Using Lord of the Rings

[Shockley]

I'll differentiate from people and say that you don't *have* to read Tolkien. You should, because it's great fiction, but you should read whatever and whenever you can.

 

[Aidan of the tavern]

In the books there's tons of events and even characters who never made it to the screen, thats another interesting thing. While they wouldn't have been necersarry to the film story, in the book they work wonders to provide depth and character to his world. Take Tom Bombadil for instance (also isn't that a genius name) while he only plays a small role in terms of plot he adds a wonderful dash of colour to the cast. He's a cheerful guy who lives in a forest with his wife who he always sings about, and is as old as time itself, to such an extent that the ring has no effect on him.

 

[Justme]

Minor the correction: The movie omitted the final battle between Saruman and the Hobbits, not Sauron.

They also missed Tom Bombadil and the Barrow Wraths.

P.S. If you really want to get aquainted with The Lord of the Rings, you should read The Silmerilian.

 

[The Dark One]

In the books there's tons of events and even characters who never made it to the screen, thats another interesting thing. While they wouldn't have been necersarry to the film story, in the book they work wonders to provide depth and character to his world. Take Tom Bombadil for instance (also isn't that a genius name) while he only plays a small role in terms of plot he adds a wonderful dash of colour to the cast. He's a cheerful guy who lives in a forest with his wife who he always sings about, and is as old as time itself, to such an extent that the ring has no effect on him.

You know what? There are probably no bigger LOTR fans on this planet than me, but Bombadil is by miles my least favourite character. I think he sticks out like dog's balls as something which should either have been properly developed or edited out of the story. That's what happens when you publish serially.

I think it's Tolkien inserting himself into the story and it simply doesn't work. Why have such a powerful character if he's to have no impact on the resolution?

 

[Justme]

You know what? There are probably no bigger LOTR fans on this planet than me, but Bombadil is by miles my least favourite character. I think he sticks out like dog's balls as something which should either have been properly developed or edited out of the story. That's what happens when you publish serially.

I think it's Tolkien inserting himself into the story and it simply doesn't work. Why have such a powerful character if he's to have no impact on the resolution?

As i remember, didn't Bombadil save the party from certain death from a barrow wright. I think he inserted him in as one who like Gandalf, was a caretaker of the world, but concentrated on the natural world, instead of the dealings of men.

From what i picked up in the Silmarillion, Gandalf and I'm certain Bombadil were equal to angels in Christianity for the MiddelEarth world. If you read back, when Faramirs company feel upon the trio, I think Samwise made reference to the gods set up in the Silmarillion, at that time.

The one thing that pissed me off, in the film was the falling out between Frodo and Samwise on the sides of Mt. Doom. That was entirely unnecessary and had no place what-so-ever in the story.

 

[SeverinR]

One thing that has been hinted at above, and that bears mentioning again, is that you should also be well-read outside of your genre. If you're only reading within one genre, you are severely limiting your development as a writer, imo.

Reading outside your genre will give ideas on how to expand your genre, or write about something that hasn't been written about, or hasn't been written the same way.

To me reading LOTR is about the same as reading "those" books in school, catcher in the rye, the great gatsby, and all the other boring reads that educators feel are "must reads." Try it, if you like it, read it. If it doesn't keep your interest find another author that does.
(I only made it to chapter two in LOTR)

 

[JBryden88]

Lord of the Rings - Obvious choice, it's a classic.

Any of Robert E. Howard's stories regarding Conan the Cimmerian or Kull the Conqueror - The father of sword and sorcery is a classic.

George RR Martin's Song of Ice and Fire - Heavy Reading, but it is not your typical fantasy, and not for kids.

The Witcher Saga - Only one book in the series, as well as the anthology collection of short stories are translated for the US, but its a great model of how you can take traditional high fantasy, and make a tongue in cheek parody yet keep the tone dark, serious, and pretty damn intense. (by parody I mean, it flies in the face of the rules for elves and dwarves and magic.)

