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How can it get any WORSE?

Caged Maiden

Staff
Article Team
In my original post, and many times after, I clearly stated that what I was experiencing wasn't a mode to eternal character suffering, but a new way to raise stakes and make small situations worse. I used the example of Martin burning homes, killing family, torturing characters as HIS method for story-telling and that my realization came from the trifecta of watching GOT, reading Donald Maass' book about his methods for asking deeper questions to raise tension by adding different layers of "worsening" any given situation, and the conversations Helio and I are having during a very critical rewrite for me.

I didn't agree with Martin's methods, necessarily, I merely acknowledged that it was the first time in my life I FELT the affect of denying me what i thought was logical for a story line's outcome, and he yanked the carrot out of my grip and instead made the situation worse IN HIS WAY.

I said I couldn't put that kind of WORSE into my stories, because I simply am not writing that kind of story, but I can shame a character more, guilt her more, make the stakes higher, risk more, put her feelings up a notch. It is also a "worsening", though it has little actual suffering. I gave an example of Cedrick and his undead problem (please read that, because it's a perfect example of how I advised writers think about HOW to make things worse), I gave the actual problem I was workmen through in the rewrite (the character trying to leave the crime boss and his business) and Helio gave countless examples of how asking yourself the question "How can I make it worse" is a perfectly viable tool for any story-teller.

You have a character at a party? Okay, make it worse.

She sees her ex-fiance at the party and they had a bad breakup. Make it worse.

He's there with her best friend. Ooh, yeah, that's worse. (and maybe you planned that from the beginning, so okay...make it worse).

The friend is noticeably pregnant. Make it worse.

The MC and the guy only broke up six weeks ago...

THAT is how any writer, whether they're writing literary fiction, historical romance, children's lit, YA, Grimdark, paranormal, murder mystery, etc can strategize more immediacy, more tension, and more conflict into their story.

To me, it doesn't always occur to me every deeper possibility when I write a first draft. That's all. I missed opportunities. I failed to fully capitalize on situations I'd constructed. I'd solved things in a logical way sometimes, but failed to push it just a little bit further, making it truly stand-out in a reader's mind.

And yet, through great heaping piles of examples, people continue to hear "Make your characters suffer more" which I said in one paragraph, relating to how Martin communicated this idea to me and caused a breakthrough. And a few paragraphs below, I explained how I was implementing the same tactic, this tool I didn't fully understand (because I felt too, like it was simply a worsening for worsening's sake), and now I saw the light and the potential.

The thing causing a miscommunication here is that we're still talking about "suffering" and "worsening" as though they're the exact same thing, interchangeable words. And to me, they're very different, in about every way imaginable. If you saw your pregnant friend on the arm of your old boyfriend, and it clicked in your head that they were together before you and he broke up...would you call yourself "suffering"? I wouldn't. Pissed is what I'd be. Maybe vengeful? Maybe jealous? Maybe betrayed? It might cause me to react in an open display of hostility at that party, toward my former friend. I might embarrass myself. I might storm out and key his car. I might have a run-in with the law after that.

And all I can say, is that maybe Sheila plans that outburst at the party, the reaction and the run-in with the law, right from the beginning of her writing. Maybe she can do all that and consider all those possibilities when the writing spirit takes her and she just has a gut feeling that it's right from the beginning. But for ME, and for many other writer's I've traded with, they're looking for ways to make more impact. An emotional gut-punch for the reader.

With this tactic, I can take a scene where a girl went to a party and had a splendid time dancing with her new boyfriend, and turn it into a scene that has a little bit of emotional slap in the face. I can then decide whether to change her future actions or not. I mean, the outcome of that scene can be kept original, with her leaving the party with her new boyfriend and keeping her anger inside, or I can cause a volatile reaction, or do anything in between. Any way I chose to go, the ideas is better worse than it was originally TO ME. Because MY goal is to increase the emotional impact of books i'm rewriting that have been LACKING in that department.

