Magic can't coexist with technology... like really...

There are some ways I've gone with this problem. One, magic is not universal, but only available to a few gifted individuals (I worked out the genetics ). So most folk still need to use more pedestrian ways of making a living. Two, magic is limited in what it can accomplish, and even then normal ways of doing things may be more practical—mages tend to reserve their power for emergency use.

And third, the use of magic CAN be dangerous and lead the practitioner to madness. This is not quite the same sort of limitation as the other two, but definitely a consideration. Not surprisingly, this also make ordinary folk a bit leery of those who use magic.

 

Well, magic is great, but a bullet to the head is still pretty fatal (maybe Voldemort should have tried that?)

I do think the problem you describe above would serve as a good explanation for why technology in many fantasy settings does not really evolve over time, magic could have a retarding affect on its progress.

I think the thing is, if you include magic of a nature that it really has no limits, then there is no need for technology, but you are the author, you get to make or not make any limits you want. So, if you want to write a world where everything has evolved with the use of magic, then yeah, its likely technology would not have evolved with it, and I am sure there are still awesome stories you can tell in that, where everything is done with magic. But many magic systems are not like that, and do come with limitations. So, if you apply limitation, you may retard magic's universal appeal as the answer to all problems, and technology comes back into play. Why use magic to communicate, which has the risk I may open a portal to a dark place and a demon may eat my soul, when I can just use a cell phone (which eats my soul in another way...)?

I think the trick is, whatever your setting, tell a story that is worth telling in it. At the end, do you want people to go, wow, that was a neat setting? or do you want them to relate to what the story was about?

 

Everyone can use a machine with a few minutes or hours of instruction. Not everyone can use magic, perhaps ever.

Also, the overall situation is adressed in "Sanderson's Second Law of Magic": Limitations are more interesting than powers. If magic is free, unlimited, and can do everything, there isn't much interesting going to happen. Magic becomes interesting when characters are using creative ways to use the limited ways magic can be used in unexpected situations.

Also, magic does not really conflict with religion. There's plenty of ways of religious believes that don't require belief in miracles. And if faith is purely based on belief in miracles, even many deeply religious people would consider that a rather poor form of belief. Though one could say that if all people have unlimited power, then all people are gods. But again, what's the interesting story there?

 

On this, just sayin', if the world was such that magic was common and undeniable, religion may have turned out very differently. But even with magic, what is in the realm of gods, is still in the realm of gods. Before there is all of us taking advantage of a magic system, there is still something that brought it about, and would possibly have dominion over it, so a realm of gods could still be fashioned, and religion would still be about the things that are expected of us.

C'mon. Everyone can use Magic, they just need to RTFM?

 

I don't remember the exact specifics, but there have been several religious movements throughout history which followed the principle that if you want to understand the meaning of a world created by a god, you have to learn how it works. Understand how the universe works and you will be able to understand god.
The very same approach could, and in my opinion most likely would, apply to magic as well. If the universe was created in a way that allows mortals to use magic, why? Why was it deemed necessary to give this ability to humanity? And even in a religion without a creator, you're still left with questions of "what is right or wrong?", "how should I live my life?", "where do we come from?","where do we go to". Shoting fire from your hands (or building an electric power plant) does not give you any answer to these questions.

 

I haven't written anything in the setting but I've given thought to an urban fantasy setting without a masquerade which, for the most part, still looks like the modern day world.

What I've arrived at is that magic is treated a lot like martial arts are in real life. Everybody knows about martial arts, but not everybody knows martial arts. There's also significant difference between the kid that learns karate from the local dojo in the mall and the old grandmaster whose spent their entire life mastering martial arts.

Secondly I have it where magic can't be mass produced. You can't just copy someone else's spell. You have to adjust it at least a bit to your own personal style. You have to enchant any objects by hand and the more you're involved in personally creating the object to be enchanted the more of a charge it can hold. Any mage worth their salt should be capable of carving their own staff and sewing their own wizard robes.

