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Making a fantasy court system

Avery Moore

Troubadour
Okay, so if they're judging major crimes like genocide, then I guess I should be thinking of larger scale crimes than theft and murder.

Maybe necromancy? I suppose a necromancer could end up slaughtering the entire world and bringing them back as his undead puppets if left unchecked.

Perhaps killing a God could be considered the worst crime of all. Killing a mortal is one thing, they die all the time, but Gods aren't supposed to die, and killing one would greatly upset the order of things.

Interfering with time could be one. Say you manipulate time to save the life of someone you love, but that ends up fucking up the whole space time continuum thingy and a whole bunch of stuff happens that isn't supposed to happen.

Let me know if I'm on the right sort of track here. :D
 

Amaterasu34

Dreamer
I’ve never thought of the necromancy angle now that you have brought it up that is good. Killing a God is one of the big ones that I have in mind. I hadn’t thought of time either lol. You are definitely on the right track!
 

Avery Moore

Troubadour
I’ve never thought of the necromancy angle now that you have brought it up that is good. Killing a God is one of the big ones that I have in mind. I hadn’t thought of time either lol. You are definitely on the right track!

Awesome! Okay, let's see if I can think of a few more.

Causing a natural disaster? I guess only Gods could be responsible for this, but things like floods or plagues or earthquakes that could kill large amounts of people.

Something to do with the creation of monsters? Greek mythology has loads and loads of super powerful monsters that the Gods made 'cos they got bored and wanted to watch some humans squirm. Guess it only makes sense that this should be disallowed.

Giving away the Gods secrets? Prometheus got his liver pecked out every day for giving the secret of fire to the humans. I imagine all Gods have secrets that'd get them into a whole lot of trouble if the wrong people knew them.
 
I have imagined a 10 commandments sort of deal, but that is what I’m struggling with. The big evil god is in a constant battle with my Creator God, although that more or less isn’t very important is this instance of punishment. The evil god does have lesser gods that follow its will and are punishable in ways that aren’t possible for them.

If my Creator God chooses to ignore these rules and act anyway, nothing can be done about it, but once again this happened very very rarely.
On the punishment angle, there are two basic reasons for punishment: retribution, and deterrence. The deterrence can be for the offender: if you do this again, this or worse is what will happen to you, do you really want to repeat that experience?

Perhaps more importantly, though, the deterrence is for others. When other people see that the offender is punished, and how, they know the same will happen to them if they do anything of the sort, and may be deterred for that reason. Deterrence to others is arguably the more reliable effect.

When you're dealing with gods, it might be a whole other ballgame. Can gods really be deterred by any kind of punishment? Is punishment all about retribution? Is it simply an effort to stop them from doing their nefarious deed again?

Thinking along those lines, what, if anything, would be deterrent to a god? What would be adequate retribution?
 

Amaterasu34

Dreamer
Awesome! Okay, let's see if I can think of a few more.

Causing a natural disaster? I guess only Gods could be responsible for this, but things like floods or plagues or earthquakes that could kill large amounts of people.

Something to do with the creation of monsters? Greek mythology has loads and loads of super powerful monsters that the Gods made 'cos they got bored and wanted to watch some humans squirm. Guess it only makes sense that this should be disallowed.

Giving away the Gods secrets? Prometheus got his liver pecked out every day for giving the secret of fire to the humans. I imagine all Gods have secrets that'd get them into a whole lot of trouble if the wrong people knew them.

I imagined that if a population grew too large that actions such as natural disasters are alright, but to needlessly do it would not. Monsters will always be created, but making them to cause misery until they become plagues and mess up ecosystems could be considered a problem.

Giving away secrets of Gods is an interesting one and I can definitely see about doing that.

I’m not sure if you’ve heard about a webtoon called Lore Olympus, that is a modern retelling of the Hades and Persephone tale. Basically they have a very interesting idea, that some gods have permits for what they do. For example, Ares has a permit for acts of wrath because he is the God of War and can do that. On the other hand, if you don’t have such a permit and commit an act of wrath, then they are punished in some way and another God, which is Eros has to rebuild the population because the people were killed.

I always thought this was a cool and interesting idea to say the least.
 

pmmg

Istar
I have imagined a 10 commandments sort of deal, but that is what I’m struggling with. The big evil god is in a constant battle with my Creator God, although that more or less isn’t very important is this instance of punishment. The evil god does have lesser gods that follow its will and are punishable in ways that aren’t possible for them.

