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pmmg
Myth Weaver
I'm gonna add a new rule. 4) Don't beat yourself up.
I'm gonna add a new rule. 4) Don't beat yourself up.
I still struggle with fluid engaging dialogue as a fledgling.So...In our long writing careers, I am sure we have all had to address many difficulties along the way. I wonder what some of you would consider the things that you found the hardest to get right on paper. What was particularly hard about it? How did you handle it? And do you think it succeeded? If for whatever reason, you wanted to tackle it again today, could you improve it?
(Feel free to use a loose definition of hard.)
I'm of two minds when it comes to a rule (guideline) such as this.I'm gonna add a new rule. 4) Don't beat yourself up.
Yeah, beating yourself up is only worthwhile if you stand to gain something from losing the fight.I'm of two minds when it comes to a rule (guideline) such as this.
If you never beat yourself up over writing issues, it's likely you will not improve.
If all you ever do is beat yourself up, you will likely lose inspiration and enthusiasm.
I beat myself up as a way of being realistic and as a way of focusing on what needs to be improved. I think I have a healthy mix going.
While this is certainly clever, it may be overextending the metaphor.Yeah, beating yourself up is only worthwhile if you stand to gain something from losing the fight.
There are a lot of terms used to describe negative self-appraisal, "beating yourself up" usually describes a more prolonged, aggravated, in depth approach than a smack on the cheek.While this is certainly clever, it may be overextending the metaphor.
It's not an all-out fight to determine a winner/loser. It's a smack across the cheek as a reminder that you've not written something as good as it might be. It's a (rough) call to do better next time.
Yes, that is a good distinction that I failed to acknowledge. I should beat myself up over it!There are a lot of terms used to describe negative self-appraisal, "beating yourself up" usually describes a more prolonged, aggravated, in depth approach than a smack on the cheek.
I agree both are certainly useful for different reasons as long as the result is improvement and one is able to dismiss the episode in a timely and appropriate manner, with no lingering effects of self-deprication.
So I agree with you on both counts, I'm just not sure they mean the same thing.
It's not so much a rule as it is just plain reality. There is simply no way to create something complete, balanced, engaging, and well-written all in one go. Certainly not for secondary-world fantasy.
So ugly I can do. I've got piles of it.
But if I'm using a technique that will need to be fixed later, it would be nice to know now, before I use it another hundred times.
It's a curiosity that there is so much advice on offer for the first-time writer, yet almost none for the authors who are on their, say, third book. Does something magical happen at Book Two?
I rather think not, seeing as how I'm on my sixth book and I still flounder like .... well, a flounder. Flop flop gasp.
Where are the articles on How Finally To Make a Useful Outline? Or, Better Dialog for Those Who Already Do It OK. Or, Fifth Book But First Flashback.
It isn't that we more experienced writers have stopped listening. It's just that all the pundits have suddenly run out of wisdom. Hmm. Curious.
On this subject I think it's helpful to point out two very different types of "books on writing."Where are the articles on How Finally To Make a Useful Outline? Or, Better Dialog for Those Who Already Do It OK. Or, Fifth Book But First Flashback.
I’d love to know about peoples experiences writing series. Fantasy specifically. Or SF, but more fantasy.
So I’m either expressing more negativity than I intend, or it’s being misread (or a little of both).Yeah...you can sift through my words and see if some other wisdom can be applied to it instead.
^ All of this is projecting beating oneself up. I cant, its impossible. All I can do is ugly....
We are our own worst judge of what is good and what is not. You've beat yourself up enough. That's why you need us. We'll do it for you, so you dont have to
Maybe there is much that can be improved, but that is it true for everyone. Look for bad, and you find bad. Look for good...
You are projecting not believing in yourself. I am betting your stuff is better than you think it is.
What technique? What technique is going to change your voice, or that thing inside that says, this is good and this is not? I love yakking on the site, so I would love another system to grind through the gears, but is this really the problem?
I would say that yes, something magical does happen at book 2, which make generic advice harder to give. The magic is that at this point, you have finished 2 books. It's easy to forget in a world where prolific writers publish a book a month or more, but getting 2 full novels written is pretty magical. Most people never make it past the "I would like to write a book one day" stage.It's a curiosity that there is so much advice on offer for the first-time writer, yet almost none for the authors who are on their, say, third book. Does something magical happen at Book Two?
I've written an unplanned trilogy. When I finished the first novel, I found that there was more to tell. The journey wasn't over yet. So I wrote that. I think it shows in the sense that while there is more story to tell, there aren't any clear hooks that draw a reader into the next story. I'm currently working on a new series, and that's more planned. I have a rough idea of where I want the series to go, and which characters I need for that. So I can drop in some hints about later events.I’d love to know about peoples experiences writing series. Fantasy specifically. Or SF, but more fantasy.
There really isn't much out there for those of us drowning in words. I've encountered a couple, like this one. The author makes a great case for a story structure to rival, and even compliment, the Hero's Journey. https://www.amazon.com/Heroines-Journey-Writers-Readers-Culture-ebook/dp/B08D5ZSNRB/ And of course we have Campbell, because even 20 years away from the Ivory Tower I can't escape. It's in e-book, finally! https://www.amazon.com/Thousand-Faces-Collected-Joseph-Campbell-ebook/dp/B08MWW2VDL/Prince of Spires, I agree. Combined with earlier comments on this thread, I'd say that most *useful* writerly advice concerns basic work habits, the fundamentals of grammar and composition (neither of which is much taught in school these days, at any level), and some pointers to basic resources. There are so much advice in part because advice-givers are legion, and in part because advice can be re-phrased and re-packaged almost endlessly. In this, writing advice is much akin to advice on time management or dieting or organizing your junk drawer.
But I do think there's room for later advice, even though it becomes less universal. How to write a series--and different kinds of series. How to switch genres. Dealing with burnout. Retcon tactics. Managing your research (the junk drawer, redux).
I wonder if you're not overthinking this. Maybe that is simply the way you write. There is this image of writers as people who sit down and write, inspired by whatever muse they have, driven to finish the latest story as midnight approaches. As though what we do is easy, and just comes to us. But reality isn't like that. Those of us with publishing contracts know all about deadlines, we know the need to write no matter how we're feeling to meet those deadlines and the fact that what goes out of the door to meet that deadline just has to be good enough and not perfect. Maybe that's what they're not telling us?It's a curiosity that there is so much advice on offer for the first-time writer, yet almost none for the authors who are on their, say, third book. Does something magical happen at Book Two?
I rather think not, seeing as how I'm on my sixth book and I still flounder like .... well, a flounder. Flop flop gasp.
Where are the articles on How Finally To Make a Useful Outline? Or, Better Dialog for Those Who Already Do It OK. Or, Fifth Book But First Flashback.
It isn't that we more experienced writers have stopped listening. It's just that all the pundits have suddenly run out of wisdom. Hmm. Curious.