Mythic Scribes Fantasy Survey Results (w/Discussion)

Hi,

Just a question. What's the difference between High fantasy and Epic fantasy? To me the terms seem interchangeable.

Cheers, Greg.

 

I like epic fantasy because it combines so many genres. For me, a really good epic fantasy contains a combination of:

Political thriller
Combat
Action/Adventure
Romance
Coming of Age
Superhero

You can get lot of diversity of story just by changing up which of those elements you want to emphasize.

As long as a story is well-written with good characters, I truly couldn't care less how full of clichés it is. I pay absolutely no attention to trying to change any of them.

 

I always thought that epic fantasy deals with a story with a world-changing scope. Whatever happens will have consequences that impact the entire world of your fantasy. In contrast, other genres may focus more on a small scale event that only has consequences for your characters.

High fantasy, as Phil stated, deals with fantasy creatures and lots of magic.

I think something can be both epic and high fantasy.

 

I write a lot of female characters as physical destroyers in battle, with vast strength and durability even compared to male warriors (without the use of magic or being non-human), and their prowess isn't just lip service, they fight and kill main villains etc (they're usually the MC or if not, often noticeably more impressive warriors than the male MC).

That's as much it being my 'thing' as trying to change anything, though.

 

Given that it's pretty much been admitted by everyone that a given book can fit into multiple categories, perhaps it'd be worth it to rerun the polls and allow multiple choices.

 

As one of the folks who doesn't write epic, I'd like to give my reasoning.

First, I don't write at length. My "longer" stories tend to be 17-18k words, and I don't make much use of subplots. I just tell one straight story and then conclude it.

Second, I like to focus in tight on a small cast. When I read epics, there are often characters who I'd really like to see more focus on, and they get lost in the shuffle. When I write, I just write those few really interesting characters.

On an unrelated note, I'd like to mention that genre interest can depend on medium. I don't usually read dark fantasy, since I find it depressing. But video games are often about one hero versus the world, so I'm willing to play dark fantasy games.

 

I prefer to read and write dark fantasy. I don't know why, the only answer I can give is that I'm just a pretty dark person. I love blood and the nature of fear. It simply appeals to me.

For me, clichés don't get on my nerves. I don't mind them at all as long as the writer tells it in his own way and makes it unique to his own story. Truth is, it's very difficult to find anything that hasn't been done before. I like when someone can take a cliché (or what I like to call "something classic") and put his own spin to it. It's like writing a cover for an old song.

 

Hi,

I sort of wonder about the results given the answers I got about High versus Epic. My thought is that the terms are so easily interchanged that people voting for one could really have meant the other. Perhaps if you do the survey again you could give definitions of each. So Epic might be fantasy of large scale and multiple casts etc such as Game of Thrones and High could be fantasy involving lots of magic and magical creatures eg Lord of The Rings. And to give a clearer picture I'd suggest a ranking system so that the absoute fave is ranked one and the stuff down the bottom gets a nine or a ten.

Cheers, Greg.

 

What aspect of the writing or story does epic fantasy appeal to you? If you disagree with this being the most important genre of fantasy, express why you think so.

Given the above discussions arguing between high/epic fantasy, I would say that I do distinguish between the two and that I think high fantasy is the most important genre of fantasy, but epic... less so. The cast of a hundred characters, the year-long journeys across continents, the fights and the prophecies and the end of the world - it's all fine, but I find its prominence in the genre limiting. I'd love to see more fantasy that explores other subgenres besides action/adventure (which is basically what 'epic' ends up being). More fantasy dramas, romances, and mysteries for me. But I do think high fantasy - tons of worldbuilding, magic everywhere, different rules - has the greatest potential for interesting fantasy. Low fantasy is good, great for political stuff, but the magic of a high fantasy world can be used for so much more than just fighting Dark Lords. Give me a kitchen of mages who use fire spells to cook their food and waterbending and transmutation for a bit of molecular gastronomy. I like seeing all of the potential of magic without necessarily being tied down to certain types of stories, and the magic really is the core of the genre. I love low fantasy, too, but for very different reasons to why I enjoy fantasy as a whole.

Do you agree that epic fantasy is the most attractive to write? Why does this style of fantasy attract you?
See above as to why I don't tend to write it. Of course, sometimes I do, because no matter what I said above... let's be honest, if you read fantasy, you've read the great epics of the genre and probably loved them a little. I mean, I bemoan Tolkien at every turn but that doesn't mean I haven't pre-ordered my tickets to see The Hobbit next month. So every few years or so I sit down and start plotting out one because it was what I grew up with and many of the books I love are still part of the genre. But what I prefer to write is high fantasy, which I find attractive for the reasons listed above. The stories I'm working on right now are kind of... middle? fantasy. Not quite low, not quite high.

