The Inciting Incident

[GeekDavid]

Here's some input from K.M. Weiland's Outling Your Novel (which includes a lot more than basic outlining):

What Is an Inciting Event?
Bestselling legal suspense author James Scott Bell describes the inciting event as a doorway: "The key question to ask yourself is this: Can my lead walk away from the plot right now and go on as he has before? If the answer is yes, you haven't gone through that first doorway yet.

What Isn't an Inciting Event?
Your story may include several important plot developments before you get to the inciting event. For example, in Ridley Scott's 2000 film Gladiator, the inciting event -- the death of Roman Emperor Marcus Aurelius -- doesn't occur until after several important scenes, including Aurelius's offering his throne to the protagonist. Even though the preceding scenes are important, they do not irrevocably change the character's world.

Where Should the Inciting Event Occur?
Generally speaking, the inciting event should occur not quite a quarter of the way into your story. Setting it this late in the story allows you to appropriately pace the introduction of your character, his personal problems, and his normal world, so readers will sympathize with him and understand when the inciting event blasts into view. For example, Gladiator's inciting event takes place after the character's normal world has been established (via the opening battle and the main character's interactions with the emperor and other important characters).

 

[Chessie]

GeekDavid, that post is awesome thank you! That explains things much more (and it used one of my favorite movies as the example haha). What I gather from that tidbit is that if the character can carry on normally after an event happens, then that's not it. So Penpilot is correct: the inciting incident in my story would be the protagonist volunteering herself for the large task ahead. When her professor gets word of the outbreak, she's in the room, but if she doesn't volunteer herself to help then she would just go back to her meager cabin and work on her tonics. However, taking responsibility here is what allows her to move further on into the story and get robbed. Sweet. I think I got it.

Let me just add in that I really like that explanation about the incident happening a quarter of the way in. I like the idea of the readers getting a feel for what she's like, so they understand why she volunteers herself in the first place.

 

[GeekDavid]

GeekDavid, that post is awesome thank you! That explains things much more (and it used one of my favorite movies as the example haha). What I gather from that tidbit is that if the character can carry on normally after an event happens, then that's not it. So Penpilot is correct: the inciting incident in my story would be the protagonist volunteering herself for the large task ahead. When her professor gets word of the outbreak, she's in the room, but if she doesn't volunteer herself to help then she would just go back to her meager cabin and work on her tonics. However, taking responsibility here is what allows her to move further on into the story and get robbed. Sweet. I think I got it.

Let me just add in that I really like that explanation about the incident happening a quarter of the way in. I like the idea of the readers getting a feel for what she's like, so they understand why she volunteers herself in the first place.

That's why I posted it. When I read it, the lightbulb went on over my head too.

 

[Penpilot]

The inciting incident doesn't have to involve the protagonist. Nor does the protagonist have to make a choice. Those are arbitrary rules you or somebody have made up.

If the protagonist isn't involved in the inciting incident and they don't make a choice then they have no agency. Agency is what makes the protagonist matter. Their choices matter. If they don't then the, the protagonist, doesn't matter to the outcome of the story. If Luke doesn't chose to buy R2 D2, nothing happens to him, no message from Leia, no seeing Ben. His life would remain the same, so no story about becoming a Jedi and fighting the Empire. Luke, our protagonist, will remain a farm boy. It doesn't matter what Leia does because she isn't the protagonist. Sure if she didn't send R2 away we wouldn't get the story but what she does is just background. She's part of the interesting things happening that intersect with the path of the protagonist and start him down a different path. Star Wars is Luke's story. That's why sending R2 isn't the inciting incident. The trajectory of that story doesn't involve Luke yet.


This is not arbitrary. If you examine movies and books this will be shown to be true.

Others think it is the catalyst, as per say, Snyder's page 11/12.

Others, like you, suggest it is the thing that takes you into Act 2, which would be more like Snyder's "break into two."

Me thinks you did not read my post closely enough. My definition of inciting incident is closer to Snyder's catalyst and nowhere near "break into two."

 

[PaulineMRoss]

It seems to me that much of the disagreement here stems from differing terminology. If you google 'inciting incident', you get a whole range of different points in the story, from some event, perhaps even before the start of the story, that sets the whole ball rolling to the point where the protagonist commits himself to some life-changing and irrevocable action.

