What makes for a good compelling Magic System?

[pmmg]

The title says it all... Fantasy kind of implies there is going to be magic, but what makes magic good in a story? When does it fail, and when is it most cool? How defined does a magic system have to be, how does it all fit in with telling an immersive and compelling story? So what are your thoughts on magic?

(PS: would one of the Mods be kind enough to put a question mark on the end of my title, thx).

 

[Bick vire]

This is only my opinion that when there is a magic there should be separate rules for it. And there should be a strongest element and weak element and we can create a entirely new element when we combine the two diff elements. And the main thing is even when someone has a weakest magic element but they train hard and make that the strongest. that's what makes it look cool and badass at least that's what I think....

 

[Mad Swede]

I wonder if the answer to this depends on whether you like hard or soft magic, in the same sense as hard or soft SF? I'm also not sure that fantasy implies magic. Fantasy certainly suggests that there might be magic in the setting and story, but it isn't a given.

Personally I'm not a great believer in having detailed rules for magic in a story setting, but what I do want to see is consistency in the way magic is used. A fireball, for example, probably wouldn't have much impact on a stone wall, but might be more useful against something made of dried wood. Taking that one step further, are inexperienced mages more likely to use the wrong spell against something?

The other thing I like to see explored is the effects of using magic. To take another example, does using magic make the spell caster tired? Could that be used against them? Is there any other price to be paid for using magic? The latter is interesting as it gives opportunities for character development, a sort of internal debate as to whether being a spell caster is worth the price.

There's also the small question of the difference between some new technology and magic. The new technology might be seen as magic by those who'd never come across it before and who didn't understand how it worked. Depending on how you set things up an inventor might be accused of sorcery just for developing a simple steam engine. What effect would that have on technological development? On peoples attitudes to new things?

I feel that you don't need detailed rules to consider the effects of using magic, both on people and on society. Which is another way of saying that I prefer to see the story focus on the characters and their aims and hopes in life rather than the mechanics. Good characterisation and character development are for me one of the keys to a compelling story, the others being the story and characters arcs.

 

[SamazonE]

I think magic is a blank page, a fantasy element without cause and effect. It is integral to an object it is used upon. Gravity is not magic, nor a falling object, but it holds it together.

The user of magic is a learned scholar, not an ephemeral concept, that is why it works. He is the user of magic and holds it together. He is the decider on how it works and how it should be used. He does not create magic. He does not benefit from it. He holds it in his mind, body and soul.

The trade off with magic, is responsibility for that magic, as the guarantor of its secrets. A user does not know how to create it, but learns of its beginning and end, through books and lore. The creator of magic is also no guarantor of its personal secrets.

If I knew of magic, I would not tell anyone. I would feel this way, because magic can be very different all of a sudden. They can find out on their own, with their intellect. They are recognised by their own kind, and useful in secret ways, it is not an uncommon concept.

 

[pmmg]

This is only my opinion that when there is a magic there should be separate rules for it. And there should be a strongest element and weak element and we can create a entirely new element when we combine the two diff elements. And the main thing is even when someone has a weakest magic element but they train hard and make that the strongest. that's what makes it look cool and badass at least that's what I think....

That's a pretty specific expectation for the broad question I asked. Might this be how the magic system works in the story you are trying to tell?

It is not uncommon, especially in stories where magic plays a high role, for there to be discrepancy in skill, and the protag has to grow to master something, or learn something over the course of the story to defeat the villain at the end. I dont think stories have much a natural way of working if the power balance does not favor the villains throughout much of the tale. The good guys always need something to strive for.

Why is this your only opinion on this? If it truly is, I hope you would expand on that thinking before its over.

 

[Bick vire]

That's a pretty specific expectation for such broad question I asked. Might this be how the magic system works in the story you are trying to tell?

It is not uncommon, especially in stories where magic plays a high role, for there to be discrepancy in skill, and the protag has to grow to master something, or learn something over the course of the story to defeat the villain at the end. I dont think stories have much a natural way of working if the power balance does not favor the villains throughout much of the tale. The good guys always need something to strive for.

Why is this your only opinion on this? If it truly is, I hope you would expand on that thinking before its over.

Well yes it is but not in my current story "the lost stone and the forgotten pact".
I have another story in my mind that i haven't started writing yet but yes that's how the magic system work on that one.
And I said that it's only my opinion because the concept magic is like a blank paper we can do what ever we want with it either creating rules or just adding strongest and weakest elements, creating a new type of magic that doesn't even exist there are infinite no of possibilities we can do whatever we want with magic and also everyone has a different perspective towards the concept known as magic and it's possible that few other people may also have a same perspective as me...

