The Name Thread

[Mindfire]

Incidentally, part of the Teeth touches on the Hungry Sea.

If I decide on Hungry Sea, will it still clash with the Teeth?

 

[Isivaa Sanaru]

Thanks Mindfire, and for your name I like Hungry Sea for sure!

 

[Mindfire]

You're welcome!

 

[Abbas-Al-Morim]

So in Ferranaia there's this Empire called the Thessaliker Reich. It's a very unstable nation because (much like the Holy Roman Empire) the emperor is elected and has to contend for power with several kings. Because of this, there's a lot of espionage going on - and not just internally but also in other countries. The head of the secret police is called the "Drost".

I however, still haven't found a name for a special kind of spy. They - contrary to other espionage operatives - have only one mission and that is to protect the imperial crown. They are above the intrigue of court (unless said intrigue proves to be a threat to the crown). I'm still looking for a name for these operatives.

A bit about the language of the Reich:

There's lower imperial which is actually plain and simple English. And then there's high imperial which is a German-ish language. These two languages compliment each other. For instance, when you're talking about the emperor, you use the word "emperor". But when you're using his title in combination with his name or when you're addressing him personally you use the word "Kaiser". For instance, in a conversation:

"I heard the emperor is coming to visit the city."
"Yes, Kaiser Hanz-Heinrich is on his way now, and he brought his imperial guard."
"Is Imperiaalgardist Friedrich coming as well?"

Now, back to the matter on hand. Since these agents are supposed to be secret, they will only need a name in one language. However, due to the historical meaning of high and low imperial, it could be German-ish as well (High Imperial is the older language but is now exclusively used for formalities and to show respect).

Any help? Or is there a historical term for spy that could be more suitable? Also - I'm not looking for some "heroic" name. I'm looking for a simple and formal name for these agents. Something like "shadow-walker" is too heroic and strange. I'm also not looking for a contemporary rank/name/term. I don't like it when I'm reading fantasy and I suddenly read "Squadleader" (no offense, Brandon Sanderson. Way of Kings is great but who uses "squadleader in Fantasy?)

 

[Mindfire]

Actually, there is a name for what you're describing: Secret Service. The German term would be Geheimdienst if you prefer. Their agents Could simply be called agents. There's usually no need to invent a word for something when a perfectly serviceable one already exists. If Secret Service/Geheimdienst is too modern for you, you could try Die Leibwächter, which means "The Bodyguards". An agent of Die Leibwächter would then also be called a Leibwächter. (The word's singular and plural forms are identical, or so Wiktionary tells me.) If that's too long, shorten it to Die Wächter.

Not sure why, but your use of German gives me an early 19th century vibe. Just a side note.

 

[Abbas-Al-Morim]

It's not really set in the 19th century but it's set in the Early Renaissance. So I'm glad it sets it a bit apart from the masses of medieval Fantasy (nothing wrong with medieval Fantasy - I love it) but I hope the vibe isn't "too strong". I just wanted to use a few "new" terms without having to get rid of the English ones (which are easier to use when you need to repeat them a lot) so I came up with the double system. Geheimdienst doesn't sound that bad. Secret service makes me think too much of a certain double O. Leibwächter is perhaps a bit too German. I'm currently deliberating between Kroonwacht and Geheimdienst. More suggestions are of course welcome!

Thanks a lot, Mindfire!

 

[Mindfire]

No problem. What does Kroonwacht mean?

 

[wordwalker]

Incidentally, part of the Teeth touches on the Hungry Sea.

If I decide on Hungry Sea, will it still clash with the Teeth?

Hmm. I got the impression they were separated, sorry. They'd go together nicely.

 

[Jabrosky]

I've decided to convert one of my drawings into a character:

I imagine she's the queen of a civilization called Kametu that combines aspects of ancient Egyptian and various sub-Saharan African cultures. To reflect this mixture, I want to call her Nzambihotep (combines the Kikongo word for god with the Egyptian word for peace or satisfaction), but I worry it might seem excessively long to some readers. Any opinions on Nzambihotep as a name?

 

[Abbas-Al-Morim]

Kroonwacht isn't an actual German word I think. It's made up out of two dutch words (which have similar equivalents in German): Kroon (= crown) and wacht (= guard).

 

[Mindfire]

Might look better with "Krone" instead of "Kroon". Just a thought.

 

[Abbas-Al-Morim]

Good point. Kronewacht does sounds better.

 

[OGone]

I need a badass sounding name for a former pirate captain. Preferably Spanish/Portuguese.

I was thinking "Barbosa" or "Cervantes" but these are already two relatively well known pirate characters from a movie and game respectively... or should I just go with one of those anyway?

 

[CupofJoe]

Any opinions on Nzambihotep as a name?

