Star Wars Spoiler Thread (the first post probably doesn't have them)

Discussion in 'Film & Television' started by Garren Jacobsen, Dec 16, 2017.

  1. evolution_rex

    evolution_rex Grandmaster

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    Wait, what? How does that make the force BS? His astral projection thing was him using the force. The force was never implied to just be moving objects with your mind. This was an example of just being really, really powerful and doing something we hadn't seen in the films before. I don't get what you mean.

    Also the film makes clear only that the books and dogma attached to the Jedi was largely unimportant, and even then you see that Rey stole the Jedi texts at the end. Luke's own cyncism toward the Jedi was portrayed as wrong within the film and he realizes that toward the end. Nowhere does it say anything about the force being not important nor the Jedis, quite the opposite. The little boy using the force at the end and Rey being 'nobody' is a message that anyone can make a difference and you don't have to be a Chosen One.
     
  2. pmmg

    pmmg Dark Lord

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    The movie did have a very anti-hero theme to it. Though, I too wanted something more from the AT-AT scene other than Luke was a projection. It would have been very cool if he would have used the force to just sweep them all out of the way. Which would have been a great culmination of Luke's growth from earlier movies where he could not pull his x-wing out of the swamp, and was shot down facing these same platforms before. In Empire, we do see Vader block the lasers with just his hand, so its not unknown that the force alone is enough for this. Luke could have been more Bad-ass, but as Mark Hamill says, its not really his movie anymore.

    I don't know, I feel like I am up for the ride, but I don't expect the story to match up well anymore. For me the concept of the Force awakening is along the lines of the Force was going extinct, and it decided instead to not let that happen and spontaneously awakened in the character of Rey. This could be similarly happening all over the galaxy, such as shown with the boy at the end.
     
  3. Reaver

    Reaver Dune Lord Moderator

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    Okay. You win. I think that The Last Jedi is an awesome movie. The best ever.
     
  4. evolution_rex

    evolution_rex Grandmaster

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    Look man, I'm not arguing with you, You don't have to get angry at me. You're not the first person I've heard say similar things and simply don't understand how you're equating one thing into another. I genuinely am curious on what you're trying to say and I don't understand your point. I'm asking for clarification. You don't want to clarify? Fine, but don't act like I'm forcing you to like the movie.

    You said: anyone can be a Jedi I guess.
    Then I said: what do you mean
    then you said: they made the force seem unimportant and useless
    then I asked how
    Then eventually you gave your reasons: Luke did an astral projection thing

    I'm asking how does Luke using astral projection = the force being unimportant? and how does the force being unimportant = anybody can be a Jedi? None of those things have to do with one another, which is why I keep asking. I'm not trying to change your opinion on anything.
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2017
  5. Reaver

    Reaver Dune Lord Moderator

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    I'm not angry. Just exasperated. I feel like I answered satisfactorily. If you feel that I didn't, that's alright. You're absolutely entitled to feel that way. I just don't want to spend this much time over-analyzing my initial reactions and thoughts on this movie.
     
  6. Annoyingkid

    Annoyingkid Mystagogue

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    - Luke Skywalker's portrayal was diametrically opposed to his ep 6 characterization.
    - It conflicts with the narrative of The Force Awakens. He left a map for the rebellion to find him. So he clearly didn't go there to just die.
    - Mark Hamill completely disagreed with the portrayal.

    Yet Rian Johnson went ahead with his "vision" anyway.
    He knew that Yoda only put on that act of being a senile eccentric in ESB only to test Luke's patience. Yet he has Yoda do it again. Even though Luke already knew the real him.
    So much backstory and continuity sacrificed for the sake of his "vision" and political message.
    He tore down far more than he set up. To the point where I won't be seeing the next one. There's no hook for ep 9.

    One can tell much about a writer through their work. In Rian Johnson I saw arrogance and a flagrant contempt for what came before.
     
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  7. Reaver

    Reaver Dune Lord Moderator

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    [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  8. Black Dragon

    Black Dragon Staff Administrator

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    OK. I finally saw this movie today.

    Overall, I enjoyed it. However, I think that many of the criticisms found in this thread are valid. I am particularly perturbed by the lack of explanation regarding Snoke. Where did this insanely powerful Sith Lord come from? How did he manage to resurrect the Empire from the ashes and obliterate the Republic?

    So, who wants to write an analysis of this movie for our Mythic Scribes blog? We can potentially run several different articles from different perspectives.
     
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  9. ascanius

    ascanius Grandmaster

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    I watched this last night, it is by far the worst movie I have ever seen, almost as bad as Eragon. This movie made no sense at all, every single plot point relied on chance, It was drowning in socjus political propaganda.

    First if you can just light speed through ships and destroy a fleet, why the flying **** didn't they just do that to the deathstar, battle ships, hell every single battle in the entire star wars series. Are we to believe people advanced enough to master interstellar travel incapable harnessing it as a weapon until now?

    Time seems to be very screwy with this the new star wars space travel because it seemed like Rey was on the isl of milked sea giraffes for months or at least a good week, learning well nothing, oh I forgot, how to reach out. All the while the snail space chase seems to have had only a day pass. How much time actually passed? anyone know.