 

[Steerpike]

I liked the inclusion of Tom Bombadil in LOTR.

I also second the recommendation of Robert E. Howard. There's a gap that should be filled between something like LOTR and newer series like SoIaF (a gap in time, I mean). Lots of classic reads in the interim.

Jack Vance's Dying Earth books have been mentioned.

Also look at Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun series (four books in the original series, each a major award-winner in the year of its release). Great stuff.

Read Glen Cook's Black Company books.

Read Mervyn Peak's Gormenghast books.

Read Roger Zelazny's Amber books.

We've already mentioned Moorcock's Elric books. Also, read Steven Brust. Emma Bull. Robert Holdstock (particularly his Mythago books), Charles deLint, anything you can get a hold of by Guy Gavriel Kay (who may be the best writer in the genre right now), read Stephen Donaldson (which you will love or hate),

Read C.S. Lewis.
Read The Princess Bride.
Read Watchmen.
Read The Stand.
Read The Mists of Avalon.
Read Stardust.
Read The Last Unicorn.
Read Angela Carter's short stories (Burning your Boats).
Read China Mieville.

And when you look at science fiction-style stories that include many elements of fantasy, you open the door to many more excellent works. But the above, and everything else mentioned in this thread, will give you an excellent cross-section of the genre.

 

[Shockley]

Here's my suggested reading list. It's not entirely traditional fantasy and it's not all good writing, but it brought me to this point. I'm leaving out a lot of my other loves (Hemingway, Salinger, etc.) simply because I don't think they're necessary to writing good fantasy.

Bernard Cornwell: The Winter King, Enemy of God, Excalibur, Last Kingdom, Pale Horseman and the Archer's Tale
Thomas Malory: Le Morte d'Arthur
J. R. R. Tolkien: The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings
C. S. Lewis: The Chronicles of Narnia
Brian Jacques: Redwall and Mossflower
Glen Cook: The Black Company, Shadows Linger and The White Rose
William Morris: The Well at the World's End, Roots of the Mountain, the Wood Beyond the World and House of the Wolfings
Lord Dunsany: The King of Elfland's Daughter, 51 Tales and the Gods of Pegana
Terry Pratchett: Colour of Magic, Guards Guards! and Hogfather (but anything you can get your hands on, really)
H. P. Lovecraft: Shadows Over Innsmouth, The Color Out of Space, Call of Cthulu, At the Mountains of Madness, and the Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath (but again, anything you can grab)
Robert E. Howard: Queen of the Black Coast, The Phoenix on the Sword, The Hour of the Dragon, El Borak and any of his numerous short story collections.
Isaac Asimov: Foundation, Foundation and Empire and Second Foundation

If you can ever find it, I suggest picking up two specific anthologies: L. Sprage de Camp's 'Swords and Sorcery' which has stories by Lovecraft, Howard, Lord Dunsany (none that I suggested, but just as good), and a number of other very good pulp writers. The second is called 'Legends,' edited by Robert Silverberg. It has material by Stephen King, Jordan, Goodkind, McCaffrey and Orson Scott Card. Good stuff, though I have to admit I'm not a huge fan of any of those writers.

 

[Anders Ämting]

As a beginner in fantasy writing should I read J.R.R. Tolkien's Lord of the Rings. I know that is something all fantasy writers use so I was just wondering if its a good idea

It's not a bad idea, but it's not something you have to do. Nor is it necessarily good for you.

Stephen King once said that after he read Lord of the Rings, he instantly wanted to write his great fantasy epic. But he didn't, because he actually understood that if he tried to do that right after reading Lord of the Rings, he would actually be writing JRR Tolkien's great fantasy epic. It wasn't until many years later his own idea finally materialised out of a movie screen showing Sergio Leone westerns. The result was The Dark Tower, which as far as I can tell has very little in common with Lord of the Rings.