SO no, this is not about praising Martin or GOT, merely my saying that he had a very IN YOUR FACE way of making things worse, and the way it affected me led to my eyes opening fully about how many missed opportunities I had. I can make things a little worse for my characters and cash in on that emotional impact for many scenes. Which means my characters and their stories will have more of the impact I personally am aiming for.
 

T.Allen.Smith

Staff
Moderator
I've been thinking a lot about this topic lately, so thank you for that, CM!

I'd like to share another consideration. It's not an original thought, but it does meld with the idea of Making it Worse.

The concept comes from author K.M. Weiland. She has one of the best blogs about writing (Helping Writers Become Authors), a great twitter channel, and even a YouTube channel where she briefly discusses craft topics. I highly recommend checking her out as she communicates well with her audience.

Consider this: SETTING

How can you Make it Worse?

Think of the movie The Patriot, starring Mel Gibson. When Mel's band of rebels is on the lamb from the redcoats, where do they hide?

They hide in a swamp.

Now, that setting could've been written any number of ways, but a swamp is a worsening for the characters. It's bleak. It's damp (which wreaks havoc on a soldier's body and equipment. I know that from personal experience). It's difficult to even build a fire to cook food. Hell, it's hard to even maintain food supplies. Dangerous reptiles abound. And the bugs...don't even get me started on insects. I once saw a bug in a South Carolina swamp that was so large it actually had smaller bug on it! No joke.

Point being, they aren't hiding out in a dry, cozy barn at the edge of town. They're in a setting that makes things worse.

Ever since I read K.M.'s post on the consideration of setting, I've stopped and thought deeper about where my scenes are taking place. Setting matters. If you're intending greater tension or difficulty with the scene, it might behoove you to consider making the situation worse for all involved characters by using a setting that brings added layers of difficulty.
 
I think that we are well beyond the issue of miscommunication. Yes, there is still some miscommunication. But there is something other happening as well.

I don't come to Mythic Scribes forums to read an Encyclopedia Britannica entry, especially not in the Writing Questions forum. I don't take the opening post in a thread as a definitive entry in some inalterable rulebook or encyclopedia. I see it as the opening of a dialogue that can expand my understanding as discussion continues. I can say with absolute certainty that my own understanding of this issue of M.I.W. has expanded during the course of this thread. More than that, it's evolved. And I am grateful for that. I think that opening up a topic is not a setting in stone of commandments to be followed. Changes in opinion, outlook, understanding for the better can happen as a conversation unfolds when people get together to discuss and explore an issue. Since I am often full of questions, this sort of environment can help me quite a bit.
 

Caged Maiden

Staff
Article Team
But again, I'm sure no one will read my voice of reason on this matter, and instead chime in with another poignant post about how "making your characters suffer and rape people isn't a means to better fantasy." Yeah. Because that's exactly what i've been saying, right? I mean, look at my posts, please. I spent hours yesterday reading each line of every post. I've consistently said the same thing in about a dozen ways, and so has Helio, citing dozens of literary fictions examples of how any writer can take a basic concept and find ways to make it more important to a reader.

The main problem with the communication here, is that people believe "make it worse' has a single definition, and perhaps it does, and I'm using the wrong words. But I assure you, "crete more tension" could be just as misconstrued, in that it can be said that "creating tension" could be simply an external or interpersonal mechanism. Is tension an army invading a character's hometown? Or is that "increasing stakes"? When Cedrick needs to learn about an undead creature in a nearby village, and I changed ONLÃ his situation and the circumstances of how he learned about it, did I "Make it more immediate?"

FAIR ENOUGH!!! There are different ways to say the thing I'm doing. I acknowledged early in my personal posts on this subject, that one of the problems was that discussing these concepts, there aren't industry standards for terms. We interpret things differently (and I cited the Writer Voice thread as one we had a hard time defining too).

If Sheila wants to call what i'm experiencing "editing with increased tension" I'm fine with it. The tool still works, my feelings of success are still real, the method can work for other people who want to accomplish similar goals.