 

[pmmg]

I wonder if the answer to this depends on whether you like hard or soft magic, in the same sense as hard or soft SF? I'm also not sure that fantasy implies magic. Fantasy certainly suggests that there might be magic in the setting and story, but it isn't a given.

Well...I am sure there can be stories that would make it as fantasy stories, but the definition of fantasy story of is stated as having magical or fantastical elements, where things happen but there is no explanation. That's pretty hard baked into the perception by the world at large, whether we fantasy writer types can argue against it or not.

The other thing I like to see explored is the effects of using magic. To take another example, does using magic make the spell caster tired? Could that be used against them? Is there any other price to be paid for using magic? The latter is interesting as it gives opportunities for character development, a sort of internal debate as to whether being a spell caster is worth the price.

I always recall most strongly the sorceress from one of the Sinbad movies, having her leg turned into a birds leg because of the cost of magic. Somehow, while I have seen costs in other stories, none struck me as truly costly as that one. I think many have that magic should have a cost, and mostly in the wear and tear on the caster, but the cost oft times is more in risk and less in immediate disaster on screen. In the Last Air Bender, for example, the cost of using his powers was that he could turn into avatar mode and be slain in it...thus, little Ang avoided going into avatar mode as much as he could. And when he did go into it, its was always a close call, but never actually penetrated. Use of the force, in Star Wars was always a struggle towards taking the dark path or finding reasons to use the force for selfish reasons. One was always capable of joining the dark side, with all the bad consequences of it.

I am not sure there was much of a cost in Harry Potter others than you might get the other students to laugh at you, or the teachers to snap at you. I supposed the danger was the draw to join Voldemort or use one of the forbidden spells. but there was not much of a cost past that.

There's also the small question of the difference between some new technology and magic. The new technology might be seen as magic by those who'd never come across it before and who didn't understand how it worked. Depending on how you set things up an inventor might be accused of sorcery just for developing a simple steam engine. What effect would that have on technological development? On peoples attitudes to new things?

My question with this is always...necessity is the mother of invention. If I can already cast a spell to make coffee, why do i need to invent a coffee maker machine? I think magic would cease a lot of technology to never get invented, or iterated very much.

 

[ThinkerX]

I my worlds, magic is PSI ability.

I wanted 'magic' that would work in a fantasy setting, yet would also be at least somewhat plausible in contemporary real-world stories.

I spent a long time trying to make 'game magic' (AD&D and Warhammer), trying to fit that bill. AD&D flopped, Warhammer was closer, but no.

So, I finally dug into my old books on people attempting to investigate real-world psi abilities. Some of these investigators could make cases of sorts for things like ESP and telekinesis, among others. Not great cases, but not horrible, either. I decided to assume for story purposes that these PSI abilities were 'real,' and that there were people on other planets with vastly greater psi ability than here on Earth. Cue the naturally psionic 'ancient aliens,' who moved groups of humans and other races to distant planets, and later genetically imbued select individuals with enhanced psi ability before their civilizations imploded.

Common abilities include 'Fixing' (a TK superglue or lube), Healing (convincing the body to heal itself), Bodily enhancement (bursts of strength, speed, or holding one's breath for an insanely long time), Scrying (Remote Viewing), Growth (accelerating plant growth, entangling others), Charm (hypnotism ramped up to 11), Illusion (trickery combined with manipulation of light), Pyrokinesis, and Teleportation.

To this, I added complementary elements from Lovecraft and magic as it was perceived in the ancient world. Specifically, 'True Names' that were attached to power, often malevolent entities from some other dimension. These entities have vastly superior psi abilities than mortals.

Added to this are assorted runes, rituals, charms, and potions of varying effectiveness, much of it derived from the ancient aliens.

This results in moderately powerful hereditary 'wizards,' in fantasy worlds, while leaving open the possibility of much less potent psi folk on Earth.

 

[pmmg]

I think magic is a blank page, a fantasy element without cause and effect. It is integral to an object it is used upon. Gravity is not magic, nor a falling object, but it holds it together.

The user of magic is a learned scholar, not an ephemeral concept, that is why it works. He is the user of magic and holds it together. He is the decider on how it works and how it should be used. He does not create magic. He does not benefit from it. He holds it in his mind, body and soul.

