Stories Within Stories

[Androxine Vortex]

I really like the idea and main plot I have for my novel series. The only thing is that I can see so many opportunities to write seperate novels set in the same setting, just maybe not 100% directly related to the main story arc. So I was thinking of writting my main novel series but then also writting a seperate collection of novels (or short stories) directly related to the setting/universe of the main storyline but not directly related to the actual plot.

To give an example let me use a hypothetical suggestion. Harry Potter. The main storyline would be of Harry but what if Rowling made a seperate series about an Auror hunting dark wizards and witches? Let's say she named it "The Auror." So the "Harry Potter" series and the "Auror" series wouldn't be directly related by plot but by setting.

There is a lot going on in my plot and the setting is vast in scope, involving many different countries. So do you think it would be a good idea if I made a sort of central "universal setting?" This way, the main novels and storyline would still be the cental focus but also allowing me to branch out for more creativity and novel opportunities. I'm not sure if this has a defined term or anything.

(And I'm not sure if I would want the seperate series to be actual novels or collection of short stories yet. I think the concept of a novel would be better because you can go into far more detail but as for now it's just an idea)

 

[JCFarnham]

Reading the title I was expecting a discussion on Metafiction, hehe, but since it's not I'll get on with it

This concept is widely used across genre fiction (at least SF&F any way), in fact I bet if you picked any series of books published recently and another couple of stand alones by the same author you would find they involve the same setting. Brandon Sanderson does it. Orson Scott Card does it. Iain Banks. And to be fair Tolkien did it. Well, I could list some more but it would get very long very quickly.

I personally can't come up with a rich setting WITHOUT thinking of every possible story nugget it could yield. I'd even say it is our duty as writers and authors to do this.

Stories within stories isn't the right term for it, bit misleading, but you know I can't come up with anything snappy. Surely "stories set in the same universe" would do?

Banks for example has written a lot of Scifi novels he tags with the phrase "A Culture Novel" - because in general they involve a far spanning intergalactic group called the Culture, even if the books themselves have wildly varying plots and even genre. Go figure . If you want or rather need each seperate story to be equated in people's minds it might be worth coming up with a general name for it.

 

[myrddin173]

Like JC said a lot of authors do this. Pratchet does it with his Discworld, Terry Brooks too, though his series are spread out through time. Michael Scott, author of the Secrets of the Immortal Nicholas Flamel, has a new series planned that occurs in the same world but goes into an aspect that his current series only touched on briefly. I don't believe there is a specific name for it, but we can always make one up.

It is one of my goals someday to create a world where I can do this.

 

[JCFarnham]

I find if one creates a simple setting with one or two main "premises" then you'd be surprised how many stories can be pulled.

Here's an example from my own work (and I never mind sharing!). I have an urban fantasy project whose setting is more or less real world, modern Britain but in a fairly predicatable way, oh look Fae and demons and Otherworldly Lovecraftian monsters exist. This would have been pretty boring on its own granted, so I added a complicating faction - in this case the idea that if someone doesn't believe in the existance of the supernatural they project a kind of "veil" of disbelief within which magical beings have trouble living (ie, cities would be totally impassable to Fae).

This is a pretty simple premise, but those two points have the potential for a lot of different kinds of conflict.

For me, creating the setting first lends itself more to these kind of multistory worlds whereas character first seems to limit me more to one.

Hope you can draw something from that :s haha

 

[Androxine Vortex]

I tend to just use the term "universe" and for my definition it just means the setting and combined lore. So if there were hundreds of novels written involving the lore, and characters, and setting of LOTR, they would all fall under the "LOTR Universe."

 

[myrddin173]

Another example of this is the Star Wars novels, usually referred to as the Extended Universe, though this is written by many people while the previous examples were just one person. Another example, that I can't believe I didn't think of before, is the Mythic Archipelago project. The goal of which is to create a world where many different stories can take place. (yes that was a shameless plug )

 

[CL Mozena]

I agree with everyone. Using your 'Harry Potter' example, if J.K. Rowling came out with an 'Auror' series, it would be a big hit simply because it's a part of a well known (and well loved) universe.