Period. That's all I want to say about the experience I've had. It was good. But for those who want to downplay this thing and put it into a neat little box and set it on the dusty shelf of "not good tactic" you cannot cheapen my experience or the impact it's had on my writing spirit. The only thing arguing semantics will further accomplish with me, is to discourage me from ever sharing my personal writing journey on this forum again. I'll share my experience and methods in private emails with the folks I respect and work with, and abandon discussing craft as I've abandoned the majority of threads on this forum because I feel they're not applicable to my personal journey.

So yeah, disagree with MY method if you want, but please show me the respect and courtesy of understanding what I'm saying (because it took me hours to type all those clear sentences) before discounting my whole experience and distilling it down to "writing like GRRM" because I have multiple times shown exactly how I'm applying the lesson I learned and how it can have value to any writer, whether they're writing genre fiction or literary fiction. Whether they plan every possible outcome of their story before writing, or whether they change things and increase impact through editing. NO matter HOW we come to decide to write a particular story, there are always little ways to increase the impact of the story, and the main one I'm focusing on right now, is wringing some more emotional impact out of scenes I loved. BY making situations just a little worse (like introducing not only the best friend on the arm of the ex-boyfriend, but hinting at betrayal) I can cause a little more impact. It doesn't matter if in the next scene of that fake story I show the MC in bed with her new boyfriend, aiming at a graphic scene, or whether my inclination is to instead show the ex come to her house and apologize for the shock and explain that he's not the father of the friend's baby and he didn't betray the MC. I mean, those are two very different stories, but perhaps either of them gained an impact for a reader, based just on taking a situation and making it slightly worse.
 

Caged Maiden

Staff
Article Team
You know, Fifth, the morning I wrote that post, I had just had a spiritually MOVING experience. Something clicked big-time for me. I've been writing about every day of my life since 2001. That's a lot of story-telling, yet in my experience, I've not reached that place I want to be. I have wowed readers of some of my short stories, but my novels are so difficult. I can't get readers to really FEEL them.

And after I FELT how Martin punched me in the face with a scene and situation made LOADS WORSE, it struck me like a brick in my thick skull, that Make it Worse isn't just about literally making something take a turn down the mine shaft of depravity and awfulness. It can have a larger impact. It isn't shock value, it's emotional engagement. Because without toying with reader expectations, it's just not reaching its potential (in my personal terms of success).

I wrote that post because my eyes had been opened. I had seen the light. I felt moved in my very spirit. I wanted to share that with this community of people I support whole-heartedly and call my friends. Many of them have my phone number. I've worked with these folks. I've bled in the trenches with them, as we all fight to push ourselves and each other to get better.

I wanted to reach people like you, who maybe hadn't contemplated this thing before (as I haven't) and really come up with a good answer. I felt like I'd reached a good answer, perhaps by a mystical hat trick of three conversations coming together. Maybe that was the bolt from the sky that had to hit me just right to get this thing to make sense.

I appreciate everyone's weighing in on how they create tension, increase emotional impact, etc. I feel like if I'd just titled it "creating more emotional impact" no one would have argued. But because of the title, people failed to really read and absorb the message of what I was saying, and instead only embrace the one facet of "make it worse" (the eternal downslide and suffering of a character/ story) as I once thought it applied strictly to that tactic.

Yes, that's certainly one way to make it worse, but there is also a broader meaning to the phrase. And yet, after countless examples of how any writer can use this tool, it's still being reduced to its one implication.

I'm holding a Swiss Army Knife in my hands, and people are saying, "oh, I don't need a knife." And I am saying, "Yeah, but it's more than a knife. You can use it to open that bottle, or clean under your nails, or cut that string hanging from your manuscript shirt." And the reply I keep hearing is that that person doesn't use a knife, so it's stupid for me to be carrying one because it could be dangerous if I offer it for people to use. ???
 

Heliotrope

Staff
Article Team
T.Allan... I absolutely LOVE K.M Weiland as well. I have read most of her books on writing, subscribe to her blog, and have even emailed her on occassion when I have a deeper question I need answered. She is very helpful and accomodating.

