Purple Prose and playing with words

[JLiana]

Hi all,

So, I will be the first to admit I love me some purple prose. Sometimes I can't help but write it. It worms it's way in during drafts, and I cut the fat when I make revisions. However.

I feel like a lot of writers have forgotten that playing with language exists, that writing is an art and making things sound interesting is part of our jobs. Putting words together that shouldn't work. Making keeping language fresh to read page to page

I posted something to Reddit for critique (my mistake, I know) and I was told that the prose was far too purple. The examples provided were:

"The door to our bedchambers clicked shut with a precarious finality."

And

"In an ironic twist of fate."

Which I suppose might be fair, but at the same time, flowery language is what makes my writing feel like mine, y'know? They did also "suppose" that the piece got better in the later half.

I suppose what I'm asking is, does all prose need to be written in such a literal sense? Can prose be a little purple if grounding details follow? Can Redditors give critique without being snarky about it? Or am I a little delusional for thinking this way?

 

[skip.knox]

I would not call either example purple. The second example is hackneyed. The twist could surely be better described. To be purple it would need to pile on a few more adjectives, preferably as superlatives.

The first example is just awkward. Finality and precariousness don't really go together. Something that is precarious is in danger of falling. When it has completely fallen it has reached finality. Nothing purple here, just a need for a better adjective. Also, just a trifle but maybe worth mentioning, do you really mean to say they (the "our" in the sentence) have multiple bedchambers? I stumbled over that because I was picturing multiple bedchambers having at least one door each, which made the click neither precarious nor final.

Prose, no matter what the color, ought to be precise.

 

[JLiana]

I would not call either example purple. The second example is hackneyed. The twist could surely be better described. To be purple it would need to pile on a few more adjectives, preferably as superlatives.

The first example is just awkward. Finality and precariousness don't really go together. Something that is precarious is in danger of falling. When it has completely fallen it has reached finality. Nothing purple here, just a need for a better adjective. Also, just a trifle but maybe worth mentioning, do you really mean to say they (the "our" in the sentence) have multiple bedchambers? I stumbled over that because I was picturing multiple bedchambers having at least one door each, which made the click neither precarious nor final.

Prose, no matter what the color, ought to be precise.

Oh, yeah, it's "ours" as in shared.

For me, I liked "precarious finality" as an oxymoron because in context of the chapter, my character is escaping her abusive husband, and it's written from her POV so it's her being unsure if her plan is going to work, or if she will manage to escape. I think I'll be removing it anyway.

The second example will definitely be gone in the next revision, it's a bit overwrought now that I think of it.

 

[Prince of Spires]

I would probably ask them what exactly they mean when they'd give me such a critique. It could very well be that something else feels wrong to the reader, but they can't explain it directly so they resort to calling it purple.

Also, consider that not all writing is for everyone. Maybe your style simply doesn't fit the reader.

In general I think that you should write in whatever style you feel like. Yes, you cut fat during revisions, but that doesn't mean you have to strip the story down to its bare bones without any feeling in there. It just means you remove bits where you first tell what's happening and then show it. Or remove repetitions. Etc. You definitely want to keep your own voice in there.

It is important to be consistent in style (unless there's a specific reason to deviate of course). You can't write non-purple prose for most of the novel and then include a purple paragraph. That would throw readers off.

 

[JLiana]

I would probably ask them what exactly they mean when they'd give me such a critique. It could very well be that something else feels wrong to the reader, but they can't explain it directly so they resort to calling it purple.

Also, consider that not all writing is for everyone. Maybe your style simply doesn't fit the reader.

In general I think that you should write in whatever style you feel like. Yes, you cut fat during revisions, but that doesn't mean you have to strip the story down to its bare bones without any feeling in there. It just means you remove bits where you first tell what's happening and then show it. Or remove repetitions. Etc. You definitely want to keep your own voice in there.

It is important to be consistent in style (unless there's a specific reason to deviate of course). You can't write non-purple prose for most of the novel and then include a purple paragraph. That would throw readers off.

Yeah, it was a bit jarring because some comments were fine, but some just failed to elaborate even when I asked. Like, looking back on the piece myself, I can see that people meant the purple bits were overwrought or just unnecessary, but no one said that, they just said it "stuck out"— someone even just made a list in the comments of the bits they didn't like lol.

I tend towards flowery language, I can't help it. I would definitely say it's my voice and your comment made me feel a little better about that, so thanks.

 

[pmmg]

I suppose what I'm asking is, does all prose need to be written in such a literal sense? Can prose be a little purple if grounding details follow? Can Redditors give critique without being snarky about it? Or am I a little delusional for thinking this way?

I suppose what I'm asking is, does all prose need to be written in such a literal sense?

