iklwa

[imsc]

i remember seeing this weapon on "deadliest warrior" on spike tv. popularized by shaka zulu, i noticed the weapon was used a type of spear, but also could slash like a sword. i was wondering if any weapon experts on the forum know anything about this weapon's effectiveness as a slashing weapon? was it commonly used to slash, or just stab? would it be difficult to wield as a slashing weapon?

 

[Saigonnus]

While I don't admit to being an expert at anything really, I would think a bladed spear would be useful for either slashing or piercing depending on the situation. In close combat, more likely it would be used either as a staff to block/deflect attacks or to stab since it takes less space to complete the action than slashing. I would think a limited slashing action (like drawing a knife backwards across the skin) as part of the piercing action would make it more effective, possibly even disarming the enemy if it severs the tendons in the forearm/wrist or upper arm.

Against a mounted rider however, or somewhat a short distance away, a slashing attack could be devastating since it would have the weight of the weapon plus the velocity and strength of the user behind the attack. Also, when used BY a mounted rider as a slashing attack it could work very well indeed, especially against infantry with limited range weapons (swords/axes etc.) Also it could be used in a pinch as a missile weapon, thrown to great effect a short distance.

 

[CupofJoe]

I've got a 19C Assegai, (30 inch handle and 18 inch blade) I bought at a Christian Mission sale - from the Christian Missionary - they said they got it from Natal [the home of the Zulu] and was told it "100 years old" in 1962.
It certainly looks used and well made. The blade is extremely sharp and very pointed to this day and will cut cloth and leather with little effort. it can slash and stab, you could even throw it a few metres [but I haven't tried that]. Against unarmoured or lightly armoured[i.e. not metal armour] opponents it would be lethal... I've cut myself enough handling it... [and there are odd dark stains on the wood near the blade I prefer not to think about...]

 

[imsc]

thank you all. i'm going to look online and see if i can find a vid of that episode of deadliest warrior. i think the guy demonstrating the weapon used it against a side of beef (both slashing and piercing).

i plan on having the amazons of the setting use the iklwa as their primary weapon. while they would primarily would be fighting against infantry, they would at times also have to take on mounted opponents. armor would be pretty uncommon, as the world is largely a tropical/sub-tropical environment . . . though i imagine some armies would use hide armor or alternate types of armor that adapt to the heat.

 

[wordwalker]

thank you all. i'm going to look online and see if i can find a vid of that episode of deadliest warrior. i think the guy demonstrating the weapon used it against a side of beef (both slashing and piercing).

Not to rag on Deadliest Warrior --it can be a good source of ideas, and sometimes it's just fun-- but never take it that seriously. Especially their sense of what was used when in history, or their belief that the amount of damage a solid hit does to beef is more important than how weapon reach, balance, and so on affect whether you'd actually get that hit.

I'm told the best way to watch it as a warmup for its online forum, that does try to hash these things out. And please, let's not start listing the things that are wrong with the show, or whether it's got good points or not. Either of those could go on forever.

I do like that you're using your iklwa in a lightly armored setting. It sounds like one of the many blade types that are best at carving up basic flesh.

 

[Devor]

It doesn't look like it would be effective at slashing. At that range, to me, the slashing area seems too small to rely on. Your target would have to be in exactly the right spot, several feet away, to slash them. I think it's a thrusting weapon, and the edges are probably there to help the weapon pull out with a slash after the hit has landed.

It width of the spear, needed to hold those edges, would be more hindrence than help against armor, as they increase the surface area going in.

 

[Anders Ämting]

i remember seeing this weapon on "deadliest warrior" on spike tv. popularized by shaka zulu, i noticed the weapon was used a type of spear, but also could slash like a sword. i was wondering if any weapon experts on the forum know anything about this weapon's effectiveness as a slashing weapon? was it commonly used to slash, or just stab? would it be difficult to wield as a slashing weapon?

As a general rule, you want to take anything said on shows like Deadliest Warrior with a helping of salt. In fact, you probably shouldn't trust anything weapon related that you see on TV.

That said, any long-bladed spear is going to be able to deal cutting damage in some regard, and it's certainly not something exclusive to the iklwa. A lot of Japanese spears had long cutting blades that were sometimes even converted directly into short swords. The european equivalent is called a hewing spear -a weapon described in a lot of viking sagas - and a medieval Swedish polearm called a "hafted sword" which was basically a hewing spear with a broad crossguard. Some of the early, more simplistic versions of the partisan would also qualify.

Now, I'm going hazard a guess and say that this type of weapon was still primarily used for thrusting, cutting and slashing being a secondary feature. Note that there are polearms that do focus more on cutting - the glaive or the naginata, for example - but these aren't normally considered spears. A certain dedication to the thrust seems to be part of the definition.

As for the iklwa, I don't know much about it but looking over some pictures on Google, it seems to me that some were definitely longer and more slashing oriented than others. So, I'm assuming the slashing capacity varied from spear to spear, possibly depending on the individual warrior's prefered combat style.

 

[imsc]

As a general rule, you want to take anything said on shows like Deadliest Warrior with a helping of salt. In fact, you probably shouldn't trust anything weapon related that you see on TV.

That said, any long-bladed spear is going to be able to deal cutting damage in some regard, and it's certainly not something exclusive to the iklwa. A lot of Japanese spears had long cutting blades that were sometimes even converted directly into short swords. The european equivalent is called a hewing spear -a weapon described in a lot of viking sagas - and a medieval Swedish polearm called a "hafted sword" which was basically a hewing spear with a broad crossguard. Some of the early, more simplistic versions of the partisan would also qualify.

Now, I'm going hazard a guess and say that this type of weapon was still primarily used for thrusting, cutting and slashing being a secondary feature. Note that there are polearms that do focus more on cutting - the glaive or the naginata, for example - but these aren't normally considered spears. A certain dedication to the thrust seems to be part of the definition.

As for the iklwa, I don't know much about it but looking over some pictures on Google, it seems to me that some were definitely longer and more slashing oriented than others. So, I'm assuming the slashing capacity varied from spear to spear, possibly depending on the individual warrior's prefered combat style.

this is interesting. the main character i'm planning about writing about i'm thinking of arming with two of the weapons (possibly developing a two-weapon fighting style with them), that's why i was curious about the slashing ability. i'm not really sure if the weapons were used in this manner by real zulu though.

 

[wordwalker]

Right, it's supposed to be primarily a thrusting weapon. "Ik-lwa" is the sound it makes as it goes in and comes out (which might actually be too gory for Deadliest Warrior--naah ).

 

[JBoots]

Shorten the thrusting blade a little and add a smaller curved blade on the back end of the Iklwa shaft. Use the pointy end for thrusting with a shield. When the shield is dropped or comprimised drop it and turn the weapon around and use it as a 2 handed slasher with the curved blade end. I'd draw out a couple prototypes to make sure of if its functionality, but it could work and it would be unique.

 

[imsc]

Shorten the thrusting blade a little and add a smaller curved blade on the back end of the Iklwa shaft. Use the pointy end for thrusting with a shield. When the shield is dropped or comprimised drop it and turn the weapon around and use it as a 2 handed slasher with the curved blade end. I'd draw out a couple prototypes to make sure of if its functionality, but it could work and it would be unique.

now that's a very interesting idea!