Your example of the setting is exactly perfect, and exactly what I mean when I say "Try to infuse as much tension into the scene as possible"...

Look at setting, how could it be worse?
Look at the other characters, how could they have their own goals and motives that could cause problems?
Look at the MC, what sort of inner conflict or choice could they be forced to make in this scene?
Look at the stakes, how could they be made more immediate, more personal? How could they matter more?

Janice Hardy at Fiction University is another great blogger with amazing stuff to say.
 
And after I FELT how Martin punched me in the face with a scene and situation made LOADS WORSE, it struck me like a brick in my thick skull, that Make it Worse isn't just about literally making something take a turn down the mine shaft of depravity and awfulness. It can have a larger impact. It isn't shock value, it's emotional engagement. Because without toying with reader expectations, it's just not reaching its potential (in my personal terms of success).

I think that's an extremely common sort of thing. Sometimes, it takes an extreme example to make us wake up and notice something. It's after exploring the issue, digging deep, that we can begin to formulate a general principle.

At least, that happens to me all the time.
 

Steerpike

Felis amatus
Moderator
@CM Yes, I think that kind of label on the idea drives the underlying point home. I've seen it presented as "put your characters through hell," as well (I saw that recently in the context of screenwriting). I think it is apt for the type of writing contemplated by most people who are going into writing. It's the approach the most popular fiction uses. I submit that not only does GRRM use it, but Rowling used it for her Potter books, and Suzanne Collins uses it in Hunger Games.
 

Amanita

Maester
This a straw man argument that could be turned on its head with neither direction making a logical point.
Would you care to elaborate?
I meant to convey the idea that making things worse by adding violence to highlight the threat posed by the villains doesn't necessarily lead to a better story, quite the opposite.
I'm well aware of the fact that this isn't the only possible definition of the term as pointed out by Caged Maiden later but it's one possible way of using and interpreting this phrase.
 

T.Allen.Smith

Staff
Moderator
Janice Hardy at Fiction University is another great blogger with amazing stuff to say.
That's a new one for me. I'll check her out.

Thank you.

@CM:
I think we're beyond shooting down the discussion based on misunderstandings, or labels, or whatever caused the derailment of your intention.

I, for one, have enjoyed this conversation greatly & I am a firm believer in the MIW advice as it applies to my vision...my writing. It appears you and I aren't the only ones either.

In something so personal as writing, you've got to expect a little dissent when discussing the merits of a process or method. You've been around long enough to remember those old threads on adverb use. Geez, Louise! They were heated with opinion and examples galore for both sides.

I think we should all be free to express ideas tactfully while maintaining respect for opposing positions. I also believe that our members are intelligent people, and capable of determining, on their own, if a concept is right for their writing.

I still don't use many adverbs. Not my thing.

I don't modify the word "said". Ever.

I limit passive voice to conscious choices and try to also limit my use of "to be" verbs.

I rarely use exclamation points.

I definitely ascribe to Making it Worse!

There are many more points of craft on my personal list of rules. But, I recognize others work differently.

There are pros who write like me. There are pros that fly in the face of every rule on my list. Those two points alone say everything we need to know.
 

Caged Maiden

Staff
Article Team
EXACTLY!!! YES!!!

Helio and I are working on my rewrite (look how I've fully pulled you onboard the project now!) and when I showed her the first chapter I had planned, a rewrite I did last summer, that felt like the opening to The Lies of Locke Lamora, she asked me how I could build up the main characters and conflict to have more impact. To which I sheepishly replied, "Oh, those aren't the main characters, those are the other guys and I'll never use their POV again."

At which point, she I think spluttered and smacked herself in the forehead with her palm, and asked me to just explain my story a little, so she could help me make sense of the steaming hot mess I wrote in 2008.

After several great back and forth conversations, where I truly tried to embrace three-act structure, a more intense outlining than I'd ever been successful with, and a long conversation about how to make things more immediate and pertinent, I wrote a new first chapter. I posted loads about that, too, so folks could sympathize or laugh, or maybe take away something about the horrible experience. Anyways, so I wrote a new first chapter. I sent it to three people. Two said they preferred the old first chapter, and Helio said I was making progress but was still missing something.

