Bad Writing Advice

[BWFoster78]

I think that's right. The one thing I would like to point out, however, is that these days you have to produce quantity as well. This seems to be especially true if you're going to self-publish, and looks like it is becoming more true of traditionally-published authors.

I agree.

Part of it is an economy of scale consideration. If I spend time and effort promoting a single book, my chances for profit are limited to that sole book. With two books, every person that finds the one I'm promoting is a potential customer for the other one. At some point, it becomes worth the time you spend doing promotions.

For some writers, step 1 takes way too long because of endless edits and revisions. If you're starting out putting a book out there every three years, I think the odds are you're going to have problems.

I agree that, once you enter the market, you need to follow with new products relatively quickly. For your first novel, however, you need to make sure you're ready.

My first book is taking a long time because I'm still on the steep part of the learning curve. Every time I think it's "good enough," I discover my ability has transcended where I was when I completed the previous version. I think (hope) that my last leap added the final missing ingredient.

Regardless, I think I'm justified in taking the time to get a first book right. I had to go through that learning process, and I don't think putting out something subpar would have helped me.

I can only hope that future books will go faster since my rate of increase in ability will slow significantly.

 

[A. E. Lowan]

I think that's right. The one thing I would like to point out, however, is that these days you have to produce quantity as well. This seems to be especially true if you're going to self-publish, and looks like it is becoming more true of traditionally-published authors.

For some writers, step 1 takes way too long because of endless edits and revisions. If you're starting out putting a book out there every three years, I think the odds are you're going to have problems.

I also agree. I'm seeing working writers out there talking about putting out at least 1 - 2 titles per year, sometimes more if they're working multiple series. It's hard to balance reader expectations of quality with this economy of scale, but it's becoming part of the business. We're just going to have to learn to keep up.

I think economy is one of the big reasons series are so popular these days, too - readers like to have characters they can invest in, characters they know with a writer they trust and spend time with from one book to the next, as opposed to only have a few hundred pages and then "The End." They're more reluctant to put their limited entertainment budgets at risk on a new name or a new character. But, revisiting Brian's earlier comment...

How many times have you read an author's early stuff and really enjoyed it. Then, their later stuff falls a bit flat. Turns out, in the beginning they really put the time and effort in to make it right and listened to their editor's advice. Later, their heads grew with their pocketbooks, and they started just churning stuff out.

I've seen writers I've followed for years doing this, and I've got to say it's very disappointing to watch. It seems to me that they just don't get edited after a while, generally once their names get larger than their book titles, and unless they're watching themselves closely and insisting on holding themselves to the highest standards their publishers will literally put anything with their name on it out there secure in the knowledge that it will sell. Pity. I, for one, am in no hurry to read these authors anymore.

 

[C Hollis]

I think that's right. The one thing I would like to point out, however, is that these days you have to produce quantity as well.

You only "have" to do this if you want to make money right here, right now. Myself? I'm in no big hurry. You see, while these bozo's are cranking out crap title after crap title, I will be plodding along, honing my craft, and improving with each title. I would like to think everything I put out is high quality, but I would only be fooling myself. I do know, however, that my slow release, quality over quantity method will win in the end.

Why do I know this, you ask?

I've seen writers I've followed for years doing this, and I've got to say it's very disappointing to watch. It seems to me that they just don't get edited after a while, generally once their names get larger than their book titles, and unless they're watching themselves closely and insisting on holding themselves to the highest standards their publishers will literally put anything with their name on it out there secure in the knowledge that it will sell. Pity. I, for one, am in no hurry to read these authors anymore.

That is the sentiment of most customers.

Eventually the truth catches up to the crowd not concerned with quality of work. And that's when this guy rolls on by on his moped that gets 80mpg, while hotrod stands on the roadside waiting for a lift.

 

[Steerpike]

You only "have" to do this if you want to make money right here, right now. Myself? I'm in no big hurry. You see, while these bozo's are cranking out crap title after crap title, I will be plodding along, honing my craft, and improving with each title. I would like to think everything I put out is high quality, but I would only be fooling myself. I do know, however, that my slow release, quality over quantity method will win in the end.

I think that's part of it. I think part of it also marketing and staying in front of the readers, so that you're not effectively re-introducing yourself to your target audience every number of years.

I think either approach can work out in the long run. There are good authors who can put books out at a rate of once per year or more and continuously put out high-quality material. If one has the desire and ability to do that, then great. If waiting, say, three years between titles is the only way to ensure you haven't put out crap, then it is best to wait.