    It is mentioned multiple times that the force is a balance and one side of the force will rise up to balance the other. Snoke even says that rey is a response to Kylo. So Snoke is.... how does he fit into the the whole balance of the force? is it like a three way balance, or four if we include luke, maybe I'm getting this all wrong it was a very incoherent movie.

    What the hell was the whole thing with Rey and the mirrors? What was with the monologue? Why is the dark side suddenly a physical essence.

    Now, yoda? WTF! So basically yoda and every jedi has been taught about the force, how to use it but most importantly WHEN AND WHY. Or the moral way to use the force, not in anger, not for vengeance, to have respect for the force etc.. funny how it's kinda like religion. its the reason why Luke went uncharacteristically paranoid, maybe all that green milk addled his brains or something, because he feared a evil, immoral influence on his nephew. Then comes yoda and says let the past die, yeah all that knowledge about right and wrong the new generation doesn't need that, they woke.

    casino planet was pointless, unless one likes to be preached at about social injustices and get some social justice afterwards by disrupting their party for a night? Yeah way to go Flin and Rose, you really showed them. This completely ignores the absolute stupidity of the whole arms dealer oppressor that Rose brings up. Give me one reason why a very totalitarian/fascist/communist/authoritarian government is going to outsource their weapons to a third party who is selling to their enemy? From everything, even in the last movie it gives the impression that they have complete control over the means of production. It doesn't make any sense, unless its not supposed to in the movie but in.....

    Then we get to the bitchy incapable leader, sorry I mean strong female character. Amilyn Holdo, who in all her glorious wisdom to teach Poe about non violent solutions or as Leia tells him later "She was more interested in protecting the light than she was seeming like a hero." Right gotcha, like how withholding important information that impacts their very survival, even a "there is a plan" has nothing to do with protecting the light/hope/whatever. No she lets him believe there is no hope, they are going to die, so he goes out and acts proactively instead of doing nothing. And in the end she lets how many die, lets see 400ppl - 10 = 390 ppl dead, and Poe who lost about 20 ppl. And no simply sacrificing herself doesn't make her heroic, it makes her an idiot for not doing it sooner. Did anyone else notice that all the leaders were women? Well they woke i guess.


    So basically Poe goes from being an aggressive, heroic fighter to a child in need of instruction?

    and then there is Lukes arch, Lins, Rey..... I can go on.

    I really didn't like it there was so much stuff that made me go wtf and pulled me out of the movie. I really hate when movies or books are used for unashamed propaganda.
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2018
  10. pmmg

    pmmg Dark Lord

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    I feel your pain, but worst movie ever is quite a stretch...I saw the Last Air Bender...

    I've seen this 2 or 3 times, not sure. I fear I must pick on it pretty hard as time goes on, and would be somewhat relentless today. Some questions I might ask.... Why do bombers rely on gravity to drop their payload in space? Why do bombers have to fly over their targets? Where does gravity in a bomber when the girl falls of the ladder come from? Where are the bombers when Poe is flying about taunting the imperial commanders? And were not the Y-wings and B-Wings already bombers? Seems they had figured out how to fire from a distance away....And that is just the beginning....

    Still, its not the worst thing I have ever scene. Though, I do feel, on my own, I have decided this new stuff is alternate story stuff. The expanded universe is still the story I would look to for continuing Star Wars.
     
  11. Black Dragon

    Black Dragon Staff Administrator

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    You must have missed Alvin and the Chipmunks 2: The Squeakquel.

    I sat through it with my daughter just last week. Here is a highlight:

     
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  12. skip.knox

    skip.knox Staff Moderator

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    pmmgpmmg, because ... movies. I mean, from the very first movie we have sound effects in space, complete with swooshes, so it's a little late to be demanding accurate physics from Star Wars.

    ascaniusascanius, they don't fly through the enemy for the same reason as kamikaze tactics in WWII--it's a suicide run. Doesn't scale well.

    I only saw two sides of the Force--the good guys and the bad guys. Star Wars has never been especially subtle about that.

    I was not troubled at all at seeing women as leaders. Why ever should that matter? We've seen all men as leaders, without comment. I only care if they are good actors. These did a decent job.

    Totalitarian governments have no problem with outsourcing weapons. Take a look around.

    I won't bother replying in detail. Some folks pick this movie apart. For myself, I was fine with it. It was fun, it furthered the legend, it did no particular violence to the Star Wars universe. I speak as one who has survived decades with DC and Marvel. There were some obvious plot jiggery--I agree about the commander withholding her plan from her own folks. That was done so we didn't have to watch whole scenes of people trying to talk her out of it. Again, it's fine. I paid money to be entertained for two hours. I was entertained for two hours.

    Worst movie? Prowl around in the basement at Netflix for a while. *shudder*
     
  13. pmmg

    pmmg Dark Lord

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    Now we see why Luke lost so much hope.
     
  14. Yora

    Yora Mystagogue

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    I think it's the fourth best Star Wars movie. It's the first in over 30 years to actually capture the visual style that is essential to Star Wars. It's not a good movie by any stretch, but I did not hate it when I came out of it, and even considered seeing it a second time to look at some details.
    Classic Star Wars ended in 1998. The only good things that came after it are Jedi Knight and KotOR.
     
  15. Reaver

    Reaver Dune Lord Moderator

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    Oh, no.. no my friend. You want to see a diabolically horrible movie? Check this out:

     
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