An idea for a system where rpg mechanics / skills are part of the plot but not sure how to do it

[LostName]

RPG mechanics are all the rage among isekai mangas and all sorts of manhuas and manhwas these days. They can be fun but I always feel like it's kinda of cringe when you quantify everything like a video game where it's down out of necessity to tell the player what's going on rather than because it's so cool.

Normally I'd never use this because it's ultimately too cringe but I just created a setting where it actually makes a lot of sense. It has a focus on characters raiding dungeons via gates like all them popular manhwas but it's all sci fi magitech, the dungeons aren't called dungeons or anything and are virtual but real worlds created through magitech gates (e.g. like the Stargate) and deleted when everyone left but matter brought back from inside the gate-created worlds does not get deleted and is needed to support their home and keep things running.

Because they are from a civilization with highly advanced magitech (which has gone extinct a long time ago so they are in this current state) they have an in-head HUD like e.g. the Terminator but looking more like modern Windows.
And it's precisely this in-head HUD that has a focus on supporting Hunters, who used to be a part of that extinct civilization's military, which would quantify and categorize everything to make it easier to gauge progress and training and make it easier to apply learned techniques.

I'm not sure how to go about it as it would be mainly descriptive but just now I thought that it's all magitech so the in-head HUD could be linked to nano-magitech inside their body magic genetic engineering or whatever and they could actually learn skills this way but I certainly do not want to just use the generic as-is rpg mechanics everyone uses cause that's just lame.

 

[Queshire]

Well, my first advice is to learn to appreciate what you're doing. =_=

 

[Devor]

I don't mean to sound snarky or anything, but are you writing a novel or a graphic webtoon? I've seen HUDs in webtoons and anime, but I've never read a book with one, so I don't know how well it translates to text. I guess it would mean interrupting paragraphs with bracketed lines like [Your skill, SAGE, is in effect.]?

Whenever I've seen a social skill in one of these stories, they tend to be very descriptive. They get names like "acting" or "steel mentality" or "sense of justice," and they cover just about anything you'd imagine based on their names. Sometimes part of the idea is that just about everyone has one or two of these personality skills at the heart of their character.

What exactly are you asking?

 

[barrowyarrow]

When you try to quantify your characters skills with numbers it's kinda hard to shake that video gamey feel when you read it. I'd say if you want to do something like that you just need to embrace the cringe. Lean into it so it feels less like you're trying to sound so cool and more like you're being self aware with what your story reads as.

 

[ThinkerX]

It is called 'Lit-RPG' and is a major fantasy subgroup. I have seen it done in several different ways. Most of those ways didn't work too well.

 

[Rexenm]

It sounds angry. The whole point of a computer game is to grind, I don’t know if books work the same way.

Say you actually got this thing up and running, it would probably be for personal enjoyment, not reaching a wider audience.

I think HUd would be like antimatter, and the gate, alternate reality. Just saying.

 

[SpecterOcelot]

I'm not quite sure if you're asking more of "How would I go about writing this into my world?", or if you're looking for more of advice on how the RPG rules system itself should function, mechanically.

If it's the former, I'd just go about it by referencing it from time to time, as opposed to really making it a main focus of the narrative structure. It can be a cool, interesting piece of lore about the world that everyone sees this virtual HUD in front of their eyes at all times without you having to inform the reader every single time something happens in it. Ex. instead of writing a health/damage readout every time the character takes a hit in combat scenes, save mentioning it until they've just stumbled across an enemy that will really challenge them, has bettered them quite thoroughly. NOW let the readers know that their HUD is flashing red urgently, maybe showing scan readouts of their injured limbs, maybe a small program in the upper corner is showing a suggested route to escape. The character notices the map with said escape route, now they are faced with a choice. Do they stay and push their luck to get that extra loot, or protect their group, and possibly get them selves killed? Or do they play it safe and run, possibly bringing shame upon themselves later?

Use it as a device to enhance your plot and I think you'll be just fine. If you treat it like a gimmick, the audience will as well.

Now, if you're asking how the Mechanics system for the world or the HUD should operate.... there's a reason why the majority of RPG mechanics are basically the same across works that implement them. Once you really start to break down things like "how does leveling up or skill progression work?" and "why are progression systems designed the way they are?" you get into logical strings like--

In reality people get better at things by doing them, or you can deus ex progression onto characters by giving them "powers" derived from an external source. Or since you specifically are utilizing magitech, do certain "cybernetic" implants/systems impart aptitudes on their host?

If you take progression by performance route, how do you represent that the character has gained progression in a skill once they've used it? Do they just level up mining, every single day when they go out an mine? Do they get more traditional experience points each time they perform the action?

The implants route, are they widely available, or expensive coveted relics from a bygone society? Can you buy them anywhere, or are they regulated in any ways? etc.... etc...

The RPG systems that are utilized widely are so because people really have taken time (decades) of time to think about how these systems should work logically but also in an easy to comprehend manner for the audience. Getting away from them in any substantial way would require a whole reworking of how we think about RPGs as gaming systems, methinks.

 

[Prince of Spires]

What you described is a part of a setting, nothing more. You can tell all sorts of different stories in different (sub)genres within that setting. You could go with a Romance or a Horror story if you want. So if you don't want to write Lit-RPG, then don't. Plenty of SciFi stories feature HUD's and implants and Dungeon like places. As such, I agree with Queshire if you don't like writing it, then don't.

If you do want to write a Lit-RPG style story, then maybe check out Dungeon Crawler Carl. I haven't read it, but from what I gather, it's one of the best Lit-RPG stories out there at the moment. There is also the Delicious in Dungeon manga series on Netflix. Though that doesn't have the level-system as a focus, it is very much a Lit-RPG type story.