I began reading Donald Maass' book (which I would highly recommend to anyone who wants to push their understanding of their process, but be forewarned, it isn't a cake walk, it's HARD work). I heard him basically shouting in my face to make things worse, and to consider the immediate implications of every character emotion, every small happening in a scene that was meant to lead to the emotional payoff. AND I was only in chapter 1!

Then I watched GOT season 4 and Tyrion's trial went sideways in such a MONUMENTAL way for me, the lightning struck, the brick hit my head, the light dawned. I stepped out of a confused fog and I KNEW what I was doing so stupidly wrong, I felt ashamed to even admit it.

But admit it I did, the very next day. I came here and shared my failure with you guys, hoping it might help anyone else who was struggling with the same thing, the same sort of fogginess. The same sort of weakness I've been battling in my manuscripts forever.

The main thing I learned is what Helio quoted earlier, something like, When you feel you're slapping the reader in the face with it, it's just enough for them. That's the point where you can quit pushing toward that emotional impact.

Wow. Yeah, I finally got it, and it hit me hard. And I believe now that my method for trying to relay this experience has in some way turned the conversation about a viable tool that Donald Maass defines broadly, into a confused interpretation of my original post and the follow-ups. I said a word, "worse" and it became synonymous with GRRM and slaughter. And that was so far from my original meaning, that's why we've been discussing it at length here, but folks keep weighing in to say that wanton slaughter isn't a good thing in every story.

Well, DUH! But increasing tension is almost always a great thing, because agents and critters and writers and readers all seem to concur that too much tension is better than not enough. And an easy way to increase tension is to simply ask yourself "what could make this girl at the dance's situation worse?" and I suppose to resist the temptation to answer, "Slaughtering her family at the party, burning down their home, making a dragon eat her best friend, and having the entire town impaled on fifteen-foot poles by her father, who is a magistrate and took personal offense when his daughter's heart was broken!" Because that's just stupid, and it defies the logic of the tool.
 

Caged Maiden

Staff
Article Team
@ TA I hear you, and I might be a little riled at this point, because I so fully enjoy the back and forth of conversing at length about anything that can bring about a deeper understanding. But then there's this:

I meant to convey the idea that making things worse by adding violence to highlight the threat posed by the villains doesn't necessarily lead to a better story, quite the opposite.
I'm well aware of the fact that this isn't the only possible definition of the term as pointed out by Caged Maiden later (actually, I said it in the OP and several times after, and so did several other people) but it's one possible way of using and interpreting this phrase.

Are we still at this point? I thought we'd moved on, yet here it is...the same thing we've spent hours and pages refuting, that NO ONE is advocating using violence as the MIW option. It has a more important meaning of increasing emotional impact through inner conflict, simply by worsening a situation in a way that readers would never even see as a worsening (Harry Potter again).

SO I think I'm done with this today. It's time I write something other than forum posts, because I've said all I have to say about mimicking GRRM. I'm not trying to be rude, but I only have time for people who are seeing the same light I'm seeing. If anyone is still trying to find that light because they think it could help them, I'm happy to talk about it, here in this thread or elsewhere, but I'm done trying to get people to stop defining MIW as only the proponent for wanton violence and depravity just for shock value. It's ludicrous, and seriously, we've all accepted that THAT isn't a great idea for any writer unless it's their expressed intent to write that kind of story. I'm not writing that kind of story, so I'll be increasing the dramatic and emotional impact of MY stories by making social situations worse, giving my character higher stakes in their scenes, and overall attempting to get a reader to care more, right from page one.

Thanks, sincerely, to everyone who shared this experience with me. It was a bit of a transformation for me, accepting and understanding how many missed opportunities I'd been leaving unchallenged.

I sincerely hope some folks took something away from this. Something they'll be able to apply to their own work, in their own way. So that when they get to that next critique, or that next submission, they won't hear the thing I've heard over and over, "There really isn't any tension in this scene, so I'm having a hard time connecting with the character."

