When to Capitalize...the Gods?

[pmmg]

So...another sticky wicket. How do you decide to capitalize the Gods.

In my story, there are many belief sets, and many POV characters. I had been plowing through, choosing to capitalize, if, in the esteem of the POV character, the God was a real God... Or, in other words, the POV character believed them true.

But with so many POV's and so many conversations where Gods come up, it gets confusing. In one scene God is capitalized when talking about Kullis, but in another, he is lower case. And I cannot expect a reader to sort why I am doing it the way I am. So, I just decided to capitalize in every instance...there, problem solved. Only...not really, cause the reader will know some characters do not think some Gods are actual, so why would I capitalize?

In a conversation that just floated by, I have the sentence... 'No, I do not believe in your Gods, I believe in the God of my father'...

So, what should I do? Seems silly to capitalize when they are saying they dont believe, but on the other hand, I need a consistent rule. I have been capitalizing in every instance, believed or not.

I should note, I am a Caps nut. I capitalize many things I probably should not. Like Captain, and Steward, and anything the even looks like a title or name. But they have rules. Captain is quite tricky at times.

Anyway...your thoughts?

 

[Incanus]

Oh, cool--another 'style manual' kind of issue. I think these are interesting to go over.

I don't have my manual with me, but I looked how to deal with capitalizing terms like 'captain' not long ago. From what I learned, if it is just a reference to the title, it is not capitalized. But when the title appears as part of someone's name, it gets capitalized.

Thus:

"Did you ask Captain Barlow?"

"No, I couldn't find the captain anywhere."

Does that sound right? Second, third opinion?

I'm not sure about god/gods and capitalization. That one may have special rules.

 

[Devor]

You capitalize when it’s used as a name or part of a title.

In Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, you’re not supposed to use a proper name for God (“thou shalt not take the name of the lord thy God in vain”), so Lord and God are capitalized because they are used the same way as a name or title.
But you could imagine a fictional god who is addressed with different titles, like Holy One or something.

 

[ThinkerX]

Grammarly throws a fit when I capitalize 'Gods.' It prefers 'God,' singular.

 

[pmmg]

You capitalize when it’s used as a name or part of a title.

In Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, you’re not supposed to use a proper name for God (“thou shalt not take the name of the lord thy God in vain”), so Lord and God are capitalized because they are used the same way as a name or title.
But you could imagine a fictional god who is addressed with different titles, like Holy One or something.

What I imagine is... taking from the example above....


"I do not believe in your gods," said Carl. "I believe in the God of my father."

"How can you not believe in my Gods," said Dolph. "Your god is dumb."

"What?" said Carl, "My God is a great God, and your gods are all fake."

"My Gods just got us through this whole battle. Did you not see the rage of Kullis as I handled my axe?"


OR....Changing the POV

"I do not believe in your god," said Dolph. "I believe in the Gods of my father."

"How can you not believe in my god," said Carl. "Your Gods are dumb."

"What?" said Dolph, "My Gods are all great Gods, and your god is fake."

"My God just got us through this whole battle," said Carl. "Did you not see the rage of Crom as I handled my axe?"


Do you see the confusing mess, if I base it on what one believes?

If I follow the Real World manual of styles rules, I would either have them all be lower case, or...I might uppercase one, if I was a stand in for the read God. But that would show the reader what I the author thought of it, not the characters. It would be tipping the scale as to what is to be believed. Dolph believes just as strong as Carl, why discount his god? Especially if it's in his POV?


I think it would be a rare reader who could decipher that I was doing it based on the current POV character.

I think I just have to capitalize them all, or capitalize none. I lean towards all. <--though my editor got tripped up on this. He would prefer I followed the real world example.

I dont think Elements of Style will work with this type of fiction.

Course, in dialog, the characters just spit out the word. I dont think they care if it capitalized or not. But this problem also shows up in the prose outside of dialog as well. As the Author, I dont want my thumb on the scale.

 

[Devor]

What I imagine is... taking from the example above....

"I do not believe in your gods," said Carl. "I believe in the God of my father."

"How can you not believe in my Gods," said Dolph. "Your god is dumb."

"What?" said Carl, "My God is a great God, and your gods are all fake."

"My Gods just got us through this whole battle. Did you not see the rage of Kullis as I handled my axe?"

OR....Changing the POV

"I do not believe in your god," said Dolph. "I believe in the Gods of my father."

"How can you not believe in my god," said Carl. "Your Gods are dumb."

"What?" said Dolph, "My Gods are all great Gods, and your god is fake."

"My God just got us through this whole battle," said Carl. "Did you not see the rage of Crom as I handled my axe?"

