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Spoiler-Fest: Star Wars VII

Discussion in 'Film & Television' started by Legendary Sidekick, Dec 22, 2015.

  1. X Equestris

    X Equestris Maester

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    Here's something I haven't seen anyone really talk much about: where are the other Knights of Ren? We see them in the flashback, but they don't put in a later appearance.
     
  2. MineOwnKing

    MineOwnKing Maester

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    Touching back on what Ryan Crown mentioned about Death Stars. Besides just finding the resources to build them, the fact that three of them were built within the lifespan of Luke Skywalker, seems improbable. Anybody that knows anything about construction would realize how difficult that would be in such a short time frame.

    I'm happy to know that so many members like Kylo Ren's light saber. It seems I'm the only one opposed. Maybe it has something to do with being among fantasy writers versus sci-fi writers.

    Why is the search for Luke so important? He gave up his teachings and made sure to avoid people. Why not just let him die of old age?
     
  3. Zadocfish

    Zadocfish Troubadour

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    What I liked about Kylo's lightsaber is that he used the cross-guard in EXACTLY the way that a laser cross-guard should be used; to attack the enemy even when he's been parried.

    I can never quite understand people who say that Rey shouldn't have been able to beat him, though. He had an energy bolt through the side minutes prior, and a shoulder wound from fighting Finn. The weird thing is that he lasted as long as he did... Loved his character, too. It's rare to see a young villain angsting because he doesn't feel evil enough. I think that was an amazingly inventive angle to go for.

    The one thing I didn't like was Finn saying that he had no idea if the plan he made would work, since he was just a janitor. What? Why did it work anyways? Was he totally cool with hundreds of resistance fighters dying for nothing just to get Rey back? Well, it worked, so I give him a pass on that weird character moment.

    Loved the movie.
     
  4. X Equestris

    X Equestris Maester

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    Well, it's not like there were many options. They were facing annihilation. A plan, even if the odds are poor, is better than no plan and certain death.
     
  5. Penpilot

    Penpilot Staff Article Team

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    For me, it's the rule of cool. If it's cool enough it doesn't matter, just like the impracticability Starkiller base. And as for Sci-fi vs Fantasy, Star Wars is fantasy. It's definitely not hard sci-fi.

    I think it's because the Jedi are the key to bringing down the Empire...err.. First Order. At least that's what the title roll said.

    In practical terms, he's important to bring old fans back to the franchise and to pass the torch.
     
  6. ThinkerX

    ThinkerX Myth Weaver

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    I was a bit disappointed with Death Star version 3.0...but not really surprised the First Order had the resources/ability to construct it. They'd had most of three decades to do so, after all, and the First Order appears to have inherited a lot of the old Empire's knowledge and resources (they already had most of the map from imperial archives, and made use of Imperial Star Destroyers.) More, the impression I had was they ruled a great many systems outright and they had agents everywhere - witness the agents popping out of the woodwork in the hunt for BB-8.

    I find myself wondering about the designer of Starkiller. The resistance folk had only a hazy idea how it worked, which implies some major league brainpower went into that devices concept. I suspect Snoke is not that designer.
     
  7. Zadocfish

    Zadocfish Troubadour

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    Also, I thought the firing of the Starkiller was so much better than the firing of the original Death Star. Why? Because you SEE the people on the ground looking confusedly at the beams coming at them. That adds an incredible amount of weight to the proceedings; with Alderaan, you only were told that there were many peaceful folk there. With this one, you saw them and felt their last moments a little. That was an incredibly smart design choice on behalf of the movie creators.
     
  8. MineOwnKing

    MineOwnKing Maester

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    I wasn't really referring to genre classification, just the difference in fans that are also writers. I think Sci-fi writers in general are interested in different things than fantasy writers.

    Perhaps I'm biased on light sabers due to my age. I'm not up to date on internet feuds over light sabers. Kylo Ren's saber looks more like a traditional sword and I find that jarring. I'm trying to get into a futuristic space opera mood and the laser sword looks out of place. All he needs is a shield and a horse to completely ruin it for me. Sorry.

    I don't want members to get the wrong idea about me. I really enjoyed the movie. I'm just always thinking of how to make things better, but with my own opinions.

    It was certainly a vast improvement over the last three films.

    I see things that look out of place but still work. Some scenes almost looked like they could have fit in The Temple of Doom. Han Solo could have traded his flight jacket in for his Indiana Jones hat and whip, and still fit right in.

    I would have preferred something completely new and unrelated to the older movies and older movie director mentoring.

    I wish someone would make a movie out of Half Life. Or at least give us Half Life 3.

    Hint, hint Santa!
     
  9. Penpilot

    Penpilot Staff Article Team

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    Maybe this is where the difference lies, expectations and desires.