If my Creator God chooses to ignore these rules and act anyway, nothing can be done about it, but once again this happened very very rarely.

Sorry, I have tried to parse through this but cant make sense of it.

What instance of punishment?

Did you mean evil god chooses to ignore the rules? Why would anyone feel nothing can be done about it if the Creator God did? Would they not support it?

What is the 10 commandments thing giving you a problem? Is it that you just want a larger set of rules?
 

Amaterasu34

Dreamer
On the punishment angle, there are two basic reasons for punishment: retribution, and deterrence. The deterrence can be for the offender: if you do this again, this or worse is what will happen to you, do you really want to repeat that experience?

Perhaps more importantly, though, the deterrence is for others. When other people see that the offender is punished, and how, they know the same will happen to them if they do anything of the sort, and may be deterred for that reason. Deterrence to others is arguably the more reliable effect.

When you're dealing with gods, it might be a whole other ballgame. Can gods really be deterred by any kind of punishment? Is punishment all about retribution? Is it simply an effort to stop them from doing their nefarious deed again?

Thinking along those lines, what, if anything, would be deterrent to a god? What would be adequate retribution?

My Creator God is merciful at times, but if the act is very bad than there is a heavy price that will be paid. One extreme punishment for the Gods is complete erasure. The Creator God completely erases them as if they never existed. Gone from memories, bibles and books, the whole nine yards.

Other punishments I had in mind were to curse them for periods of time and strip them of abilities, and another would be imprisonment in a facility that takes away their abilities.
 

Avery Moore

Troubadour
I imagined that if a population grew too large that actions such as natural disasters are alright, but to needlessly do it would not. Monsters will always be created, but making them to cause misery until they become plagues and mess up ecosystems could be considered a problem.

Giving away secrets of Gods is an interesting one and I can definitely see about doing that.

I’m not sure if you’ve heard about a webtoon called Lore Olympus, that is a modern retelling of the Hades and Persephone tale. Basically they have a very interesting idea, that some gods have permits for what they do. For example, Ares has a permit for acts of wrath because he is the God of War and can do that. On the other hand, if you don’t have such a permit and commit an act of wrath, then they are punished in some way and another God, which is Eros has to rebuild the population because the people were killed.

I always thought this was a cool and interesting idea to say the least.

That's very interesting. I suppose you could work with that idea. Maybe one of the major crimes could be Gods using their powers out of turn. Like, say, a God/Goddess of love using their powers to force someone to fall in love with them.

I suppose that can be another potential crime. Taking away a human's free will. Forcing them to do your bidding.

Also maybe bringing someone who isn't a God into the kingdom of the Gods?
 

Amaterasu34

Dreamer
Sorry, I have tried to parse through this but cant make sense of it.

What instance of punishment?

Did you mean evil god chooses to ignore the rules? Why would anyone feel nothing can be done about it if the Creator God did? Would they not support it?

What is the 10 commandments thing giving you a problem? Is it that you just want a larger set of rules?

Sorry if this is confusing you, but the evil god, who is my big bad, does not follow these rules. This is more for the other gods and sometimes mortals who meddle with the affairs of Gods. I meant this thread was more for them, not my big bad.

My 10 commandments thing is the set of rules I’m trying to make. I want rules that make sense in the grand scheme of things. I honestly think more than 10 is a lot, maybe 15, but I don’t think it’ll get that far.
 

Queshire

Auror
I'd recommend thinking about how what's illegal could potentially benefit the evil god if a big part of the court system is to protect the creator god from them. Necromancy is illegal? Then perhaps Necromancy comes directly from the evil god and every undead brings a shard of its power into creation. Genocide? Perhaps the evil god tempts the desperate & powerless. Those threatened by genocide are a rich recruiting ground for it.
 
One extreme punishment for the Gods is complete erasure. The Creator God completely erases them as if they never existed. Gone from memories, bibles and books, the whole nine yards..
Does that make whatever they're the gods of disappear too?

Any god in a pantheon has to be the god of something. That's how pantheons work. A god is the god of war, or the dead, or fertility, or harvest, or thunderstorms, or that mountain over there, or the sea, and so on. Usually one god is the god of multiple things.

So if the deity of fertility got erased, would no more babies be born? If the deity of a mountain were erased, would the mountain cease to exist?
 