:)
 
C

Chessie

Guest
CM: I thought of you last night during my study of chapter cliffhangers. The article I was reading mentioned how cliffhangers don't need to be explosive. They can be emotional, an underlying sensation that something isn't right here but strikes up enough curiosity to encourage the reader forward.

We're in a similar process right now. You're rewriting and I'm redrafting (we might actually be doing the exact same thing). BUt in reading through your responses something stuck out to me long after I promised myself that this morning I would write before checking Mythic Scribes. (heh) You mentioned how you wanted to talk about how this very MIW tool applies to rewrites and how you're trying to weigh in old ideas vs new ones.

This is what I'm going through now as well. The OG manuscript has literally a killer ending (yes, it end on a cliffhanger because I'm wicked liked that). But now, I'm faced with new ideas that are an improvement. A new POV added in who is supposed to die but now at chapter 3 I'm not so sure that he should. Does he really have to die to raise the stakes?

I wrote this novel 2 years ago and am a better writer now. As I'm drafting this novel and thinking of the old one (of which I threw out all the chapters except the first one), I'm seeing places where there was a ton of room for tension but I didn't take it. Things that are so obvious and huge that I just let sit there because my skill was so much lower and I didn't have a good eye for these things.

The crit partner I had at the time kept telling me he wanted to see more violence, more gore, and more sex. Well...that's just not the kind of story it is! I prefer more subtle tactics to reader manipulation. I don't think he liked my story because the featured relationship is between two lovers who do something really, really bad and they're unable to flee the situation, thus they are placed in a pressure cooker type of story. The tension slowly builds, drives them bonkers, and they turn on each other.

Even though Martin has been a featured author on this thread because of the violent nature of GOT, I remember reading scenes in the first book that were ripe with tension but had no violence. I recall when Bran's mother (forgot her stupid name) swept aside his bangs after he was pushed that stayed with me. Martin connected to the mother in me. He moved me. And this was done without violence, which no one here has pushed as being necessary to MIW and I'm glad about that. :)

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy a good mystery and moments of violence in fiction, too. BUT what I'm saying is that this conversation has been a wonderful place to discuss how MIW can be done in so many different ways. Maiden has all her secret notes and torture and spies which is awesome. It's a versatile tool and although I apply it differently to my work, the essence of the main point remains. Whenever my characters tries to do something to rid herself of her problem, she makes it worse. She messes it up. She trusts in the wrong person, she makes a foolish decision which causes someone to lose their life, etc.

So when it comes to redrafting this novel, I'm taking the opportunity to make the story more intense than it was the last time. I love writing about relationships of all sorts, but especially really bad ones. How can Zina makes things worse for herself? By trying to go up against a dark lord she can't control and wants to consume her. She's going to mess it up, time and time again because it's what seems natural to me and it's not that I enjoy torturing her, but I also want readers to stick with me during the story and buy the next one.
 

Demesnedenoir

Myth Weaver
You put forth an example that was easily defeated and which no one actually argued for... murder and rape in Rivendell, and present it as proof for your argument. To quote grammar girl discussing it, thereby saving me time:

Debaters invoke a straw man when they put forth an argument—usually something extreme or easy to argue against—that they know their opponent doesn't support. You put forth a straw man because you know it will be easy for you to knock down or discredit. It's a way of misrepresenting your opponent's position.

So, if turning this upside down one might say: So what you gonna do? Have Frodo wander into Mordor with Sam, singing drinking songs from the Green Dragon with Gollum and toss the ring in the fires: The End! Happily ever after! No you must make it worse, worse, worse!

Neither argument actually works because neither side of the argument has actually in fact been argued for. Hence, Straw Men.

Personally I'm a bit like Treebeard on this discussion, I'm not entirely on anybody's side, because nobody is entirely on my side, heh heh. But, these sort of straw man arguments are something that really irks people and sets off the argumentative tone in many cases.

