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Political World Building Allies Wallow in Despair Over

rareruin

Dreamer
So, I'm not going to write this story, It came to as I watched somebody doo-doo talking Xianxia Chinese high fantasy, to be fair he likes Wuxia, but Xianxia is like the mythological cultivator trend where everyone has dantian and there whole goal is to become an immortal with internal Qi...

But Xianxia reminded me of trendy high fantasy liberal worlds without high-class systems and heavy church doctrines.

It always bothered me why they would make such uninteresting world especially if they wanted to make the Mc a black lesbian woman. I feel like a class system would peak my interest 100x more then a black lesbian princess who magically waives a wand and fixes the world to be exactly how they wish it. There are a lot of writers who do this with their character, and they make the villain for show.

The world setting for my story idea is a 12th century black powder swords & magic world with heavy aristocratic tyranny and church debauchery with sensitive topics on slavery between (these are real world examples for coherency)Northern Nordics Gypsies English and African warriors and woman all waring and enslaving each, witch hunts, crucifixions, and public executions.

The story would follow a young woman named Anya who gets captured by pirate slave traders and she' sold to the Viking tribes for a hefty price, she then is demanded to partake in wars against the English where she's captured and freed, she then travels to the Roman empire, learning and often experiences culture shocks along the way. Everything is different, but she finds through Christian lands many things are the same gruesome truths, hangings homosexuals and demonization of foreign power. She makes it to the roman empire and even met a caravan along the way which helped her travel through monster infested lands giant snakes drakes dragons and wild wolves roamed the woods but now she's made it to the capital where she's free the church of light is seen at the corners speaking in latin (luckily her second language as she is the child of Mediterranean sea) she can scrape by as she understands how to speak. She's gone through battles and learned the savage sword of the vikings and yet maintains a large athletic stature against the pale back drop of the people here. Here she parts ways with caravan and friends she's made along the way. She gains notoriety for her beauty and ruthless blade as she slays monsters to make her wages in the city. She learns the ruthlessness of class in the city as an aristocrat cuts down a slave using aura, here she has a flash back to the battle field against the English where the enemy commander used a similar skill, she becomes obsessed with gaining that power and begins to train, starts to grasp what it means to hold a sword, the blade and her soul become one as she emits white & black aura and swing her blade into a stone slicing halfway through like cutting butter.

She meets a strange lady at a guild office a blond-haired woman wearing a robe on it a crest of Vikings, Anya thought it looked strangely familiar. As time moved passed. She learned the ladies name Valkhir Ünderson. They end up fighting after Valkhir truly took notice of her on a raid mission. It was Valkhir who took notice of Anya and decided to call her out to fight. Valkhir knows the blade style she uses but something about it was wrong like it had evolved. Valkhir thought it was strange, as if she was taught properly and yet she came so far. Anya fought back fiercely and decided she couldn't hold back any longer Valkhir pushed her aside in the next moment and hero is stunned and embarrassed that she lost. Valkhir and Anya sit and talk about where she had learned to fight becoming close (possible indications of blooming love). Valkhir states that she fights like a man and that's the issue with her knees and basic footwork. They train and become stronger, but somethings not right within the city walls. The church "light" has started, the truth is the greedy assembly want more slaves and forces the pope to sign an edict claiming a holy war against a druidic nation to the northern Eurasian continents an uprising in the north, Valkhir must go to war with them as her tribe is allied with the Empire (pst Valkhir Ünderson is a princess). She leaves without telling Anya, but she, Anya, finds out the next day and runs after her. There she signs up as warrior as well hoping to meet Valkhir, but Valkhir although she's troubled and misses her wiafu Anya she knows that she can't put her into any danger. By the time the two find each other again they are on the battle field an Valkhir is injured, Anya fly's into rage killing anyone everyone that was on the better half the hill she stood on. After regaining composure completely soaked in blood Valkhir wakes as she is being carried back to camp, she points the upper districts of the camp, and Anya finally discover Valkhirs true identity as the 3rd princess of her tribe and the truth behind the sword style that she has inherited (implication of love).
 

rareruin

Dreamer
Valkhir is done as a warrior, feeling dejected Anya finally ceases the moment and cheers her up...

