Writing A Series Out Of Order

[Babayaga321]

Morning all!

Okay... here's the problem. Wannabee writer of fantasy coming back to a series of books I have had in my mind for absolute ages (far too long!), and have four books planned for the series. The problem is that, although books one and four have been outlined (not in any great detail it must be said), but the majority of the plotting and writing has been done on books two and three. I'm currently working through book two to try and finish the plotting of the main core (middle) of the book.

The question is, I'm having to build a history for the two middle books in any case, so should I put these on hold and get book one done and dusted? I wouldn't be able or want to publish (say) book three in any case first until the preceding books had been completed, so should I put the brakes on and complete them in order?

I tend to write whatever chapter / scene occurs to me in a book at any one time, and it looks like I'm doing this with the entire series itself. But will this work? Has anybody else completed a series out of order? I'm thinking that this might be why I'm taking so long to get these done!

Any advice / experiences gratefully received.

Cheers - G.

 

[Lynea]

Yeah, I'd say finishing book 1 should be your immediate goal. I won't tell you not to plot or outline your other stuff but, having something airtight to continue from later will save you alot of time.

 

[Babayaga321]

Thanks for this. Each time I progress a bit further with the others the more I'm feeling that the entire series arc will become unmanageable and disjointed. Maybe time to slam on the brakes and take another look at the plotlines of each of the books before I go on. Thanks for responding.

 

[Penpilot]

Honestly, do whatever you want as long as you’re making steady progress on the project. Just realize there will be pros and cons to each approach, from a simple organizational standpoint to creative one.

Also if you’re more attracted to the middle portion of the series, you should ask yourself why that is. It could be that first book isn’t all that interesting and the real meat of the story lies in the middle books. Everything else may be just backstory, though important for context, but not really interesting enough to drive a story.

Not a novel series, but look at the Star Wars movies. Lucas told the middle portion of his epic tale. He then went back to make the beginning, but after so much time away, he couldn’t recapture the magic. And then, he didn’t have the desire to finish off the tale and handed it off to someone else.

 

[Chasejxyz]

How are you defining the number of the books? Like are they chronological in time for your world? Or are they the order that your reader should read them?

Part of writing a whole-ass book is you need to sit down and force yourself to finish the whole-ass book. Even if your writing style is to jump around, you still need to put everything in order, fill in the gaps, and read it from cover to cover as part of editing. So if it's absolutely critical for the reader to read book 1 first, then you need to sit down and write, edit, and publish that book first.

But also...is there a reason why you just haven't been writing the first book? Is it not interesting to you? Then how is it going to be interesting for your readers? If you think it needs to be written and read to understand the "good" books, then you're just creating homework for your reader, and no one is going to like that. WHAT, exactly, is in that book that is 100% required for the latter books AND it cannot be delivered in any other way?

 

[Demesnedenoir]

I’m working on three books, one a prequel and released in serial fashion on Vella, while the other two have time overlap, and so they have proven to be messy, making sure that events in one don’t cluster-flubber the other. That said, once I got the one worked out enough I know I’m safe from unruly historical events! It’s time to hit the book in the order they’ll be released.This can be a horror because inspiration is a fickle lover. That’s where one must buckle down and go, IMO, as the temptation to never really finish could creep in. That said, if one is writing for Indie release, and you plan on doing a rapid-fire release of the entire series, THEN, I guess one could do whatever you want.

 

[ThinkerX]

My rule of thumb: have at least a outline or rough draft of the last book in the series before releasing the first book. With 'Empire' - seven book series - I continually find myself putting things in later volumes that must be accounted for, if only in passing, in earlier books.

 

[ButlerianHeretic]

Just throwing this out there, but this sounds to me like a situation where asking oneself where the story starts is a good idea. By that I mean, you can really start the story at any point potentially, but some places to start the story are going to be a lot more interesting than others. If you find yourself really invested in book 2 and 3, does book 1 really need to be told? To use the Star Wars example, we all were just fine for ages without Anakin Skywalker's story being told in mind-numbing detail. Sometimes an idea is more powerful when we just imagine it. Look up the principle of the "Noodle Incident" from Calvin and Hobbes in TV Tropes, for example. "Named for an incident referenced by the characters of Calvin and Hobbes, where the author admitted he decided against ever stating what happened, as he figured nothing he could come up with would be as outrageous as what the readers thought happened." But this is a classic pitfall of prequels where our imagination and the mystery of what the clone wars, or the fall of Anakin Skywalker, or any number of other things in the world were was way more intriguing than the reality of being shown that stuff.

Maybe try starting with book 2 and see if you find yourself being forced to tell a lot of backstory that would be more interesting if shown, then trying to add just enough showing of backstory to avoid excessive telling and see if it actually takes a whole book to accomplish that, or if maybe it could just be a prologue or a few chapters at the beginning of the former book 2. And by "forced" I mean, it literally wouldn't make sense without that info. Readers are smart and want to think and imagine things, so leaving some stuff that is merely hinted at can be really fun.

 

[Mad Swede]

When I write a novel the first thing I write is the opening scene, because its this which sets the whole plot going. If you don't know how your first book (and hence the series) is going to open then I'd suggest you probably don't need that book at all. The reason I say that is because I get the impression that most of the action happens in books 2 and 3, which suggests that book 1 is mostly background and maybe some back plot. I tend to introduce background and back plot as part of character development, as this gives me the freedom to leave some things vague or unsaid, so that the readers fill in things as they see fit. There are some incidents which need describing but which don't fir into the novels and which aren't enough to build a novel around, and these I tend to write as short standalone stories.

