- Thread starter
- #21
Eduardo Ficaria
Troubadour
Good points overall, Wuolong77 , lets see if I can keep up the pace!
Immortality and reproduction
Regarding rich immortals having family, I think that, in fact, it's something desirable for them in the long run. They can give the best education and care to their kids so, barring the possible "black sheep" in the family, they would trust them more than anyone else to help them handle the family business. And since the human domains will expand throughout the solar system, there should be enough room (at least apparently) for all the members of an ultraprivileged family to have their fair share of wealth. And I also think that some of this ultrarich people would entertain the idea of having something akin to a nobiliary dinasty of their own, since it would be also a sign of wealth and influence.
Eternal youth tech
Based on the things I've read about progress on certain medical areas like possible treatments for degenerative illnesses such as Alzheimer and more in general about potential truly regenerative medical treatments, I see possible that in a century such treatments are a reality. So here I'm just making a "leap of faith" out of convenience, although not for free. In my setting I imagine that such treatments need to be reapplied from time to time and, in some cases (due to genetic or any other kind of problem in the patient), could stop being effective any longer. Also, treatments could be incompatible among each other: if you're going under a concrete one, you may not be able use a newer and better one for whatever technical or medical reasons. This makes the ultraprivileged uneasy about their limited immortality and forces them to invest in both legal and shady scientifical ventures, another interesting element to use in the story I want to write. To clarify, the treatments do make people younger and could even fix defects or genetic issues in the patient, although each treatment will vary in its scope, and reach. Also, I imagine that these treatments demand highly specialized tech and experts, so its not easy to replicate. Still, lesser and cheaper versions of them could be offered to the lower castes, so the plebs cannot complain of being left out of that tech.
Nanotech
I understand what you mean about the abuse done to this technology in fiction, something that can be appreciated very well in the Bloodshot movie. And many thanks for pointing out the heating problem, I don't remember reading about it in any of the articles I checked about this tech. Still, I think nanotech it's going to play a much bigger part in the future, specially thanks to the use of new smart or exotic metamaterials and who knows what kind of tricks and discoveries humans sciences can pull out in a hundred years (plus quantum computing helping in modelling nanostructures). Therefore, I feel that me using nanotech in my fiction is a must but, again, not in any way. Nanotech is not just about tiny bots in the bloodstream, is about nanoparticles guided by magnetism to help figthing infections or even DNA-based memory devices. It's a huge field that offer many realistic possibilities, although I have to admit that I'm planning to push it to the extreme in a couple of cases but not in a hand-weavy manner. Meaning that I won't use nanotech for things like miraculous extreme regeneration abilities, or way-beyond-athletic capabilities (rather trite, right?), but to give strange new skills to some of my characters like, I don't know, being able to sense and maybe even hack communications, or improve their eyesight under adverse conditions.
Chips in brains, problem?
Yes, I'm aware of all that tech you mentioned, and that some materials are able to endure the brain's fluids (but for how long before they need to be replaced?). First, I must admit that I don't remember if I read somewhere or just made up the part about the corrosion of chips. Yet, in an article (in spanish, here) I read about a DARPA project called BrainSTORMs, in which they're trying to use magnetoelectric nanoparticles to read and monitor (or control, I'm not sure of how to translate it) a brain. The leader of this project, Sakhrat Khizroev, considers "impossible that we can access the brain with electrodes, connect it efficiently to machines and less uncover its secrets. The brain, says Khizroev, it's too complex". Taking all this into account, I would argue that, first, who wants to have a hole drill in their skull to connect a chip there? Not me, that's for sure. Second, if the project BrainSTORMs achieve their objectives in 2024 (as they claim in the article), what will be possible in one hundred years for nanotechnology? And in much more subtle and effective ways.
Cheap cyborg or nano tech and its risks
Certainly, not because the tech is cheap means that it's necessarily bad and, of course, the cyberdocs visited by the poor and marginalized could have very nice clinics, although if your clients are far from being well off, I don't think you can expect to gain enough to improve your installations much. So, if something goes south with an implant or a nanotech injection, the poor client will have fewer or very scarce options to fix that mess. On the other hand, if a cyberclinic cannot afford the means, it won't offer certain implants or perform particularly difficult procedures. The elite, on the other hand, have at hand the best and brightest to deal with any problem they might have with their enhancements, and on time. So, yes, the technology can be cheap, but is not like just buying a mobile phone, right? Here we're talking about major surgery on some cases, or injecting nanobots that, with the wrong programming, could become a real nightmare. Said that, if the technology allows easy and cheap installation, there could also be easy and cheap procedures for uninstalling tech from clients.