I've seen (somewhere, although I can't find the reference now) that you can define three key points for the early part of the story:

- Catalyst (some event which kicks everything off, which may or may not directly involve the protagonist)
- Call to action (when it becomes clear the protagonist has something to do, but may refuse)
- Point of no return (when the protagonist commits)

I think people are using the term 'inciting incident' to refer to *different* points in the story. Here's a post which describes the inciting incident as a catalyst (and which says the inciting incident in Star Wars is Darth Vader attacking Princess Leia's ship):

Plot Points and the Inciting Incident - Narrative First

 

[Helen]

Here's some input from K.M. Weiland's Outling Your Novel (which includes a lot more than basic outlining):

Generally speaking, the inciting event should occur not quite a quarter of the way into your story.

At around the 25% mark, that makes it close to plot point 1, which makes it more or less the break into two.

My definition of inciting incident is closer to Snyder's catalyst and nowhere near "break into two."

That makes it around the 10% mark.

Here's a post which describes the inciting incident as a catalyst (and which says the inciting incident in Star Wars is Darth Vader attacking Princess Leia's ship):

Plot Points and the Inciting Incident - Narrative First

That puts it at, lets say, 0% - the get-go. Pretty much within the earliest sequences.

I think people are using the term 'inciting incident' to refer to *different* points in the story.

That's exactly what people are doing.

If the protagonist isn't involved in the inciting incident and they don't make a choice then they have no agency. Agency is what makes the protagonist matter. Their choices matter. If they don't then the, the protagonist, doesn't matter to the outcome of the story.

You're ignoring the debate about what a protagonist is and multiple characters with agency. For example, this suggests that the main character and protagonist can be split into two or more:
The difference between Hero, Main Character and Protagonist

With ensemble movies, there's more than one character with "agency." You're suggesting that they all have to be involved with the inciting incident, in the way you say, to have "agency," to matter to the outcome of the story.

"Agency" can be established earlier or later. It does not necessarily need to be established at the inciting incident, it does not need to be established in the way you say, choices and protagonist involvement can occur at various points, there are many ways to establish agency.

This is not arbitrary. If you examine movies and books this will be shown to be true.

You're probably using a narrow set of examples (Star Wars, Matrix) where it "seems" that your "rule" works (Luke agreeing to go with Ben, Neo taking the pill). These stories are better understood through hero's journey language (for which BTW, I recommend kalbashir.com )

The point of the inciting incident is to move the story forward, not establish agency.

There are lots of stories where the inciting incident doesn't involve a protagonist making a choice, because it actually doesn't need to be about the protagonist.

I mean, if it helps you write an inciting incident, then OK. But there's no rule saying that the inciting incident must feature those two elements, as you're suggesting.

 

[Penpilot]

You're ignoring the debate about what a protagonist is and multiple characters with agency. For example, this suggests that the main character and protagonist can be split into two or more:
The difference between Hero, Main Character and Protagonist

With ensemble movies, there's more than one character with "agency." You're suggesting that they all have to be involved with the inciting incident, in the way you say, to have "agency," to matter to the outcome of the story.

Each of the main POV characters has their own plot to follow. Each of their plots has a an inciting incident that starts it going. In the hero's journey all the hero, the main character, and the protagonist are the same person.

"Agency" can be established earlier or later. It does not necessarily need to be established at the inciting incident, it does not need to be established in the way you say, choices and protagonist involvement can occur at various points, there are many ways to establish agency.

I don't thing you're really listening to what I'm saying. You're attributing things to me that I never said. I did not say the inciting incident is use to establish agency. I said your main character, hero, protagonist must make the choice to go on the adventure. They must have agency in the matter of whether they go on the journey.

You're probably using a narrow set of examples (Star Wars, Matrix) where it "seems" that your "rule" works (Luke agreeing to go with Ben, Neo taking the pill). These stories are better understood through hero's journey language (for which BTW, I recommend kalbashir.com )

The point of the inciting incident is to move the story forward, not establish agency.

Again you're putting words in my mouth. Inciting incident is not used to establish agency. I never said that.

There are lots of stories where the inciting incident doesn't involve a protagonist making a choice, because it actually doesn't need to be about the protagonist.

I couldn't disagree more. It's all about the protagonist.

I mean, if it helps you write an inciting incident, then OK. But there's no rule saying that the inciting incident must feature those two elements, as you're suggesting.

Here are links where the source says the inciting incident is all about he protagonist.

Inciting incident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Main/Inciting Incident - Television Tropes & Idioms
Inciting Incident | Definition & Examples | Scribe Meets World

The thing is you can break down a story how ever your want. It doesn't matter. Because all those elements, however you want to label them, exist. If you want to get down to it, there are no rules for writing. Labels in writing often mean different things in different theories in writing. Inciting incident, how I define it and many others, I defy you to find a story where the protagonist doesn't have to make a choice the way I've described it.

