Magic System Critique

[ABearsGarden]

edit: correction, "magic", not magic system. As this is but a small, though important, part of it.

I'm curious: If you were a reader, learning about this older magic system throughout the narrative, what are some questions that you might have?

Background ( summarized ):
"Psyche magic" ( placeholder title ) is the most powerful form of magic, born of a once naive, young-of-mind spirit. Following somewhat of an "all powerful child who got bored" trope, treating the world she'd stepped into as a playground, "unofficial candidates" ( e.g. random humans ) were given exceedingly weaker copies of her own power. She chose them not based on their personalities, but rather aesthetic appeal. Expectantly, things went south among the humans.

Her guardians, concerned only about her wasting the "uniqueness of this gift", demanded she revoke it at once. The little spirit refused to lift a claw, but agreed later to an alternative offered by an older, equally rebellious sibling: She'd not have to remove her gift from humanity's grasp, merely re-write how the magic works.

What is it that this magic can do, precisely?:
Aside from not rewriting the universe itself, its copies seemed limitless. Those who received the gift could conjure up and manipulate anything. In a way, they became what mankind may consider "gods or goddesses".

The re-written rules:

1. Anything animate, in other words, animals and humans, can't be enchanted directly. There must be something acting as a connection between "the enchanted" and the enchantment itself. Take, for example, a necklace.

2. "Enchantments" must be precise. For every detail incorrectly given, the spell could backfire, not working at best and harming the caster at worse. The addition of inflicting harm was added from a misplaced form of blame; the spirit sought to get back at the humans who got her in trouble.

2.1 Complete thoughts: "When this necklace is worn, the wearer will turn to stone" or "When worn, this bracelet will give the wearer manipulation over fire" are valid. Now, following example one, if you wanted the wearer to revert ( stone being ) back to normal afterwards, you should also have specified the duration of time. That is, unless you planned on casting a new spell later.

2.2 incomplete and nonspecific thoughts: "This bracelet will allow the manipulation of fire" won't work as it's not clear what or who exactly is meant to be able to do so. Extremely short thoughts like "Manipulate fire" are definitely invalid.

Extra notes:
Soul and will are important factors in its usefulness; if without either, it won't do as it should.

One's will is easily defined as their desire to do X. Example: Enchanting something to harm someone when you do not truly feel like doing such a thing to them simply will not work, no matter how many times you might try.

A soul is a physical characteristic that every species is born with, and can harvest power from.

I imagine magic itself could be random, with "Psyche magic" as an unusually specific exception, since it itself is otherworldly. Although, rationalizing non-related magic in a quite fantastical universe might not have to be as strict.

 

[pmmg]

All of the above is a mystery to people living in this world? Or is it common knowledge?

I guess my first question is, is this still available to me? or have the selected pretty people already been chosen?

My next question is what else is there? If this one child offered this, is this all, or are there other powers the other greater beings might offer? I would not accept a word like 'most powerful'.

Am I right in reading this as.... The old magic is the first offer of psyche magic, and the new is the watered down version with all the rules?

(And as a creator....those rules are going to be endless.)

 

[ABearsGarden]

All of the above is a mystery to people living in this world? Or is it common knowledge?

I guess my first question is, is this still available to me? or have the selected pretty people already been chosen?

My next question is what else is there? If this one child offered this, is this all, or are there other powers the other greater being might offer? I would not accept a word like 'most powerful'.

Am I right in reading this as.... The old magic is the first offer of psyche magic, and the new is the watered down version with all the rules?

(And as a creator....those rules are going to be endless.)

To answer the first: Very common knowledge. It wasn't around so many generations ago that everyone soon forgot its existence. I'm still debating "timelines."

Adding onto the first: Unless you are a descendant of one man who figured to manipulate this "blessing" in such a way that those born of his bloodline could have "his" ability ( a peculiar way to indirectly say "thank you" to the spirit ), the likelihood is low once Psyche magic gets rewritten. Perhaps, if you're lucky enough to meet someone with this magic who would be willing to give you an accessory allowing temporary use, it could work, but who wants to risk any tricks being played?