    After 15 years of the words "F-Off" popping into my head every time I heard the phrase Star Wars, my expectations were set very low. Hopes were high, but the bar was set low. As soon as the prequels were done, I was pretty done with Star Wars.

    The franchise had lost it's magic, or rather, it was taken away in a Midichlorian induced insanity. This was a franchise I loved so much as a kid, that when I had to return a picture book adaptation of Star Wars to the library, I copied all the words down just so I could have the story. (This was pre-internet, pre-computers, and pre-VCR)

    So all I wanted was a competent story. I got that and more. The story isn't perfect, not by a long shot, but now, maybe the bar gets raised just a little.
     
  10. Legendary Sidekick

    Legendary Sidekick The HAM'ster Moderator

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    My birthday poem was going to have a second verse about Kylo Ren's ship flipping me the bird, but it wasn't funny enough to justify a minor spoiler.

    But I am curious, so I'll ask. Did anyone besides me think the silhouette of the star destroyer passing over a planet (right after the yellow words) looked like a middle finger? I didn't ask my friends that because (a) I don't even whisper in the movie theater and (b) after the movie was over, there were too many scenes worth talking about.
     
  11. Legendary Sidekick

    Legendary Sidekick The HAM'ster Moderator

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    I liked that part. You knew since episode IV that life is cheap to the Dark Side. But actually seeing the victims made the mass murder more real. You had a moment to think, if someone is blowing up your planet/moon, there isn't a thing you can do about it. People on the one surviving planet looked up into the sky and knew exactly what was happening, and the victims were truly helpless/hopeless.

    I wonder about that bounty hunter (or prostitute or whatever she was) who called the First Order. Any regrets? She might've had contacts on those worlds. I realize there can't be any focus on these minor characters, but it was a thought I had. At the time she called, I thought she has no idea what shitstorm she's putting herself into... and it turned out, neither did I.
     
  12. Philip Overby

    Philip Overby Staff Article Team

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    Been waiting for a chance to talk about this since I'm pretty sensitive to people's aversion to spoilers. My overall thoughts: really enjoyable film, from beginning to end. It actually exceeded my expectations.

    Mostly it was because the story was relatively simple. There wasn't a lot of rambling about stuff no one cares about and it got right to the core of the characters quickly without laying out everything.

    Character thoughts:

    Rey-Awesome new lead character in the series and I'm interested to see what happens with Luke. (I'm hoping it's not just a bunch of Karate Kid/Kill Bill training sequences). I was a little confused why she just knew all the Force powers so quickly, but I think that had to do with her just knowing the stories of how it worked. She did seem familiar with it all. It felt out of left field at first, but then I grew to accept it.

    Her "mind battle" with Kylo was one of my favorite scenes in all movies for a long time. Her actual physical battle was visually impressive. I'm loving this character and interested to see how significantly she grows in power over time.

    Finn: Finn's story as a stormtrooper fed up with all the destruction, but with no real identity of his own is intriguing. The four main characters that were introduced were all incredibly interesting in various ways and actually overshadowed the returning characters for me. Finn's reluctance to stay involved in an increasingly dangerous conflict felt realistic, but his eventual standing up to those that would cause harm to the ones he cared about won me over. Him being in a coma (I assume) will be interesting to see what he does next (surely the First Order will want him dead. Maybe some bounty hunters? :))

    Poe Dameron: The least focused on main character still brought a lot to the table in his scenes. We could see him as the smartass that Han Solo was, but brave in the face of certain death as well. His X-wing scenes were incredible, but I couldn't help wanting to see more of what was going on with the other characters. Another character I'm intrigued to see what they do more with in the next movie.

    Kylo Ren: Probably the most controversial character, Kylo Ren was actually one of my favorite Star Wars villains right after, ironically, Darth Vader. I liked that we're getting this parallel story of the rise of a villain and the rise of the heroine in this new trilogy. I didn't want Kylo to be a badass that just wrecks everyone. He's insecure, (gasp) emotional, angry, unhinged, and unpredictable. The fact that he tries so hard to look badass and be badass like his famous grandpa makes him that much more dangerous. And as others have pointed out before, when he takes off the mask he looks pale, weak, and his voice is much less intimidating. I think the criticism levied against him mostly that he was too weak of a villain, but I think that was the point. Snoke is there to make him stronger, which is a frightening thing to think about.

    Short thoughts about others:

    Han Solo: Sucked to see him go out, but I found it a necessary plot point to cement Kylo as the series new main baddie. He was great in this movie for sure.

    BB8: Awesome new droid. I literally LOLed several times at him. He accomplished what Jar Jar couldn't (but I won't get into the Jar Jar bashing).

    Chewbacca: Cool, but I agreed with some other criticism I saw that he looked too clean. Shampooed even.