Now back at the capital we learn that they started a witch hunt for demonic priest from Anya's home, and this only escalates as Anya achieves many accolades in the name of the Empire. They make it back to the empire, although in victory Valkhir must use a crutch to walk and her carrier is over, but with funding from her home she starts her mercenary group with Anya as the captain. The demonic priests (p.s. this is not Anya's religion even though they are from the same place she believes in mythology but converted to the church of light) the priests have infiltrated and has been kidnapping random people off the streets. Anya and Viking mercs (probably someone vital to the story related to the war is her vice-captain) are tasked with guarding a noble caravan and when meeting said noble the guards tense up with prejudice against Anya...

Valkhir gets angry when she hears this at a later date, but vice-captain settled it.

The noble on the other hand was quite gentle, at least he was in her eyes at the time, but he was scum. The noble tries to get with Anya, but the Vice captain intervened while they traveled, after that she stayed away from him, but the noble was embarrassed and insulted and tried to get revenge once he made it to his territory. They were arrested and tried for heresy, but Anya simply kicks him in the nuts and takes her pay after beating the guards. On their way back they meet young siblings a boy and a girl discovering that their older brother has been kidnapped, the demonic cult wants to make use of him as ingredients. The vice-captain a big burley man warns Anya not to go, but she doesn't listen. It was indeed a trap to fool wanderers, the demonic cult wanted strong aura users not some useless kid, but the pleads of the children were real even though the cult was cunning Anya was being lured people in.
 
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Honestly this is... very, very rough. I know you said you're not planning on actually writing it, but you're really all over the place here.
Might just be a 'me' thing but I'm not sure 'politics' is a good tag for a story unless they mean the traditional sense of the word (Government talk, like how star wars / star trek has politics in it.)

That being said (and OP can ignore that bit if that's not the intention) I agree, it seems very rough/thrown together.
There is SOMETHING tucked away in there but I can't parse it.
 

Queshire

Istar
Hrm. Indeed. For the sake of my blood pressure I'm pretty much just looking at the actual world building and ignoring all the stuff before that.

So it seems to be a version of Earth only there's aura and a... church of light instead of Christianity?

Funnily enough with the generally darker tone it seems to be going for then I think Xianxia stories would be a good reference. They get up to some really messed up shit in some of them.
 
Hrm. Indeed. For the sake of my blood pressure I'm pretty much just looking at the actual world building and ignoring all the stuff before that.
Yeah, it's their story so they can do what they want I guess? Just throwing a word of Caution out. Politics at all is a charged word anymore these days, regardless of if you're talking about the traditional definition or not. anyways:
So it seems to be a version of Earth only there's aura and a... church of light instead of Christianity?

Funnily enough with the generally darker tone it seems to be going for then I think Xianxia stories would be a good reference. They get up to some really messed up shit in some of them.
Hmm, I think Aura is meant to be like Ki or in video game terms 'mana' maybe but I'm not sure.

Church of Light could be Christianity expy, but it could also just be...Church of Light.

In my experience with video games, and fantasy fiction, I've seen plenty of 'good guy' churches use this term. It's not always referring to Christianity but the inspiration is often there. In Dragon Quest they have a Goddess of Light but the churches are similar to Christianity. Though the context is quite different.
 

Queshire

Istar
Hmm, I think Aura is meant to be like Ki or in video game terms 'mana' maybe but I'm not sure.

Church of Light could be Christianity expy, but it could also just be...Church of Light.

In my experience with video games, and fantasy fiction, I've seen plenty of 'good guy' churches use this term. It's not always referring to Christianity but the inspiration is often there. In Dragon Quest they have a Goddess of Light but the churches are similar to Christianity. Though the context is quite different.

Aye, though by that point we've already gone through fighting the English and making our way to Rome. Either the Church of Light is in addition to or is replacing the Catholic church. Both of those would get the readers wondering what's up with that.

EDIT: Personally I like cosmic stuff so I'd probably go the route of having there be some alien Immortal that warped history away from its proper path and set itself up as the false god at the top of the Church of Light. Aura itself would be the manifestation of the false god's infection of Earth.
 
Aye, though by that point we've already gone through fighting the English and making our way to Rome. Either the Church of Light is in addition to or is replacing the Catholic church. Both of those would get the readers wondering what's up with that.