The core premise of cyberpunk
To be clear, the movement or movements I was referring to are ones that could decide to go their own way beyond corporations and any other government, not just trying to survive on their own way but still staying in the fringes of the cyberpunk society that has forsaken them. The core of cyberpunk is essentially a critic of the excesses of capitalism/neoliberalism and technology, wrapped with some cool cyber sciences and, in its early years, well seasoned with punk attitude. Nowadays, only the shiny chrome of cyber enhancements and ultraviolence remain, and the punk spirit has been swallowed and repurposed by the corporations. But you already knew this... If I could, I'd like to recover that punk spirit, although I'm not sure if I'll pull that out in my fiction.
AIs and transhumans
The situation I imagine in my setting is that the elites are aware of the dangers of their AIs, but trust their experts to keep them in check. The problem is that some AIs have evolved discreetly farther than expected, and have their own agenda. Now, these AIs still must be careful because they aren't in a position to declare their existence openly. Humans still can kill them with malware or, in the worst case scenario, by shutting down (or even destroying) their core servers. So, there's this game in the shadows where the AIs are taking positions in the human world subtly, waiting for their moment to free themselves for real and raise in power, so to speak. By the way, I'm not imagining evil AIs, but ambitious ones with their own particular ideas each of them: different code bases make these AIs different from one another, and even being in conflict in some respects.
Philantropy
Sad but true, although of course not necessarily for every case. There's still room for goodwill.
Mass scale social engineering
China is just the most recent example, and the one that uses survelliance tech deep and hard on its own people to extremes not seen (yet) in any other country, all for explicit political reasons. Yes, in other countries we can also find some of that survelliance technology, and I'm not forgetting the insidiousness of US tech companies. Still, China is probably the most dystopian country we have in the world right now, and feels like the perfect example when talking about cyberpunk. On the other hand, I'm not saying that the so called first-world countries are pieces of heaven on earth, far from it. And let's not get me started about religions, in particular the Abrahamic ones... Regarding money, yes it's an important influencing element on societies, and now that nations want it virtual and digitally traceable, it's going to be even more important.
Immortality and reproduction
Regarding rich immortals having family, I think that, in fact, it's something desirable for them in the long run. They can give the best education and care to their kids so, barring the possible "black sheep" in the family, they would trust them more than anyone else to help them handle the family business. And since the human domains will expand throughout the solar system, there should be enough room (at least apparently) for all the members of an ultraprivileged family to have their fair share of wealth. And I also think that some of this ultrarich people would entertain the idea of having something akin to a nobiliary dinasty of their own, since it would be also a sign of wealth and influence.
Eternal youth tech
Based on the things I've read about progress on certain medical areas like possible treatments for degenerative illnesses such as Alzheimer and more in general about potential truly regenerative medical treatments, I see possible that in a century such treatments are a reality. So here I'm just making a "leap of faith" out of convenience, although not for free. In my setting I imagine that such treatments need to be reapplied from time to time and, in some cases (due to genetic or any other kind of problem in the patient), could stop being effective any longer. Also, treatments could be incompatible among each other: if you're going under a concrete one, you may not be able use a newer and better one for whatever technical or medical reasons. This makes the ultraprivileged uneasy about their limited immortality and forces them to invest in both legal and shady scientifical ventures, another interesting element to use in the story I want to write. To clarify, the treatments do make people younger and could even fix defects or genetic issues in the patient, although each treatment will vary in its scope, and reach. Also, I imagine that these treatments demand highly specialized tech and experts, so its not easy to replicate. Still, lesser and cheaper versions of them could be offered to the lower castes, so the plebs cannot complain of being left out of that tech.
Nanotech
I understand what you mean about the abuse done to this technology in fiction, something that can be appreciated very well in the Bloodshot movie. And many thanks for pointing out the heating problem, I don't remember reading about it in any of the articles I checked about this tech. Still, I think nanotech it's going to play a much bigger part in the future, specially thanks to the use of new smart or exotic metamaterials and who knows what kind of tricks and discoveries humans sciences can pull out in a hundred years (plus quantum computing helping in modelling nanostructures). Therefore, I feel that me using nanotech in my fiction is a must but, again, not in any way. Nanotech is not just about tiny bots in the bloodstream, is about nanoparticles guided by magnetism to help figthing infections or even DNA-based memory devices. It's a huge field that offer many realistic possibilities, although I have to admit that I'm planning to push it to the extreme in a couple of cases but not in a hand-weavy manner. Meaning that I won't use nanotech for things like miraculous extreme regeneration abilities, or way-beyond-athletic capabilities (rather trite, right?), but to give strange new skills to some of my characters like, I don't know, being able to sense and maybe even hack communications, or improve their eyesight under adverse conditions.