I've read books that all took place in the same setting although they were different stories. It was really exciting when the MC from one story bumped into characters from a different story line.

 

[Leif GS Notae]

Sounds intriguing, but it is a good way to get lost in the stories that might not be worthy of a series. I'd always thought to write my world's major changes in novel form and touch on other areas in my flash fiction writing and perhaps some novellas. Yes, everything is important, but you want a story to have value and connect with people too.

It seems as though you have a good idea though and I hope it all works out. Just keep in mind, don't stray from the hard hitting stories! Good luck and I look forward to reading it.

 

[Androxine Vortex]

Sounds intriguing, but it is a good way to get lost in the stories that might not be worthy of a series. I'd always thought to write my world's major changes in novel form and touch on other areas in my flash fiction writing and perhaps some novellas. Yes, everything is important, but you want a story to have value and connect with people too.

It seems as though you have a good idea though and I hope it all works out. Just keep in mind, don't stray from the hard hitting stories! Good luck and I look forward to reading it.

Thanks for your advice and support, and dont count on reading it anytime soon lol

 

[Caged Maiden]

I Love my world as well (though it is nothing really special). It's tempting when you've put so much time and thought into creating cultures, places, countries and kingdoms with history..... Who wouldn't want to use it again? I say if you like it, use it! I have used my world over and over again though some of my stories are stand-alone, really.

 

[Ghost]

I like "stories set in the same universe," JCFarnham. I've said before that my main project is a world built to host several novels. I like series and epic stories, but my personal preference as a storyteller is standalone novels. My intention is to have a place to set dozens of unrelated novels in different areas and time periods. Characters might mention events, places, and people I write about in other novels, but only in passing. Although I'll have a world that could support stories that are larger in scope, my focus will be localized.

I'm not sure if this is a good thing for readers. On one hand, they don't have to buy more than one book or wait for years to finish a story. On the other hand, someone might like one place the best and, after reading other novels, find I never return to it.

When readers enjoy your story and your world, they'll happily read a new series set in the same place. They may even prefer you stay there. (That's an entirely different problem, where fans expect you to do the same thing when you want to branch out.) IMO, you should focus on the main series, Androxine Vortex. Keep very, very good notes on the details and plot bunnies. You can always add and elaborate later. If you had a better idea of what the other stories/novels would be, you could go either way. Stopping to worldbuild for possibilities instead of certainties might slow your momentum right now.

 

[Androxine Vortex]

I like "stories set in the same universe," JCFarnham. I've said before that my main project is a world built to host several novels. I like series and epic stories, but my personal preference as a storyteller is standalone novels. My intention is to have a place to set dozens of unrelated novels in different areas and time periods. Characters might mention events, places, and people I write about in other novels, but only in passing. Although I'll have a world that could support stories that are larger in scope, my focus will be localized.

I'm not sure if this is a good thing for readers. On one hand, they don't have to buy more than one book or wait for years to finish a story. On the other hand, someone might like one place the best and, after reading other novels, find I never return to it.

When readers enjoy your story and your world, they'll happily read a new series set in the same place. They may even prefer you stay there. (That's an entirely different problem, where fans expect you to do the same thing when you want to branch out.) IMO, you should focus on the main series, Androxine Vortex. Keep very, very good notes on the details and plot bunnies. You can always add and elaborate later. If you had a better idea of what the other stories/novels would be, you could go either way. Stopping to worldbuild for possibilities instead of certainties might slow your momentum right now.

Thanks for the tips, I totally agree with that. And I hope what you are shooting for goes well too lol
But I tend to think too far ahead, I know I need to take stuff one step at a time. I'm usually too woried about what something could become than rather spending time on actually making the first steps.

 

[Alva]

Reading the title I was expecting a discussion on Metafiction [ - - ]
Surely "stories set in the same universe" would do?

I also found the title misleading (for the very same reason).

I tend to just use the term "universe" and for my definition it just means the setting and combined lore. So if there were hundreds of novels written involving the lore, and characters, and setting of LOTR, they would all fall under the "LOTR Universe."