EDIT: Personally I like cosmic stuff so I'd probably go the route of having there be some alien Immortal that warped history away from its proper path and set itself up as the false god at the top of the Church of Light. Aura itself would be the manifestation of the false god's infection of Earth.
In my fantasy world I don't have a 'religion' tied to the gods/goddesses (At least in the general sense) there's cultures that celebrate certain ones, but I'm avoiding any real world expys in mine. (provided they don't take place on regular earth) Though I'm sure folks will 'see what isn't there' anyway and I can't stop that. They do have Sanctuaries and Shrines, but more in the general 'this is a sacred space' sense.

In my story that has alien races (the king midas parody) some of the aliens have come to earth to investigate other culture's gods to figure out what they're doing wrong.

One of them is based on Cthulhu but after several comical failures of taking over by force, She decided to come to earth to investigate more peaceful gods because she learned regret. (Took three instances of her species going near extinct but hey she got there eventually) She doesn't actually 'invade' earth, she sends a few folks to investigate the cultures. The other two alien species come to earth for similar reasons. Though the main folks they send to investigate earth to begin with get distracted by human culture. (for better or worse...)
 

rareruin

Dreamer
Honestly this is... very, very rough. I know you said you're not planning on actually writing it, but you're really all over the place here.
Your right it is rough, i tried to explain this bit, but I was using earth as an example so just void the geography you can even void the generic magic system. The very point was to make an outline of somebody who struggles with society, an outcast system of sexuality urged on through profit (Canada is doing the same thing right now, less people means more money so legalize involuntary suicide), the church and ruling class kill for profit.

So what the opening statement I am contrasting from is- within modern trends you find certain story archs which follow a boring narrative with very little conflict within the world. Like a revenge murder story, and the MC, is, for some reason *allowed* to kill people in broad day light. Or LGBTQ fantasy where you can be a trans queer black princess with a beard and tutu in deep space with magic and its 1812 fighting space godzilla and you're on a magic trampoline jumping around in space trying to save earth. The point is in 1812 trans people would've been thrown into the psych ward, and the politics have been made far to convineantly to match the Mc like the politics are only there to benefit one man.

I know the example is crazy but this is why the contrast is important, if you can be a black princess in a historical English setting, most people will find that reasonably crazy. If you wanted a black lesbian princess make it make sense even if the whole world is against it.
 

Queshire

Istar
Your right it is rough, i tried to explain this bit, but I was using earth as an example so just void the geography you can even void the generic magic system. The very point was to make an outline of somebody who struggles with society, an outcast system of sexuality urged on through profit (Canada is doing the same thing right now, less people means more money so legalize involuntary suicide), the church and ruling class kill for profit.

So what the opening statement I am contrasting from is- within modern trends you find certain story archs which follow a boring narrative with very little conflict within the world. Like a revenge murder story, and the MC, is, for some reason *allowed* to kill people in broad day light. Or LGBTQ fantasy where you can be a trans queer black princess with a beard and tutu in deep space with magic and its 1812 fighting space godzilla and you're on a magic trampoline jumping around in space trying to save earth. The point is in 1812 trans people would've been thrown into the psych ward, and the politics have been made far to convineantly to match the Mc like the politics are only there to benefit one man.

I know the example is crazy but this is why the contrast is important, if you can be a black princess in a historical English setting, most people will find that reasonably crazy. If you wanted a black lesbian princess make it make sense even if the whole world is against it.

Can you provide a specific example, or ideally three or so examples, of the type of series you are criticizing here? It's rather hard to fully understand where you're coming from with only such made up examples to go by.

EDIT: (Three examples would be ideal, because if you got three examples you can the common aspects between them when you can't always do that with just one.)
 

Gurkhal

Auror
I like the basics, from what I can deduce, from the two top posts, of this story.

Like others have said there's alot of work that would need to be done, but a if that work is put in I think something good could come out. I think it has potential.

After all many stories grow from an interesting topic, a cool idea or a vision of a character.
 

A. E. Lowan

Forum Mom
Leadership
Your right it is rough, i tried to explain this bit, but I was using earth as an example so just void the geography you can even void the generic magic system. The very point was to make an outline of somebody who struggles with society, an outcast system of sexuality urged on through profit (Canada is doing the same thing right now, less people means more money so legalize involuntary suicide), the church and ruling class kill for profit.

So what the opening statement I am contrasting from is- within modern trends you find certain story archs which follow a boring narrative with very little conflict within the world. Like a revenge murder story, and the MC, is, for some reason *allowed* to kill people in broad day light. Or LGBTQ fantasy where you can be a trans queer black princess with a beard and tutu in deep space with magic and its 1812 fighting space godzilla and you're on a magic trampoline jumping around in space trying to save earth. The point is in 1812 trans people would've been thrown into the psych ward, and the politics have been made far to convineantly to match the Mc like the politics are only there to benefit one man.