If you want to focus on the progression side of things, consider reading the Cradle series by Will Wight, which is one of the best out there. As a side effect, he also has a HUD-like system on some of his characters, so you can also see how he does it.

 

[Queshire]

I keep seeing Dungeon Crawler Carl recommended, but the premise has always been a turn off for me. Still, I have an audible credit burning a hole in my pocket and nothing better to spend it on.

Delicious in the Dungeon is a great story. I highly recommend it on its own merits. I'm not sure how useful it is here? The story puts a lot of work into looking at what would be required for a D&D style dungeon to naturally exist in the world and the impacts that would have. With the rifts LostName describes being virtually created worlds such a naturalized nature isn't as required.

Cradle is good. It establishes the power ceiling early on and has events at the highest level affect the protagonists instead of being essentially being utterly divorced from the protagonist until they reach that level of power. It also has some grear examples of how to marry sci fi and fantasy elements. Mind, it's a good example of a progression series as a whole. It doesn't have levels, attributes or skills represented by numbers or anything specific to rpg mechanics like that.

 

[pmmg]

I'm gonna also say, i am not sure the question. I could not make sense of the second paragraph.

Is the question just, 'how do I write a story with an HUD system as part of the character experience?'

To this, I would say, any game system may try to be all encompassing, but it will always fall short. An HUD, and nanobots can only measure so much. It may be there is some objective measure of how a skill might improve, such as, if I practice, I may be able to jump further, and the 'System' can know that, and say Jump Skill: 21 feet, but people are dynamic and things always change. Maybe today, I cannot jump as far....

So, in story form, I think you would either be showing the tale through a limited set of capabilities, or....part of the story must be about what is not really fitting into the HUD system.

As far as writing it, I am not sure the special difficulty in that. Just write it.

Bob's HUD said he lost 10% of the strength in his right arm. He did not need the system, he could already feel it in the dull pain of his shoulder...

 

[LostName]

I don't mean to sound snarky or anything, but are you writing a novel or a graphic webtoon? I've seen HUDs in webtoons and anime, but I've never read a book with one, so I don't know how well it translates to text. I guess it would mean interrupting paragraphs with bracketed lines like [Your skill, SAGE, is in effect.]?

Whenever I've seen a social skill in one of these stories, they tend to be very descriptive. They get names like "acting" or "steel mentality" or "sense of justice," and they cover just about anything you'd imagine based on their names. Sometimes part of the idea is that just about everyone has one or two of these personality skills at the heart of their character.

What exactly are you asking?

purely for fun, not publishing in any way.
In a fictional timeline it would be some audiovisual media like a tv series or whatever as I read a lot of sci fi / fantasy novels but I don't really like the medium itself and obviously it could not be a game.

 

[LostName]

It sounds angry. The whole point of a computer game is to grind, I don’t know if books work the same way.

Say you actually got this thing up and running, it would probably be for personal enjoyment, not reaching a wider audience.

I think HUd would be like antimatter, and the gate, alternate reality. Just saying.

Why would games exist for grinding? Not everything is life service. Though of course that's the point of mmorpgs which are the inspiration for all the non-game stories with game mechanics.

And what do you mean with Antimatter and alternate realities?

Well, my first advice is to learn to appreciate what you're doing. =_=

I am not 100% onboard with it and if I cannot find a way I feel is not as cringe as many manwhas / manhuas / mangas using this I just won't.
It's just that it synergizes well with the setting as their in-head HUD was made specifically to assist in training and combat and for both precise quantification of your own abilities, enemy abilities and resource / health counters are an incredibly valuable asset.

And changing up from the standard way of learning new skills and abilities the way I do it normally sounds interesting, especially since this all magic in the end I like the idea of the in-head HUD not just being about data but actually powering Hunters up.

 

[LostName]

What you described is a part of a setting, nothing more. You can tell all sorts of different stories in different (sub)genres within that setting. You could go with a Romance or a Horror story if you want. So if you don't want to write Lit-RPG, then don't. Plenty of SciFi stories feature HUD's and implants and Dungeon like places. As such, I agree with Queshire if you don't like writing it, then don't.

If you do want to write a Lit-RPG style story, then maybe check out Dungeon Crawler Carl. I haven't read it, but from what I gather, it's one of the best Lit-RPG stories out there at the moment. There is also the Delicious in Dungeon manga series on Netflix. Though that doesn't have the level-system as a focus, it is very much a Lit-RPG type story.

If you want to focus on the progression side of things, consider reading the Cradle series by Will Wight, which is one of the best out there. As a side effect, he also has a HUD-like system on some of his characters, so you can also see how he does it.

Dungeon Meshi has no rpg mechanics lol.
It's more like Solo Leveling or at least Danmachi. Danmachi does a good job at having rpg mechanics without spamming them nonstop as main part of the actual plot but due to the in-head HUD, which is a crucial aspect of the setting as incredibly advanced magitech civilization (e.g. Polity style), low key use of rpg mechanics cannot work.

TBH I am now leaning towards quantification without real numbers but using symbols or bars only. Also would make sense because health would be shown as summary so e.g. a flesh wound only reduces the health bar a little but a lost limb or a broken spine reduce it a lot (for beings with a biology similar to humans).

 

[Rexenm]

Why would games exist for grinding? Not everything is life service. Though of course that's the point of mmorpgs which are the inspiration for all the non-game stories with game mechanics.

And what do you mean with Antimatter and alternate realities?

Well, antimatter is a generalisation, I guess I could have easily have said holographics or volumetric, but if you take gaming seriously, it is because of grinding, that you do it.