 

[Chessie]

There are good authors who can put books out at a rate of once per year or more and continuously put out high-quality material. If one has the desire and ability to do that, then great. If waiting, say, three years between titles is the only way to ensure you haven't put out crap, then it is best to wait.

This sums it up for me. When is the work ready to be published? I think its a combination of going with your intuition, working with an editor and beta readers. I would love to publish my WIP a year from now, but it may not be ready then. I'll trust and let it go when it feels right, when I know for sure its ready. That varies for all of us.

 

[The Dark One]

I agree.

Part of it is an economy of scale consideration. If I spend time and effort promoting a single book, my chances for profit are limited to that sole book. With two books, every person that finds the one I'm promoting is a potential customer for the other one. At some point, it becomes worth the time you spend doing promotions.



I agree that, once you enter the market, you need to follow with new products relatively quickly. For your first novel, however, you need to make sure you're ready.

My first book is taking a long time because I'm still on the steep part of the learning curve. Every time I think it's "good enough," I discover my ability has transcended where I was when I completed the previous version. I think (hope) that my last leap added the final missing ingredient.

Regardless, I think I'm justified in taking the time to get a first book right. I had to go through that learning process, and I don't think putting out something subpar would have helped me.

I can only hope that future books will go faster since my rate of increase in ability will slow significantly.

Spot on! Sorry if I sound patronising, but this is when you know you're on the right track. When you can spot the weeds amid the flowers you thought so brilliant when you planted them...and then come back again and again and see where the book still needs work because you've grown as a writer and what was good enough before now seems like trite and tinkling garbage...that's when you are seriously finding your voice and learning to refine the raw material into quality.

I honestly wonder how many dilettante writers (and I number myself among these because I still have a day job) ever acquire enough personal insight, taste and skill to see beyond their egos and appreciate the work for what it really is. If you do, you'll know it - partly because of the disgust you feel for your early work - but partly because you will also learn to take other writers' work apart from the perspective of a writer. Plenty of us learn to do that as readers, but when you're automatically deconstructing as a writer you instantly recognise every trick and device the writer throws at you and you're surfing the plot with him/her. Good writing is still enjoyable, even when you're guessing most of what happens, but I really love the writers who can manage to surprise me. It doesn't happen often now, but that's one of the many curses of becoming a serious writer.

 

[JCFarnham]

I think that's part of it. I think part of it also marketing and staying in front of the readers, so that you're not effectively re-introducing yourself to your target audience every number of years.

You've got it spot on there.

We're not talking producing total dren so it'll sell, we're not even saying flood the market. Take a cue from other industries. It's much safer to have more products out in consumer space, and as a business it may be the easiest way to survive. Say someone buys what you're selling, enjoys the experience and wonders if there's anything more. When they find out there isn't... Well, they shrug and effectively forget about you. You may stick in their mind associated with a particular good time in their life, or a smell, maybe a relationship, but that's a lot of mays and mights to rest your income on.

The voracious reader will always finish your back catalogue before you've released anything new. That's a given. That certainly lends credibility to keeping a slow pace, with extra high standards of quality. We must however keep in mind that even if everyone has consumed your only offering you have to stay in their mind somehow if you want your marketing to stand the test of time.

More releases could give you the necessary presence to keep the brand that is your name ticking over ... but so could simply existing fully amongst your fan base. While you plod away at writing great books don't forget to exist outside of the vacuum.

I tend to view getting your second book out there as quick as possible as bad advice. It only serves to strengthen the awkward second book image. You spend years on the first and perhaps half that on the second because your agent says so... Well, do the maths. If you can pull it off, that's great, but there are still other options available in the marketing tool box.

This is why web presence is somewhat key now days. B2C Interaction is the buzz word I'm looking for (if jargon interests you)

 

[wordwalker]

One tip that keeps bugging me is "Said is the best tag"-- not because it's wrong, but because so many people overstate the point. Yes, the most vital tagging lesson is not to use shouted/ said softly/ etc often, but that doesn't mean Said is the only other option. And Said is NOT "invisible" when you use it left and right, or even when you put it in the part of a line that steps on its rhythm.

(I still remember how someone murdered a story by brilliantly relating a Native American legend and then finishing the short story with "That's why Indian children are so well behaved," he said. Argh!)