 

[Helen]

Each of the main POV characters has their own plot to follow. Each of their plots has a an inciting incident that starts it going.

You don't need an inciting incident for each POV character.
e.g Hangover. One event moves everything forward.

Same with Blue Jasmin.

In the hero's journey all the hero, the main character, and the protagonist are the same person.

Not necessarily. We know that in Charlie and the Chocolate Factory (2005), we've got a main character and a protagonist.
But that can also be seen as hero's journey - we've got an Ordinary World, New World, First Threshold and so on.

I don't thing you're really listening to what I'm saying. You're attributing things to me that I never said. I did not say the inciting incident is use to establish agency.

Again you're putting words in my mouth. Inciting incident is not used to establish agency. I never said that.

Well, you did say that the inciting incident must involve a protagonist who makes a choice. And that if there is no protagonist making a choice, then there's no agency. So you did say it, if indirectly.

I'm really not trying to out words in your mouth. I'm just disagreeing with some of your statements and some of the implications within them. Like the one where you say that the "inciting incident must involve a protagonist who makes a choice."

I said your main character, hero, protagonist must make the choice to go on the adventure. They must have agency in the matter of whether they go on the journey.

Often, at the inciting incident, the protagonist isn't involved and doesn't have a choice. They're just "carried." Other characters do all the work and make the choices, if any.

In Alien, I'd say that the inciting incident is around when Dallas tells the crew that they have to investigate the signal. Parker, Brett, Lambert all resist going, but they got to go. Ripley's not really involved at all. She's not even part of the team that goes down to the planet. It doesn't become clear until much, much later that Ripley is the protagonist.

I couldn't disagree more. It's all about the protagonist.

In Blue Jasmin, Jasmin is the protagonist. But it's clearly not all about her. It's about Ginger too.

I think if you look at that story, you'll find Ginger carries a theme too.

So it's not all about the protagonist necessarily. Unless you start calling every POV character a protagonist.

Here are links where the source says the inciting incident is all about he protagonist.

I can't see a statement in any of them which says that the inciting incident MUST involve the protagonist.

And if there is one, then Alien proves them wrong.

I defy you to find a story where the protagonist doesn't have to make a choice the way I've described it.

Lets start with Alien, as I've described above.

 

[Penpilot]

I can't see a statement in any of them which says that the inciting incident MUST involve the protagonist.

Then I don't thing you read them closely enough. A quote from one of the links. " The Inciting Incident need not be the first thing the audience sees, nor the first eventful thing to happen in the story. It can often be preceded by long bits of Exposition, glimpses into the Backstory, or scenes setting up the world of the story. It pertains to the protagonist solely, and his role in the overall plot"

And if there is one, then Alien proves them wrong.

The inciting incident for Alien is when Ripley discovers the transmission is possibly a warning. It's more of action of inaction that lets the story proceed. She's about to go after the crew to warn them, but lets Ash talk her out of it. If she gets to warn the crew, then no face-hugger. Refusal of the Call happens when the crew returns, one of them having been contaminated by the face-hugger, and she refuses to let them in. But then Ash lets them in anyway, forcing us beyond the point of no return and into act 2.

Alien can be a tricky movie to identify structure because they're deliberately trying to hide who the real protagonist is. But it's obvious that Ripley is making choices that could stop the story cold, but Ash works against her and forces her ahead.

 

[Helen]

Then I don't thing you read them closely enough. A quote from one of the links. " The Inciting Incident need not be the first thing the audience sees, nor the first eventful thing to happen in the story. It can often be preceded by long bits of Exposition, glimpses into the Backstory, or scenes setting up the world of the story. It pertains to the protagonist solely, and his role in the overall plot"

For every link you come up with to support your argument, I can come up with one to support mine. Also, your links are suggesting that "the hero's life/direction/whatever changes" as a result of the inciting incident. That's different to being directly involved with it. And they omit your "choice" element.

A lot of links have been thrown about in this thread, We've had an inciting incident at 0%, at 10%, at 25%.... . Not everyone is right. Some / most are wrong.

Anyone who says that the inciting incident must involve a protagonist who makes a choice is wrong.

The inciting incident for Alien is when Ripley discovers the transmission is possibly a warning. It's more of action of inaction that lets the story proceed. She's about to go after the crew to warn them, but lets Ash talk her out of it. If she gets to warn the crew, then no face-hugger. Refusal of the Call happens when the crew returns, one of them having been contaminated by the face-hugger, and she refuses to let them in. But then Ash lets them in anyway, forcing us beyond the point of no return and into act 2.