The trade off with magic, is responsibility for that magic, as the guarantor of its secrets. A user does not know how to create it, but learns of its beginning and end, through books and lore. The creator of magic is also no guarantor of its personal secrets.

If I knew of magic, I would not tell anyone. I would feel this way, because magic can be very different all of a sudden. They can find out on their own, with their intellect. They are recognised by their own kind, and useful in secret ways, it is not an uncommon concept.

I had trouble making sense of this. I find most of it has me asking questions Why would one who uses magic use it and not benefit from it?

 

[pmmg]

While I dont think its important to have magic all planned out, I do think it is useful to have an idea of how grounded the role of magic is going to be in one's story. As an author, I would most want to avoid something the was just very inconsistent with the portrayal of magic. If magic has been shown to require great effort and little reward, it would not do for it to come with great ease later in the tale, at least not without some explanation as to how that could come about.

The more concret the magic system is, the more thought out I think it has to be. The Magic of HP for example, needs to be consistent cause its components and effects play prominently into the narrative of he story. If Harry says the wrong words, all the readers will know, and the spell should not work.

Magic is tough in that it has great potential to solve any problem, but if magic is to be this way, it would seem the Antag and Protag need to have equal understanding and ability in casting magic. If the protag can bring up whirlwinds and fire, the Antag needs to be able to do so as well.

In my own story, magic if vague, and almost not present. Its source has become scarce and the connection to magic is somewhat race dependant, and those magic using races are becoming fewer and further between. For my story there is a silver dust that pervades into everything and the silver dust has a type of magic capability attached to it. But an angry God has reclaimed much of its power, leaving the dust inert. The world also has ley lines and places where various types of magic have pooled. Different races have had various degrees of success in finding other sources of magic, but for most of the world, it is hard to come by, and to use often causes unwanted side effects. While magic still remains predictable for those that use it. Those magic using characters would not be unwise to also have a sword for those just in case moments.

Magic does not play a key role in the story, which is to say, magic is not key to the conflict of the story. It is a sword and sorcery story with a heavy emphasis on sword over sorcery. Therefore, the magic system remaining vague fits the tone of the story. The MC is not out to learn and understand magic. It they were, I would have to define it more.

But magic is important, and does play a big role in the story, even if it is used in minor ways. Without it, the world would be entirely different.

 

[A. E. Lowan]

I usually boil most things I would make compelling down to risk. Risk makes the world go, and Conflict = Story. And I do love tasty, tasty conflict. Whatever form magic takes, risk should be a factor. Or else all we get is a bad magic show where the seats are a bit sticky and the popcorn wasn't made today.

 

[skip.knox]

(PS: would one of the Mods be kind enough to put a question mark on the end of my title, thx).

Done. Like magic.

 

[skip.knox]

I'm interested to hear pmmg's take on Altearth magic.

The basic rule is this: magic is unreliable.
The second rule is: different people have different explanations for how magic works.

The result of all this is, there are people who do things that sometimes are quite astounding and other times aren't, and the reasons for this are not especially clear.

That magic works in this erratic way in Altearth can be laid primarily to the author's disinclination to explain things in detail. I liked the idea that magic wasn't just this one thing that could be explained by a system, no matter how esoteric. Then I started thinking how such a situation might lead to some interesting consequences. There are things that some people do that are called magic, and some things that are considered "wonders", and still other things that are mysterious. And some people think they have quite precise explanations for all this, while there are other people who simply refer to tradition or religion or whatever.

All this, I freely confess, stems from yrs truly having a natural resistance to "systems". I like to make stuff up as I go. I like to dodge explanatory material where I can get away with it.

So, pmmg, in your considered opinion, does this sort of evasionary writing (yes, I just made up a word), make for something less than fantasy? I'm genuinely interested in your opinion, and in the opinion of any others who wish to weigh in.

 

[Mad Swede]

Well...I am sure there can be stories that would make it as fantasy stories, but the definition of fantasy story of is stated as having magical or fantastical elements, where things happen but there is no explanation. That's pretty hard baked into the perception by the world at large, whether we fantasy writer types can argue against it or not.

Is it? The Oxford Dictionary of Literature defines fantasy as "a general term for any kind of fictional work that is not primarily devoted to realistic representation of the known world. "

Now that can include magical elements, but it could be enough to set a story in a secondary world. Whilst we're discussing the English term here we should be aware that other nations and languages have different definitions of what constitutes fantasy.

