrote, rather than going on with the story.
Improvement follows writing, that much is true, and for a young and fresh writer, maybe progressing is the best option. The different nuances (is that the right word?) of writing will accumulate and develop over time, with a finished draft and plot to boot.
 

Guru Coyote

Archmage
There's another argument to be made for the importance of finishing:
It gives you something to show to others. Sounds obvious but consider this:
1. Write
2. Get feedback
3. incorporate the feedback
4. Repeat
... is the accepted formula for improving one's skills. For step 2.) Get feedback, you need to have something that people will want to read, esp if you are going to rely on them to do this repeatedly. A finished story will do that. Feeding your test-audience with only fragments will not help.

Another thing about this process of steps is that it helps the learning AND the motivation to keep the loop fairly tight. One of the big frustrations of writing is the extended periods of isolated work without feedback. Hmmm.... Actually, that argument could be used to champion handing out your WiP in chunks, chapter by chapter.... oh well.
 
The ability to finish a novel is one of the things beginning writers need to practice. It brings with it the ability to practice writing a good ending, the ability to practice maintaining interest and persistence through the middle, the knowledge of what you do when you write yourself into a corner or something odd happens you didn't intend, the ability to balance the needs of two or more plot threads at once , and the ability to create a whole work, finished to the best degree the writer can manage at the time. None of these things can be practiced without actually doing them. You want to practice the skill of finishing your novels, you have to finish your novels.
 

Jhunter

Dreamer
I am plagued by something similar. I can't write a chapter without editing it once I am done. I write a chapter, then edit the chapter every time.
 

Guru Coyote

Archmage
I am plagued by something similar. I can't write a chapter without editing it once I am done. I write a chapter, then edit the chapter every time.

That's not so bad... as long as it doesn't turn into an infinite loop! I, for one, also try to write/edit in relatively short intervals, simply because I know... once I finish it, I may not touch it again. The TRICK is keep on pushing the story forward also. What the OP described sounded more like creating an infinite loop of revision the same material over and over.

I'd argue that as long as there is forward movement, going back from time to time is ok. Two steps ahead, one back. That ok, it just means it will take longer. But you will eventually finish.
 

Jhunter

Dreamer
That's not so bad... as long as it doesn't turn into an infinite loop! I, for one, also try to write/edit in relatively short intervals, simply because I know... once I finish it, I may not touch it again. The TRICK is keep on pushing the story forward also. What the OP described sounded more like creating an infinite loop of revision the same material over and over.

I'd argue that as long as there is forward movement, going back from time to time is ok. Two steps ahead, one back. That ok, it just means it will take longer. But you will eventually finish.


Yeah, It doesn't turn into an infinite loop, that is for sure. Though, I do have a tendency to copy edit the chapters as well.
 

skip.knox

toujours gai, archie
Moderator
I am plagued by something similar. I can't write a chapter without editing it once I am done. I write a chapter, then edit the chapter every time.

Lucky! I can't even write a chapter, first time out of the gate. I write scenes. This one goes "somewhere near the start, maybe the first but I don't really know yet and heck I don't even know if I'll even keep one of the characters". Another one feels like it goes near the end but maybe it won't because if I start the novel over here then that puts it more like the middle and ....

It doesn't even start to look like a chapter until well into the process. Every once in a while I'll get something that feels really self-contained and it turns out to be of proper length to make a chapter, but frankly I'm mystified by writers who can somehow magically start at the beginning and move forward chapter by chapter.

And yes I do outline. The bloody outline is as fluid as the writing. Fluider!
:p
 
Same here. It's simply wondrous how people write in chapters to me. I was starting to think I was doing something wrong... And yes, the parts I write are outlined.

Considering that I write in a notebook, and the only way I can edit is with a red pen (or green, or yellow), I find it a highly unattractive prospect. I'm a fan of not editing till you finish, though, so it works out well. Can't see anything wrong with editing a teensy bit as long as you go on with the story. Wouldn't be a problem then.

Chapters are overrated in my opinion; there's plenty of time to divide the story later on when you've finished. It would be arduous going to all the trouble of going by the story in fixed chapters to me. Better to just gather it up in a huge glob first, and see to the chapters afterwards. Or maybe that's just me being lazy. But I can't foresee my story ahead of what I've already written in terms of chapters and fixed divisions. So what I do seems reasonable.
 

Guru Coyote

Archmage
Writing in disjointed scenes... yes, I do that too. At least at first, when the story is not yet well formed. I often start with a document where I just jot down anything that comes to mind... fragments of scenes, dialogue, facts I want to convey... sometimes I'll just keep writing scenes as they come to me, not worrying about proper order or over all story. Later... I'll sit down with all these scraps of story and see how they fit together, how I can arrange them to form a whole.

Sometimes, all of the above happens in my head, no actual writing involved. The story forms over days... and then I can just sit down and write an outline and actually write the story from start to end. But note: just because I write it from start to end according to my outline does not mean that's how it came to be... it started as a cloud of ideas!

[Update:] Some years ago, I wrote about this in terms of using Tinderbox... The general idea applies to anything though (you can do this with PostIts or in your head)
Traumwind - Tinderbox: going from cloud to text
 
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Jhunter

Dreamer
I have a broad outline for my series as a whole, as well as outlines for random cool scene ideas that I will stick in future chapters (I randomly think of cool scenes all the time, so I jot down a fast outline for them when it happens). But, I without a doubt, have complete outlines for my chapters before I write them. I know exactly what is going into them--at least the next six or so. After that I have to spend a few days outlining the rest. I do change things frequently though, my initial chapter outlines are far from perfect. I should also point out that my chapter outlines are kind of broad, I know the main elements and key scenes, but I discovery write at least 50% of them.

A big reason I have so many chapters planned already is because I have had to re-write this manuscript dozens of times--because I suck, haha. I have learned a lot over the past two years. But, while I did my many re-writes, I still kept planning the rest of the book and series. So it has left me a little ahead now that I have found my voice and style. My current re-write should be the last one before I go full steam on finishing the book.
 
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Nobby

Sage
Nothing you write is ever "done" in my opinion.

Just charge on until you can charge no more. If that is the end of a tale, then god bless you.

Then you can break your head on nibbling at the (perceived) faults :)
 

Addison

Auror
Heck even when a book is published it isn't done. Every time a reader picks it up and reads it they are engaged. They day dream about being in the book, their own adventures with the characters. The book grows inside them and through to others.
 
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