Organised Religion?

[Terry Greer]

I guess what i meant - but didn't explain properly - is that if something is replicable - its science - if it isn't reliably replicable then its a belief system and therefore not true - i.e. myth, religion and the 'Occult'.

What follows is that to have a believable occult it needs to have a set of mechanisms and laws that make it effectively a science - without that its unbelievable.

In my view magic without a rule system, where anything can happen, is utterly boring and without suspense. The reader has to be able to forecast what can and can't happen in advance, and the writer has to provide the reader with interesting (and surprising ways) that their protaganist uses these known (and well explained and understood) rules so that the reader thinks 'of course', when the surprise hits them.

 

[Terry Greer]

Could be that it doesn't work when it's studied, there's a limited amount of power so that the more people use it the less power each one has, or if people start understanding too much about it the entire way it works shifts.

Personally I find that too easy a cop out, and a lazy way of thinking. If anything goes - why should I should I care? If the protagonist can get of danger by something illogical or novel - something known as 'Deus ex machina' - then I feel as a reader insulted - and don't bother reading any more from that writer.

Having said that - Larry Niven in his Warlock books (The Magic goes away) had a great reason for why magic isn't around any more - treating it (mana) as a resource like oil that can be used up in an area. That was well handled - but had distinct rules.
Similarly something linked perhaps to the uncertainty principle might be valid - but its an overused trope that magic can't be measured.

 

[Gryphos]

Science is basically just a methodology for finding out the truth - so this basically boils down to - if the occult works - why isn't it studied using the scientific method?

In my world the Occult does work, but it's a closely kept secret between occultists, and even then what the Occult can do has quite a few limits. The rest of the world A) can't ever find out how to harness the Occult due to the occultists' secrecy and B) wouldn't really want to be able to do what Occultists can do due to the stigma put upon their practices, vampirism, sacrifices etc.


Anyway, I've decided that there will be an organised religion in place. The exact nature of the religion I haven't decided on but I'm thinking something along the lines of spirit reverence, worshipping many natural divine beings as opposed to a set of gods. Unlike the Occult, this religion is false and was thus its doctrines were largely disproven during the Age of Minds. This caused it to lose a lot of its following and influence.

 

[skip.knox]

As the hangman said, it's all in the execution.

I hesitate to rule out any approach on a theoretical level. Almost any system can be made to work, if the story itself works. I have read a great many books that had sensible magical systems but where the story did not engage me. I have yet to read a story that hooked me but I put it down because I did not find the magic system to be internally consistent.