No, prose can be written in any voice you like. If you have a good and well-developed voice, it would be a shame not to use it. Most things are written in what I term 'Competent Librarian' Voice. And it works, cause its clear and does not get in the way of things. But voice is hard to get right. I takes a lot of development to get right, and be clear.

There will always be more who dont like it than do, so... You can't take a sampling of a general public and know, you have to take a sampling of your readers, and those are hard to gather.

Can prose be a little purple if grounding details follow?

Purple prose by definition is bad prose. So, I'm gonna say no. Avoid purple prose. Aim for prose that adds to the experience and does not take away. Its an art and not a science. You can master it and do it.

Can Redditors give critique without being snarky about it?

Does this need an answer? What else would I expect on reddit but snarky answers?

Or am I a little delusional for thinking this way?

Thinking what way? About Reddit? Yes, you are delusional. Otherwise, you don't seem delusional to me.


The sample above does not have enough in it for me to call it purple. I can go with a precarious finality, as in the final state was still precarious. Leaves open the possibility that it will be insufficient to keep the door closed.

I would avoid 'In an ironic twist of fate', as to me, that reads as the narrator voice trying to speak to me directly. If that is the style and voice you want, then it would get a pass, but generally, that is a bad author habit. We are not chit chatting. Just show what happens and let me decide if it was ironic, or maybe that a character found it ironic.

 

[skip.knox]

Redditors are human beings. Some will be snarky and some will be helpful. As with other gatherings of humans, the ratio will vary with time and circumstance. Because we have to deal with human beings regularly, it's best to develop both filters and a thick skin.

 

[Romy]

Can prose be a little purple if grounding details follow?

Depends on what you want to achieve?
Too much jargon or tech words... In smaller doses, might make situations feel more 'forced/fake upper class' in a keeping up appearances style. Imagine a critic or the classic teacher talking crap nobody understands but makes him feel better. Just be careful not to become that teacher.
In a gentler way, someone very focused on his own job might use acronyms very common in his workplace (not only tech but consider government/insurance) in regular situations.
Can try to use the same not only when those characters speak but when you are in the teacher's room or a big government building to change the atmosphere without describing it... Dangerous and might put off the reader.

Too 'fluffy' romantic descriptions might feel like poetry.
In a novel same as the jargon, a way to slow down non-action scenes.

Just be aware of it. Let it rest for a while and be honest to yourself when you reread it.

Can Redditors give critique without being snarky about it? Or am I a little delusional for thinking this way?

It is more fashionable to be negative and keep positive things to yourself, especially anonymously behind a screen (I am no exception to this). And yes, Reddit is a cesspit that encourages this.


'similar threads' gave me this gem... (for this question quite some useful ones)

The Purple Thread

A recent conversation inspires me to start this thread. I'm hoping I'll discover an author or two. Purple prose comes in for its share of thrashing and then some. Often it's merited. But there are also examples of ... let's call it poetic prose. You can call it purple if you prefer. Or ornate...

mythicscribes.com

 

[JLiana]

I suppose what I'm asking is, does all prose need to be written in such a literal sense?

No, prose can be written in any voice you like. If you have a good and well-developed voice, it would be a shame not to use it. Most things are written in what I term 'Competent Librarian' Voice. And it works, cause its clear and does not get in the way of things. But voice is hard to get right. I takes a lot of development to get right, and be clear.

There will always be more who dont like it than do, so... You can't take a sampling of a general public and know, you have to take a sampling of your readers, and those are hard to gather.

Can prose be a little purple if grounding details follow?

Purple prose by definition is bad prose. So, I'm gonna say no. Avoid purple prose. Aim for prose that adds to the experience and does not take away. Its an art and not a science. You can master it and do it.

Can Redditors give critique without being snarky about it?

Does this need an answer? What else would I expect on reddit but snarky answers?

Or am I a little delusional for thinking this way?

Thinking what way? About Reddit? Yes, you are delusional. Otherwise, you don't seem delusional to me.


The sample above does not have enough in it for me to call it purple. I can go with a precarious finality, as in the final state was still precarious. Leaves open the possibility that it will be insufficient to keep the door closed.

I would avoid 'In an ironic twist of fate', as to me, that reads as the narrator voice trying to speak to me directly. If that is the style and voice you want, then it would get a pass, but generally, that is a bad author habit. We are not chit chatting. Just show what happens and let me decide if it was ironic, or maybe that a character found it ironic.

Oh, I've been misinterpreting purple prose as like, flowery or overly written prose. I understand what you mean.

Yeah, I got rid of the twist thing in the revision. I slip between being genuinely artistic with my language and then trying too hard to sound good, but that's because I'm a little insecure about my writing. Thanks for the reply!