One example of a secondary or alternate world setting without magic would be Richard Cowper's book The Piper at the Gates of Dawn, which opens the White Bird of Kinship series.

I always recall most strongly the sorceress from one of the Sinbad movies, having her leg turned into a birds leg because of the cost of magic. Somehow, while I have seen costs in other stories, none struck me as truly costly as that one. I think many have that magic should have a cost, and mostly in the wear and tear on the caster, but the cost oft times is more in risk and less in immediate disaster on screen. In the Last Air Bender, for example, the cost of using his powers was that he could turn into avatar mode and be slain in it...thus, little Ang avoided going into avatar mode as much as he could. And when he did go into it, its was always a close call, but never actually penetrated. Use of the force, in Star Wars was always a struggle towards taking the dark path or finding reasons to use the force for selfish reasons. One was always capable of joining the dark side, with all the bad consequences of it.

I am not sure there was much of a cost in Harry Potter others than you might get the other students to laugh at you, or the teachers to snap at you. I supposed the danger was the draw to join Voldemort or use one of the forbidden spells. but there was not much of a cost past that.

I think you're oversimplifying the question, or possibly I'm being unclear. Let's suppose some person becomes an all-powerful mage. What is the personal price they pay for this? The ability to do something brings with it a responsibility with regard to how that power is used. How does this mage stop themselves being manipulated by others, and where does that leave their trust in other people? What does that mean for their personal relationships?

My question with this is always...necessity is the mother of invention. If I can already cast a spell to make coffee, why do i need to invent a coffee maker machine? I think magic would cease a lot of technology to never get invented, or iterated very much.

For you as a spell caster there would be no need. But suppose some person has a desire for coffee and no access to a spell caster. What happens if they invent a coffee machine? The implications are quite interesting. Is there a need for spell casters in a world where people dream up technical solutions to problems? How do spell casters deal with what may be a threat to them and their livelihood?

 

[pmmg]

I think I am good enough to maintain confidence. My dictionary of choice is the FreeOnlineDictionary, but AI Summations seem to be challenging them, and all the others for the job. But below is a sample of what a google search will provide.


AI SUmmary: Fantasy writing is a genre of literature characterized by its inclusion of magical elements, supernatural occurrences, and often otherworldly settings not bound by the rules of the real world.

Wiwipedia: Fantasy is a genre of speculative fiction that involves supernatural or magical elements, often including imaginary places and creatures.

Cambridge Dictionary: a type of story or literature that is set in a magical world, often involving traditional myths and magical creatures and sometimes ideas or events from the real world, especially from the medieval period of history:

Dictionary.com: a genre of fiction involving magical, folkloric, or mythical elements. I've been reading a lot of fantasy lately. Literature. Also an imaginative or fanciful ...

TheFreeOnlineDictionary: Fantasy literature is literature set in an imaginary universe, often but not always without any locations, events, or people from the real world. Magic, the supernatural and magical creatures are common in many of these imaginary worlds. Fantasy literature may be directed at both children and adults. <--the one I use most.

Writing Explained: Define fantasy in literature: In summation, a work of fantasy fiction includes settings that are imaginary and often times magical in nature. The characters in ...


We can play a game of which dictionary says what, but I will accept the some don't say it. But it is true that many do conflate fantasy fiction with magic. More so, when you are doing a compare of SciFi and fantasy. One is which is defined as a story in which the impossible happens, but there is an effort to provide a scientific reason as to why, and a story in which the impossible happens, but it is explained away by magic.

 

[pmmg]

I think you're oversimplifying the question, or possibly I'm being unclear. Let's suppose some person becomes an all-powerful mage. What is the personal price they pay for this? The ability to do something brings with it a responsibility with regard to how that power is used. How does this mage stop themselves being manipulated by others, and where does that leave their trust in other people? What does that mean for their personal relationships?

I may have gone off on the wrong tanget. Magic having a cost, for me most hit home in the sinbad movie. Everythings else, that I am aware of, was kind of a make believe cost. I never had fear that it would really hurt the spell caster. What you are saying here is almost an investigation of the cost as it applies to the character. For which, that would have to come via an author devoting to such in their tale, for which...I am not sure how many will go down this road. I can speak to how magic affects things in my tales, but they won't be the same as others. For me, the need for magic almost like drug. I drive various mages insane with their power, and when it is revoked, they become desapare to find another source of it. This need for it kind of leads to their damnation. There is an investigation of the sins of the old races in the story, but it is not the main story. The current crop of POV characters dont have use of magic, they just encounter some of the old races that did.