Third: Entirely plausible. Maybe not in that universe. I'd say, given the likelihood of differing dimensions, or sides of the universe other beings might dwell, the possibilities are, theoretically, endless.

four: I might have worded it strangely, but yes. Psyche magic went from being this old, superior force to an especially watered down concept that now proves itself useless if the caster's feelings, choice thoughts, etc. aren't decisive enough.

 

[pmmg]

Obvious question to me is, if I have this useless, watered down version, how do I move past it to the non-useless, non-watered down version?

Sorry, as a character, the above is my question, as a reader, my question is about the 'all powerful child who got bored' and her guardians. You put those words in quotes, I am going ask is she really all powerful, or are there others that are more powerful? And then take off from there. Why do these guardians care? What would they do about it if she did not listen? What is the point of her? Is the power really a gift? or just a whim? Is there any real purpose behind it? Is there any meaning to any of it? Would we be better off with more of it, or less of it? Would we be better off with or without the girl, and/or her guardians? And on and on....

And last...I would have to ask you about story. How is this magic system important to a story?

 

[ABearsGarden]

Obvious question to me is, if I have this useless watered down version, how do I move past it to the non-useless watered down version

Hope to learn decisiveness, for the most part. Patience is also a virtue, knowing you'd have to articulate your words in a way that could not be misconstrued into something else by the unfortunate spite embedded into this source since its revision.

A better example would be a slight rephrasing of one mentioned in the original post: Say that you're under the command of someone who demands you use the magic to harm another. Most likely, a stranger. Do you feel strongly against your "opponent"? Do you truly desire to inflict harm? Then, you probably can. So, do your thing, and all else should work out. Of course, good luck getting the individual to wear any enchanted objects in the first place. Otherwise, failure will inevitably follow suit.

I'd say the magic is all about stability, in a sense. It was, after all, worked around that idea.

edit: whoops, almost forgot: As souls are a more physical part of an individual, they grow as you do. The younger you are, the less complex spells you'd be able to perform, lacking both in the energy and mindset to do so.

 

[pmmg]

I would assume that somewhere on the planet is the person who is the best with this magic. If that person was me, what could I do? Suppose I wanted to be better?

And stories are about conflict, what would I oppose? Other wizards just using it wrong, or the gods themselves?

 

[ABearsGarden]

As the best, your options are far less limited. For the sake of conserving your "soul's" energy ( for clarification on "energy", think of it like a secondary stomach ), mundane tricks can be performed. These tasks, like turning apples to oranges or making certain clothes block out sound when worn, would hardly impact reserves. Less interesting ideas kicked aside, while there might not be malicious intent, you're still an individual with power; you've got to do something exciting with it, right?

An amulet that can transform you into an animal sounds nice. Thing is, shape-shifting itself is energy consuming. In addition to using part of your own magic, more energy will get withdrawn than before, as you'd now essentially be using two abilities. Nevertheless, you could still use more spells throughout the day on average; give or take a few depending on how the greater and lesser "add up", which is a subjective take one must be willing to risk.

Improvement would come cognitively. A better memory and talent in describing things yields the greatest results.



Conflict-wise, aside from the spirit herself if you somehow found and chose to make it her problem that you can do nothing more ( unlikely ), it could be your fellow people. Psyche magic effected enough societies for it to be deemed dangerous regardless. If you're "one of them" and not from a community which tries to work with such individuals ( in other words, only the place where yet-to-be-named-man's bloodline comes from ), lack of service from those not afraid, and wary stares, are definite. Getting caught in a fight relying on physical tactics remains a downside for anyone with this magic, unless already cheating with "enhancements" or trained in physical combat.

There's also the opportunity for conflict with yourself if the power, in spite of all its time consuming restrictions, manages to get to your head.

 

[pmmg]

Those who first received the gift of this magic still have it? or did that get reverted to the weaker more controlled form?

 

[pmmg]

Looking at the OP, and the question posed there, my questions are still about the power behind the magic. Who are they, what do they do? what do they want? what do they mean? Are they good or bad? are they 'all powerful' or the 'most high'?

That the system is limiting for the mere mortal types in the story, is kind of the characters problem. You seem to have thought out how you want it to work, so dont leave them any loopholes unless loopholes are secretly the story.

