Using real world things/concepts in fantasy fiction

[BiggusBeardus]

Ok, I've made a similar post to this before talking about using "mafia" terms in my fantasy novel. That question is moot now because the story changed.

But I have a broader question now:

Is it ok to use "real world" things in a fantasy story?

I'm creating a magic system/concept of all creation and it is based on Taoism and Chi.

I've been racking my brain over using different names and words, but they all sound dumb and the concept is still the same, regardless of what I call it.

It clearly (in my mind) doesn't make sense to have words from a real world language in my setting where that language doesn't exist. Yet, we as writers obviously have to pick our own native tongues to write out stories, regardless of what the fictional people speak.

My story is very focused on magic and the philosophy behind it so it will be included in the story.

I mean, if cartoons, and video games can include Chi and such, I assume I can get away with it, right?

Thoughts?

 

[Queshire]

Sure. At worst it might just sound funny to the audience if you don't do your research.

 

[pmmg]

As a general rule, stories kind and of exist with the presumption that its in english as a translation of whatever they speak on the fantasy world.

But… if you start using terms like chi and tao, you suggesting the story is of a flavor where preconceived notions that of those things may be expected. Use the terms and deviate and you might draw some looks.

For myself. I went with making up a lot of terms. While still being mostly in english.

 

[Queshire]

M'yep. If you've got Harry Potter using daoist magic then you've got some explaining to do. I mean, that explaining can be really, really fun to do, but still...

 

[BiggusBeardus]

Sure. At worst it might just sound funny to the audience if you don't do your research.

I am doing research, but I'm not trying to make it exactly Taoism or Chi in every sense. My stuff is just sooooo close that it's hard not to use the real world versions as a major basis. Plus every made up word I come up with seems to be something in some other language or already means something in English.

Thanks for responding.

 

[Queshire]

Hmm... how does it work?

 

[Naruzeldamaster]

Is it OK to use fantasy objects in real world stories?
Indiana Jhones and Laura Croft seem to agree wholeheartedly.

In regards to your question: you gotta make sure that your 'expy' item is close enough to the real world thing that the reader understands what is being talked about.

Like if I have a social media outlet, I'm going to have it have networking and all kinds of similar things that social networks have.

 

[Finchbearer]

I think most of all fantasy uses real world stuff. I have most of my fantasy set in the ‘real world’, using recognisable place names etc.

So many fantasy examples of this! Context is everything as others have suggested, using an Asian concept in a European setting might put a bad taste in some readers mouths. There’s a lot of de-colonising attitudes around at the moment, everyone seems to hate ‘the British’ for that reason right now as if we’re all from aristocratic families with a personal heritage of colonialism…

 

[Prince of Spires]

If it walks like a duck and it quaks like a duck, it's a duck.

Go for it. As pmmg mentions, a very common idea is that someone translated the story set in a different world to our English so we can actually understand what's going on. After all, when you think about it, while there is no reason for your fantasy world to have the exact word "Chi" in their language, they also have absolutely no reason to be speaking English in the first place. So you can make the same argument for each and every word in your novel.

So steal to your heart's content.

everyone seems to hate ‘the British’ for that reason right now

I'll just leave this here: List of countries that have gained independence from the United Kingdom - Wikipedia

 

[Finchbearer]

I'll just leave this here: List of countries that have gained independence from the United Kingdom - Wikipedia

Yeah that’s a good reason to hate an entire race, most of which don’t have anything to do with colonialism…

 

[Finchbearer]

I mean, if cartoons, and video games can include Chi and such, I assume I can get away with it, right?

To extend on this subject and to offer some (hopefully) more critical thought, you are touching on the subject of appropriation here. And since you’re asking the question, I feel like you know there are some things to consider here.

What is appropriate to include or not include in fiction writing as far as real world terminology, culture and discourse I think begs to be properly considered before use, so as to not take another culture and it for your own gain without proper consideration for that culture. If it’s your own culture, you still need to consider how you’re taking inspiration from it, imo.

That is not to say you can’t be fan of Asian concepts, but you might want to be careful as to how exactly you are using them in your writing, particularly in the sense that if you make poor connections and choices as to how you use this inspiration source in your writing, you as the author is going to be coming off worse.

You won’t be able to please everyone with your writing however politically correct you make your work, but if you’re using a fusion concept, as in a mixing of cultures, then it’s worth taking the time to consider how you’re using your inspiration from the real world and how your story will affect the reader.

 

[BiggusBeardus]

To extend on this subject and to offer some (hopefully) more critical thought, you are touching on the subject of appropriation here. And since you’re asking the question, I feel like you know there are some things to consider here.

What is appropriate to include or not include in fiction writing as far as real world terminology, culture and discourse I think begs to be properly considered before use, so as to not take another culture and it for your own gain without proper consideration for that culture. If it’s your own culture, you still need to consider how you’re taking inspiration from it, imo.

That is not to say you can’t be fan of Asian concepts, but you might want to be careful as to how exactly you are using them in your writing, particularly in the sense that if you make poor connections and choices as to how you use this inspiration source in your writing, you as the author is going to be coming off worse.

You won’t be able to please everyone with your writing however politically correct you make your work, but if you’re using a fusion concept, as in a mixing of cultures, then it’s worth taking the time to consider how you’re using your inspiration from the real world and how your story will affect the reader.

You are correct. Appropriation is a hotspot for people. I don't want to disrespect anyone's culture. Although, the more I study Taoism, the more I think I'm a Taoist.

This is why I want to call it something else. But this group that I'm writing about are warrior monks that are, for lack of another word, Taoist in how they view the world and life. Chi and yin and yang are also a big part of it. I've been trying to avoid those terms but just about anyone would recognize the yin yang symbol. I can't help it if the real world came up with a really good idea. LOL

I'm going to keep working on it and try to distance some of it from real world stuff as best I can.

I appreciate your insight.

Same to all of you who have responded. I sincerely appreciate it. It helps me think through things and I don't have anyone locally to talk to about this stuff. You've all been a great help.

 

[Aldarion]

Ok, I've made a similar post to this before talking about using "mafia" terms in my fantasy novel. That question is moot now because the story changed.

But I have a broader question now:

Is it ok to use "real world" things in a fantasy story?

I'm creating a magic system/concept of all creation and it is based on Taoism and Chi.

I've been racking my brain over using different names and words, but they all sound dumb and the concept is still the same, regardless of what I call it.

It clearly (in my mind) doesn't make sense to have words from a real world language in my setting where that language doesn't exist. Yet, we as writers obviously have to pick our own native tongues to write out stories, regardless of what the fictional people speak.

My story is very focused on magic and the philosophy behind it so it will be included in the story.

I mean, if cartoons, and video games can include Chi and such, I assume I can get away with it, right?

Thoughts?

Tolkien explained it as "translator's convention". Basically, story was originally written in whatever is the actual language of the setting, and then writer-as-translator uses terms that are the closest equivalents to originals. And I tend to follow that.

In short: go ahead and use real-world terms. Concept is important more than the word as such.

 

[JBCrowson]

Yeah that’s a good reason to hate an entire race, most of which don’t have anything to do with colonialism…

Agree - when you see how those colonial types treated their own poor (ie ordinary) folk you understand that what they did to natives elsewhere was of a piece with that. All horrible stuff.

DOI: I would have been a serf in days past.