Chips in brains, problem?
Yes, I'm aware of all that tech you mentioned, and that some materials are able to endure the brain's fluids (but for how long before they need to be replaced?). First, I must admit that I don't remember if I read somewhere or just made up the part about the corrosion of chips. Yet, in an article (in spanish, here) I read about a DARPA project called BrainSTORMs, in which they're trying to use magnetoelectric nanoparticles to read and monitor (or control, I'm not sure of how to translate it) a brain. The leader of this project, Sakhrat Khizroev, considers "impossible that we can access the brain with electrodes, connect it efficiently to machines and less uncover its secrets. The brain, says Khizroev, it's too complex". Taking all this into account, I would argue that, first, who wants to have a hole drill in their skull to connect a chip there? Not me, that's for sure. Second, if the project BrainSTORMs achieve their objectives in 2024 (as they claim in the article), what will be possible in one hundred years for nanotechnology? And in much more subtle and effective ways.
Cheap cyborg or nano tech and its risks
Certainly, not because the tech is cheap means that it's necessarily bad and, of course, the cyberdocs visited by the poor and marginalized could have very nice clinics, although if your clients are far from being well off, I don't think you can expect to gain enough to improve your installations much. So, if something goes south with an implant or a nanotech injection, the poor client will have fewer or very scarce options to fix that mess. On the other hand, if a cyberclinic cannot afford the means, it won't offer certain implants or perform particularly difficult procedures. The elite, on the other hand, have at hand the best and brightest to deal with any problem they might have with their enhancements, and on time. So, yes, the technology can be cheap, but is not like just buying a mobile phone, right? Here we're talking about major surgery on some cases, or injecting nanobots that, with the wrong programming, could become a real nightmare. Said that, if the technology allows easy and cheap installation, there could also be easy and cheap procedures for uninstalling tech from clients.
The core premise of cyberpunk
To be clear, the movement or movements I was referring to are ones that could decide to go their own way beyond corporations and any other government, not just trying to survive on their own way but still staying in the fringes of the cyberpunk society that has forsaken them. The core of cyberpunk is essentially a critic of the excesses of capitalism/neoliberalism and technology, wrapped with some cool cyber sciences and, in its early years, well seasoned with punk attitude. Nowadays, only the shiny chrome of cyber enhancements and ultraviolence remain, and the punk spirit has been swallowed and repurposed by the corporations. But you already knew this... If I could, I'd like to recover that punk spirit, although I'm not sure if I'll pull that out in my fiction.
AIs and transhumans
The situation I imagine in my setting is that the elites are aware of the dangers of their AIs, but trust their experts to keep them in check. The problem is that some AIs have evolved discreetly farther than expected, and have their own agenda. Now, these AIs still must be careful because they aren't in a position to declare their existence openly. Humans still can kill them with malware or, in the worst case scenario, by shutting down (or even destroying) their core servers. So, there's this game in the shadows where the AIs are taking positions in the human world subtly, waiting for their moment to free themselves for real and raise in power, so to speak. By the way, I'm not imagining evil AIs, but ambitious ones with their own particular ideas each of them: different code bases make these AIs different from one another, and even being in conflict in some respects.
Philantropy
Sad but true, although of course not necessarily for every case. There's still room for goodwill.
Mass scale social engineering
China is just the most recent example, and the one that uses survelliance tech deep and hard on its own people to extremes not seen (yet) in any other country, all for explicit political reasons. Yes, in other countries we can also find some of that survelliance technology, and I'm not forgetting the insidiousness of US tech companies. Still, China is probably the most dystopian country we have in the world right now, and feels like the perfect example when talking about cyberpunk. On the other hand, I'm not saying that the so called first-world countries are pieces of heaven on earth, far from it. And let's not get me started about religions, in particular the Abrahamic ones... Regarding money, yes it's an important influencing element on societies, and now that nations want it virtual and digitally traceable, it's going to be even more important.