If you have the money for it then yes, you can have a mage teleport you somewhere, but for most people it's cheaper and easier to just take a plane.

 

Magic is no fun if it is unlimited, at least in my opinion, it becomes a panacea for all world problems, and as such ruins good stories. Just magic your way out of the problem. The challenge for me was to limit magic in a way that was believable/acceptable to the reader, and to work within the self-imposed limits to solve the problems that couldn't be solved by the technology of the world, at the same time accepting that certain problems couldn't be solved or were indeed problems that didn't need solving (first world problems). In the world I am basing my WiP I have tried to find a sweet spot between technology and magic. You can do this in different ways, consider the costs involved, the practicality or indeed the era/setting. Then simply play around - the what if game can be fun.

 

No. Magic can't exist with Technology. In this world we have technology, therefore we can't have magic.
QED
My spurious [if not outright specious] logic aside, it's your world so anything can happen. As long as you make what happens in your world behave according to the rules of your world, who knows [but you] what the outcome may be.
Readers will buy in if it feels believable and coherent.
I think any world where magic was unlimited in easy of use and power, would have to quickly define some laws to limit it [social and cultural taboos] or end up being thought out of existence by the first homicidal [or just really ANNOYED] person to come along. Thinking about it, that would probably happen anyway...
I like my magic subtle and limited.
I like LotR because Gandalf shows the power of his magic very sparingly.
I like Harry Potter because spells can be complicated and take time to learn [and longer to perfect].
I like Discworld magic because it usually gets in the way and makes things more complicated not less [just as Gaspode the talking dog, or the Sapient Mice]

 

This is of course based on a very small sample size of 1 universe...

 

It does beg the question - "Did magic exist before we had technology?"
In which case "Does technology kill magic, and at what point did that happen?"

 

Magic is being phased out in my setting, but not by technology, although technology is advancing so it may appear that way. Does technology replace magic or simply fill the void that magic leaves.

 

I struggle with this idea. What exactly do you mean by "technology"? Because I can easily envision magic-based technology... Actually, all magic is technology in the broadest sense of the term. And can you elaborate on why magic would kill industrialisation?

 

I think the big problem with this thread is that you didn't define your terms. Here's what I got when googling the terms:

Technology is the collection of techniques, skills, methods, and processes used in the production of goods or services or in the accomplishment of objectives.
Magic: the power of apparently influencing the course of events by using mysterious or supernatural forces.

I don't see these as being mutually exclusive. In fact, there can be a lot of overlap. So, if you use a crystal ball and wand to perform magic, the ball and wand would be considered "technology".

The issue is that the "magic/spirituality/nature/mystical vs. science/materialist/technological/skeptical" conflict is maybe the most ubiquitous cliche in all of fantasy fiction. A lot of people just can't imagine things the other way.

 

I have thought about this problem a lot in my setting, because both exist and compete quite frequently, with various results. Some of these results depend very heavily on the 'rules' for Magic.

Technology is hard to beat, even with magic, because you don't need that much extra training to use technology. You traditionally will need said training for magic. It's relatively easy to teach someone how to shoot a firearm, or use a grenade. How hard would it be to teach a person how to throw fireballs and shoot lightning? If it takes longer than it would to teach an average person how to use the previous, then technology wins. That's for warfare at least, but the same is true for any industry. If magic can outdo agriculture techniques with minimal training, then everyone will use magic to produce food. If it requires someone getting an education that's the equivalent to an PHD? You might find some really successful magical farmers, but its out of reach for most people at that point. Ability, training time, and the availability of people capable/willing to train others are key factors in how well magic can compete with technology.

I do like settings like Irregular at Magical High School and Fullmetal Alchemist, where technology and magic are essentially intertwined, as you can use magic to assist technology, and technology to assist magic. I think it makes for some much more interesting applications of the two, and uniqueness in setting.