    Leia: Probably my least favorite of the bunch, but I think she did what she could.

    Luke: Awesome reveal at the end. I'm excited to see his role in the next movie now that Han's gone.

    Phasma: I suspect she escaped the explosion somehow and will maybe (maybe?) become Finn's Boba Fett. I've seen this theory bounced around, but it would be cool if Phasma kept hounding Finn, maybe her beautiful chrome armor is all beat up and wrecked a la Mr. Fett. Lots of potential left with her since she didn't get much time.

    Maz Kanata: I dug the design of the character and loved her pirate base. She was cool as a one-off character. I don't suspect we'll see much of her in the next one.

    General Hux: I think we'll see more power struggles with him and Kylo. I loved his speech. It felt angry and impassioned, something some villains seem to lack.

    Supreme Leader Snoke: I won't speculate too much on him since I don't know much about the background mythos, but I love that he's this gigantic hologram. I saw elsewhere that it would be funny if he's this small little alien dude and he makes himself look huge to intimidate everyone. I think the less I know about him the better, as I like the mystery behind his purpose and origin.

    Overall, 10/10. Very minor issues that were drowned out by the overall awesomeness.

    (Oh and hope to see more of the Kanjiklub and Guavian Death Gang)
     
  13. MineOwnKing

    MineOwnKing Maester

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    Yeah,

    Being a little kid in the 70's was fun but there wasn't much for tech stuff around.

    We had better quality Star Wars toys though. Now everything that's not made by Lego is crap.

    I never saw the fun in building something that falls apart. I just wanted to play right off the git go.

    My kids love Lego stuff, but I have to put it together. Double not fun.
     
  14. Codey Amprim

    Codey Amprim Staff Article Team

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    I really like Poe's character. The Alliance hasn't really had a badass character, him being an ace pilot and all. I'm thinking he will train Finn to be a pilot, or maybe the two will tag team up again as pilot and gunner.

    General Hux could actually be terrifying as the charismatic leader of the First Order. That speech gave me chills, too. A power struggle seems to be developing between him and KR.

    On another note: I hope we get to see more of that BAMF vibro-mace that the stormtrooper that went toe to toe with Finn had. When that thing came out all I thought was hnnnnnnnnnnnng. I want one. Actually make that seven. Because reasons.
     
  15. Legendary Sidekick

    Legendary Sidekick The HAM'ster Moderator

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    @Phil, awesome analysis!

    I agree that it's simplicity that made the story work. Maybe to some, a few things happen too fast. I'm fine with that (as a viewer, as a reader, as a writer). I think there are certain things that, in real life, would take many steps in order to establish trust--Finn's defection, for example. It would have added needless "drama" to drag that out, where the quick do-or-die was believable enough and moved the story.

    Prequel bashing is not beneath me. I'll just say this: the yellow text was the first sign that this was more like Ep.IV and unlike Ep.I. The words made me feel like I was seeing Star Wars for real. A simple intro, easy to digest, hooked me.
     
  16. ThinkerX

    ThinkerX Myth Weaver

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    Speculation:

    Finn is descended from or otherwise related to Mace Windu, the Jedi Master from episodes 1 - 3.
     
  17. Legendary Sidekick

    Legendary Sidekick The HAM'ster Moderator

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    I wouldn't rule that out... but a part of me hopes Poe and Finn aren't related to any characters from past episodes. Like in the original trilogy, there was the Skywalker family, and other characters were awesome without being related to anyone big. Rey and Kylo Ren are likely cousins or maybe even siblings. I think one awesome family secret reveal is enough. That said, I am >99% sure I will accept if Finn is related to Mace or Lando and Poe is related to Wedge or some Ep.I-III character I forgot existed. I am more than happy to just enjoy this trilogy.

    In fact, I'm seeing it again with my wife and parents next Monday. How many aging Star Wars fans can say "I saw it twice in 2015!"

    Or maybe a better question... how many aging Star Wars fans would hear my boast and ask, "Only twice?"
     
  18. ThinkerX

    ThinkerX Myth Weaver

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    The other thing that is bothering me is the dearth of Force Users this time around, good, evil, or indifferent.

    Lots of Jedi in episodes 1 - 3. But since then, very, very few. Yet despite this paucity, Luke found enough Force-Users to start his own academy.

    Or to put it another way, Luke may be the last Jedi, but he, Rey, and the current crop of bad guys are almost certainly far from the only significant Force-Users left.
     
  19. Pfft took you long enough to see it twice.
     
    Legendary Sidekick likes this.
  20. Penpilot

    Penpilot Staff Article Team

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    Never say never, but I'd personally like to distance everything from now on from the prequels. I'd like to pretend they don't exist. There's a small part of me that hopes that down the road they reboot those episodes and do them right.
     
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