 

[JLiana]

Depends on what you want to achieve?
Too much jargon or tech words... In smaller doses, might make situations feel more 'forced/fake upper class' in a keeping up appearances style. Imagine a critic or the classic teacher talking crap nobody understands but makes him feel better. Just be careful not to become that teacher.
In a gentler way, someone very focused on his own job might use acronyms very common in his workplace (not only tech but consider government/insurance) in regular situations.
Can try to use the same not only when those characters speak but when you are in the teacher's room or a big government building to change the atmosphere without describing it... Dangerous and might put off the reader.

Too 'fluffy' romantic descriptions might feel like poetry.
In a novel same as the jargon, a way to slow down non-action scenes.

Just be aware of it. Let it rest for a while and be honest to yourself when you reread it.


It is more fashionable to be negative and keep positive things to yourself, especially anonymously behind a screen (I am no exception to this). And yes, Reddit is a cesspit that encourages this.


'similar threads' gave me this gem... (for this question quite some useful ones)

The Purple Thread

A recent conversation inspires me to start this thread. I'm hoping I'll discover an author or two. Purple prose comes in for its share of thrashing and then some. Often it's merited. But there are also examples of ... let's call it poetic prose. You can call it purple if you prefer. Or ornate...

mythicscribes.com

Yeah, when I say I want to write "purple" I just mean flowery, maybe ornate. But I get it, and I've started taking longer breaks between revisions too so I can spot when I'm maybe doing too much.

 

[pmmg]

It is flowery, overwritten prose. It is flowery overwritten prose to the point that it detracts from the writing and draws attention to the writer.

 

[A. E. Lowan]

My team writes a gritty, dark, and sometimes brutal Urban Fantasy series, and I'm the team's drafter. There are a lot of writers out there who would never consider writing suspense with anything but short, concise, punchy language. Keep it short. Keep it violent.

And then we have me.

I treat the English language like it's my own personal jungle gym. If I can't find a word that fits what I want to say, I'll make one. Drives my younger writing partner batshit. She's also one of our two editors, and for the next two books I'm just going to run with it and see if I can make her head explode.

Welcome to Seahaven. Now, somebody hold my em-dash.

I'm trained in writing poetry, so we can just blame that teacher for this.

Two pieces, examples both from Ties of Blood and Bone: The Second Book of Binding...

~~

Alerich’s gut clenched. All these years, he had held on to her memory as the kindest, purest person he had ever met—and his father wanted him to bring her to Arariel.

He couldn’t do it.

He needed to leave. He needed to leave right now. There was no way he was sacrificing this wonderful woman to the demon. He knew he needed to leave… but she smelled so good, and she was so warm. He couldn’t muster his courage.

A look of concern crossed her lovely face and she reached up, laying gentle fingers on his cheek. “You are so lost.” She slipped her hand into his and led him back through the garden, up to the clifftop where a large gazebo stood covered in bare vines. She patted the bench next to her. “When I’m lost, I come up here to think. In the spring, this gazebo is covered in wisteria. It’s so beautiful. You can see the whales and orca from here, and watch the dolphins play. Some of them are even wild.” Her smile became a little sad. “It’s peaceful. This is a place of comfort. The House can be very lonely. My family is all gone. It’s just me, and now Cian and Noel and Etienne. But the Mulcahys are all but extinct. I come here to remember them.”

Alerich’s stomach twisted, hating himself for sitting next to this good, kind, accepting woman who his family had all but destroyed. He had no right to speak to her… but he was not brave enough to walk away. Just a few more minutes. He just wanted a few more minutes with her before he ran away and tried… anything, to keep her safe from the monsters who had sent him to fetch her. He wanted to say something, but, “I’m sorry,” was all he had.

Winter laid her head against his shoulder and he wrapped the warmth of his arm around her. “It’s a sad thing, but life continues. I have a new family, a tiny son. A chance to leave my mark on this city of chaos and innovation.”

Alerich’s hand found her hair and it was just as soft as he had imagined. “You deserve better.”

Winter raised her face to him and gave him a gentle smile. “So do you, Rick.” Her words resonated in his soul and he closed his eyes for a moment, thinking of what if’s.

Her lips found his and he was suddenly a drowning man. ‘Sweet Helen, make me immortal with a kiss.’ She tasted of sweet wine and all things pure and good, and he knew he should pull away even as his hand found the back of her neck. He was drowning, and she was air. She was the last living thing in the world and he knew he would never be the same without her. His body felt like it was on fire and he slipped his other arm about her, pulling her close, offering his warmth against the cold even as he danced with her sweet tongue. He could feel her heart racing against his chest, mirroring his own, and his head spun with need.

Winter finally pulled away, leaving gentle kisses against his lips in her wake, and for a moment she met his gaze, searching for something. At last, she said, “Stay with me tonight.”

