How do you improve World-Building?

[FifthView]

To give you a couple of examples to make the point. If the fictional world has no cows the character would not for a moment think about the fact that is has no cows over the course of the story.

That one is rather broad. This means that in my medieval fantasy novel I don't have to mention black holes and Harry Potter.

Or perhaps a better example. A character lives in a world where teleportation through magic is possible but could well go through many days without thinking about that fact the same way that I will go through many days without thinking about the miracle of air travel.

A much better example. But this leads back to the caution I gave earlier. If this plot device will play a role in the story, it could become rather on the nose. Or, deus ex machina, if world building is ad hoc.

Plus, if the teleportation magic isn't going to play a role in the story, then we might be back to black holes and Harry Potter.

If the teleportation magic isn't going to play a role in the plot, the mention of its existence could still add to worldbuilding, maybe. For creating mood. For creating the sense that magic has many uses in the world—or at least, that there are many wild tales about strange magics. Whether it would be useful would depend on what the author wants to do. If not teleportation magic, then pixies. Dragons, even if dragons play no direct role in the story.

The problem as I see it is that the failure to mention any aspect of the world that doesn't directly affect a POV character in the here-and-now of his activity or the plot can potentially lead to an on the nose development of the story, deus ex machina, or Mary Suing it.

Ex.: Character needs to get from this tavern to a city 100 miles away; I know, I'll have a mage walk in who can teleport him for a fee! "Very convenient; thank goodness I live in an implausible fantasy world! Now I hope there's something like a magic sword at my destination point...."

In a world where everyday things are very different than here, it is likely many of those things will get taken for granted and no thought about.

This will depend on the importance and effect of those things. If massive electrical storms strike every three days without fail—probably, they are going to be thought about. If the King's soldiers patrol the streets day and night...probably thought about.

I imagine intelligent extraterrestrials in our own universe looking up at two moons and having a mythos about them.

To me the character who is artificially aware or hyper aware of the common differences in their world is just a walking info dump.

It's not just about having a talking Wikipedia walking around vs someone who only thinks about what's in front of his nose.

The world around us constantly informs us of things about which we don't care and which are entirely (seemingly) unimportant to our daily quests. I can see a delivery truck drive past me despite the fact that I don't need a refill of propane and haven't bought any in over a decade. The other day, despite the fact that I'm not a farmer, I saw a truck pulling a trailer with a single huge hog going to slaughter (I assumed.) No, I haven't seen any dragons lately.

Edit: I think we agree on avoiding the worldbuilder's disease, of the pointlessness of creating aspects of the world that have little chance of appearing anywhere in the story. But I think that building outward from those things needed for plot and character is not a bad idea, and questioning the ramifications of those things you have built.

 

[Russ]

That one is rather broad. This means that in my medieval fantasy novel I don't have to mention black holes and Harry Potter.

I picked that one as a live example. A member here started a thread about that topic a while ago, I would not have come up with that one myself.

The problem as I see it is that the failure to mention any aspect of the world that doesn't directly affect a POV character in the here-and-now of his activity or the plot can potentially lead to an on the nose development of the story, deus ex machina, or Mary Suing it.

Ah...perhaps I have been not been clear. I did not suggest that the observations need be limited to immediate need or notice, rather simply to what is needed for the story. I am all for making sure the musket is noticed over the fireplace in chapter one, if the character is going to fire it in chapter seven.

This will depend on the importance and effect of those things. If massive electrical storms strike every three days without fail—probably, they are going to be thought about. If the King's soldiers patrol the streets day and night...probably thought about.

It will depend on how they impact the character in question. It is amazing how many things we take for granted that are really quite impressive if you think about them. Nuclear power is a good example.

The world around us constantly informs us of things about which we don't care and which are entirely (seemingly) unimportant to our daily quests. I can see a delivery truck drive past me despite the fact that I don't need a refill of propane and haven't bought any in over a decade. The other day, despite the fact that I'm not a farmer, I saw a truck pulling a trailer with a single huge hog going to slaughter (I assumed.) No, I haven't seen any dragons lately.

Absolutely, but as a reader I don't want to read about the propane truck or the hog truck in your work unless they are going to collide on the road in front of you and cover you in bacon thus starting your adventure. And as a writer I don't need to know all of those common things that might inform your character to write that character well.

Edit: I think we agree on avoiding the worldbuilder's disease, of the pointlessness of creating aspects of the world that have little chance of appearing anywhere in the story. But I think that building outward from those things needed for plot and character is not a bad idea, and questioning the ramifications of those things you have built.

We are probably quite close to agreeing on most things. I advocate world building from the character, plot or theme(s) outwards. You only need to build out as far as the story demands or a bit further to give a sense of solidity to the world. There is nothing at all wrong with pondering all of the ramifications of every aspect of your world or every major aspect of your world, but I don't think it is necessary for good fiction to do so.

 

[FifthView]

Absolutely, but as a reader I don't want to read about the propane truck or the hog truck in your work unless they are going to collide on the road in front of you and cover you in bacon thus starting your adventure. And as a writer I don't need to know all of those common things that might inform your character to write that character well.

As a writer and reader, I find that going from explosion to explosion boring. If every time I mentioned a tavern on the street, I had to make sure bandits burst out of it to attack my MC, or that the necessary info my MC needed to make a breakthrough in his quest would be within, that would be boring.

It would be awfully hard to surprise, also.

The worst thing would be knowing that every item related to the world, when I bothered to describe the world at all, would need to be of major significance to that MC. Then again, if I wanted to create a highly neurotic character, this might be a great idea.