Hmm… Interesting. Even though I’m afraid I might have missed your point here... I’d like to consider a term "universe" referring to some more flexible framework than a summation between known characters, same setting, and combined lore. To me, an author can make a statement that all their stories are situated in the same universe even if one of the stories includes intergalactic spaceships diving through wormholes and the second one tells a traditional high fantasy story situated in the Middle Ages.

Maybe these stories only take place in different countries, continents, worlds entirely – on different planets perhaps? In any case, the points of contact between different stories and plotlines don’t need to be anything major to “qualify”. Small hints here and there would already be enough to keep me on my toes and my antennae ready.

I personally can't come up with a rich setting WITHOUT thinking of every possible story nugget it could yield. I'd even say it is our duty as writers and authors to do this.

The same. I love brainstorming and playing with ideas

Stopping to worldbuild for possibilities instead of certainties might slow your momentum right now.

…and I must say wordlbuilding with possibilities has granted my current story a lot. Of course my writing speed may “suffer” at times when I end up spending time daydreaming and scheming but luckily I’m in no hurry. Besides, as long as the story gets further polished in my mind through posing questions and “what if?”s, I’m content with my current manner of working. : )

I like "stories set in the same universe," JCFarnham. I've said before that my main project is a world built to host several novels. I like series and epic stories, but my personal preference as a storyteller is standalone novels. My intention is to have a place to set dozens of unrelated novels in different areas and time periods. Characters might mention events, places, and people I write about in other novels, but only in passing. Although I'll have a world that could support stories that are larger in scope, my focus will be localized.

I like stand alones too! (Alongside with trilogies and other series with definite number of parts).

Also, my understanding is that Stephen King does something a bit same as you described(?) I’ve been told he includes hints in his stories so that careful reader can notice the connection forming between two seemingly separate stand alone novels. Although I’m personally no Stephen King fan so I can’t yet tell myself.

 

[Saigonnus]

I think your idea has merit, and it could possibly used two different ways. You could put out the short stories first (assuming they are closer to completion than the main novel) and get readers used to how your world works, even if the characters are different from the main novel. The downside comes with perhaps stealing some of the thunder from the main book, which should be a surprise to readers (everyone loves surprises) in the characters, the world etc.. I think perhaps the main book should come first; but that is my humble opinion.

Like many others, the title to the post through me off a bit. I was thinking more like a background plotline or story involving secondary or tertiary characters, perhaps like they are observers to the true events as they unfold, but have a different adventure themselves. Like a page serving a knight who goes off to war... while his master is fighting fiercely (the main plot), he is left at camp and stumbles across a plot to kill the knight. Ever protective, he takes care of business (being he is strong and fit also) before the knight returns victorious. Such could really add depth to the story if done properly.

It's no big deal really, once I cracked open the post it wasn't hard to figure out what you meant.

 

[The Dark One]

Any story has infinite possibilities. As authors we choose the possibility that crystallises into reality...whether it's enjoyed is down to our judgment and skill (in carrying it off).

My recently published book, I would have thought, was the most quintessentially stand-alone work imaginable. But after several fabulous reviews I've started dreaming up ideas for a sequel (well...a prequel/sequel simultaneously to be precise) good enough to do justice to the original. Thing is, that first book was VERY ambitious and took years to get right. I already have several other projects on the boil so it would take some very serious sales indeed to realise the sequel inside 3 years.

 

[Androxine Vortex]

Any story has infinite possibilities. As authors we choose the possibility that crystallises into reality...whether it's enjoyed is down to our judgment and skill (in carrying it off).

My recently published book, I would have thought, was the most quintessentially stand-alone work imaginable. But after several fabulous reviews I've started dreaming up ideas for a sequel (well...a prequel/sequel simultaneously to be precise) good enough to do justice to the original. Thing is, that first book was VERY ambitious and took years to get right. I already have several other projects on the boil so it would take some very serious sales indeed to realise the sequel inside 3 years.

Wow that's pretty good. I'm glad your novel got such good reviews. What was it called?

And sorry to everyone for the misleading title

 

[The Dark One]

Hi Androxine, thanks for asking. The name of the novel is THEM and my initials are AD (there seem to be a few books around called THEM).