 

[Rosemary Tea]

To my mind, writing is similar to making a movie. The scenes are not filmed in order. They're filmed when the actors and setting can be gotten together, and then edited into the actual film. Inevitably, some scenes get cut.

Writing is less complicated, because you don't need a team for it, and you don't need to physically be on location or build a set, it's just you and you sit down and do it. But still, scenes get written out of order. A book is a patchwork quilt. The patches can be made in any order, and you stitch them together however catches your fancy.

You might find that some scenes you write for one of your books need to be cut. In some cases, those scenes might better fit in another book. Or they might be the backstory you keep in your mind but don't outright tell the reader. If you have enough backstory scenes, they might turn into a prequel, to release after the main series.

 

[pmmg]

You gotta do what works.

One issue I tend to come across a lot writing in a linear fashion is often I find something that becomes better then my first effort, and I want to go back and change it....but sometimes making even a small change snowballs all the way through the story creating a lot of rewriting. So, starting from closer to the end might even be an advantage. Also...if you are working on the middle parts, those tend to be harder parts to write. The beginning and the End is were a lot of the cool stuff is set up and delivered. I'd say you are ahead of the game.

 

[Babayaga321]

Also if you’re more attracted to the middle portion of the series, you should ask yourself why that is. It could be that first book isn’t all that interesting and the real meat of the story lies in the middle books. Everything else may be just backstory, though important for context, but not really interesting enough to drive a story.

Interesting you should say that. The first book I had imagined would describe the fall of the existing ruling structure due to a rising of the enemy forces. This will be referred to in book two, but is basically the historical backstory which sets up the middle two books.

Not a novel series, but look at the Star Wars movies. Lucas told the middle portion of his epic tale. He then went back to make the beginning, but after so much time away, he couldn’t recapture the magic. And then, he didn’t have the desire to finish off the tale and handed it off to someone else.

And this got me thinking that maybe the second book in the series could, in fact, be moved to first. Changing the plot of books 2, 3, and 4 might then fit into into a trilogy rather than four books. As I said... it's got me thinking....

 

[Babayaga321]

How are you defining the number of the books? Like are they chronological in time for your world? Or are they the order that your reader should read them?

Yep. I'd planned them to be chronological in time.

But also...is there a reason why you just haven't been writing the first book? Is it not interesting to you? ........ WHAT, exactly, is in that book that is 100% required for the latter books AND it cannot be delivered in any other way?

I think initially I started with book two as I had the impression that the book was near enough fully formed in my head. Book one was all the historical stuff which would have required a shed load of worldbuilding at the time which I wasn't particularly interested in. Since then I've been doing this as I went along which I should have been doing in the first place....

 

[Babayaga321]

This can be a horror because inspiration is a fickle lover. That’s where one must buckle down and go, IMO, as the temptation to never really finish could creep in.

I'm beginning to think that's where I am at the moment, whether I like or not...

 

[Babayaga321]

Maybe try starting with book 2 and see if you find yourself being forced to tell a lot of backstory that would be more interesting if shown, then trying to add just enough showing of backstory to avoid excessive telling and see if it actually takes a whole book to accomplish that, or if maybe it could just be a prologue or a few chapters at the beginning of the former book 2. And by "forced" I mean, it literally wouldn't make sense without that info. Readers are smart and want to think and imagine things, so leaving some stuff that is merely hinted at can be really fun.

Thanks for this. As I replied to PenPilot earlier, I'm beginning to think this is the way I should go with it. Over the last few days I've been thinking more about how I could work in some of the backstory / historical stuff from book one - MC experiences dreams / visions, historical events discussed between the characters around the campfire, plus also the 'prologue' route. In fact, I've potentially already written what could be used as a prologue in the form of a diary entry made by the former Calasarn ruler, dictated and sealed in the vault as his seat of power is being assailed by the enemy Queen. It explains the reasons why his daughter, only a baby at the time, is sent away for her own safety and to hopefully protect the ruling line of which she is the last member. And this then is where book two begins, when the girl has grown, learns the truth of her lineage, and has to find her way back to recover it...

Maybe I will try to cover the backstory in smaller chunks throughout the book, rather than going initially down the prologue route. I always thought a writer should try to avoid them if at all possible, as they are not generally well liked by readers and editors...

 

[Babayaga321]

.... I'd suggest you probably don't need that book at all. The reason I say that is because I get the impression that most of the action happens in books 2 and 3, which suggests that book 1 is mostly background and maybe some back plot.

Thanks for saying this. That's more like the conclusion I'm beginning to come to as well!

 

[Babayaga321]

....often I find something that becomes better then my first effort, and I want to go back and change it....but sometimes making even a small change snowballs all the way through...

Yep. This has happened a fair bit as things have progressed (albeit slowly) over the years...

.... Also...if you are working on the middle parts, those tend to be harder parts to write.

That's what I've been finding . I know that she wakes up and starts at A, and has to travel to B to do this really important and crucial task, but then a few things have to happen in the interim to try and stop her and trip her up... trying to come up with fresh ideas for these 'interim' events is hard sometimes, and gives me a headache at times. I've got at least three - 'something happens here' - notes in my Scrivener plot cards due to this!

.... The beginning and the End is were a lot of the cool stuff is set up and delivered. I'd say you are ahead of the game.

Thanks for saying that, but at times I'm not too sure.... ;-)