My 10 commandments thing is the set of rules I’m trying to make. I want rules that make sense in the grand scheme of things. I honestly think more than 10 is a lot, maybe 15, but I don’t think it’ll get that far.
The Egyptian goddess Ma'at, also a law giver, gave 42 commandments. Maat and her 42 laws - Yoga Konga

15 wasn't enough for them. But to be fair, many of those laws are specific breakdowns that could be covered by a broader law.
 

Amaterasu34

Dreamer
Does that make whatever they're the gods of disappear too?

Any god in a pantheon has to be the god of something. That's how pantheons work. A god is the god of war, or the dead, or fertility, or harvest, or thunderstorms, or that mountain over there, or the sea, and so on. Usually one god is the god of multiple things.

So if the deity of fertility got erased, would no more babies be born? If the deity of a mountain were erased, would the mountain cease to exist?

No it still exists. Usually the children of that God would take over or another God will be assigned to this task.
 

pmmg

Istar
Okay, just some laws I would want to have in a Pantheon...

No killing each other.
No interfering with the followers of another god.
No breaking the laws of nature.
No engaging in anything that would make all of the Gods look bad...such as lying to mortals.
No acting to undermine the authority of another.
No travelling into the mortal realm without special circumstances.
No acting in a way that makes the rules set seem less than binding.
No changing what fate or prophecy has already decided.
No revealing the secrets of another.
No revealing the weaknesses of another.

For mortals, I would stick to the stuff like no murder, rape, stealing or lying, or forgetting about the gods.
 

bdcharles

Minstrel
Hello! New here and was wondering if anyone could give some helpful tips on a court system? I have a goddess of law and she wrote the laws of the universe with the leader of her pantheon and her pantheon essentially judge the gods or other very dangerous individuals. Some ideas for laws that could get gods or very dangerous people in trouble. Also the court system as a whole! So to sum it up…need some help thinking of laws and possible punishments. Anything would be very helpful!

I think it would be neat to have a court system so byzantine as to be all but incomprehensible to mere mortals. Implausibly convoluted clauses along the lines of: "In the event that, that which and therefore, pursuant to thus which that falls before, and notwithstanding that which falls within the remit of subsection F, item MCMXBII, notable superpart 1223_0.d12-A of the twelve-hundredth edition of P.S.Backle's paper on the subject (no longer in print), the court has decreed that you're going down, son." Then a major plot challenge can be to unravel the meaning of the document before time runs out. You could have schisms within schisms, factions dueling over whether the 43rd "that that" in the 1199th edition of Backle's treatment of the bylaw in question means plain old "that" or "actually that that".
 
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pmmg

Istar
I think it would be neat to have a court system so byzantine as to be all but incomprehensible to mere mortals. Implausibly convoluted clauses along the lines of: "In the event that, that which and therefore, pursuant to thus which that falls before, and notwithstanding that which falls within the remit of subsection F, item MCMXBII, notable superpart 1223_0.d12-A of the twelve-hundredth edition of P.S.Backle's paper on the subject (no longer in print), the court has decreed that you're going down, son." Then a major plot challenge can be to unravel the meaning of the document before time runs out. You could have schisms within schisms, factions dueling over whether the 43rd "that that" in the 1199th edition of Backle's treatment of the bylaw in question means plain old "that" or "actually that that".

Sounds like the evil one already won.
 

Amaterasu34

Dreamer
This has been very very helpful and I have a pretty good idea about what I’m going to do now! Everyone has been really patient and helpful and I’m beyond thankful! I’ve always been shy and protective of my stories so actually asking and receiving help has been enlightening! I’m glad I came to this site for help. So once again thank you everyone who helped out!
 
  • Tips on a court system
  1. The twelve archetypes (innocent, orphan, warrior, caregiver, seeker, lover, destroyer, creator, ruler magician, sage, and fool) in AWAKENING THE HEROES WITHIN (according to the Heroic Myth Index ,(Form E)), or,
  2. The Objective Characters in DRAMATICA: A New Theory of Story, called in the proper order (that is, protagonist, skeptic, sidekick contagonist, guardian, antagonist, reason, and emotion).
  • The court system as a whole
  1. Promote optimism and curiosity or
  2. Help people connect or
  3. Fiery very active
  • Laws and possible punishments
Laws: the quintessential of the laws
Punishments: turn their STRENGTHS TO FLAWS.
 
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