And he was too much of a coward to say no.

~~

Magnus’s hands shook with rage, clenching the head of his cane with a white-knuckled grip.

Bastian hummed cheerfully along to his damn earbuds as he poured the last of the sand, oblivious. Idiot.

Arariel crouched by the support post and crumbled a bit of incinerated rope between his fingers. He snorted with amusement. “Well, this is a complication. So close to the finish line, too.” He stood. “Oh well. It’s been very entertaining working with you, Magnus.”

Magnus snarled. “We’re not done, yet.” He struck Bastian across the back with his cane, eliciting a yelp of pain, and then flung him backward to the ground by his shirt collar. “Where are they?” He threw magic at the complex geometric pattern, fixing it in place and preventing it from being damaged.

Bastian looked to where the two wizard women were—had been—and his eyes widened with panic. “They were just here! I bound them well. I’ll find them for you, I swear it.”

Magnus put his foot on Bastian’s chest. “No. You’ve failed me for the last time.” He looked to Arariel. “My lord, let me call a Legion Commander. We’ll find this girl before your deadline.”

Arariel raised an eyebrow. “You’ll need quite a sacrifice to bring them here and you seem to be a victim short.”

The look Magnus cast on Bastian was devoid of pity. “I see one that should suffice.”

Bastian paled and struggled to get away. “Magnus, no! I’ve done everything you’ve ever asked of me. I’ve been your partner in this. I killed my first Mulcahy when I was twelve! You can’t!”

Magnus ground his heel into Bastian’s sternum, causing a small pain noise. “I have given everything to this geas. I gave my daughter to Arariel. My son betrayed me and will be dead soon enough. I have nothing left. What makes you think I won’t use you?”

Bastian’s eyes filled with tears. “Magnus… Master… please! I love you.”

Magnus turned to Arariel. “My lord, may I present your sacrifice?”

Arariel’s grin was a thing of menace and teeth and laughter. “Sure. Why not?”

Magnus swung his cane. “Goodbye, Bastian.”

Bastian screamed as the steel head of the cane struck his face.

Arariel was a demon of blood and pain, and so while a simple offering of a soul would technically suffice, he gained more power—and more pleasure—from offerings that ended with bloody, agonizing, death. The more violent the death, the more power generated, and Magnus had a particular Legion Commander in mind.

One that required quite a bit of power to summon, indeed.

By the time Bastian was finally dead the Demon Gate fairly hummed with power, and Magnus could again see the blasted hellscape that was the native realm of both demons and angels. He paused for a moment to contemplate what they had done to their own home in their unending war and was grateful that they could not pass so easily to the Mortal Realm. It was enough that the strongest of them chose to come here and use mortal souls as some sort of point system in their conflict. The demons wanted to collect them for their personal power, and angels sought to set them free.

He wondered if sweet, soul reading, angel-eyed Winter Mulcahy knew that. He wondered if she even knew about the damn guardian in Seahaven’s Historical District. Magnus had spent twenty years avoiding the tenacious son of a bitch.

On the other hand, it really didn’t matter. She wouldn’t live to see sunrise. He caught the power of the Gate like reigns and sent out his summons. “Setheus, hear me. Your lord requires the service of you and your demons.”

A large demon in glittering, chitinous, insect-like black armor stepped through the gate and over Bastian’s body, massive leathern wings folded against his back, thick horns curling back away from his brow. The dark shadows of twenty-seven lesser demons followed him and formed ranks even as they found solid form, nine abreast and three rows deep.

Setheus, Arariel’s most powerful Commander, bowed low to Arariel. “My lord, we come to your service.”

Magnus brought the rope fragments. “There are two wizard women loose on the grounds, Winter Mulcahy and Jessie St. James.” He handed the fragments to Setheus. “Find them and bring them back to your lord before sunrise.”

Setheus tasted the ropes and then passed them back among his demons. “It shall be done.” The demonic unit spread out to their search.

 

[The Dark One]

Purple prose doesn't have to be bad prose.

Done well, in the right context, it can be fun and even quite literary but it requires the right voice and a lot of finesse. If you overreach you can stumble (and look a berk) but if you can achieve that voice and finesse, in the right context, you can pull off a masterpiece (see The Book Thief, for example).

I often include some little purple frolics in my work but my work (and voice) is suited for it. For example, my most popular book is about a very naughty lawyer. He's very clever and refined and the reader is constantly privy to his thoughts which are not at all the thoughts most would expect from such a fellow. He is extremely judgmental of others and constantly putting them down in his own mind - rather amusingly - and both his dialogue and internal monologue can wax purple.

And yes, you are supposed to hate him, but everyone loves him by the end.