Fantasy Cuisines

[ascanius]

I have a few things that are worth thinking about. First save for the very wealthy food was a product of necessity and as such the means to acquire food was just as valuable. What I mean is take the pig for example, the entire pig was used, even the skin. In Italy they have a dish called cotechino which is basically a type of salami made from the cutaneous tissue of the pig along with the snout, feet, gristle, spices and salt. It is cooked, usually by boiling then eaten. Now depending on the region of Italy a porridge like condiment is used called pearà made from old stale bread that is ground or diced, water and a good helping of pepper. They are both delicious. Another one is a type of congealed blood sausage, that is salted, spiced and cooked, this is one that isn't done anymore. Or they would take the bones of the pig boil them to loosen up the meat, place the bones on a plate in the center and pick the bones clean, also very good. My point with this is that throughout history people ate what foods were available to them and could not afford to let anything go to waste. With the pig, everything was used, even the bones to make broth. Now during hardship and war this really increases. My grandmother makes a salad from dandelion leaves, horrible and very bitter when raw, but very good when cooked right. The dandelions and many other grasses that were edible were picked clean from the countryside during the second wold war, so to were cats. Rabbit is a very common food in Italy and many other countries, birds the size of robins where captured and eaten, horse meat is very good. Also one last thing, and anyone who has spent time in Italy will know, bread in Italy is a mandatory thing to have at the table it's more important that wine and water. In a lot of places food is very dependent of the season too, in the summer certain foods are eaten that are not eaten in the winter, hell oranges are a late fall fruit not summer.

I would really like to read about these types of dishes, the dishes based on necessity. The extravagant dishes that the rich eat are fun but show so little about the world. I think it's why Italian food is so well known, because they could take simple sometimes the discards, and make something mouthwatering.

 

[arboriad]

Sheesh, this thread has me salivating. I've always loved food in writing, particularly in the Redwall series. It goes a long way to make a scene more immediate, and use more senses in description.

In the last couple of years, I went from cooking pancakes to roasts and Asian cuisine, and do all the cooking for my family. An interesting journey with a lot of overdone chicken, but loads of experience and a renewed desire to give food a bigger role to play in providing action to a scene.

 

[Ban]

I have a minor question for you guys.

I was thinking of one of the cultures in my main story. They are a fairly advanced (16th-17th cent european tech) society living in a warm jungle land close to the sea. They are traditionally hunters and gatherers, who have only advanced to their current status in the last few centuries. My intention is for them to sugar their meats and fish to preserve them instead of salting them. Does this sound eatable to you? And do any of you know of any real life examples of this being done.

 

[TheKillerBs]

It sounds doable, and sugared meats aren't unheard of (glazed ham comes to mind). The real question is, though, why would a culture that lives so close to the sea not brine their meats and fish to preserve them instead of using sugar?

 

[CupofJoe]

Very edible but not very preservative.
Salt was used to keep food edible and not really for the taste
[unless you can get Salted Cod soaked in milk - which is delicious! Almost sinfully so :devil: imho]
If you can find some Elizabethan recipes, then you might see that they were very much in to sweet foods. And lots of fat as well.

 

[ascanius]

diabetes here we come. Anyway, I don't know how much you know about preserved fruits such as jams and jellies, but sugar can be used as a preservative. However, I don't know how well it will work for meats.

Ok there are two main things needed to preserve food, which means to retard, delay or more ideally stop the growth of harmful bacteria or fungus. Bacteria need a few things to survive and thrive.
The right temp, too hot and they are killed (but some produce spores that can survive very high temps), too cold and their rate of growth and reproduction slows or even stops. why refrigeration, freezing, and boiling both work to preserve food.
Moisture is also very important, they need moisture that is not too acidic or basic (remember were talking about bacteria not the clade archae). With moisture the solute concentration is also very important. The cell membrane of a bacteria(include cell wall) is a semipermeable membrane which means certain ions, water, sugar, salts, proteins, etc. can pass through. Now osmosis is the principle that the solvent(the substance in-which another substance usually water is dissolved) will pass from an area of low solute (the substance being dissolved) concentration to an area of high solute concentration until an equilibrium is achieved. What this means for our bacteria is if there is a high solute concentration outside the cell, the water will move from the inside of the cell to the outside of the cell until the concentration of both internal and external solute concentration are equal (equilibrium). That is not a problem for normal water or salt water(depending on the bacteria) the bacteria can survive. However if the concentration of external solute is very high the solvent(water) will again move through the semipermeable membrane of the cell wall to the external high concentration of the external solvent at a much greater rate.
Ok as an example. Bacteria a has A solute concentration of 15% solute to water internally. externally 20 percent solute to water. So the water inside the bacteria will move to the outside until the internal concentration is 17.5 percent solute and externally is also 17.5 percent solute. Now bacteria B has an internal solute concentration of 15% solute and 80% solute per liter externally, guess what happens. In this case the water inside the bacteria moves to the outside until the solute concentration inside the bacteria is 100% solute and no water. while external solute concentration is lowered by 15% to 65% solute. the bacteria becomes dehydrated and all metabolism stops.
This is a very simplified example and explanation, and you may be wondering why doesn't the water go back to lower the 100% concentration of solute in the bacteria. remember bacteria are very very small and the usually container is usually measured in liters, its the difference between having 100trillion salt ions outside the cell and only 1000 inside the cell. I hade to keep this simple without getting into calculations no one would understand. Enough sugar, salt, or almost any ion in solution in very high concentrations work in this manner.