So if this were real life, presumably God would be capitalized as a reference to the Judeo-Christian God, and gods would all be lower case, regardless of which POV it is. Just like you always capitalize Zeus, or a title like Thunder Bringer, as the name of the god Zeus. God is always capitalized when discussing the Judie-Christian God.

The problem, I think, is that you’re steering too close to the real world. There’s no reason a fictional monotheistic deity couldn’t have an often used name, or a different set of preferred titles, and that god as a reference to it wouldn’t need to be capitalized - but also, probably wouldn’t be the word a believer would prefer to use.

 

[Demesnedenoir]

I simply cap zero uses of god/gods because every use is not a proper title as in God.

 

[pmmg]

I should have made it a poll.

 

[pmmg]

I simply cap zero uses of god/gods because every use is not a proper title as in God.

Do you do this because no one in your story thinks they are real gods? or because they are not real gods due to outside concerns. As in, they are not the capitalized as they are not the Christian/Jewish/Muslim god as Devor as noted?

 

[Karlin]

Just write it, and let the editor sort it out...

 

[Prince of Spires]

Do you do this because no one in your story thinks they are real gods? or because they are not real gods due to outside concerns. As in, they are not the capitalized as they are not the Christian/Jewish/Muslim god as Devor as noted?

When they're a group of gods, then you don't capitalize them, because then it's just a jobs title (sort of). Doesn't matter if they're real or not. Presumably most people who refer to their gods believe they're real after all. Just like you wouldn't refer to a group of carpenters as the Carpenters unless they're a music band and that's their name.

God (as in the christian one) is capitalized simply because it's used as his name.

In my setting, I've got a polytheistic panteon. Everyone refers to them as the gods, none-capitalized. However, we've also got a dark cult (because of course there's one...), who believe one of those gods should rule the others. They capitalize God when they're refering to him alone.

 

[Penpilot]

Whenever I run into an issue like this, I try to default to keeping it simple for the reader. I don't have a singular God in my worlds, so everything would be lowercase. If I ran into a issue like yours, I'd worry that alternating the upper and lower cases would confuse the reader or make them pause to think about what's going on with the text instead of engaging with the story.

One approach to consider is instead of changing cases use italics. Now when someone is talking about their god the italics places emphasis on the god that's important to them. My gods would kick your gods' arses.

 

[SamazonE]

God should have a capital, because that is the meaning of the word. Like other things, perhaps there is a meaning that would be a lower case, for the ideal to be set in place, that is comparative not superlative.

If I was using a capital letter for anything else, it would be a name, because that is a being. If there is any form without sentience, I would use a lower case.

There is the idea of firsts and seconds with superlatives and comparatives. In this case, I would just forget pronunciation, and use permutation to confuse the reader.

 

[TheKillerBs]

In Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, you’re not supposed to use a proper name for God (“thou shalt not take the name of the lord thy God in vain”), so Lord and God are capitalized because they are used the same way as a name or title.
But you could imagine a fictional god who is addressed with different titles, like Holy One or something.

That's just Judaism, really, and they're also uncomfortable with using the title God (you'll often see observing Jews writing G-d instead). In Christianity we have no qualms about using God's personal name (the Tetragrammaton) and the usage of Lord is related to the discomfort of Second Temple Jews to use the divine name. In Islam the name of God is Allah (apparently a contraction of al-illah "the god") and preferred over translating it to God. Also, funnily enough, the Holy One is (part of) one of God's titles in Judaism and Christianity, i.e., the Holy One of Israel. I dunno if it's one of Allah's 99 names in Islam though.

 

[pmmg]

In Christianity we have no qualms about using God's personal name (the Tetragrammaton) and the usage of Lord is related to the discomfort of Second Temple Jews to use the divine name.

That's not true. I know plenty Christians who have an issue with it.

 

[pmmg]

God should have a capital, because that is the meaning of the word. Like other things, perhaps there is a meaning that would be a lower case, for the ideal to be set in place, that is comparative not superlative.

If I was using a capital letter for anything else, it would be a name, because that is a being. If there is any form without sentience, I would use a lower case.

There is the idea of firsts and seconds with superlatives and comparatives. In this case, I would just forget pronunciation, and use permutation to confuse the reader.

I am not sure what you've said, but it sounded very smart.

 

[Mad Swede]

Of course, what you are discussing is capitalisation as applied in English. The rules are not necessarily the same in other languages...

 

[xena]

I just treat them like any other proper noun, capitalize divine names/titles, but leave 'gods' lowercase when it’s generic.

 

[pmmg]

Supposing its not generic?

 

[pmmg]

Of course, what you are discussing is capitalisation as applied in English. The rules are not necessarily the same in other languages...

So what would you do in a different language?