I could recommend my very old story, which is still on amazon The Ruby Cage. It shows the high cost of magic in a tragic sort of way. 2 reviews. It could use more love.

For you as a spell caster there would be no need. But suppose some person has a desire for coffee and no access to a spell caster. What happens if they invent a coffee machine? The implications are quite interesting. Is there a need for spell casters in a world where people dream up technical solutions to problems? How do spell casters deal with what may be a threat to them and their livelihood?

Very interesting. Magic means there needs not be technology, but technology means their need not be magic. What happens if there are both?

I am not sure. Sounds like a good backdrop for a book.

 

[pmmg]

I'm interested to hear pmmg's take on Altearth magic.

The basic rule is this: magic is unreliable.
The second rule is: different people have different explanations for how magic works.

The result of all this is, there are people who do things that sometimes are quite astounding and other times aren't, and the reasons for this are not especially clear.

That magic works in this erratic way in Altearth can be laid primarily to the author's disinclination to explain things in detail. I liked the idea that magic wasn't just this one thing that could be explained by a system, no matter how esoteric. Then I started thinking how such a situation might lead to some interesting consequences. There are things that some people do that are called magic, and some things that are considered "wonders", and still other things that are mysterious. And some people think they have quite precise explanations for all this, while there are other people who simply refer to tradition or religion or whatever.

All this, I freely confess, stems from yrs truly having a natural resistance to "systems". I like to make stuff up as I go. I like to dodge explanatory material where I can get away with it.

So, pmmg, in your considered opinion, does this sort of evasionary writing (yes, I just made up a word), make for something less than fantasy? I'm genuinely interested in your opinion, and in the opinion of any others who wish to weigh in.

Pmmg's opinion coming up...

And I must ask, why would an unreliable magic system make for something less than fantasy? I think you can still have fantasy without magic, and your story still has magic, it's just unreliable.

I've not read any of Alt Earth, but I love the idea of unreliable magic. Just the thought of that strikes me as maddening. If I was a wizard who could use magic, I would never be sure if I could rely on it to send that fireball or not. I would have to carry a sword just in case, and I might have a very hard time explaining why I could use lightning to kill off a horde of goblins on one effort, but I am not able to when the next horde of goblins shows up. (specially if the Mayor was there, and the Shire Reeve.)

You may be able to pass this off as the author is lazy, but to me, it speaks to something is wrong in the magic realm--or the alt magic space where things of magic kind of reside. Like suppose magic all flowed through some giant crystal at the heart of the Earth, but the crystal was cracked and broken. One day the city is over the largest piece and so Goblin's get destroyed, but on another, its over just a tiny shard: Lightning hits one goblin and fizzles.

If I dont know anything about the crystal, I really dont know anything about how magic works. I just know it does sometimes and not others.

For me, this would be part of the struggle the characters must figure out, but I suspect alt earth does not lend itself to this.

In my own world, I made magic understandable...in that it has a type of power source and some can tap into it, while at the same time, never really explaining it. But my magic system is understood as once being more powerful than it is in the present story, and very few can actually wield it. But I could have made it not understood, I just didn't.

I dont know that the clarity of how the magic works has much to do with is a story a fantasy or not. If I have a story with a dragon and a unicorn in it, but there is no magic, I think it would still be called a fantasy story. Your story has magic, it's just not defined. It must make for very bold characters to claim to be able to wield it, when maybe the magic is not there to support it.

In your world, I think knowing magic might mean I still couldn't quit my day job. I better get all those same metal things the other adventurers get before leaving home.

I like the term evasionary writing. Typically, if one is writing in an evasionary way, I would think they are making a mistake in their story. The readers won't really appreciate that. But it may work in the case of Alt Earth. I am sure it works for some.

Maybe evasionary might be types as writing in an evasive way. My spell checker does not like that word

 

[ThinkerX]

Magic in my system does have costs.

The first is simple: casting magic can be exhausting, leaving the caster tired and hungry.

The second is ethos. A wizard's ethos shapes what they can do with their magic. Wizards who consistently go against their ethos run a high risk of having their magic fade or even vanish.