Would you care to elaborate?
I meant to convey the idea that making things worse by adding violence to highlight the threat posed by the villains doesn't necessarily lead to a better story, quite the opposite.
I'm well aware of the fact that this isn't the only possible definition of the term as pointed out by Caged Maiden later but it's one possible way of using and interpreting this phrase.
 

Russ

Istar
Personally I'm a bit like Treebeard on this discussion, I'm not entirely on anybody's side, because nobody is entirely on my side, heh heh. But, these sort of straw man arguments are something that really irks people and sets off the argumentative tone in many cases.

Good point.

And I might add another thing that irks people and turns a discussion in a darker direction is assuming the people who are reading the thread or being exposed to the advice are idiots or something less than you.

When I give advice or discuss an idea (in this case a tool) I think it is polite to operate under the assumption that our community members are quite bright and not likely to misuse the tool in some dangerous or stupid way.

Some people use it as a substitute for the straw man argument saying (effectively) "well you and I are experienced writers and thus are aware of these pitfalls, but beginners might read this and might not be capable of handling it as well as I (we) do."

I don't think that kind of paternalism adds much and has so much potential to cause trouble.
 

T.Allen.Smith

Staff
Moderator
Even though Martin has been a featured author on this thread because of the violent nature of GOT, I remember reading scenes in the first book that were ripe with tension but had no violence.
Yes. So true.

One of my favorite scenes is when Cersei first confronts Ned Stark. He tells her that he knows the truth about her children. She lectures him about true power, its use, and playing the Game of Thrones.

Though her guards are near, and Ned is alone, there is zero violence. All threats are insinuated, and delivered with a calm demeanor. Yet, the underlying tension in the dialogue blew me away & had me ripping through pages. So. Darn. Good.


And I might add another thing that irks people and turns a discussion in a darker direction is assuming the people who are reading the thread or being exposed to the advice are idiots or something less than you.
Yes, I agree. Generally, readers and writers are of above average intelligence.

We should trust in that. What's the worst that can happen? Failure?

I learn more from failure than from my successes.
 

Caged Maiden

Staff
Article Team
@ Chesterama

Absolutely feel you! Rewriting is painful. I'm taking what I liked about the old draft, kicking that into high gear, and throwing out what was crap and can't be salvaged, and then adding in new material that supports my current goals. We're probably doing the same work. And it's frustrating.

Everything I wrote in the first draft felt logical. It was inspired by my own desire to see successes and failures and complications at key moments. And there's nothing wrong with how I undertook this book or any other. but now that I'm a more confident writer (some days), I'm looking for impact. When my character loses her old life, I want the reader to be exited for her new possibilities, but understand deeply her fear of change. I didn't play on that before. I just said out with the old, in with the new.

When my character falls in love with a man who was her enemy in the beginning of the book, I want the reader to feel they were meant to be together, so that means I have to turn that guy who was a minor annoyance because he continuously challenged her, into a more compelling and complete character, who doesn't just shame her and make her feel bad, but who has some redeeming features TO HER, not just the people around her.

There are so many little ways I can increase tension in this story, looking at it now, it's EMBARRASSING how bad it was. I can only say I'm glad that I'm in a position where I can recognize the drivel for what it is...a story that got away from a young writer still learning the craft.

Best wishes, Chesterama and everyone else who are working on adding in tension to a story you already feel you know. I can only say that when I read The Lies of Locke Lamora, I felt like the twists hit me in the gut hard, like the barrel scene (I'm not spoiling, you'll know when you get there). OMG, I FELT so much in that book, and it wasn't a tale of wanton violence, really, or taking everything away time and time again. It was a fully compelling tale of a young man and his crew, being cleverer than everyone else. And I LOVED it SO much. But imagine if things hadn't gone from bad to worse...if Locke hadn't been a thief deep into the very fiber of his being. If Jean hadn't been such a great friend. If Chains hadn't been so harsh in that first scene where he told Locke about his dead little Streets friends. The story might have been the same outcome, but the emotional impact would have been lessened, SO MUCH.