Alien can be a tricky movie to identify structure because they're deliberately trying to hide who the real protagonist is. But it's obvious that Ripley is making choices that could stop the story cold, but Ash works against her and forces her ahead.

That's not the inciting incident.

I think you're stuck on the protagonist and are just tracing back to the moment she seems to first get involved.

 

[Penpilot]

A lot of links have been thrown about in this thread, We've had an inciting incident at 0%, at 10%, at 25%.... . Not everyone is right. Some / most are wrong.

There is not right for when the inciting incident should be. The fact that you're trying to apply absolutes to this subject matter shows that you're not understanding how the "rules" can be manipulated when writing.

Anyone who says that the inciting incident must involve a protagonist who makes a choice is wrong.

That's not the inciting incident.

I think you're stuck on the protagonist and are just tracing back to the moment she seems to first get involved.

Weather you think it's right or not, I told you every story contains a point where the protagonist must make a choice that will effect whether the story will happen or not. Call it the inciting incident or call it the jibber-jabber point, whatever. You said that that point doesn't exist in Alien. I pointed out that point and all you can say is "You're wrong." So that's your whole line of reasoning, "You're wrong". Well, I can see where this is going. I think any further "discussion" will be fruitless.

 

[Helen]

I told you every story contains a point where the protagonist must make a choice that will effect whether the story will happen or not. Call it the inciting incident or call it the jibber-jabber point, whatever. You said that that point doesn't exist in Alien. I pointed out that point and all you can say is "You're wrong." So that's your whole line of reasoning, "You're wrong". Well, I can see where this is going. I think any further "discussion" will be fruitless.

In The Godfather, most people would say the inciting incident's when the Don refuses Sollozzo or when the Don is shot.

But because neither of them involve the protagonist, you'd totally ignore both of them, scan the protagonist and probably point to when Michael calls the house and Sonny tells him to come home, or some later event involving Michael.

Your arbitrary rule is causing you to ignore likely, highly reasonable answers and favor unlikely, highly unreasonable answers.

To have a debate, the opposition needs a reasonable argument. And you don't have one.

you're not understanding how the "rules" can be manipulated when writing.

I don't see you doing that.

I see you flapping about with your suspicious rule and coming up with the wrong answers.

 

[Chessie]

So Helen, is your point that the inciting incident doesn't need to involve the protagonist? Isn't the story about the protagonist in the first place so why would the inciting incident not include him/her? :/

 

[Helen]

So Helen, is your point that the inciting incident doesn't need to involve the protagonist?

Yes.

Isn't the story about the protagonist in the first place so why would the inciting incident not include him/her?

The inciting incident gets the ball rolling.

We can see it in Alien. They get going without her. She gets involved later.

We can see it in The Godfather. The Don refuses Sollozzo, then gets shot. These events bring Michael in. He doesn't need to be directly involved with them.

 

[Chessie]

I disagree. The inciting incident is what gets the protagonist involved into the story in the first place. It changes their lives forever. If it doesn't include the protagonist, then where is the story? Why have a protagonist at all then?

 

[Penpilot]

I see you flapping about with your suspicious rule and coming up with the wrong answers.

I was going to ignore this further, but stop trying to make this personal. "Flapping? Suspicious rule?" I've given you links that back up my claim. Understanding comes with respect. Your tone is disrespectful.

 

[Sheilawisz]

Hello everyone, in order to keep a friendly atmosphere in this thread please click on the following link and read the Forum Guidelines.

Helen: Making degrading, snide or derisive comments and engaging into Argumentative or hostile behavior goes against our Forum Guidelines. Please try to be more friendly and respectful towards other members of Mythic Scribes.

Thank you =)

 

[Helen]

stop trying to make this personal

I wasn't trying to.

You threw some snide remarks and I responded.

You're right. Lets keep it civil.

If it doesn't include the protagonist, then where is the story? Why have a protagonist at all then?

You could equally say, why have all those other great scenes where the protagonist isn't involved.

In Alien, a lot goes on when Ripley isn't involved. Same with The Godfather.

There's a lot of story in those movies where the protagonist isn't involved.

 

[shangrila]

I think the inciting incident has to relate to your hero/MC in some way (obviously), but at the same time it doesn't HAVE to be a choice made by them. There are sometimes just things that happen, for good or bad, that can radically change a life.

 

[Helen]

I think the inciting incident has to relate to your hero/MC in some way (obviously)

There is a relationship. It can be cause and effect. The inciting incident can result in a character getting involved in the story, who turns out to be the protagonist.

But the protagonist doesn't have to be involved in the inciting incident.