Can we make new heroes?

[Netardapope]

I was recently thinking about the heroes journey and the whole concept of the "hero". As we all know, there are a shit ton of hero archetypes. Antihero, romantic hero, epic hero, and much more! I've been thinking lately if it's possible that we've discovered every type of hero? I mean, it would be cool to hear if you guys think a new archetype has been recently created (I hope it has). One of my my greatest fears ( albeit irrational) is that the heroes journey shall become so pervasive that we'll run out of original ways to tell stories. Hell! Sometimes I think we might run out of ways to put twists on the old tropes!

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[Penpilot]

How many shades of gray are there between black and white? To me, that's how many heroes or villains we have to work with, whether we have labels of or them or not. The same sort of thinking, for me, applies to the heroes journey and twists on tropes.

Will painters ever run out of different colors to work with?

 

[WooHooMan]

There are probably as many types of heroes as there are types of people or types of conflicts.
Which is to say there are an infinite amount, really.

Also, keep in mind that the hero's journey has always been a tool for analysis and evaluation of stories, not a formula for writing (though it can be used in that way).
Saying that the pervasiveness of the hero's journey will limit the ways in which we tell stories is like saying science will limit how nature can operate.
I also think the hero's journey is broad enough that there is always room for originality within the formula.

On that note, there's nothing inherently special about putting twists on familiar conventions as eventually those twists will become the norm. A good story will be good regardless of how much it fits or doesn't fit conventions.

So, there's my opinions.

 

[Heliotrope]

I think, at the end of the day, people want to see someone overcome some sort of obstacle. I think that is all that story telling is about. The bigger the obstacle, the better, but it can be anything. Divorce? Cancer? Autism? Rabid dogs? Zombies? Vampire love? Evil wizards whatever. Give us someone who over comes something and people are pretty happy.

So how you want to work that is pretty much endless, I think.

Like PP noted, there are as many heroes as there are people.

Or, there are as many heroes as there are challenges to be overcome.

Now, I DO think that heroes change based on what society values. In the 1930's Superman was huge because he was a stand-up guy who withheld the values of the time. Nowadays we love a bad ass, and so the anti-hero has risen in popularity. Young kids have a different idea of what makes up a 'hero' then adults between the ages of 30-55, etc. I think that there is some value in identifying your audience and then writing the hero for them… But not always, and breaking out or twisting the norms is good.

However, I just came back from a workshop by a publishing company that publishes YA fiction. They have said that they are looking for heroes that are between the ages of 13-19 (because kids almost always read up, but rarely down in age) and they are looking for more 'boy' heroes. There has been a huge insurgence in 'girl' heroes, and boys are not buying those books. They want more boys heroes… so, depending on what you are writing for, knowing what 'heroes' the publishers are looking for might be valuable.

 

[Netardapope]

I guess it all really depends on how you view it all. The way I see the whole world is that history follows a pattern and that in that patterns you have the same core conflicts repeating but in different contexts. While I do feel that the contexts will always change and be infinite, I often ponder if we'll ever run out of core ideas for conflicts. Sorry if I'm being a bit vague or abstract but this is the best way I could put it

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[Penpilot]

I guess it all really depends on how you view it all. The way I see the whole world is that history follows a pattern and that in that patterns you have the same core conflicts repeating but in different contexts. While I do feel that the contexts will always change and be infinite, I often ponder if we'll ever run out of core ideas for conflicts. Sorry if I'm being a bit vague or abstract but this is the best way I could put it

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Well, when you put it that way, there are some who say there are only a limited amount of plots. The number varies, but one of them says there are only three, Man vs. Man, Man vs. Nature, and Man vs themselves.

If for the sake of argument we say that's true, then of all the stories ever written, filmed, told, etc, has that been a limiting factor? Personally, I don't think it has.

I say this all the time. Originality doesn't lie in ideas or concepts. Originality lies within the execution of those concepts. It's your personal take on things that will determine originality, and though you are similar to other people, you are unique. So how well you can bring out your personal uniqueness, your voice, and put that into your writing will determine how successful you are at being "original".

Personally, I think originality is overrated.

 

[Heliotrope]

Yeah, I agree with PP. Look at the popularity of reality TV. It is always the same drama, just with different people in different clothes with different accents, and yet people keep watching it.

Look at every romance ever written:

Boy and girl hate each other.
Then boy and girl learn to love each other.
Then boy and girl hate that they love each other and that they actually 'need' somebody.
Then boy and girl get over their egos and learn to love each other again.

It is all the same, over and over and over, and yet we (women… me… *cough, cough*) still love it.

Look at every car accident that people slow down to gawk at. Look at every murder in the news. Look at every train crash. People love drama. Look at every political scandal. It is always 'new' even though we have all seen it before.


I have watched the Hunger Games series three times in a row in the past two weeks. I'm a 31 year old woman. That is shameful. There is nothing new about Hunger Games… and yet….

Same story. Different way.

 

[skip.knox]

This matter of types of heroes, or types of plots, isn't really about heroes and plots at all. It's about our ability to discern patterns. So yes, critics going clear back to Aristotle have been able to look at a wide body of literature and place all the works into three or five or seven (it always seems to be an odd number, doesn't it?, or else a multiple of ten) buckets. This says much more about the buckets than it does about the works.

IOW, don't spend much effort thinking about this. Write your story. It will be original because no one else, in the entire history of humanity, has written exactly that.

 

[WooHooMan]

Well, when you put it that way, there are some who say there are only a limited amount of plots. The number varies, but one of them says there are only three, Man vs. Man, Man vs. Nature, and Man vs themselves.

If for the sake of argument we say that's true, then of all the stories ever written, filmed, told, etc, has that been a limiting factor? Personally, I don't think it has.

To build off this: keep in mind postmodernism, deconstructionism and film are all less than 200 years old. New technology and new approaches to fiction are constantly being developed. It's so gradual and ubiquitous that I don't think anyone really notices.

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if in the next century, Man vs. the Writer or Man vs. the Story's Medium conflicts become more common than Man vs. Nature

 

[psychotick]

Hi,

For me the key plot is man versus the laptop, but I refuse to type about it beause the laptop keeps winning!

Cheers, Greg.

 

[ascanius]

How many shades of gray are there between black and white?

If I remember correctly there are 255 shades of grey, well on my laptop at least.

Otherwise I agree with everything everyone else has said.

 

[Gurkhal]

I don't think there's an actual limit. Sure there will be many who are similar but in the end of it each hero will, or should, operate within their own world and life that gives them unique experiences to shape them and in so remain distinct from other heroes that shares traits or concepts with them.

EDITED: Thus while some core concepts may be limited there's no limited to the different versions and ways in which it can be done.