You might be right about it being too long. It took be a couple of attempts to make sure I wasn't getting it wrong. To my ear/tongue it does feel like a bit of a word-crash with the Southern African and Ancient Egyptian phrases not quite gelling.
If it is a formal name then I would think it okay at 5 syllables but is there a shorter more colloquial name for the character as well?
This site I thought might look interesting to you...
Welcome to the The Kiswahili-Bantu Research Unit
[I have no idea of the validity of the site but it is an interesting read - where I understand it...]

 

[Jabrosky]

This site I thought might look interesting to you...
Welcome to the The Kiswahili-Bantu Research Unit
[I have no idea of the validity of the site but it is an interesting read - where I understand it...]

Thanks for the link! I actually don't believe the real ancient Egyptians were Bantu-speakers as the site asserts, but it might provide name ideas for a fantasy culture nonetheless.

 

[Mindfire]

I need a badass sounding name for a former pirate captain. Preferably Spanish/Portuguese.

I was thinking "Barbosa" or "Cervantes" but these are already two relatively well known pirate characters from a movie and game respectively... or should I just go with one of those anyway?

Vasco
Duarte
Silvio
Valerio
Basilio

 

[Abbas-Al-Morim]

Both Cervantes and Barbosa sound Spanish/Italian, so you could look at a list of Spanish/Italian surnames and first names for your pirate captain. Pretty easy solution.

 

[Addison]

I've recently come across seven rules for character naming. Maybe they can apply to naming other things.

1. Check root meanings. some readers will know the name's root meaning. Those who don't might sense it.

2. Get your era right. Browse for names in the era you're writing. Go to libraries and check yearbooks.

3. Speak them out loud. A perfect name on paper may sound unclear aloud.

4. Manage your crew appropriately. Distinguish your cast by different first initials an vary your number of syllables and place of emphasis.

5. Use alliterative initials. employ this strategy to call special attention to a character: Bilbo Baggins, Ratso Rizzo, Severus Snape, etc.

6. think it through. Especially if you really want to give middle names. Put a foreword that all names are pure fiction, relation to reality is coincidence.

7. Check 'em Again. Always check name origins. What you think is Japanese could very well be Chinese.

 

[Mindfire]

I've recently come across seven rules for character naming. Maybe they can apply to naming other things.

Some of these rules I kinda agree with, others not so much.

1. Check root meanings. some readers will know the name's root meaning. Those who don't might sense it.

Root meanings don't matter all that much. Your reader probably won't care. And what's more, when you're dealing with fantasy universes, real-world etymology is meaningless. E.g., my MC's name is Reuben, which supposedly means "Red Gaze" (he has haunting red eyes). Now to anyone with internet access or a Bible that its obviously not true. But it doesn't matter, because I say it is true. Also, naming characters based on etymology is not necessarily the best way to go. It's more important to have a name that "feels" right than to have a name that also serves as a genius bonus for a select fraction of your audience.

In summary, unless your story is set in the real world or some variation of it (urban fantasy, alternate history, etc.), roots don't matter as long as your names all feel consistent.

2. Get your era right. Browse for names in the era you're writing. Go to libraries and check yearbooks.

Again, this might be important if you're writing historical fantasy, but not for much else. Sticking to a certain era will help your work feel consistent, which is a good and necessary thing, but sticking to names from a real-world time period isn't the only way to get that feeling of consistency.

3. Speak them out loud. A perfect name on paper may sound unclear aloud.

This I agree with. It's important to pay attention to how your names sound, not just how they look.

4. Manage your crew appropriately. Distinguish your cast by different first initials an vary your number of syllables and place of emphasis.

Also a good point. It's important to make sure that no two people's names sound too alike to minimize the chance of confusing the reader. A possible exception is when characters are twins, relatives, or otherwise paired, in which case similar sounding names can be used to link them in the reader's mind. (E.g., Fili and Kili.)

5. Use alliterative initials. employ this strategy to call special attention to a character: Bilbo Baggins, Ratso Rizzo, Severus Snape, etc.

This one gets a mixed reaction from me. It is a potentially helpful suggestion, but I wouldn't make it a rule. If a writer goes too crazy with the alliterative names, the whole thing starts to feel like a 60s comic book. Or a Baby's First Fantasy Novel.

6. Think it through. Especially if you really want to give middle names. Put a foreword that all names are pure fiction, relation to reality is coincidence.

I'm kinda confused about what you mean by this. "Think it through" I definitely agree with. And the bit about middle names. Middle names are usually unnecessary, so if you're going to use them, it's best to have a very good reason. As for that bit about a foreword, I don't know what you're talking about. Why would a fantasy novel need such a disclaimer? In fact, the disclaimer might be counterproductive because as soon as people read it, their first impulse is going to be "let me see if I can find any resemblance to real world figures in here!"

7. Check 'em Again. Always check name origins. What you think is Japanese could very well be Chinese.

This could be important, again, if the work is set in a variation of the real world. But otherwise, does it really matter?

 

[Addison]

If you mean "Dwarf" or "Elf", it's up to you. But if it's modern then definitely double check.