And that's what i'm trying to capture now. And with this new understanding, I'm no longer wielding a goldfish net, trying to chase this beast around the jungle, I've got one of those Batman freaking nets that shoots from his vambrace or whatever and engulfs the baddies and they can't get out of it!

DO it, girl! Get that tension in each little scene, subtle or in-your-face. Whatever it calls for. Make things just a step worse, more pertinent, more real NOW, more important to the character and her own feelings.
 
C

Chessie

Guest
It's grimy work but I love it.

I had no idea what I was doing before. I have a much stronger impression of the story this time around. There are some things that have me confused at the moment, but I'll eventually get past that stickiness.

Get that tension in each little scene, subtle or in-your-face. Whatever it calls for. Make things just a step worse, more pertinent, more real NOW, more important to the character and her own feelings. <---- I believe this is the most important point here. The MIW has to be organic, natural, true to who you're writing about. Zina is very real to me. I understand her motivations, her strengths, weaknesses, and her desires. I also know her future. So as I write, new ideas come to me. A new bit of dialogue that's more intense than the last go around, and I'm even getting a strong idea of how to open the second book.

So how does MIW or try/fail apply to a redraft/rewrite? By comparing it to the last version. I was always told by my readers that there needed to be more intensity between the characters and although I KNEW/understood that, I was too shy to apply it to the story. This time around, Zina is much more bullheaded. She challenges everyone and everything. She's changing for the worst, and in the process screwing things up for herself. For me to say that this story is hella more exciting now would be an understatement.
 

Heliotrope

Staff
Article Team
So much agree with ^^^^ And that is why for me this is a very layered process. I will use my current WIP as an example.

I did a TON Of plotting/front end loading first... then wrote my first chapter. Here are my layers:

- Girl's goal is to win the speech competition to win summer internship to get away from her annoying dad.
- Her best friend is her main opponent
- She wants to get a photo of the weird busker for her speech, but a boy she likes is at the station, and she doesn't want him to - see her because she hasn't told him she is in the contest.
- She hasn't told her father either, because he is so embarrasing all the time.
- Weird, invisible things in the station keep touching her.
- At the last minute her friend turns on her (stress from the competition) and when the busker performing coin tricks needs a volunteer, her friend calls her out... thus embarrassing her in front of the boy she likes.
- The busker seems to know her, and weird things happen with the coins, and he quickly tries to get away from her.
- Finally, the weird invisible creatures nuzzle her, this time with fangs... this time whispering her name.


Ok... it was NOT enough. I was like, Aw yeah, there is plenty going on in this scene to be interesting.

Nope. Not enough.

The problem was some major issues with character motivation (not deep enough)... so she wants to win the competition, who cares? Why? Why should I care?

And the stakes - so she wants to get away from her annoying dad? Who cares. You haven't shown me how annoying he is, so why should I believe you?

My redraft needed some serious work in the MIW department.

Now, I have increased the motivation. The girl has been searching for her mother, who left her father after she was born. She found records of her mother's name and address in her dad's study. She tracked the woman down. The woman is perfect. Not only is she smart and beautiful and well dressed and educated, she is a treasure hunter/archeologist who is presenting her latest find at the museum. The prize of winning the speech competition is a summer internship working with this woman... This is my MC's in to getting connected to her mother, who is leaps and bounds more interesting and cool and sophisticated then her lame dad.

(The woman will end up being the villian, but that is niether here nor there at this point. The fact is that my MC had a lame goal and lame stakes, and I had to make them better in order for the reader to care.)

- I have shown her lame dad, who, still dressed in his uniform from the novelty sword shop at the mall, is now playing old sea shanty's on his fiddle for change at the very station she is at with her friends... so the MC has to try to prevent him from seeing her as she has told him she is "tutoring" tonight, so he doesn't come to the speech contest.

*Sigh* I sort of love drafting actually.

*Note: I'm writing a children's urban time travel fantasy, for kids ages 11-13, so I have to be pretty creative in how I ramp up tension. I really want to avoid my MC doing anything too illegal lol.
 
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