If these are cliches that you want to see changed, how are you trying to change them yourself as a writer?
Well, I write female characters in diverse roles. Usually as the main character. I have one project right now with a male lead who has a mistress and wife that feature quite prominently, arguably as 'love interests', but I do my best to keep them active and important (his wife is literate and writes his letters for him, she frees him from his werewolf state multiple times, and his mistress is a mercenary who works with him in his army). European settings are a bit tired, but I majored in medieval studies, so I have a soft spot for that one. I'd love to see something other than bloody England, though, god they were boring during the medieval era. Give me some medieval Italy, or a little Byzantine Empire. Strange spellings only bother me since I am a linguistics geek and nobody knows why they are spelling that name with an 'Xh' other than the fact that it looks cool. If it actually served a purpose (say the sound it made was 'ksh'), then I'd be okay with it. The Chosen One, I just don't write since it tends to erase secondary characters and simplify things too much. I don't mind things like 'king's bastards' since, y'know, he probably has a few, and I don't mind vague enough prophecies that there is ambiguity as to who the Chosen One is. But clear-cut, this man right here is the only one who could accomplish X, I think it limits the potential of the story.

 

What aspect of the writing or story does epic fantasy appeal to you? If you disagree with this being the most important genre of fantasy, express why you think so.

i'm not supr big on it. i don't mind in small doses and as such it's a fine genre on it's own. the reason it appeals to some folks is the idea of this poetic power fantasy of great heroes and grand spanning myths. however i don't read them as i'm limited as of late. i'm a person in her near twenties who's first fantasy novels starred cats as the main leading roles. it kinda colored my taste in things even to this day.

fantasy, like any genre has, has they're conventions and if you so much as broke a lot of them, do you even have a right to call it fantasy?

So a question: do you agree that epic fantasy is the most attractive to write? Why does this style of fantasy attract you?

nope and it's subjective. again i rarely do epic fantasy and i don't have a say in what i fully think about it.

If these are cliches that you want to see changed, how are you trying to change them yourself as a writer?

seconded wanting women in leading roles (despite writing mostly male protagonist) or really diverse people in general. I guess the main reason I feel like i don't like most fantasy might have something to do with how it portrays characters. when i think fantasy, i always think of the cliched human chosen one killing the evil overlord and saving the land. bonus points if they're straight and male. I don't like this, at all and it's a massive turn off for me. i don't mind it, i'm just not into it.

wanna see fantasy branch out, i wanna see it take new heights than confine itself as just another medieval fantasy adventure filled to the brim with orcs, elves, and dwarves. (and humans to a degree but i feel they are a necessary evil and i much rather write one than another elf).

that's why i love modern fantasy so much. no one would bat an eye if one of the main characters is black or other sorts of things because it takes place in modern day. and, it lets go of the burden of so much world building since all fo that is taken care of.

but then again i'm a semi sci fi writer who somehow joined this forum for no reason then to get help on her craft.

and another thing, can we just stop with the european settings? i'm serious. more 18th century to modern i can tolerant atleast. but ey i have alot of unpopular opinins i can't help showing.

 

What aspect of the writing or story does epic fantasy appeal to you? If you disagree with this being the most important genre of fantasy, express why you think so.
So a question: do you agree that epic fantasy is the most attractive to write? Why does this style of fantasy attract you?

I guess my general dislike for the subgenre comes from my view that "epic stories" tend to (ironically) limit the scope of the setting by saying that everything that is important in the setting is within the immediate vicinity of the characters. When all you see of a setting is a single city, I think one tends to wonder more about what lies beyond the city or what the rest of the world is like. I think epic fantasy tends to dislike having mystery and wonder in their settings and so try to show everything there is to know about the setting from the get-go. The genre also tends to paint the day-to-day lives of the average people of the setting as "unimportant" when down-to-earth character drama is what I like most in fiction.
I think good fiction needs to do a balancing act of having the story be "epic" enough to be important but also intimidate enough to feel grounded.

There's also the very common mistake that writers seem to make where they think giving their plot an "epic" scope makes their story or their setting "deep" when it often doesn't.

The only thing I really like about the genre is that it tends to focus on heavy, often melodramatic, character drama such as political intrigue or over-the-top romances or life-and-death struggles (and often, all those at once happening to one character).

As to why the subgenre is well-liked among writers, I think the answer is that epic stories featuring many characters and many locations allow the writers to show-off more of the setting. Most fantasy writers just have too much imagination (or are too much love for their own creations) to limit themselves to a small cast in few locations.