'White' (Good) is the first ethos. These wizards see magic as a tool for teaching, healing, protection, nd enlightenment. Directly casting spells for money is usually, though not always, a violation of this ethos. Gifts are acceptable. Many take a sort of 'salary approach,' which covers both magical and nonmagical services. Likewise, using magic to kill or inflict harm outside of an emergency or special situation is a violation.

'Gray' (Knowledge) is the second ethos. Learning bout the world or some aspect of it motivates these wizards. IF it serves the knowledge goal, these wizards can use harmful magic or cast spells for money. Should that drive fade...

'Black' (Power) is the third ethos. These wizards seek authority over others and are not shy about inflicting harm to obtain/maintain it. They often see themselves as 'chosen' and may be aristocrats. However, their power is a heavy weight hanging from a fraying cord.

'Sworn' are wizards dedicated to a specific cause, somewhat like Gray wizards. They are often in the military. This ethos lets them use harmful magic if the Cause requires it. Stray from that...

These ethos can be combined. White wizards are often scholars (gray), and 'White/Black' is not unknown. (Well-meaning dictator types.)

 

[pmmg]

Magic in my system does have costs.

The first is simple: casting magic can be exhausting, leaving the caster tired and hungry.

The second is ethos. A wizard's ethos shapes what they can do with their magic. Wizards who consistently go against their ethos run a high risk of having their magic fade or even vanish.

'White' (Good) is the first ethos. These wizards see magic as a tool for teaching, healing, protection, nd enlightenment. Directly casting spells for money is usually, though not always, a violation of this ethos. Gifts are acceptable. Many take a sort of 'salary approach,' which covers both magical and nonmagical services. Likewise, using magic to kill or inflict harm outside of an emergency or special situation is a violation.

'Gray' (Knowledge) is the second ethos. Learning bout the world or some aspect of it motivates these wizards. IF it serves the knowledge goal, these wizards can use harmful magic or cast spells for money. Should that drive fade...

'Black' (Power) is the third ethos. These wizards seek authority over others and are not shy about inflicting harm to obtain/maintain it. They often see themselves as 'chosen' and may be aristocrats. However, their power is a heavy weight hanging from a fraying cord.

'Sworn' are wizards dedicated to a specific cause, somewhat like Gray wizards. They are often in the military. This ethos lets them use harmful magic if the Cause requires it. Stray from that...

These ethos can be combined. White wizards are often scholars (gray), and 'White/Black' is not unknown. (Well-meaning dictator types.)

Somehow, through this description, I can still feel the staleness of it on the world. I am not sure where Kyle fits in but I suspect he's not serving his ethos. Having read two of your books. I feel the Cthulhu aspects to it, and magic seems hard to perform. I dont feel strongly that it is all psi ability. Magic seems hard to perform, and not to have a very great reward. The evil wizard (I think it is Salam) feels like he has a connection to elder races and not so much that he has high Psi. But there are many books left. I dont know much about this system, but I can feel it hanging on kyle like he's not really a match for it. He seems like he would be happier with a sword than another magic lesson. But...he has been pegged into that hole. Everyone is pushing him to pursue magic. I do think you heros need to get good with magic though, they seem ill prepared to fight with the villains straight up. The villains have better magic and can probably bring those type of Cthulhu beast to come help. Peter, Tia and Kyle need to up their game.

 

[ThinkerX]

Somehow, through this description, I can still feel the staleness of it on the world. I am not sure where Kyle fits in but I suspect he's not serving his ethos. Having read two of your books. I feel the Cthulhu aspects to it, and magic seems hard to perform. I dont feel strongly that it is all psi ability. Magic seems hard to perform, and not to have a very great reward. The evil wizard (I think it is Salam) feels like he has a connection to elder races and not so much that he has high Psi. But there are many books left. I dont know much about this system, but I can feel it hanging on kyle like he's not really a match for it. He seems like he would be happier with a sword than another magic lesson. But...he has been pegged into that hole. Everyone is pushing him to pursue magic. I do think you heros need to get good with magic though, they seem ill prepared to fight with the villains straight up. The villains have better magic and can probably bring those type of Cthulhu beast to come help. Peter, Tia and Kyle need to up their game.

Kyle was 'sworn' during the war. His ethos wasn't quite enough to keep him 'on track.' In 'Country' and 'Capital,' Kyle is basically coasting, at severe risk of losing his powers; hence, magic is hard for him. As for Silam and Li-Pang, those two are not at all what they appear to be. Indeed, their nature and purpose are driving themes of the series.