But a good magic system does not a story make. Is there a story behind this that makes this magic system have meaning beyond just...here's a magic system?

 

[ABearsGarden]

Looking at the OP, and the question posed there, my questions are still about the power behind the magic. Who are they, what do they do? what do they want? what do they mean? Are they good or bad? are they 'all powerful' or the 'most high'?

That the system is limiting for the mere mortal types in the story, is kind of the characters problem. You seem to have thought out how you want it to work, so dont leave them any loopholes unless loopholes are secretly the story.

But a good magic system does not a story make. Is there a story behind this that makes this magic system have meaning beyond just...here's a magic system?

first half:
I assume you mean this planet's "spirits"? Or is this one specifically for the humans?

Latter half, Mixed answer:
There is a short, diary-entry styled story focusing on misadventures based on a descendant from the family that retains psyche magic. Through a more biased lens that she's learned, it's shown how this magic works, how she personally manifests it compared to others, etc.

She's not the only character with a personalized POV connected to this spirit, though in terms of diary-style entries most definitely is.

As much as I'd like something more complete, it is not doable. Excessively detailed lore is for myself, established in my imaginary encyclopedia, as a refresher. Alongside, an expanded universe for which it takes place. ( Ah, the curse of being busy with other things ). Regardless, I like to hear feedback on these obscure ideas, since it is fun.

 

[pmmg]

I am not sure I knew there were other planet spirits....

What did I mean?

The opening question is about me 'the reader'. What does this make me think as the reader? Well, I am thinking of the background story of the bored girl goddess, and her giving power, and then curtailing it, and how that might affect people in the story. So my questions are about that. When the story gets going, I many have other questions. I dont have direct questions about the magic system per se... I think one) the author seems to have the covered, and 2) it seems moot, the goddess girl is the source, and she limited it.

If I was a character in the story, I might not care about any of it. I might just go with the flow and the stories I had been told. If I was a wizard, I might wonder why the magic is limited, and maybe I want it not to be.

But, if I was in this planet, I would likely be asking questions.

 

[ABearsGarden]

I am not sure I knew there were other planet spirits....

What did I mean?

The opening question is about me 'the reader'. What does this make me think as the reader? Well, I am thinking of the background story of the bored girl goddess, and her giving power, and then curtailing it, and how that might affect people in the story. So my questions are about that. When the story gets going, I many have other questions. I dont have direct questions about the magic system per se... I think one) the author seems to have the covered, and 2) it seems moot, the goddess girl is the source, and she limited it.

If I was a character in the story, I might not care about any of it. I might just go with the flow and the stories I had been told. If I was a wizard, I might wonder why the magic is limited, and maybe I want it not to be.

But, if I was in this planet, I would likely be asking questions.

( by other spirits, should have clarified, I meant the guardians and the "sibling" )
That makes more sense. I have plans for questions like that to be answered/asked from at least two of the characters' POVs, as well as non-main characters.

 

[pmmg]

Well the magic system works for me, but like i said...a good system does not a story make. So...its really good if it works for the story, and not really good if it doesn't. None of that is known to me.

I bet this has a big effect on gift giving. Wow, a sparkly new bracelet, you shouldn't have. --Really, I want you to have it

 

[ABearsGarden]

Well the magic system works for me, but like i said...a good system does not a story make. So...its really good if it works for the story, and not really good if it doesn't. None of that is known to me.

I bet this has a big effect on gift giving. Wow, a sparkly new bracelet, you shouldn't have. --Really, I want you to have it

It certainly did play a hand in the way some cultures exchange gifts ( in one town, people continue to buy and exchange gifts in person. So, you're basically picking your own presents. Makes the holidays a tad boring, however. At least you get exactly what you wanted? ).

 

[pmmg]

Do they though???

Maybe some don't mind the trick bracelets.

On the other hand, I could see this having a huge effect on the culture. How does one show trust? How do I know if one is lying? How does this work in court? Or trade, or marriages? It would be a great mess.

 

[ABearsGarden]

Do they though???

Maybe some don't mind the trick bracelets.

On the other hand, I could see this having a huge effect on the culture. How does one show trust? How do I know if one is lying? How does this work in court? Or trade, or marriages? It would be a great mess.