Let's be honest here: Lord of the Rings was never actually supposed to be the archetype for all fantasy. Tolkien just wanted to create his own mythology, but he was so ahead of his time that nobody knew what else to do but to copy him. Today fantasy writers have finally started to realize that fantasy is whatever they want it to be - that it doesn't have to be elves and dwarves and orcs all around. So I think going back to Tolkien in order to learn how to write fantasy is a kinda backwards mentality. It's been almost sixty years, I'd like to think we've made some progress in that time.

Me, I only read Fellowship of the Ring and half of The Two Towers and thought the whole thing was really kinda dull. It wasn't until the movies came out I could actually follow through the entire plot. There are a lot of fantasy books that have had a way, way, way greater influence on me. Heck, the Wizard of Oz had a greater influence on me then Lord of the Rings.

What I mean is, reading it won't do any harm, but it won't be essential to your development as a writer or anything. You can manage without it, but go ahead and check it out if you want. But then you should also check out some of the other books mentioned in this thread, if only to remind you there is more to fantasy then just Tolkien.

If you want my personal recommendations, you should read the Chronicles of Amber by Roger Zelazny, the Cygnet books by Patricia A McKillip, The Neverending Story by Michael Ende, Ananzi Boys by Niel Gaiman, Clive Barker's Abarat books... basically anything that isn't like Tolkien.

 

[Devora]

I personally got most of my influence from watching movies (e.g. Dark Crystal, LOTR), and playing video games (e.g. Diablo, Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance) that had fantasy themes and elements to the story before I stumbled upon reading fantasy stories.

 

[Aidan of the tavern]

I personally got most of my influence from watching movies (e.g. Dark Crystal, LOTR), and playing video games (e.g. Diablo, Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance) that had fantasy themes and elements to the story before I stumbled upon reading fantasy stories.

I loved Dark Alliance, it was a fantastic game, I was so annoyed when they didn't make the 3rd one.

 

[Saigonnus]

I think reading anything at all could help you learn how to improve your writing. Don't only consider "fantasy" novels as part of your reading, other genres can be just as useful for plot devices; take science fiction for example; what is future technology? It's "magic" we haven't discovered yet. Most things possible in science fiction would technically be possible using "magic" instead of technology and it would be fairly easy to take a scenario found in Sci-fi and convert it to fantasy.

Starship Troopers (awful movie by the way) has the basic scenario of space marines that go to a planet to fight these giant bugs... what if the main characters were warriors or wizards with swords or magic instead of guns and used a form of teleportation to get to this other planet? could work right?

I guess what I am saying is that there are things in every genre of literature that can help you write better and you should take advantage.

 

[Shockley]

I hated Dark Alliance, basically because I was hoping for something on the level of Baldur's Gate and SoA. Didn't even come close to competing.

 

[shangrila]

I got a ton of inspiration from Dark Souls. The story is kind of meh, but the art direction is breathtaking. It's really cool if you're into to black/grey worlds.

Also, I'd add Joe Abercrombie and Steven Erikson to those must read lists. Erikson because of the enormousness of the Malazan world (even if the ending sucked, IMO) and Joe because of the utter grit and realism in his stories. I will say though that the Malazan series (or the main one) is ten, "door stopper" books long, so if you're going to do it prepare to spend a couple months reading nothing else.

 

[Steerpike]

I read the Malazan series, but I intersperse each one with a number of other books. So it's going to take me a while to finish.

Abercrombie is great. Best Served Cold is his best, imo

 

[SeverinR]

I
Read The Princess Bride.

Read! The Princess Bride? Inconceivable!
Sorry, it had to be said.

I avoided Dragon riders of Pern because I thought it was Sci-fi. The McCaffrey's write pretty well from what I have read...so far.

 

[Ireth]

Gregory Maguire's Wicked and its sequels are pretty good dark fantasy, if you can get past all the gratuitous sex scenes. They have a very political bent to them, though, which I find kind of odd.

 

[shangrila]

I read the Malazan series, but I intersperse each one with a number of other books. So it's going to take me a while to finish.

I tried that, but everytime someone used magic in one of the other books I couldn't help but wonder which Warren they were drawing it from.