bacteria also need oxygen(not all but for the vast majority that are a problem to humans they do), if all oxygen is removed the metabolic pathway cannot complete and will stop at a mid point, thus vinegar, it's usually and acid but not always.

Fungi have similar needs though due to cell structure and a more complex cell structure, they are eukaryotes after all, they fare much better in dry, or even acidic conditions, conditions with a high solute concentration.

I really suggest looking at food preservation, even wiki has a good overview that is probably easier to understand. the basic idea is this though.

bring the temp to extremes(very hot or very cold), isolate(no oxygen), Increase solute concentrations(salting, sugar, minerals, ions), and for those who like cheese, and alcohol, introduce a lot of benign bacteria or fungi so the harmful are two few and quickly get wiped out.

 

[Heliotrope]

My husband sent this to me the other day. Thought it appropriate to share

Big, Bold, Wild: We Re-Create Christmas Dinners Of Centuries Past : The Salt : NPR

 

[NerdyCavegirl]

I LOVE food. I love cooking it and eating it, especially when my parents or I cooked it. It's a wonder that I'm underweight. I have a strong interest in botany, gardening, herbology, nutrition, cooking, biology, and sensory gratification, so preparing a meal that is both healthy and tasty from the very beginning to end is an art form for me. I even enjoy making the cookware from scratch. Can't say I'm an expert, but I made some damn good soups over the past few weeks. I have a fondness for one-pot meals and enjoy challenging myself with limited ingredients. Food is a very personal way I connect with my characters, as both a sensory fantasy and a window into their environments and lives. One of my races has a very high caloric requirement due to pyrokinesis and other reasons, and it's fun to help them find a way to survive. Some struggle to get by, some have large trade routes and all kinds of goodies, but it's all just a great way to add depth and realism.

 

[Ban]

I shall use the power of necromancy to revive this thread!

I have decided to assign national drinks to the nations and countries in my main world. The result of this is that I now seem to have 2 beer/wine fault lines throughout the world, without actually planning it in advance. The lines seem to separate both the southern and northern regions in the world (the beerdrinkers) from the central wine drinking lands. Two nations now also have a white wine/ red wine rivalry going on, which fits in well with their historical grievances. The more alien lands in the world have their own unique, sometimes dangerous, concoctions.

Do you guys have any suggestions?

 

[TheKillerBs]

My first thought was that root-based and stem-based alcohols (such as traditional potato-based whisky and sugarcane-based rum, respectively) were missing. But then I began searching around, and came across this. Really, really interesting.

Also all alcohol carries with it a certain degree of danger.

 

[Ban]

Good point. I have two large chains of tropical islands, surely I can grant one of those the gift of Rum. Perhaps I can implement whiskeys and the like in one of the westernish countries that already have a national drink. Who's to say they can't have two national drinks, right?

Oh and I didn't properly explain why these drinks are dangerous, I suppose. Most are dangerous not for the alcohol level, but because of other ingredients. One culture makes a pseudo "wine" out of fermented fish and grasses. More help on some of these crazy beverages would be very appreciated as well.

 

[valiant12]

Do you have indian people in your world? You can research some indian drinks for example;
Desi daru - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And your nomads can drink Kumis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Ban]

I actually do have both a nomadic mongolish people and a few vaguely indian cultures. I had already included Kumis in the world but I have never heard of Desi Daru before. It seems interesting though. From what I quickly glance it seems to be a tropical moonshine type of alcohol. Thanks.

 

[Bruce McKnight]

I put way too much time into determining the food for my kingdoms. Each has different specialties based on what's in their region. The north coast eat a lot of eels and mushrooms, which the other kingdoms find disgusting. Another kingdom eats mostly seafood, but they never season it. In the south, where they grow lime and oranges, everything gets cooked with citrus. In the mountains, they eat a lot of garlic and the miners revel in how much they repulse everyone else. You can tell where someone is from by what they eat.

Of course, hardly any of this ever makes it into any stories, but I'm a compulsive world-builder, so it's all there.

And I know I've mentioned it on here before, but the book "What Kings Ate and Wizards Drank" by Krista D Ball is awesome - my all time favorite world-building book.

 

[Ban]

That's something I should probably work on, but I legitimately have no idea how normal people think about food.

Constantly, but I don't know if I am the average or the outlier in this particular subject.