Tale as old as time: a tradition starts, this particular one from fear, and then some people either stop caring, hold onto the custom, or never tried it to begin with. That said, if you try to surprise some individuals outside the holidays, you might get a strange look; even so, I don't doubt some might make a joke out of it.

Now, the idea of someone wanting to possibly obtain some cool, enchanted bracelet regardless of whether it may or may not have bad effects..That does sound fun; unfortunately plausible, too ( humans are such strange beings, sometimes ).

---

Exploring any follow-up effects is my third favorite part about exploring worlds such as this.

 

[pmmg]

Its hard to tell how the world would really be different. Even if you bought it yourself, how could you know the shop keeper did not enchant it, or some dude who made it. Buyer beware has a new meaning. What a world? How do I go and live there.

I think this makes more accessible the items, but there are doubtless ways to accomplish much of it in the world today without the magic. I guess I would say there is good and bad in everything. This would be no different. People would adjust and make it work for them. And some would be bad with it. I bet there will be a wall full of law books about it.

And in the end...its just the new normal.

 

[ABearsGarden]

Its hard to tell how the world would really be different. Even if you bought it yourself, how could you know the shop keeper did not enchant it, or some dude who made it. Buyer beware has a new meaning. What a world? How do I go and live there.

I think this makes more accessible the items, but there are doubtless ways to accomplish much of it in the world today without the magic. I guess I would say there is good and bad in everything. This would be no different. People would adjust and make it work for them. And some would be bad with it. I bet there will be a wall full of law books about it.

And in the end...its just the new normal.

Indeed.

 

[Foxkeyes]

Expectantly, things went south among the humans.

Ahahah Absolutely correct.

The re-written rules work well. Maybe more are required as your stories progress.

Be as specific as possible with your magic system.

Some questions I would ask as a reader are:

How was the god child able to give this magic to humans? Were there no constraints on who uses the old magic?

The foundation of the 'new' magic system is directly based on the 'old' magic system. Is the old magic system still relevant?

What is the relationship between the 'old' gods and the 'new' gods. Human nature would almost require the new to challenge the old, or at least try to increase their own power by stealing extra power from the old gods.


You have lots of possibilities to play around with this magic system, but It might benefit with more constraints around it--especially when it comes to the gifted being able to conjure up and manipulate almost anything.

'Enchanting something to harm someone when you do not truly feel like doing such a thing to them simply will not work, no matter how many times you might try. '
This weakens the impact of the magic. A bit of badness adds more drama.

 

[ABearsGarden]

Ahahah Absolutely correct.

The re-written rules work well. Maybe more are required as your stories progress.

Be as specific as possible with your magic system.

Some questions I would ask as a reader are:

How was the god child able to give this magic to humans? Were there no constraints on who uses the old magic?

The foundation of the 'new' magic system is directly based on the 'old' magic system. Is the old magic system still relevant?

What is the relationship between the 'old' gods and the 'new' gods. Human nature would almost require the new to challenge the old, or at least try to increase their own power by stealing extra power from the old gods.


You have lots of possibilities to play around with this magic system, but It might benefit with more constraints around it--especially when it comes to the gifted being able to conjure up and manipulate almost anything.

'Enchanting something to harm someone when you do not truly feel like doing such a thing to them simply will not work, no matter how many times you might try. '
This weakens the impact of the magic. A bit of badness adds more drama.

Thank you. There are plans for there to be a continuation of rules, as I personally dislike staying at "just" three.

One question that definitely lacks an answer is relationship between old and new "gods", given that there technically isn't. The timeline may still be debated, but on the more likely side of things they're not around any longer. One does directly impact his own family, with how they develop their views of the spirit and magic; I do know how. Aha, do not want my answers to get too long, however, as I assume that'd be more than is necessary to read. Assuming you referenced the humans there, not the spirits themselves.

The last bit did confuse me some. Are you suggesting to possibly change up the part of this specific source's requirement for ones will to be solid to do something? I also don't quite get the "badness" part, for old users of this magic did plentiful wrongs. If anything, I'm guessing this meant a bad side to the magic itself, whether to the user or an outsider?