I know the example is crazy but this is why the contrast is important, if you can be a black princess in a historical English setting, most people will find that reasonably crazy. If you wanted a black lesbian princess make it make sense even if the whole world is against it.
We write Urban Fantasy with a heavy dose of politics, gods (sssh!), monsters, and a city plopped onto the Pacific Northwest coast, 160 miles SW of Seattle, where in reality a town called Tokeland sits. I can't make that up and we write some really silly shit.

People also get eaten. Rather a lot.

Two things to take away from this. First, whence goeth the modern world, others will not always follow. You can change things. There is a line to walk when playing with reality, but the biggest one is you can play with it. Mind that line.

Second, I know a lot of people buy into the stereotype of a very white, very Viking, very rapey Medieval Europe. I can assure you with a certain degree of confidence that it wasn't the white wonderland some would have us believe. They often possess tiki torches and riot shields and yeah. Cultures that trade will mingle. Cultures that war will mingle. Cultures who can't make up their minds will mingle. There are a whole lot of genetic material being shared about from basically the first time someone wondered if that group over the mountain had cool stuff to trade for their cool stuff, and unrelated babes were always a source of curiosity.

And the babes would often eat them, because this is Urban Fantasy and the Books of Binding are a little violent. And lots us cursing. Many F-bombs. Not a trace of #ChicagosoWhite to be seen because this is Urban Fantasy.
 
I like the basics, from what I can deduce, from the two top posts, of this story.

Like others have said there's alot of work that would need to be done, but a if that work is put in I think something good could come out. I think it has potential.

After all many stories grow from an interesting topic, a cool idea or a vision of a character.
I can vouch for this part of Gurkhal's comment being true.
90% of my stories are my brain having 'shower thought' (not actually in the shower, mind) esque plot ideas.
Brain: Here's like 3-5 characters interacting Also Brain: Here's like three scenes in the otherwise cool plot. Also Also Brain: Good luck!
On one hand I love it, gives me a lot of creative liberties on where to 'take' the plot.
On the other hand: BRAIN WHY ARE U LIKE THIS :LOL:
 

pmmg

Myth Weaver
Sorry Rareruin, but I find your post difficult to interpret. It does not feel to me like english is a second language to you, but What are you trying to say?

It sounds like you want to write a story about a black, lesbian, warrior princess, who runs around having adventures, saves the world, and falls in love.

It also sounds like the concerns you are raising is that it will not match well with the reality of the time, and cultures you want to write about.

Well, I think you are right. It wont. But, its fiction, so...

I am not sure you can have it both ways, but I bet the number of lesbian princesses from foreign cultures who mastered warfare and won acclaim all over europe, is...zero. (And the plausibility of such is pretty much zero, as well).

But, why should that stop you? Write the story you want to tell.


Course, you started by saying you would not write it. What are we to do with that?
 
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Queshire

Istar
Hrm. As near as I understand Rareruin views that it is too common to have fantasy stories where there isn't backlash to LGBT characters in universe and instead wants to emphasize the challenges they would face.

I have... thoughts on this view, or perhaps it would be more appropriate to say how Rareruin expressed it, but I am trying to remain polite.
 

JBCrowson

Maester
Your right it is rough, i tried to explain this bit, but I was using earth as an example so just void the geography you can even void the generic magic system. The very point was to make an outline of somebody who struggles with society, an outcast system of sexuality urged on through profit (Canada is doing the same thing right now, less people means more money so legalize involuntary suicide), the church and ruling class kill for profit.
I really wanted to pick up on the phrase in parentheses here. First, involuntary suicide is murder. Second, Canada is one of those countries that doesn't have a death penalty, so Canada is not killing any people intentionally, for profit or otherwise. Third, while of course there are individuals who struggle with many issues and types of discrimination in Canada, the Canadian charter of rights and freedoms recognises race, religion, place of origin, disability, age, gender as grounds on which it is illegal to discriminate against an individual.
People are of course free to like / support, or not, various freedoms or protections Canadians enjoy, but at least lets have some factual basis for what those freedoms and protections are.

As to the story outline the OP posted: it sounds interesting and has potential to be something I might read.
 
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