Character Morality through Ideals

[SirenSon117]

I haven't gotten to actually writing down manuscripts, much to my dismay there's simply too much work to be done in pre-writing and I keep adding more onto that load, but thing I know for certain I want to do with characterization is to abandon the black and white "good versus evil" structure and instead adopt a more realistic and interesting structure of "people with ideals". Basically every character, no matter their relevance to the main plot, has some kind of philosophy, goal/dream. or other kind of guiding principle that determines how they behave. For example: Friederick Edelweiss would be a conventional Hercules-type hero, the strong man who protects others around him. There are two flaws in the way of that though: 1, Friederick is selfish about how he uses his incredible power and he prefers to continue developing his strength for future battles rather than fight opponents that are below him. He wants a match against someone on his level, but those kinds of people are hard to find and Freiderick has gotten his Elven behind handed to him twice, being humiliated both times, as karmic punishment for not helping the little guy when he could've. 2, Friederick was raised by a psychopath obsessed with noble title and then was raised again by a sentient wolf. Said wolf quite literally, "beat the weakness out of him" turning Freiderick into the strongman that he is and setting towards the plot. Because of his experience both being deathly ill prior to having said illness cured seemingly through training from hell, and then going through going through training from hell, and then also being an Elf and having the whole "communing with nature" ability that Elves have, Friederick Edelweiss is somewhat of a social darwinist, believing that the laws of the wilderness apply to literally everything. We see echoes of this "naturalistic" mentality in Freiderick's granddaughter Amelie Edelweiss, who admires Frederick and puts him on a pedestal but ultimately throughout her story comes to the realization that nature is separate from society and that's maybe, possibly a good thing. What I'm trying to get at here with this somewhat complex example is that here we have a character who: 1, is a protagonist by virtue of being the lens of the story rather than being "the goodest of boys" or "the chosen one"(ick). 2, is characterized largely via their ideology and how that ideology is presented. and 3, further characterization influences and is influenced by character dynamics. My goal is to create complex characters that reader will like to critique and analyze. My ultimate goal is for the different ways of thinking presented by these characters to perhaps influence a reader and make them rethink how they view things in their life. I may have given a bad example with Frederick but I'd still like feedback on this idea of characterization nonetheless!

 

[pmmg]

Well, first...I think you give short thrift to characters of a more black and white nature, calling them unrealistic and uninteresting and implying they have no dreams or goals. It may not be what you prefer, but they are plenty capable of being interesting, realistic and having complexity.

Without a story, Friederick is just a character write up. What is his story? And what is his conflict?

You can write compelling characters stories, both in grey tones or black and white. I think part of the key to it is to show his struggles, his flaws, his triumphs, and the things he believes that are not true. He should grow as a character, and the journey he is on should should change him. If he begins with one set of beliefs he should end with a changed perspective, or a reason that strengthens them.

My ultimate goal is for the different ways of thinking presented by these characters to perhaps influence a reader and make them rethink how they view things in their life.

That feels like a tall order. One must first have something to say, have an understanding of what the reader believes that they want to take issue with, compete against their thinking, and be the more right about it. Good luck with that.

 

[Queshire]

A reader can take inspiration and reframe how they think about things from the smallest thing. Yeah, you can't count on being able to blow everyone's minds, but aiming for it isn't a bad thing.

Now, as the protagonist the audience is going to be naturally predisposed towards Fredrick. Hell, I've seen protagonists that have used prisoners to test out new poisons or as food beds to breed carnivorous insects that remain the "good" guys. There's a lot of appeal in being able to act out your darker emotions in a safe way.

I think that one of your most useful tools will be to have the protagonists lose now and again. Have them make all the "right" choices that the audience is trained to expect and still lose. That'll help pull the rug out from under the audience and signal to them that there's something more complicated going on here.

 

[SirenSon117]

A reader can take inspiration and reframe how they think about things from the smallest thing. Yeah, you can't count on being able to blow everyone's minds, but aiming for it isn't a bad thing.

Now, as the protagonist the audience is going to be naturally predisposed towards Fredrick. Hell, I've seen protagonists that have used prisoners to test out new poisons or as food beds to breed carnivorous insects that remain the "good" guys. There's a lot of appeal in being able to act out your darker emotions in a safe way.

I think that one of your most useful tools will be to have the protagonists lose now and again. Have them make all the "right" choices that the audience is trained to expect and still lose. That'll help pull the rug out from under the audience and signal to them that there's something more complicated going on here.

Duly noted. Freiderick does have good qualities too, a sense of honor rooted is his big one and the desire to look out for his family, while a common redeeming quality I use, is strong in Friederick. I should mention that Friederick isn't the only protag of the story either. The story he's part of is a Jojo's Bizarre Adventure like narrative that goes down a family tree, in this case a group of characters called the House of Edelweiss. The first half of the story deals in the conflict between Humans Versus Elves, taking the perspective of the Elves defending their home from Human conquest and ultimately losing the war to defend their nation against Humanity. The Second half of the story takes place years after the war and deals with how the Elves have adapted to their new lives among Mankind.. The main villains of the second half are a group called the Peacebringers, a group of truly reprehensible mad scientists and militants who believe that existence is suffering and peace can only be achieved by returning to a state of oblivion.